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Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

December 10 2010 at 5:26 PM
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VII_PZ_DIV  (Login VII_PZ_DIV)

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WAFFer
(Login Fantaros)
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Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 10 2010, 5:32 PM 

There you go, stick to things like this. No thought required [linked image]

Photobucket

Greek Cypriots capture strategic heights on Agiou Illiarona from TMT and TURDYK forces January 1964

 
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WAFFer
(Login Zeus33)
Hellenic Hoplites (Greece)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 10 2010, 5:38 PM 

Fantaros, you must admit it's a nice corvette. Whether we can build them or not it remains to be seen. Well I hope we will build them.

[linked image]





 
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WAFFer
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Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 10 2010, 5:56 PM 

Of course it's a nice corvette. The point is, that FRENCHY has no idea of the SIMPLE CONCEPT of how Air, Naval and Land forces support eachother. He just admitted so in the other thread, so he's better off just posting magazine articles happy.gif

Photobucket

Greek Cypriots capture strategic heights on Agiou Illiarona from TMT and TURDYK forces January 1964

 
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WAFFer
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The Conquerors (Turkey)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 10 2010, 10:02 PM 

It is a frigate not corvette. Corvettes hardly above 2000t; it is also very well armed. May be Grico Navy wants cheaper options against FREMM

 
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Nutuk
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The Conquerors (Turkey)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 10 2010, 11:14 PM 

ALS-100 is a version of the Meko A-100. The concept drawing gives different options, radar masts, weaponry etc. etc. that can be user defined (the Meko modular concept)

Greece is in a difficult position with the Hellenic shipyards, the EU imposed a 15 year ban (on which the Greek government agreed) to build civilian ships. So if Greeks want Hellenic shipyard continue to exist they have to order something to give this shipyard a reason to exist. The next 5-7 years Hellenic shipyards can continue with the U-214 subs (assuming Greece can finance it), but than Hellenic shipyard needs other military projects to continue. I assume that the ALS-100 is put forth as an idea how to continue Hellenic shipyard, so do not expect ALS-100 anytime soon (after 7-8 years maybe)

--------------------------------------------
Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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VII_PZ_DIV
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Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 12 2010, 9:42 AM 

Dr. Okuz

"It is a frigate not corvette. Corvettes hardly above 2000t; it is also very well armed. May be Grico Navy wants cheaper options against FREMM"

Stop thinking 1990's style. Ships are growing bigger as we progress in time, while old MEKO-200 has a tonage of 3,200, modern frigates are twice as heavy.

FREMM 6,000t, Alvaro De Barzan 6000t, F-124 5,600t. LCF 6050t and so on. Therefore ALS-100 2,600 t is a category underneath, a corvette.

@nutuk

If ALS-100 is German A-100 why would the Greek designers spent 15,000hrs in 18 months designing this ship? You realize how dumb you sound?


This is a MEKO A-100, I don't see any resemblence, can you?
[linked image]

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WAFFer
(Login tekircik)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 12 2010, 10:32 AM 

I can not read Greek, but judging from above the ship looks nice. I can see 8xHarpoon capabilities and a 21 cell RAM.

But if my eyes do not deceive me, are these 32-cell VLS-41 launchers in the front of the ship? From the size of the ship, I guess it is 8-cell.

If 32-cell, my friends do not focus on the tonnage, this is purely a frigate which has more VLS capabilities than Barbaros/Salihreis class frigates of Turkey which has 16-cell Mk-41 VLS launchers. Otherwise, it is a corvette.

AUDACES FORTUNA IUVAT

[linked image]

 
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WAFFer
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Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 12 2010, 2:18 PM 

3-D image? Rings the bell Greeks? In the MILGEM case, at least the 3-D image was released by the MILGEM Project office after the project started. Now, Greek forumers are happy about their 3-D image that it is not even the official project or funded. Some private Greek company put a new mast on Meko-100 design and marketing it to Greek Navy. What happend to Greek NAvy decision that HN does not need corvettes? Are they going to stick to their decision or change it after seeing MILGEM? Ohh I forgot Greek budget is tight after spending all the loan money on U-214 deal, there is no money left for the other projects such a buying torpedos.


 
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(Login GER_Mark)
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Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 12 2010, 2:24 PM 

1st and 3nd piicture show a different ship as in the 3rd drawing

so wich is the real one?



to mee it lookes like an extra option catalogue by thyssen-krupp on how you can arm/equip their mako a 100

[linked image]

 
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(Login panos1980)
Hellenic Hoplites (Greece)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 12 2010, 3:34 PM 

nutuk
"The next 5-7 years Hellenic shipyards can continue with the U-214 subs (assuming Greece can finance it), but than Hellenic shipyard needs other military projects to continue."

so true nutuk

" I assume that the ALS-100 is put forth as an idea how to continue Hellenic shipyard, so do not expect ALS-100 anytime soon (after 7-8 years maybe)"

either way this is a good for our national defence we are under new program but i disagree about will take 7-8 years to start construction
maybe you will have to move ur invading schedule for 2030


[linked image]
[linked image]
............................................

