interesting, keep it next to the turdGayis casualties by Syrian forces, 1 pink bereli tellak down so far...
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Quoting a Turkish forumer:
"It's a well known fact that most of the boys or girls living in south-eastern Turkey are losing their virginities to horses or dogs of their villages, so I don't think this will suprise any Turk in this forum; we are used to these kinda news..."
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Pkk admitted to 36 dead from the Kazan Vadi operation.
Another 3 caught today.
Demek ki ordu istedigi zaman bir seyler yapabiliyormus. Son basilan kamplar Turkiye topraklarinin icinde, on bes yildir girilmiyor. Ordu yaklasmamis bile bu kamplara.
Secretary of Greek Ministry of Education, Professor Thalia Dragona:
"There is no continuity from ancient Greeks to modern Greeks."
"Modern Greek identity is a fradulent one built on myths."
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13) Gerilla Gabar'ın cenazesi gece toprağa verildi
14 - 21) Bingöl'ün Yayladere İlçesi kırsal kesiminde yapılan hava destekli operasyonda yaşamını yitiren 8 HPG gerillasının cenazesi Elazığ'da yapılan otopsinin ardından kimlik tespiti için İstanbul Adli Tıp Kurumu'na gönderildi
22-27) Altı gerilla cenazesi Diyadin'e doğru yola çıktı
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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don't forget to include the imaginary casualties turdGayish F-16s inflicted during the infamous bombing of high value targets such as rocks, sand plains and goat defecating areas.
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Quoting a Turkish forumer:
"It's a well known fact that most of the boys or girls living in south-eastern Turkey are losing their virginities to horses or dogs of their villages, so I don't think this will suprise any Turk in this forum; we are used to these kinda news..."
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Hpg will not acknowledge most of the killing lately since these groups would not take order from leadership in Kandil HPG rather move independently. or would take order from Syrian or Iranian commanders. That is why PKK in silence and not acknowledging their lost
Hpg in its latest announcement said 'The militia that claimed HPG members' They dont even call them PKK militia since above reason. Within a month more than 50 killed there was no announcement even though some of them very prominent leaders in PKK. Hpg normally acknowledge and displays dead's picture in their martians album but not this time.
These 6-7 group targeted by Turkish forces called hawks in pkk and dont take orders from Murat Karayilan. with the destruction of these groups Turkey paves road for the peace supporters in pkk to disarm.
32, 33) Licede yaşamını yitiren HPG gerillası Agit Acer, Diclede; Kazan Vadisinde hayatını kaybeden gerilla Perihan Ergün ise Ercişte binlerce kişi tarafından toprağa verildi.
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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50) Operasyona çıkan düşman askeri ile gerillalarımız arasında bir çatışma yaşanmış, yaşanan çatışmada Agit Batman Yusuf Akdarı arkadaşımız kahramanca savaşarak şahadete ulaşmıştır (zapped )
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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LOL in 20 days 50 Kurds are acknowledged by the PKK news agency Firat news. The Kurds in their propaganda keep the acknowledged numbers low. Actual numbers is at least twice.
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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what all of a sudden the Turkish armed forces found teeth after getting butt pumped by the PKK for decades?...
given your nations record with truth and transparency i highly doubt your figures....
when all is said and done, the PKK will still be there...turkish troops will still be dying and Kurds will be stronger and more numerous than ever....
the rest is all pure crap for the masses of Turks to feel better and not suffer psychological damage when the myth of the warrior turk comes crashing down....
hehehehe
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If you payed atention idiot you would have read that all the above figures are from the PKK site "firat news". These are only the ones PKK admits!!!! Which ofcourse is showing only a fraction of the real numbers, now go back to your dildo.
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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62) HPG Basın İrtibat Merkezi (HPG-BİM), Aralık ayı içerisinde Şırnakın Cudi alanında 13 gün süren kapsamlı operasyonda 1985 Mardin doğumlu, 2002 katılımlı, Zilan Bagok kod adlı Gülnaz Demir isimli gerillanın hayatını kaybettiğini bildirdi.
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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Thanks for keeping the sores coming Nutuk.
I personally hate going on that site even to see this bit of news
The army must be keeping well on top of those thugs and still no word of counter attack by PKK.
They must be having a tough time finding troops off guard just sitting in karakol.
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The hitting of those smugglers was not a coincidence too, they know very well who is transporting the weapons for the PKK. The smugglers got a very serious reminder of what the consequences will be.
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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64) Elazığ Adli Tıp Kurumu'nda, Bingöl'de infaz edildiği iddia edilen kod adı Lezgin olan 1 gerillaya ait parçalanmış bir cenazenin olduğu iddia edildi.
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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Not to happy about them being taken alive but anyhow, 4 scumbags surrendered to security forces in sirnak
http://www.hurriyet.com.tr/gundem/19615052.asp
rnak'ta 4 terörist teslim oldu
A.A
5 Ocak 2012
rnak'ta terör örgütü PKK'dan kaçan 4 teröristin güvenlik güçlerine teslim olduu bildirildi.
rnak Valisi Vahdettin Özkan, yapt açklamada, rnak'n krsal kesiminde terör örgütünden kaçan 4 teröristin güvenlik güçlerine teslim olduunu söyledi.
Teslim olan örgüt mensuplarnn sorgusunun l Jandarma Komutanl'nda sürdüü örenildi.
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66-72) Dersimin Pülümür ilçesi kırsalında Türk ordusu ile HPG gerillaları arasında yaşanan çatışmada yaşamını yitiren 7 gerilladan 5inin kimliği açıklandı.
-1970 Dersim-Hozat doğumlu, Aziz Dersim kod adlı Mehmet Güneş
-1975 Dersim doğumlu, İsa Cihad kod adlı Cihan Tarkan
-1984 Siirt doğumlu, Zinar Siirt kod adlı Abdullah Dülek
-1989 Doğu Kürdistan Urmiye doğumlu, Sason Zagros kod adlı Behman Zarı
-1985 Mardin doğumlu, Mahsum Çayan kod adlı Rufai Elik
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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They are killed in the last 2 days in the continuing operations on the Cudi mountain. Keko's are hit severely and the BDP is again organising "protest" marches to the Cudi mountains.
