HunnicTurk (Login HunnicTurk) The Conquerors (Turkey)
The name of Turk possible came from Trojan Genaral Turcus. He migrated to Turkistan with his faithful soldiers when the Troy demolished. (james Harper)
James Harper, "Rome versus Istanbul: Competing Claims and the Moral Value of Trojan Heritage"
When Ottoman Empire began to emerge as a Mediterranean power, renaissance Europeans struggled to explain the origins and successes of the Ottomans. According to one popular theory, the Turks took their name from Turcus, leader of a band of Trojans who fled into the interior of Asia after the fall of Troy. Having lived in obscurity for millennia, Turcus' descendents were reemerging to claim their destiny and revive the "glory of Ilium". This, and similar theories that connected the Turks and the Trojans, excited vigorous opposition: the debates over the origins of the Turks demonstrate the importance and moral value that Trojan heritage held in the Renaissance imagination. Through "Pius Aeneas", the legendary founder of the Roman people, both the pope (as Pontifex Maximus) and the Holy Roman Emperor claimed a Trojan heritage. Sharing these claims with anyone, especially a non-christian people, would dilute the symbolic power that identification with Troy generated. As Catholic Europe began to feel more directly threatened by the territorial expansion and cultural "otherness" of the Ottoman Empire, arguments against the Trojan origins of the Turks took on a greater urgency. A dignity and moral value were implicit to Trojan heritage, and the increasing enmity between Istanbul and Rome dictated that these very qualities be denied to an enemy people. Scholars, including Pope Pius II himself, dedicated their energies to refuting the association of the Turks and the Trojans. At the same time, there was a proliferation of visual imagery that celebrated the Trojan heritage of the west. Though this iconographic trend is often attributed to a generic Renaissance interest in classical antiquity, this paper will argue that images of the Flight of Aeneas from Troy spring from the same causes and belong to the same discourse as written works like Nicolaus Sagunido's De Turcarum Origine.
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Yes we are. Both Ataturk and Mehmet II said their victories over the subhuman griks were in the name of Hector.
No matter the era, whichever the society, people always gaze at the stars when young. Then they stretch out their hands and try to catch them. And then one day, they realize their arms are not long enough to catch the stars, and thats when they grow up.
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funny that... how these 'ancient turks' who lived in troy spoke greek
because HECTOR is a greek name
it means 'holder, stayer' (See below)
hector
late 14c., "a valiant warrior," 1650s as slang for "a blustering, turbulent, pervicacious, noisy fellow" [Johnson], Heck for short, both in reference to the provocative character of Hektor, Trojan hero, oldest son of Priam and Hecuba, in the "Iliad." It represents Gk. hektor, lit. "holder, stayer;" an agent noun from ekhein "to have, hold, possess" (see scheme). The word was used mid-1600s in reference to London street gangs. As a proper name it is rare in England but used in Scotland to render Gael. Eachdonn. As a verb, from 1650s. Related: Hectored; hectoring.
ancient turks, living in troy, asia minor, greece etc all speaking greek, amazing how educated these ancient turks must have been to speak greek also and turkish
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This message has been edited by romulus007 on Jul 14, 2012 2:11 PM
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No matter the era, whichever the society, people always gaze at the stars when young. Then they stretch out their hands and try to catch them. And then one day, they realize their arms are not long enough to catch the stars, and thats when they grow up.
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Oh, yes Hector the Turk! Why do the Turks deny their Turanic ancestors from Central Asia? Are they ashamed of them?
You know, the Turks may be right! Read the poem "TROJANS" of the great Greek writer C. Kavafy and you will know what I mean!
The Turks recently faced the crisis of the Cypriot gas drilling. And indeed they acted like Trojans.
Uncle Bibbi, who led the Cyprus-Israel-Greece coalition, acted as Achilles!
Here we go:
TROJANS
Our efforts are those of men prone to disaster;
our efforts are like those of the Trojans.
We just begin to get somewhere,
gain a little confidence,
grow almost bold and hopeful,
when something always comes up to stop us:
Achilles leaps out of the trench in front of us
and terrifies us with his violent shouting.
Our efforts are like those of the Trojans.
We think well change our luck
by being resolute and daring,
so we move outside ready to fight.
But when the great crisis comes,
our boldness and resolution vanish;
our spirit falters, paralyzed,
and we scurry around the walls
trying to save ourselves by running away.