""Maniots, known for their martial qualities, were the first to join the Greek liberation movement. The society called the Filiki Eteria ("Company of Friends") sent their representatives Perrevos and Chrisospathis to organize the Maniots. On March 17, 1821, 12,000 Maniots gathered in the church of Taxiarchs (Archangels) of Areopoli and declared war against the Ottoman Empire. The flag of the revolution was white with a blue cross in the center. On top of the flag there was a sign, "Victory or death". The Maniots were responsible for writing "Victory" and not "Freedom" on their banner since Mani was always free. On the bottom of the flag lied an ancient inscription, "With the shield or on the shield."
...........................................

 
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WAFFer
(Login nutuk)
The Conquerors (Turkey)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 12 2010, 3:37 PM 

It's a Meko-100 version, slightly changed variant of the Malaysian Meko-100 RMN offer
[linked image]

--------------------------------------------
Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
[linked image]

 
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VII_PZ_DIV
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Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 12 2010, 4:13 PM 

Clueless Nutuk

"It's a Meko-100 version"

Oh, now it is Meko-100? Before you said Meko A-100. [linked image]

Meko-100 (export to Malaysia) is not A-100 (export to Poland), they are completely different designs.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MEKO

GER-MARK

What's the matter, are you afraid your traditional client the HN is swifting away from the German market? FYI, the photos belong to the same corvette, ALS-100. The first photo incorparates the I-Mast 400 mast the third is with ICAS mast. HN hasn't decided yet for final configuration.

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WAFFer
(Login Zeus33)
Hellenic Hoplites (Greece)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 12 2010, 5:10 PM 

@GER-MARK

You obviously can't read greek, so STFU. But If you can read greek then read the ******* third page!



[linked image]





 
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Nutuk
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The Conquerors (Turkey)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 12 2010, 5:20 PM 

Panzer,

That ship is just a Meko 100 version, I don't say it's bad or something the concept design really looks good (like all other Meko's)

--------------------------------------------
Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
[linked image]

 
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VII_PZ_DIV
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Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 12 2010, 5:32 PM 

"That ship is just a Meko 100 version"

I think you are another Yannis. Meko-100 has a displacement of 1,650 tones, ALS-100 at 2,655, the only thing they have in common is the name "100".



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(Login panos1980)
Hellenic Hoplites (Greece)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 12 2010, 5:35 PM 

"That ship is just a Meko 100 version,"

in which aspect?


[linked image]
[linked image]
............................................

""Maniots, known for their martial qualities, were the first to join the Greek liberation movement. The society called the Filiki Eteria ("Company of Friends") sent their representatives Perrevos and Chrisospathis to organize the Maniots. On March 17, 1821, 12,000 Maniots gathered in the church of Taxiarchs (Archangels) of Areopoli and declared war against the Ottoman Empire. The flag of the revolution was white with a blue cross in the center. On top of the flag there was a sign, "Victory or death". The Maniots were responsible for writing "Victory" and not "Freedom" on their banner since Mani was always free. On the bottom of the flag lied an ancient inscription, "With the shield or on the shield."
...........................................

 
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(Login TrabzonLee_61)
The Conquerors (Turkey)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 12 2010, 8:26 PM 

"milgem is just 3D"

"milgem is too big for aegean"

"FAC's like süper vita are better"

---

whazzup my A(LS)-100 friends?

it's the same lol just the design is a lil bit changed.. do you think it is designed by your engeneers? lol, look at the hull..

jealos greeks, while milgem did her first trials, you are copying meko a-100 and changing a lil bit..
you know it but you dont want to believe it.. lol

i did this in school lol.. if i had a presentation at school, i took the original text and changed a lil bit.. lol :D

-----------------

[linked image]



VII PZ DIV xxx ZZZ says:

"Manage to lift it 1cm from the ground and then come and talk."

deal.