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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Thats strange as the turkish army has not released any statements with regards to 7 being killed the past 2 days, just 4 that surrended in sirnak 3 days ago.
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76) Cudi Dağı'nda çıkan çatışmada yaşamını yitiren HPG'li Ahmet Olcay'ın (Sadun) cenazesi, doğum yeri olan Suruç İlçesi'ne bağlı Kever Köyü'nde toprağa verildi.
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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81,82,83) Kozluk kırsalında infaz edildikleri iddia edilen 5 HPG gerillasından Lezgin Öztekin, Nevzat Acar ve Osman Güneş'in cenazeleri aileleri tarafından alınarak Batman'a doğru yola çıkarıldı. (PKK admits only 3 of the 5 killed terorists)
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
Kafasina kus sicti diye sevinen ve sans bileti alan bir millet agzina sicana oy vermesine sasmamak gerek
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85-93) Geçtiğimiz hafta Bingöl'de çıkan çatışmada yaşamını yitiren 9 HPG gerillasından Mehmet Aksoy Karlıovada, Haşim Kaya ise Vanın Başkale ilçesinde törenle toprağa verildi. Binlerce kişi katıldığı törenler için kepenk kapatıldı
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
Kafasina kus sicti diye sevinen ve sans bileti alan bir millet agzina sicana oy vermesine sasmamak gerek
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95-110) 15 cenaze Şırnak Devlet Hastanesi'ne getirildi
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
Kafasina kus sicti diye sevinen ve sans bileti alan bir millet agzina sicana oy vermesine sasmamak gerek
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111,112,113)
HPG, Amed, Bingöl ve Batman'da yaşamını yitiren 3 HPG'linin daha kimliğini açıkladı.
Halk Savunma Güçleri Basın İrtibat Merkezi (HPG-BİM), 13 Şubat günü Mardin ile Amed'in Çınarın ilçesi arasında yaşanan çatışmada bir gerillanın yaşamını yitirdiğini, bir gerillanın da yaralandığını doğruladı. Gerillaların kimlik bilgilerini de açıklayan HPG-BİM, "Çatışma sonucunda Doğu Kürdistanlı Yunus kod adlı Kazım Hüseyinzade arkadaşımız kahramanca savaşarak şahadete ulaşırken Zindan Gılord kod isimli İsmet Akın ise yaralı olarak düşmana esir düşmüştür" dedi.
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
Kafasina kus sicti diye sevinen ve sans bileti alan bir millet agzina sicana oy vermesine sasmamak gerek
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114) Yaşamını yitiren Mahabat Penaber kod adlı gerillanın 1985 Silopi doğumlu, 1999 katılımlı Nebahat Demir olduğu bildirildi.
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
Kafasina kus sicti diye sevinen ve sans bileti alan bir millet agzina sicana oy vermesine sasmamak gerek
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Good,keep it coming. They deserve getting killed. If only the Alevis who worship ataturk as a deity in caves would also join the PKK and get killed. They have sadly taken the other route.
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118-126) Kandil bölgesinde Dola Koke mıntıkasında 4 Mart tarihinde çığ düşmesi sonucu yaşamını yitiren 8 gerilladan Yüksekova doğumlu Ruken Çayan kod adlı Nuran Bellier, Hakkari doğumlu Beritan Şafak kod adlı Hülya Gök ile Van doğumlu Doza Welat kod adlı Rozerin Bilici için taziye çadırları kuruldu.
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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Nutuk,latest 8 pkk scums did not die due to snow fall,instead killed by pkk itself in order to exampolary to other militants who tries to escape from them.They called it snowfall but later other former pkk members who managed to escape told what realy had happened.All of those militants were women,maybe they ran from mass rape or group sex etc.
Most women members of pkk are killing themselves instead of ran because they had very little chance to survive if they return their father's home.Most of women members who turned without a husband were honour killed by their own family members,because of illegal sex with other pkk male members.(which is condidered to be a disshonour for kurds)Any way they die in some way,that is positive fact.
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129 - 133) Şırnak'ın Cudi Dağı'nda 3 gün önce başlayan çatışmalarda, HPG'li olduğu belirtilen 5 kişinin cenazeleri Malatya Adli Tıp Morgu'na getirildiği bildirildi.
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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134-148) 15 cenaze Malatyaya getirildi
Bitlis'in Hizan İlçesi kırsalında çıkan çatışmada yaşamını yitirdiği kaydedilen 15 kadın gerillanın cenazesi Malatya Adli Tıp Kurumu'na getirildi.
HPG-BMin verdii bilgilere göre irtibat salanamayan gerillalar öyle:
*1975 Batman doumlu, 1993 Garzan katlml, Arjin Garzan kod adl Leyla Altan
*1979 Adana doumlu, 1999 Van katlml, Berivan Samsur kod adl Perihan Parlak
149 - 158 Şırnak'ın Cudi Dağı'nda 21-24 Mart tarihleri arasında yaşanan çatışmada yaşamını yitiren 9 HPG'liden Batı Kürdistanlı olan Adıl Muhammed (Sadık Kobani), Elmas Xelil (Zilan Halep) ve Lokman İbo'nun (Refik Afrin), HPG gerillası Ulaş toprağa verildi
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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I get them from firatnews, the PKK news site, they only admit a fraction of their real casualties but even that is more than 150 corpses in less than half year. I guess the real numbers are close to 500.
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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Felix, soldiers are usually drafted in Turkey and Greeece.. These fukkers, took up arms by choice. There death dont deserve a single tear or sheep of sympathy. Lost a few of my family to these monkeys... I cheer every darn day Nutuk updates this count...
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I don't know about all the units, groups etc. of the Turkish army, but most of our units consist of conscripts, doing their service!some very few have "professionals" who get max. 1000-1100 euros a month and try to feed their families but I wouldn't call them soldiers of fortune!!!