Yet we are sure to fail. Up there,
high on the walls, the dirge has already begun.
Theyre mourning the memory, the aura of our days.
Priam and Hecuba mourn for us bitterly.
..
"The Turkish Cypriots looted, robbed and ravaged Greek Cypriot properties. They must start producing instead of being mere consumers. The Turkish Cypriots wanted to live without working!"
Major-General Bedrettin Demirel (1917-1988)
Commander of the Turkish Invasion Forces in 1974
This message has been edited by GavurYunan on Jul 14, 2012 2:26 PM This message has been edited by GavurYunan on Jul 14, 2012 2:22 PM
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Because Greeks had contact with Trojans doesn't make Trojans Greek. Trojans were related to hittitie people who are all Anatolians and have nothing to do with Greeks. One Trojan princess was called Turkus!!!!! And he fled to the east. Western historians said at the time that The Turks/Trojans had returned from the east to revenge troy and we did.
We have rewritten history and revenged troy during Greco / Turkish war when we cleaned Greeks from Anatolia.
-----------------------------
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the ancient turks spoke greek, had greek names, greek gods
they even made greek temples, greek theatres
these ancient turks were very educated
someone should study them more... how is it we only study the ancient greeks and not the ancient turks who were just as good and spoke both greek and turkish!?
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you created an identity on our backs.
do not forget you were nomads, no civilization. no culture, no history worth mentioning. your tour guides in asia minor spread lies, that your nomadic race built wonders of the world, irrigation and drainage networks. When we were building temples out of marble, you were setting up animal hide tents. You are an infereior race and any turk with a bit of intelligence will admit as much. Turko, take of your fesi and give thanks to the hellene that gave you civilization.
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Romulus, stay on the thread! Let us make fun of them, since they offer us so much ammunition!
..
"The Turkish Cypriots looted, robbed and ravaged Greek Cypriot properties. They must start producing instead of being mere consumers. The Turkish Cypriots wanted to live without working!"
Major-General Bedrettin Demirel (1917-1988)
Commander of the Turkish Invasion Forces in 1974
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Omiros- Homer who wrote the Iliad was a Turk too! I am serious, some of their books say it!
You know Omiros, Homer, Omer. Like Omer Vryonis!
By the way, could the Turks give more information on the great Turko-Trojan Princess "Turkus"? Sadly, Homer does not mention her in his Iliad!How forgetful of him!
..
"The Turkish Cypriots looted, robbed and ravaged Greek Cypriot properties. They must start producing instead of being mere consumers. The Turkish Cypriots wanted to live without working!"
Major-General Bedrettin Demirel (1917-1988)
Commander of the Turkish Invasion Forces in 1974
This message has been edited by GavurYunan on Jul 14, 2012 3:01 PM
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Iliad narrates a beautiful story: Before the battle, the Trojan priests tell Crown Prince Hector not to fight because the Omens of the Gods were unfavourable:
Hector gave a defiant answer to the priests and went to fight the battle.
I quote the reply of Turko-Trojan Prince Hector in perfect Turkish, exactly as it was recorded in Iliad, word by word, letter by letter:
EIS OIONOS ARISTOS, AMYNESTHAI PERI PATRHS!
Could the Turkish friends be kind enough to translate the reply of Turkish Prince Hector?
..
"The Turkish Cypriots looted, robbed and ravaged Greek Cypriot properties. They must start producing instead of being mere consumers. The Turkish Cypriots wanted to live without working!"
Major-General Bedrettin Demirel (1917-1988)
Commander of the Turkish Invasion Forces in 1974
This message has been edited by GavurYunan on Jul 14, 2012 3:12 PM
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Turk, translate to us the reply of Turko-Trojan Crown Prince Hector. Please!
TIP: Do not try Google Translator, it does not work with Ancient Greek.
..
"The Turkish Cypriots looted, robbed and ravaged Greek Cypriot properties. They must start producing instead of being mere consumers. The Turkish Cypriots wanted to live without working!"
Major-General Bedrettin Demirel (1917-1988)
Commander of the Turkish Invasion Forces in 1974
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How do you know? Did you eavesdrop the Trojans? Any written monuments of their language? Any scripts in Troy?
Turkce belongs to the Mongolian Uraloaltaic linguistic family. Is there a connection of the Trojan language to this family?