 
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Nutuk
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The Conquerors (Turkey)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 12 2010, 10:00 PM 

in which aspect?
--------------------
From concept aspect, and if Greece choses to purchase also the detail design will be Thyssen Krupp

Presentation of the Greek corvette design Als ® Class 100 'in the Navy

On October 26, 2010 was the presentation of the Navy corvettes Als ® Class 100 ', with the following improvements:

Integrate the planning board for the various observations of the Navy's first show in December 2009:

1) Planning and design in accordance with regulations of the German Classification Society to build warships
2) Increase the operational capabilities of the vessel with the installation of the Mk 41 vertical launchers (a total of 16 cages), and alternative conditions in the system Sylver A50

3) Ability to design can be accepted and alternative non-rotating multi-function radar (SEA MASTER 400 a non-rotating four-face array Volume Search Radar) instead of rotating radar Smart - S Mk2
4) Ability to install and an alternative to integrated web (I-Mast with SEA MASTER 400 Radar) instead of integrated web ICAS.

5) Ability to adjust the operational capabilities of the vessel with the development of family boats that cover broader and longer term needs of the Navy.
6) Look for the installation of the Greek system.

It should be noted that the above design is not competitive in any case none of the current programs of the Navy. Instead complements an existing gap in the Navy fleet.

http://www.defencenet.gr/defence/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=15127&Itemid=51

[linked image]

-------------------------------

Now this is interesting, why would Greeks design a boat Planning and design in accordance with regulations of the German Classification Society to build warships?

Why not a Greek classification if the design is Greek? Turkish milgem is for instance classified by Turkish Loyd.

The claim of ALS-100 being a Greek design is very weak, you guys have to put some proof on table, secondly there is not one dedicated Greek subsystem on board. How can Greeks design the whole boat if they cannot even design a subsystem?

Panzy what do you have to say?






















--------------------------------------------
Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
[linked image]

 
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VII_PZ_DIV
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Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 12:18 PM 

"Now this is interesting, why would Greeks design a boat Planning and design in accordance with regulations of the German Classification Society to build warships?

Why not a Greek classification if the design is Greek? Turkish milgem is for instance classified by Turkish Loyd."

Nutuk, HN solely uses German classification as you correctly state even for non-German ships. We used it also for British-made Super Vita class. Greece does not have a "Greek Loyd".


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Nutuk
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The Conquerors (Turkey)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 12:41 PM 

OK suppose that's the case (I am not convinced but have no opposite proof) who is the designer of the ALS-100, which company, where is the website?

--------------------------------------------
Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
[linked image]

 
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(Login Combat_Master)
The Redcoats (UK)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 12:44 PM 

What about the Subsystems ?

Alot of R&D has gone into the development of the MILGEM, of which much of it is not yet completed and won't be untill the third MILGEM.

What can the Greek Industry offer to a project if it was implemented ?



[linked image]
Pardus... For Freedom...


 
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VII_PZ_DIV
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Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 1:11 PM 

Nutuk

"OK suppose that's the case (I am not convinced but have no opposite proof)"

This is not my problem. Believe what you like.

"who is the designer of the ALS-100, which company, where is the website?"

Let's start again, there is no website so don't bother searching for it. It is a joint venture between HN which ordered the research to satisfy its needs for 6 modern corvettes and does the research funding, the Germanikos Niognomomas (who does the certification) and most important is the Greek design bureau which designs the ship according to HN concept study. The name of the bureau is Als Naval Ship Design (NSD). So far the bureau has spent 15,000 hours of work to design Als-100 with the results you see above.

To cut a long story short, Greece is looking wether or not local designers and ship-builders can produce and design ships in a cost-effective manner. We want FREMM to be the last of a series of foreign ships to enter HN service.


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Nutuk
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The Conquerors (Turkey)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 1:16 PM 

Let's start again, there is no website so don't bother searching for it. It is a joint venture between HN which ordered the research to satisfy its needs for 6 modern corvettes and does the research funding, the Germanikos Niognomas (who does the certification) and most important is the Greek design bureau which designs the ship according to HN concept study. The name of the bureau is Als Naval Ship Design (NSD). So far the bureau has spent 15,000 hours of work to design Als-100 with the results you see above.
-------------------------------

In other words it's only a feasibility study with a conceptual design. OK that's makes sense, thanks.

--------------------------------------------
Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
[linked image]

 
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VII_PZ_DIV
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Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 1:22 PM 

"In other words it's only a feasibility study with a conceptual design. OK that's makes sense, thanks."

That was the case last year, it is now beyond the feasibility or the concept study if you prefer. We can actually built the ships, only concern is the funding given the current economic state. The good part is this is an economic stimulating effort so you make the initial sacrifice but in the long term it generates capital for the local shipbuilding industry. Greece wants higher percentage of industrial output per GDP, same with energy and fosil fuels.



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Nutuk
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The Conquerors (Turkey)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 1:31 PM 

We can actually built the ships, only concern is the funding given the current economic state.
--------------------

I doubt that! Reasons are:
- Greece doesn't have military state owned shipyards like Turkey does (Turkey has 3 military owned naval shipyards).