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ahmet toork (Login the-me) Satyameva Jayate (India)
Re: body count
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April 18 2012, 7:51 AM
I think PPK took down two toord terrorist soldiers with them. Way to go PKK aryans. I wanna see massive number of subhuman toorks sent to alla.
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160) HPG Basın-İrtibat Merkezi 3 Şubat günü Batmanın Kozluk ilçesi kırsalında çıkan çatışmada Agit Yasak (Demhat Siser) adlı gerillanın yaşamını yitirdiğini açıkladı
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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maxi, those are deads admitted by the cave apes, the true rate is at least 3-4 times higher...
_________________
Yavuz Sultan Selim
Kürde firsat verme Ya Rab, Dehre sultan olmasin, Ayagini çarik siksin, Karni bile doymasin,
Vur sopayi al haraci, Asla iflah olmasn, Ol bu çesmeden gavur içsin, Rum içsin, Kürde nasip olmasin
Vasiyetim oldur kim, Kürd bin kere yalvarsin. Inanma, kanma. Yakana bit, kapina Kürd dadandirma
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161) HPG'li Bozan toprağa verildi. 13 Nisan günü Mardin'in Omeryan alanına bağlı Hebiz ile Kurik köyleri arasında çıkan çatışmada yaşamını yitiren HPG'li Abdurrahman Bozan'ın (Karansungur Pir) cenazesi Adıyaman'da toprağa verildi.
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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maxi, those are deads admitted by the cave apes, the true rate is at least 3-4 times higher...
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Source ?
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Source is Firatnews the PKK news site. They keep their admitted casualties low. So these 160 terorist death is much less than half the reality, they only admit the deaths which are collected by the Turkish troops. According to the PKK they have no casualties from all those bombings on their main camps (can you believe it?)
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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NirvanaBlue (Login NirvanaBlue) The Conquerors (Turkey)
Re: body count
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April 24 2012, 12:43 PM
All good news but no one is asking the question that should be asked.
Why did these successes only started coming after Basbug and Kosaner left?
Look at the time line.
Secretary of Greek Ministry of Education, Professor Thalia Dragona:
"There is no continuity from ancient Greeks to modern Greeks."
"Modern Greek identity is a fradulent one built on myths."
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Another 9 keko scum found their way to hell,I am posting faster than Nutuk now!
According to pro pkk website called yuksekovahaber,they took the news from anf haber which is another pro pkk network from Europe,6 more pkk members are missing and pkk can not contact with them,theri names are revealed as;
*1974 Diyarbakir dogumlu, 1999 katilimli, Agir Amed kod adli Kasım Işik.
*1981 Diyarbakir dogumlu, 26 Mayıs 2004 katilimli, Herbiji Tolhildan kod adiı İbrahim Kaya
*1989 Diyarbakir dogumlu, Haziran 2008 katilimli, Mahir Dicle kod adli Hasan Karahan
162-168 (musti reported) ANF'nin haberine göre, PKK, 24 Nisan günü Diyarbakırın Lice ve Kulp ilçeleri ile Bingölün Genç ilçesi arasındaki alanda yürütülen operasyonun ardından 6 PKK'li ile bağlantı kurulamadığını duydu.
169) Şırnak'ın Gabar Dağı'nda çıkan çatışmada yaşamını yitiren HPG gerillası Sadık Dolatkhah'ın ailesi cenazeyi alamadan geri döndü.
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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xxxKULxxx (Login xxxKULxxx) The Conquerors (Turkey)
170 - 172) Ağrı'da hayatını kaybeden 3 gerillanın kimliği açıklandı
*1976 Bozova/Urfa doğumlu, 1997 Romanya katılımlı, Bawer Bozova kod adlı Muhammed Mahsum Elmas.
*1983 Bozova/Urfa doğumlu, 2000 Almanya katılımlı, Savaş Urfa kod adlı Hasan Karadağ.
*1985 Malazgirt/Muş doğumlu, 2005 katılımlı, Azad Güler kod adlı Memduh Aydemir.
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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NirvanaBlue (Login NirvanaBlue) The Conquerors (Turkey)
Re: body count
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May 5 2012, 2:21 AM
@Nutuk
The tide turned after Basbug and Kosaner f*cked off.
Secretary of Greek Ministry of Education, Professor Thalia Dragona:
"There is no continuity from ancient Greeks to modern Greeks."
"Modern Greek identity is a fradulent one built on myths."
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There's no "tide". As previous poster has said, thousands of the crypto-armo subhumans were wasted in 90s operations.
More crypto-armo subhumans die because of their innate Indian incompetence despite being armed and trained by foreign imperialists. Big f*cking surprise.
This message has been edited by IndiaIsAShithole on May 5, 2012 5:00 AM
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173) HPG'li Ay ve Karadağ'ın cenazeleri aileleri tarafından alındı. Doğubayazıt İlçesi kırsalında yaşamını yitiren HPG'li Hasan Karadağ'ın (Savaş Urfa) cenazesi, Urfa'nın Bozova İlçesi'nde doğduğu köyde "Şehîd namirin" sloganları ile toprağa verildi.
174) HPG gerillası Elmas köyünde defnedildi
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
This message has been edited by nutuk on May 5, 2012 3:31 PM
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Those "terrorists" were probably conscripted soldiers fighting for their flag and nation and falling for it,
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Falling for what? The territorial sovereignty of their country isn't worth fighting for?
regardless of how right or wrong their state policy may have been.
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Yeah, it's pretty right. A lot more right than a bunch of WASPs running away from debtor prisons and ghettos to rob land from Native Americans only 200 years ago or a bunch of Finns who think they're Slavic moving from Estonia to rob land in the Caucasus as recently as 200 years ago.
The PKK insurgents did the same.
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PKK terrorists don't have a "state", ethiopian.
5 humans died for political causes decided by others and not them. RIP to them all and God have mercy on their souls.
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2 humans died because some Finnic douches who think they're slavic in the KGB/FSB wanted to terrorize anybody associated with NATO hire a crypto-armenian college dropout (who's currently rotting in prison awaiting execution). With the end of the Cold War, the finnic doucehs were replaced by the CIA/Mossand who saw a new purpose for said kekos.