Could you give me the names of the Trojan Royal family?
How about some information on "princess Turkus"?
You understand how much you amuse me, don't you?
..
"The Turkish Cypriots looted, robbed and ravaged Greek Cypriot properties. They must start producing instead of being mere consumers. The Turkish Cypriots wanted to live without working!"
Major-General Bedrettin Demirel (1917-1988)
Commander of the Turkish Invasion Forces in 1974
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Grikos, you are not indigenous people. Neither in the balkans and neither in Anatolia. You arrived in Anatolia and hellenized the indigenous Anatolian people and now call it your own. 1000 year later we come and do the same and we're accused of Turkification. Either you are very jealous of the current owners or you lack any reasoning and logic.
No matter the era, whichever the society, people always gaze at the stars when young. Then they stretch out their hands and try to catch them. And then one day, they realize their arms are not long enough to catch the stars, and thats when they grow up.
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Etruscans are TURK! Dont let these savages destroy and steal our heritage!
No matter the era, whichever the society, people always gaze at the stars when young. Then they stretch out their hands and try to catch them. And then one day, they realize their arms are not long enough to catch the stars, and thats when they grow up.
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Turks are unlikely to be the descendents of the Trojans per se, but it is a geographic and historical certainty that whatever descendents there may have been left of the Trojans are now a part of the unified Turkish society.
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Troy was an ancient Hellenic colony. This is an enstablished and well-known fact. We knew you were jealous of our history but trying to be copycats like the Albo-Bulgarians of FYRO"M" is too cheap, even for you Turks.
Whether we are Troyan descendants or not I have no idea but one thing is very clear that we are a Trojan curse on all Hellenic people. When you guys burned down Troy I am sure the trojans cursed you that you yunan swines will experience the same fate one day. We Turks made you experience that twice, Constantinople 1453 and Izmir 1922. on the top of that we had turned you rums into our slaves for over 500 years. Now that's what I call a payback.
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This message has been edited by _mt on Jul 14, 2012 9:04 PM This message has been edited by _mt on Jul 14, 2012 9:02 PM
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Over 500 years? 1821-1453 = 368 years, which is very short considering Byzantium ruled for over a millenium. Also, since Trojans were ancient Hellens I'm pretty sure they cursed the Acheans (name for the mainland Greeks that attacked them). You burned Smyrni(Izmir) and Constantinople like the barbarian and cultureless people you were, which are both situated in Asia Minor. So chances are you killed more Trojan descendants than Achean descendants.
Perhaps their "curse" backfired (if curses could have an actual impact and all that).
@trosas: 1453 is the conquest of Istanbul. Anatolia was in fact in the hands of Turks since 11th century end most of the western side of Aegean sea was already in Turkish hands in the 13xx.
No matter the era, whichever the society, people always gaze at the stars when young. Then they stretch out their hands and try to catch them. And then one day, they realize their arms are not long enough to catch the stars, and thats when they grow up.
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Don't make empty statements that everybody in this world is hellenes. Post sources.
Nobody is hellenes besides the fking gayreek arab indian gypsies that live in the artificial state called Greece. You lived 500 years under the ottoman empire, there is no greek left in you.
-----------------------------
Next week in cinema: Hungry Dancing
New Greek multinational firm:
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Troy is a mythical story based on Homers imagination.. there is absolutely NO proof that it even existed, let alone spawned the characters that the Turks think are their ancestors.. some sort of ancient Greek tribe.. Ask yourselves.. do you speak Greek, do you write or have ever written in the Greek script and have your ancient Gods the same attributes and names as ours?
Because Homers "Trojans" did..
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There is some evidence they DID exist. By doing a simple research you can find information about that. However we're not sure if the war took place and even if it did, we can't be sure of the causes/reasons/statistics Homer gave us.
As far as the "Troy was Turkish" claims they amuse me like all other WAFF BS topics similar to this one. Only in such forums you can find such retarded topics
The concept of Troy has been romantised by people for millennia.. It's a MYTH mate..
The only hing that's fact.. is that you Turko's are just trying to justify the fact that you live in anothers country.. by trying to claim linkage to a land that is alien to you and your kind..
Go back to the Altic mountains.. That's your home NOT Anatolia..