- Secondly although Greece has a huge mechandise fleet, she is lacking significant shipyards that can do the job. The only capable one "Hellenic shipyards" which is in German-Arab control.

- Third Greece lacks the industry to provide subsystems and backup such a task.

- Fourth and maybe the most important, there is still not an office like SSM in Greece that can coordinate these kind of tasks.

--------------------------------------------
Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
[linked image]

 
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VII_PZ_DIV
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Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 1:39 PM 

Your assesment is wrong, ENAE shipyards are 100% military and Neorion shipyards are also military oriented having a civilian sector as well. Mind you, ENAE now profit from French CMN technical knowhow as they both belong to the same parent company from UAE.

As for the electronics sector, it is a booming sector in Greece, increasing its limited capacity geometrically more than any other Greek productive sector. I expect this trend to be on the increase as we progress in time.

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Nutuk
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The Conquerors (Turkey)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 1:45 PM 

ENAE shipyards are 100% military
---------------------
Is ENAE not Hellenic shipyards that belongs to Abu Dhabi Mar?

--------------------------------------------
Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
[linked image]

 
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WAFFer
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The Conquerors (Turkey)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 1:47 PM 

I wonder if it is not MEKO-A100 class, has Greek shipyard technology related to EMC/EMI; RCS; IR; Acoustic measurment, analysys-reduction capability?

During (and before) Milgem Project Turkish institutions spend millions of dollars to developed software and tools for this kind of technology...

 
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VII_PZ_DIV
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Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 1:49 PM 

"Is ENAE not Hellenic shipyards that belongs to Abu Dhabi Mar?"

I said that already, like HDW and CMN shipyards they all belong to ADM parent company from Dubai. Of course the Arabs offer funds not any tech now-how. Being in the family now we have access to French and German know-how.



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Nutuk
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The Conquerors (Turkey)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 1:53 PM 

LOL panzer, those shipyards aren't even national but belong to private foreign companies and you still argue these ones will build you a national vessel? Name me one subsystem that will be Greek developed.

--------------------------------------------
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[linked image]

 
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VII_PZ_DIV
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Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 1:59 PM 

National this and national that days are over, we are experiencing the end of the Socialist model where the state acts as a businessman. In Germany you think there is a single state owned company? By 2015 nothing in Greek defence industry will be state-owned.



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Nutuk
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The Conquerors (Turkey)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 2:06 PM 

In that case what will be Hellenic of that ship? (if ever build)



--------------------------------------------
Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
[linked image]

 
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VII_PZ_DIV
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Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 2:13 PM 

"In that case what will be Hellenic of that ship? (if ever build)"

Once the funding is available for construction (so far neither FREMM or Als-100 have been ordered) the GDAEE (equivelant to your SSM) will give the local companies funds to develop whatever subsystems they can manufacure, either 100% indigenous, licensed co-productions or even having an industrial share. This is step 3, so far we are in step 2.

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Nutuk
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The Conquerors (Turkey)

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 2:26 PM 

Hmmm anyway, looks like Greece want's to follow SSM (Milgem). If you can pull it through it will be very good for your industry, good luck.

--------------------------------------------
Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
[linked image]

 
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Duke Nukem
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Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 2:37 PM 

@ all those informed about the greek corvette issue:

I read (not sure where though) that greek shipyards may also build large corvettes for the israelis, since they lack facilities large enough for building such ships.

Is it true? and if yes could the ALS 100 project be envisioned also for Israel?
thanks in advance...

You can take a turko out of his gecekondu, but you can never take the gecekondu out of the turko.

Dienekis June 2010

 
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(Login GER_Mark)
Elite WAFF Vet Club

Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 4:02 PM 

"
What's the matter, are you afraid your traditional client the HN is swifting away from the German market? FYI, the photos belong to the same corvette, ALS-100. The first photo incorparates the I-Mast 400 mast the third is with ICAS mast. HN hasn't decided yet for final configuration.
"

obviously not, becuase its just a meko corvette, im glad they opt them instead of fremm happy.gif

[linked image]

 
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VII_PZ_DIV
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Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 13 2010, 4:54 PM 

Nah, the Germans were complaining Greeks weren't paying. They are better off looking for other customers...if you know what I mean. [linked image]

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VII_PZ_DIV
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Re: Hellenic ALS-100 corvette

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December 16 2010, 12:59 PM 

Bump

CORRECTION

On a previous thread I stated there is no Hellenic Register of Shipping (Hellenic Loyds). Apparently there is one since 1919.

site
http://www.hrs.gr/

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