Have some respect for the deceased.
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I'll have respect for the deceased of a nation with universally recognized borders. As for keko scum, they either volunteer or are illiterate child soldier tributes to the PKK by keko peasansts to their feudal overlords (who are the so-called "politicians" and "journalists" in jail). So will you start making funeral pyres for al-qaueda then? Personally, I don't care for them but even a retard can see that even they have some legitimate greivances compared to the kekos who are pure pawns.
Childhood in much of India begins with the young child being regularly masturbated by the mother, "high caste or low caste, the girl 'to make her sleep well,' the boy 'to make him manly..."' This practice has been said to be widespread by many reliable observers, including Catherine Mayo - a physician,(91) an ethnologist,(92) a religious scholar (93) and a sociologist.(94)
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175) Mayıs günü saat 20.00 sularında Maraş'ın Nurhak ilçesine bağlı Gürsel ve Umutlu köyleri yakınlarında göreve giden bir grup gerilla ile Türk askerleri arasında 7 saat süren bir çatışma sonucu bir gerillanın yaşamını yitirdiğini açıkladı. 1978 Maraş doğumlu, Beşir Elbistan kod adlı Oruç Ay
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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Gecen sene hep biz sehit veriyorduk. Istedikleri zaman, istedikleri karakolu basip, kayip vermeden ellerini kollarini salliyarak kaciyorlardi. "Turk" subayinin Heronlari dusurulmesinin talimati vardi. Heronlarin goruntulerini transfer eden yeraltindaki kablolari kazilmisti. Basbug efendi elindeki silaha boru diyordu.
Simdi biz ataktayiz, simdi onlar lesler veriyorlar.
Yeni genelkurmay Necdet Ozel, gecen yil Agustos'ta basa gecti ve degisim basladi. 15 yildan beri girilmeyen "Turkiye topraklarinin" icindeki Cudi dagindaki kamplar basildi. Kis geldi diye Turk ordusunun operasyonlari hic durmadi. PKK'nin liderleri bombardimandan korktuklari icin magaralarindan cikamaz oldular. Bir suru terorist atagi harekete gecilmeden onlendi. Butun ataklar onlenemez ama simdi bi dinamizm var, Turk ordusu atakta.
Bu degisimleri gormemezden gelmek aptallik.
Secretary of Greek Ministry of Education, Professor Thalia Dragona:
"There is no continuity from ancient Greeks to modern Greeks."
"Modern Greek identity is a fradulent one built on myths."
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sacma sapan konusma hiyar, eger boyle vatan hainligi ispati varsa nicin yargilanma olmuyor. Kim vatan hainligi yapiyorsa assinlar, ama birturlu yargi yok sadece laf ve karalama var. Ve senin gibi yardakcilar!
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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Nicin hala uc dort senedir bir kisi bile yargilanmadi, neymis pilotlara cami bombalama emirleri verilecekmis. Ulan iftiralarinizda bile serefsizligin dik alasini yapiyorsunuz konusuyorsun hala.
Biten PKK'yi canlandiran kim, tefle davul zurna ile sinirda karsilayan kim.
Gizli gizli yardimcisini gonderip PKKlilar ile pazarlik yapan kim. Tabi rezilikler gormezden gelinir, iftiralar dizboyu.
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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Keep on count the daily lash number of the keko terorists . they are always good news in the mornings.
"l love the smell of napalm in the mornings"
?w=640&h=339
This message has been edited by emperor-attila on May 7, 2012 3:53 PM This message has been edited by emperor-attila on May 7, 2012 3:52 PM This message has been edited by emperor-attila on May 7, 2012 3:51 PM
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Nerden cikti bu iftira? Bu kadar hususi belgeleri kim oturduda uydurdu?
Bi bavul orijinal belge var, cd ler var, ses kayitlari var kimse kicindan cikarmadi bunlari.
Icerde bir suru general var, hepsinin sirasi gelecek.
Ya olaylari takip et ya da otme.
Sapsal senin body count listen neden 2010 da baslamadi da Aralik aylarinda basladi? Ayni listeyi bizim sehitlerimize yapabilirdin pezevenk. Hala ideoloji ile hareket, hala gormezden gelmek.
Sen ve senin gibiler bi kac yil once ordu goreve diyen darbeci pezevenkler degilmisiniz? Abdullah Gul'u kucuk aklinizca "kabul etmeyen" siz degilmisiniz? Sizin ne bok oldugunuz belli.
Secretary of Greek Ministry of Education, Professor Thalia Dragona:
"There is no continuity from ancient Greeks to modern Greeks."
"Modern Greek identity is a fradulent one built on myths."
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xxxKULxxx (Login xxxKULxxx) The Conquerors (Turkey)
Gotu sikilmis it, madem cuvallarla kanit var niye kimse halen suclu bulunmadi da habire sallandiriyorlar konuyu yok bilmem ne davasini bilmem ne dosyasi ile birlestirip davayi yine silbastan yapip uzatiyorlar da uzatiyorlar, maksat yargilama degil bazi sahislari iceride surundurmek. Senin gibi kelekler bunun borazanligini yapiyor.
Al sana cevap geri zekalilarin krali:
CHP Bolu Milletvekili Tanju Özcan'ın soru önergesini yanıtlayan İçişleri Bakanı İdris Naim Şahin, 1 Ocak 2003 ile 9 Aralık 2011 tarihleri arasında PKK/KCK terör örgütüne yönelik yapılan operasyonlarda, bin 268 ölü, 24 bin 385 terör örgütü üyesinin yaralı olarak ele geçirildiğini bildirdi.
BİN 398 KİŞİ TESLİM OLDU
Soru önergesini yanıtlayan İçişleri Bakanı, 1 Ocak 2003 ile 9 Aralık 2011 tarihleri arasında PKK/KCK terör örgütüne yönelik yapılan operasyonlarda, bin 268 ölü, 24 bin 385 terör örgütü üyesinin yaralı ele geçirildiğini, ayrıca bin 398 kişinin ise teslim olduğunu açıkladı.
There is a open fact! Those TSK officers and Generals are in prison, without started trial on any court! They are still searching and looking for some undidentifyed documents, where they suspect something which they have not found!
Normaly no one should kept in prison when a trial has not been started!
If they would have started a trial and they supose that these generals would left turkey, than the court and public prosecutor's office oculd send them into prison. But first the trial have to start!
Those people, reporter and officers are waiting for burden of proof, but there is nothing.
Take it serious, what would you say, when I would tell everywhere fairy tales about you, that you are a terrorist, wihtout any burdon of proof, and they would put you immediatly into prison for some years wihtout starting a trial???
Would this be a normal behaviour?
They are taking in first line our laws under their foods and show everyone that they can do whatever they want with everyone. This is the same sheme like it was under Hitler between 1933-1944! Compare it.
Everyone who has another ideology or another view have been send into prison! Same way is taken from AKP.
They clear their political enemies, thats for true. But this is not the way how it goes in a democracy!
I'm also tracking the news and political moves of AKP and one is for sure. They are trying to bring islamistic repulic to turkey step by step. They try to stay at the power forever under islamistic rules like Iran and sheria.
That has nothing to do wiht democracy!
Take the new laws which they have brought and double check it. You will see that those are not really good. They are not realy good for the people. Those are very good for AKP and to rule the country that way, which they want.
Secularizm means freedom and free opinion and free life for all people! Sheria is a dictatory ruled by some religious leaders! Which you think is better?
First of all everyone (it doesn't matter which relgious he as or which political line he is following, and without racizm) should be free until a trial starts and the court make a decision!
And this is not to seen in Ergenekon, Balyoz or something else regarding to our military officers!
Why was no one in prison in "Fener sorusturmasi"? They have get enough facts and documents which undelines the thiefs and what they have done! Why? Because they where AKP politicals and AKP was and still is ruling the goverment!
Why have no one put in prison because of over 30 killed and burned people in "madimak hoteli/sivas"? They all knew who the murderer were! Why? Because they where AKP people and politicals!
So this should be enough to open your eyes and hopeint that you will look much more objective to the scene called politics.
do not make "Mahalle dedikodusu", amke real pllitics and learn to see through and see behind the news and decisions in politics!
---------------------------------------------
Ne Mutlu Türküm Diyene - NMTD
"Özgürlük ve bagimsizlik benim karakterimdir"
Mustafa Kemal ATATÜRK
(Nutuk, 1919)
Br
NMTD
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Subject: Balyoz CD'lerine eklenme var" diyen irket, ABD'de manet
NOT: Bu haber, 27 Nisan 2012de, saat 09:00 civarnda VATAN web sayfasnda yaynlandktan ksa bir süre sonra kaldrlmtr.
Balyoz CDlerine eklenme var diyen irket, ABDde manet
Gölcükte bulunan CD ve hard disklerde sahtecilik yapld iddiasn inceleyen Amerikan Arsenal irketinin patronu Mark Spencer, aratrma sürecini Bostondaki yerel Chelsea Record gazetesine anlatt. Spencer Bu tür bir delil sahteciliini ispat etmek ABDde Watergate skandaln ortaya çkarmak gibi olurdu yorumunu yapyor
Balyoz davasna temel oluturan CD ve hard diskler için Çetin Doann damad olan Harvard Üniversitesi profesör Dani Rodrikin isteiyle inceleme yapan Arsenal Consulting isimli Amerikan irketinin bandaki Mark Spencer, inceleme sürecini Bostondaki yerel gazete Chelsea Recorda anlatt. Gazetenin manetten duyurduu haberde Binlerce veri arasnda inceleme yapan irket için kendilerine gönderilen 3 CD (Türk basnnda 11, 16 ve 17nci CDler olarak bilinen CDler) ve hard disk çocuk oyuncayd. Ama neyin içine girdiklerini bilmiyorlard. Bunlar Türkiyede son yllardaki en önemli dava ile ilgili çok önemli delillerdi ifadesi kullanld. Spencer, Adli tp açsndan konumak gerekirse bu bildiimiz tarzda basit bir doküman sahtecilii deildi. Bunu yapan insanlartutarl olabilmek için çok büyük çaba harcamlar. Asl bu tutarllk beni çok artt. Daha önce birçok sahtecilik vakasyla karlatk ama böyle bir eyi hayatm boyunca görmedim. Ustalk ii ve tutarl olduklarn söyleyebilirim diye yorumlad inceleme sürecini ise öyle anlatt:
Yaz karakterleri üphesi
Birçok kii bir doküman üzerinde ne kadar çok iz braktklarnn farknda deildir. Biz Arsenalde, insanlarn varlndan bile haberdar olmadklar bu izleri inceleriz. Bize gelen bu CD ve hard diskte yer alan darbe planlarnn 2003 ylnda hazrland belirtilmiti. imiz bunlarn gerçekten 2003te kaydedilip kaydedilmediine bakmakt. O yüzden bu izler arasnda özellikle tarihlere younlatk. lk incelememizde her ey normal gözüküyordu. Ancak detayl inceleme yaptmzdaz her eyin normal gözükmesinin asl sebebinin bu sahtecilii yapan kiilerin çok dikkatli davranmas olduunu anladk. Dokümanlara derinlemesine baktmzda Calibri adl yaz karakterine (font) ilikin referanslar bulduk. Microsoft Word programn kullanan herkes bu fontu bilir. Ayrca belgelerde XML uzantl dosya referanslar gördük. Her ikisi de 2003 ylnda kullanlmayan, hatta o dönemde icat bile edilmemi eylerdi. O an bu ite çok büyük bir yanllk var diye düündük. Sonunda 9 Powerpoint belgesinde XML uzantsna atf, 71 Word ve Excel belgesinde de Calibri ve Cambria adl yaz karakterleri bulduk. Hemen Microsoft ile iletiime geçip bu yaz karakterlerini icat eden kiiye ulatk. Bize bunlarn ilk kez Microsoftun Office 2007 kullanlmaya balanan karakterler olduunu söyledi. Yani zaman makineniz yoksa bu belgeleri 2003 ylnda kaydetmi olma ihtimaliniz de yoktu...
2004 deil 2009
Benzer bir durum hard disk konusunda da yaand. Hard diske 2009 ylnn temmuz aynda el konulmu, Türkiyede bir askeri deniz üssünde depoda youn güvenlik altnda tutulmutu. Bu diskte 8 Nisan 2004 tarihinde kaydeldii görülen 120 dosya ve klasör bulduk. Ancak dosya sisteminde daha derinlemesine inceleme yaptmzda bu belgelerin 28 Temmuz 2009dan önce kaydedilmi olmasnn imkansz olduunu anladk. Bize göre biri bu diski tarihi geriye alnm bir bilgisayara balayp bu 120 dosyay aktardktan sonra yerine geri koymu olmal.. CDler ve hard disk ile ilgili raporumuza 11 ve 17 numaral CDlerde bulunan 76 dosyann sahte olduunu yazdk.
Watergatee benziyor
Gazeteye CDlere sonradan eklenmi bölümleri ekranda gösteren Spencer için Chelsea Recordun yorumu, Bu tür bir delil sahteciliini ispat etmek ABDde Watergate skandaln ortaya çkarmak gibi olurdu eklinde oldu.
Key Evidence in Major Turkish Trial Blown to Pieces by Chelsea Company
April 26, 2012
By Seth Daniel
Mark Spencer, owner of Arsenal Consulting on Admiral's Hill, played a key part in finding forged documents that were crucial pieces of evidence in a major government trial in Turkey. Here, at his office, he points to several documents he found to be falsified.
When Mark Spencer agreed to get involved in a new case earlier this year which involved a criminal trial in Turkey, he didnt know what he was getting into.
He was given just three CDs and later a computer hard drive; pretty small potatoes for a computer forensics company located on Commandants Way that typically searches through mountains of electronic data to root out corporate fraud.
But the data on the CDs and hard drive was different; it was the key evidence in one of the most important and divisive government corruption trials that Turkey has seen in more than a generation a trial that has gone on for years and has hinged upon documents contained on the CDs and the hard drive.
And Spencers company, Arsenal Consulting, was about to blow that evidence to pieces from his small office in Chelsea; digging deep into the abyss of hidden computer data and coming out with definitive proof that the evidence had been elaborately and carefully forged.
His analysis has rocked the country of Turkey, yet Spencer said he would have never guessed what he was getting into when he first took the case.
My initial thought was that this case would be pretty small for us in the grand scheme of things, said Spencer. When presented with three CDs and a hard drive, I didnt think it would be a very big deal given what we normally do, which is analyzing volumes of data hundreds if not thousands of times larger than that. I was wrong.
Through a common acquaintance, Spencer had been contacted by Harvard University professor Dani Rodrik whose father-in-law is one of more than 300 defendants facing charges in the trial.
Rodrik and his wife originally from Turkey felt that the documents, which allegedly detailed a coup attempt in 2003 of the then-newly elected Islamist government, were all fakes.
This is the most important political trial in Turkey in at least 50 years, Rodrik told the Record. More than 300 officers are on trial for allegedly having planned a coup back in 2003 against the newly elected Islamist government.
Marks evidence is important because it comes from an independent American expert, and because it is also so conclusive about the forgery, continued Rodrik. Its also important that some of the evidence of forgery Mark documented is very easy to explain to the general public. For example, documents that are purportedly from 2003 contain references to a font that Microsoft first introduced in 2006. That sort of makes it clear to everyone that the files are bogus and the prosecution malicious.
Added Spencer, If Im left with anything from a forensic perspective, it would be that this wasnt your typical document forgery. Those responsible for forging these documents went through a s
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Added Spencer, If Im left with anything from a forensic perspective, it would be that this wasnt your typical document forgery. Those responsible for forging these documents went through a significant amount of effort trying to be consistent. It was the consistency that surprised me. Weve dealt with a lot ot forgeries in the past and Ive never seen something like this. Basically, I would say they were crafty and consistent.
FINDING THE FONT
Spencer and his company quickly set out to see what they could find, knowing that most forgers arent even aware of the depths and levels of computer data that are attached to most files.
Arsenal frequently digs into digital places that few know even exist even skilled digital forgers.
Using powerful computer forensics tools, Spencer said they were on the lookout for anything especially dates that didnt align with what the government in Turkey said was the official timeline. The documents that supposedly detailed plans by the military to enact the coup on the new government were allegedly saved in 2003.
Spencer said that upon their initial investigation, things looked legitimate, but in hindsight it was only because the forgers had been so thorough.
Upon a deeper analysis of the CDs, Spencer said hidden in the documents were references to the Calibri font something just about anyone who has used Microsoft Word is familiar with as well as references to a particular type of XML file.
The major problem with that and a key part of the forgery proof was that those things werent even invented yet in 2003, when the files were supposedly created and last saved.
When we got a little more aggressive and found the font and XML issues, thats when we knew something was very, very wrong here, said Spencer. Ultimately, we found nine Powerpoint files had references to a particular type of XML and 71 Word and Excel documents had references to ClearType fonts like Calibri and Cambria. We talked to the creator of those fonts, and they werent available in Microsoft Office until the 2007 version.
Believing the files were legitimate was becoming more and more of a stretch of the imagination.
We were getting to the point where there was no legitimate way the files landed on there in 2003 unless were going to believe in time machines, he said. Its just simply not possible.
A similar situation unfolded with the hard drive, which was seized on July 2009 and stored at a Naval base in Turkey, supposedely under tight security.
We found 120 files and folders on the drive that on first glance appear to have been created April 8, 2004, but we know from digging into the file system that they couldnt have been created before July 28, 2009, he said. Coincidentally, many if not all of the incriminating documents are in that batch of 120 files and folders. The most likely scenario is someone attached that drive to a computer which was already backdated and copied those files and folders to the drive, then detached the hard drive and put it back.
His final analysis was quite an incredible turn of events in Turkey, as well as in his Chelsea office.
In his reports to the Turkish court submitted in late March he wrote regarding the CDs, Arsenal has concluded that dates and times related to at least 76 documents found on CDs 11 and 17 have been forged.
COURTS NOT PAYING ATTENTION
Such bombshell evidence would be the equivalent of proving Watergate in the United States proving that the sitting government had forged evidence to convict its political enemies.
It would be the subject of media reports for weeks upon weeks.
However, in Turkey where Rodrik said many journalists are imprisoned for what they write the story hasnt gotten the credit it deserves. Even the courts are refusing to acknowledge the evidence despite popular uprising and a massive courtroom protest by the attorneys of the accused.
It is a very big case in Turkey, and it is closely followed, said Rodrik. Because the case against the officers is heavily supported by the government, it is also politically a very divisive trial. Pro-government media have been a source of disinformation about the case, and they have not covered the evidence that Mark presents. They have only run stories trying to discredit the findings. Other mainstream media are reluctant to cover the forgery because of strong government pressure to toe the line. Turkey, after all, holds more journalists in prison these days than China and Iran taken together. In a country with a free press, the story would have been front-page news for days on end, and would have resulted in the resignation of at least a couple of government ministers. In Turkey, coverage has been repressed.
GUILTY VERDICT LIKELY, BUT SEARCH CONTINUES
For those in America who are used to getting action when definitive evidence is presented, such as was done by Arsenal it might be a surprise that the conclusion of the trial is likely already decided.
Rodrik said that even though the judge knows Spencers evidence is solid, and that the documents are fake, hell probably render a guilty verdict.
Despite repeated requests from the defense, the judge has refused to follow up and appoint his own experts to verify or challenge Marks findings, for the simple reason that the judge is well aware of the forged nature of the evidence, said Rodrik. The judge is expected to issue a verdict almost certainly guilty in a couple of weeks.
Spencer said the unique case isnt over, though, in his mind.
Were not convinced there are just 80 forged documents, he said, noting that this is the first case in three years hes been able to discuss publicly. Weve identified many more documents that have suspicious characteristics, but well only make definitive statements about them when we are absolutely sure.
Jagare, curuk olabilir ona lafim yok, hatta vatan hainleri bile olabilir ona da lafim yok hatta vatan hainleri varsa asilmalilar derim!
Ancak ortada oyle bir oyun donuyor ki, bir komedivari bir yargilama sureci. Ustelik yargilamadan cikti habire birseyler ekleniyor sozde dosyalara, ve zaman zaman yeni yargiclar ataniyor bu sozde yargilamaya (yani habire silbastan gidiliyor, maksat uzadikca uzatmak ve degerli silahli grubu mensuplarini hicbir kesin yargi olmadan iceride tutmak, daha 1 kisi bile yargilanmadi ama adamlar 3-4 senedir iceride)
Buna yargi degil, ancak yargi katliami denir (ustelik ortada iftiralardan baska birsey yokken gudumlu medya adini ergenekon "teror" grubu koydu)
Art niyet gun gibi ortada, eli kanli Ocalan bile boyle terorist muamelesi gormedi.
--------------------------------------------
Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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"There is a open fact! Those TSK officers and Generals are in prison, without started trial on any court! "
- Do you actually think that AKP brought that law in?
- Are you saying the politicians should be giving instructions to the judiciary, arrest this person or that person?
- Do you realise that it's the AKP who's trying to change the law and not anyone else?
Judicial reform package to make pre-trial detention difficult
Minister of Justice Sadullah Ergin on Wednesday announced a new judicial reform package that, among many other things, aims to make it difficult for courts to issue detention orders for suspects before trial.
The package, which introduces nearly 100 amendments to the Turkish Penal Code (TCK), the Code on Criminal Procedure (CMK), the Counterterrorism Law (TMK) and the Enforcement and Bankruptcy Law, was designed to increase democratization in line with the standards of the European Court of Human Rights (ECtHR) and ease the judiciary's burden by accelerating judicial processes, Ergin said.
Here's a clue as to why the Turkish army hasn't been as successful against the PKK as it could've been.
Transcript of Heron treason phone conversation makes way to media
27 July 2010 / TODAYS ZAMAN, STANBUL
The Bugün daily on Monday published the transcript of phone conversations between two air officers who discussed shooting down Heron unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) to protect terrorists of the Kurdistan Workers' Party (PKK).
The conversation first made its way into the media around two weeks ago. The phone conversation created outrage nationwide because one of the officers, a senior lieutenant, referred to PKK militants as our men and asked the officer on the other end of the line, an air forces pilot, to shoot down Herons. In response, the pilot said he would take care of the issue.
In the transcript, the lieutenant says there is a major problem stemming from the Herons deployed in the southeastern province of Batman. The problem is, you know, the vehicle is monitoring the area in Batman. It is detecting clear images and information [about terrorists]. If possible, we should render them ineffective. If not, we should play with its images and coordinate system, he noted and added: In the past incident, there were many [PKK] losses. I faced serious pressure [from the terrorist organization]. Do what's necessary, OK? The conversation took place on Oct. 10, 2007.
The lieutenant also asked the pilot to be careful of wiretaps on his mobile phone.
According to Bugün, the lieutenant and the pilot were in close contact with a rear admiral during their plan for the Herons. The admiral, identified in the paper as A.S., still remains in his post, as do the other two.
The daily said that Adm. A.S. works at the Office of Defense Cooperation (ODC) in Ankara, the center where visual intelligence information supplied by the US to Turkey on terrorist activity in northern Iraq is processed and shared with units deployed in the Southeast. This center had been referred to as the Big Brother House, alluding to the popular television show of the same name, by former Chief of General Staff Gen. Yaar Büyükant, who had drawn the comparison in an attempt to explain how visible the movements of the terrorists are to the military. ODC instructs land forces that fight terrorists in the area. The Heron scandal broke when the National Intelligence Organization (MT) detected the conversation and informed the Land Forces Command.
The land forces commander at the time, Gen. lker Babu, ordered an investigation into the two officers on Oct. 28, 2007. However, the investigation was stalled when there was a dispute over who had jurisdiction, the Military Prosecutors Office or the Land Forces Prosecutors Office.
In a separate conversation, the lieutenant and the pilot express outrage at MT for exposing their subversive plan. Insulting MT officials, one of the speakers says he had much difficulty in covering up the issue: It was hard to cover up the things, but I managed. I met with the generals. Selçuk [one of the officers] will be sent abroad. But those [MT] bastards put us in a very difficult situation.
Another phone conversation reveals that Selçuk was Lt. Col. Selami Selçuk Ç., the air forces pilot. The pilot had spent one year at the Mamak Military Prison for storing confidential military documents in his personal computer. After the Heron scandal, he was sent to Italy for five months on duty, and he returned to Turkey in February 2008.
The General Staff remained silent for several days on the scandal but broke its silence last week. In a statement found far from convincing by many observers, Gen. Metin Gürak, head of the General Staffs department of communications, said that an ongoing investigation had not provided any clue about the identity or military ranks of the officers implicated in the recordings. He also said the Military Prosecutors Office is continuing its search for evidence related to the incident.
Save Mustafa ., he will become air forces commander in the future
The phone records of one of the officers also revealed yet another scandal within the Air Forces Command. In the conversation, the officer -- whose name was not shared with the public -- discusses with another officer how to save Brig. Gen. Mustafa ., an air forces pilot, from trouble for going abroad twice without official permission. The officer says Mustafa . will become the air forces commander in the future and thus should be saved from trouble.
The two decide to either purge the brigadier generals passport records or to retroactively give him permission for overseas travel.
In an ensuing conversation, the officer gives the other good news about the brigadier generals situation and says the issue will completely be covered up with a good sum of money. The conversation is as follows:
1st officer: On what phase are we for the last problem we talked about?
2nd officer: Sir, it is a very big and risky thing. I am sorry, lets make it clear. We are talking about our commander ., right?
1st officer: Yes.
2nd officer: My commander, those who covered up the issue did a clean job. They took a great risk.
1st officer: Yes, I know. We had no time. Now it is time to make money talk.
2nd officer: Whats the limit?
1st officer: This job is worth everything. There is no money limit. The important thing is to resolve the issue.
2nd officer: Its all right, commander. If there is no problem with money, we can solve it easily.
Here's a clue as to why the Turkey hasn't been as successful against the PKK as it could've been:
Uur Mumcu also published books on current and historical political issues of Turkey. He was investigating the Kurdistan Workers' Party's ties with the National Intelligence Organization (MT) at the time of his assassination.[4][5][6]
Shortly before his death, Mumcu was investigating how 100,000 firearms owned by the Turkish Armed Forces ended up in the hands of Jalal Talabani, one of the Kurdish leaders of northern Iraq and, as of 2008, president of Iraq. Twenty-five days after Mumcu, General Eref Bitlis, who was investigating the same issue, died in a plane crash, believed to be due to sabotage.[5] In his 8 January Cumhuriyet article, titled Ültimatom, Mumcu emphatically stated that he would soon reveal in a new book the ties between Kurdish nationalists and some intelligence organizations (i.e., Abdullah Öcalan and the National Intelligence Organization).[7]
According to his son, Özgür, Mumcu had an appointment with retired prosecutor Baki Tu on 27 January to learn more about Abdullah Öcalan's suspected ties with the MIT (the state was officially fighting his militant organization, the PKK).[8] Öcalan was detained on 31 March 1972 while studying political sciences at the University of Ankara. Per clause 16/1 of the Martial Law ( 1402), he was sentenced to three months in jail for participating in a boycott. He was released on 24 October 1972 after the National Intelligence Organization forwarded a message to the prosecutor handling the case, Tu, that one of the suspects was one of their agents. Tu later said that he could not remember whether the agent was Öcalan, or one of the other suspects.[9]
Do you gotveren also realise that the teror went from zero to max in the time of the reign of AKP? Ofcourse the first years there where not so many PKK death, but thanx to AKP idiots they have managed to regain full strength once again. Under AKP reign Kurds can freely slap police officers, beat doctors etc.
You talk about so called tapped telephone conversations, well if true what is keeping the judges to give live sentences? If there is indeed genuine crime it should be punished most severely, but no they rather play around with 20 thousand page dossiers full of lies, accusation from so called PKK deserters, change many times a judge just to prolong the investigation period, meanwhile professional soldier are 4 years imprissoned without any verdict. Jay AKP victory (I call it treason of highest level!) and gotverens like you applauding it.
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Turkiye Turklerindir (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)
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Nutuk you talk very different about the topic in different threads. I think deep down you also know nirva has a valid point but are too stubborn to admit. I also find it hard to believe but its better to face the truth than to keep ignoring it..
You and i both know the PKK uprise dont have anything to do with AKP but more with the iraqi war and inside traitors helping PKK to put pressure on AKP.. Please dont act like you know different.
I also have read a few things about ugur mumcu (a leftist but highly respectable and nationalistic man). I strongly recommend you read one or two things of him to get a better idea of whats really going on. Abdullah catli is from his time as well. read some stuff about it. The PKK isnt a small issue its being supported by international powers and traitors.
They covered up and burried some big stuff in the 90s when people were about to unveil the truth. So much dirt can only be hidden for so long.. its time to dig it up and face it in order to deal with it.
None of us have to act surprised when we hear commanders sell out. Its the money they do it for and they know they can get away with it. Even many here in waff would sell their mother for the right price! Unfortunately some commanders think the same way and the sad part it they always managed to get away with it. (I also said before i know some (reliable) people who have withnessed the money transfers way back even in the 80s).. think whatever you want but the SE has been used as the wild west by some of our commanders. hard to swallow i know.
last but not the least. I really think this is so big what AKP is trying to dig up that they cant even reveal a huge part to public. I really think that if we get to see the whole picture that the whole country will rise up just like that! Its not only the army also secret service, politicians lawyers, judges, prosecutors are in it. really just read some of ugur mumcu. If you dig up stuff from turgut ozal to ugur mumcu and all between you will get the picture.. and thats why i fully agree with nirv
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