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Thats not true.. The ruins that have been touted as those of Troy.. Have been investigated and measured by historians and archeologist and found to be in no way even close to the legend.. It's a myth that even he Romans used to establish a noble lineage.. I suggest you read up on it..
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hiddenwolf, if your lack of proper education is so significant that you don't know anything about the history of the region, then perhaps you should start paying for 101 history classes or you could move your lazy azz and use google (not recommended but it's the least you can do).
Sources are needed to justify something controversial. You will never find an article trying to persuade the readers that "Italy is located in Europe, not Africa!", since it's common knowledge that Italy is located in Europe. Likewise it's common knowledge that Troy was an ancient Hellenic colonial state and very few sources will try to prove what is obvious. Good luck with finding those.
Here, perhaps this map of the ancient Greek colonization might help you:
[Coalde Note: Image resized to alleviate horizontal scrolling...and Jesus! I just wrote how to do this in the Help section.]
Troy was nothing more than just another ancient Hellenic colonial state, nobody can question that. Especially uneducated and ultranationalist Turks (you cannot get any more biased and therefore your opinion is of no value).
So what is your position then? That Greek homeland is Anatolia? hahahaha, you killed Trojans and other Anatolians. We Turks kicked you out of Anatolia and revenged the Trojans. What is it that you can't understand? Even historians agree with this, the only thing you can do is whine and troll hahahah. Every Greek on Anatolian soil is an insult for native Anatolian people:
^It was never yours to begin with. Did your existence start in Anatolia? Dont think this land still belongs to you after 1000 years of Turkish rule. Continents have been found, USA has been found in a shorter amount of time.
As for the indigenous Anatolian people, you griks hellenized them, they never were grik to begin with.
No matter the era, whichever the society, people always gaze at the stars when young. Then they stretch out their hands and try to catch them. And then one day, they realize their arms are not long enough to catch the stars, and thats when they grow up.
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You're a spastic hidden nut job.. It's like saying that the British government claiming that all British citizens are decendents of numenor.. Because Tolkian was a British citizen..
Wake up!
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As a Greek I'm pissed that not only Europeans but now even you Turko's are leaching off our history and legends.. Phuck off and get your own...lol
Hidden nut job..
The people in the ancient Mediterranean basin intermingled and share the same basic ethnicity.. Basically we're from the same stock.. Nothing to do with you horse thieves..
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Answer my question faggot. Did your existence start in Anatolia? America was discovered in 1492. Do you still think you can claim any rights to our lands? You're the whacko nutjob here, delusional megalomaniac.
No matter the era, whichever the society, people always gaze at the stars when young. Then they stretch out their hands and try to catch them. And then one day, they realize their arms are not long enough to catch the stars, and thats when they grow up.
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Now what the fvck are you blabbering about now venerial domination?
Greeks and he peoples of the med basin ( before you mutts came outta Asia) were similar in DNA.. Just like the true Turks share the same characteristics as the Chinese.. So we share with the Romans and Etruscans.. In fact, the Etruscans share a alphabet with us.. While you embarrassed Turks have nothing to show other than the chicken scratching you inherited from the Arabs and then copied the Latin script which in turn derives from the Greek..
Funny how eventually you Turks keep coming full circle with Hellenism...lol
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HunnicTurk (Login HunnicTurk) The Conquerors (Turkey)
Re: Are Turks In Fact Trojans?
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July 14 2012, 11:05 PM
Lazy griks, can't you up you @sses and read the article. It was write about Trojan General Turcus. This theory haven't been wrote by me. It's belong to western historians. We don't shame of our central asian background.
"The Turks took their name from Turcus, leader of a band of Trojans who fled into the interior of Central Asia after the fall of Troy."
James Gordon Harper
Education:
University of Pennsylvania (Philadelphia, PA), Ph. D. in the History of Art, 1998.
Dissertation Title: The Barberini Tapestries of the Life of Pope Urban VIII: Program,
Politics and Perfect History for the Post-Exile Era (Malcolm Campbell, supervisor).
Trinity College (Hartford, CT), B.A. in History, 1987.
Employment:
University of Oregon, Associate Professor & Director of Undergraduate Studies,
Department of Art History. Responsible for graduate and undergraduate courses in
Renaissance and Baroque Art of Europe and Latin America (Assistant Professor 2000-
2007; Associate Professor 2007-2010).
Trinity College (Hartford, CT)
1999-2000 (with rank of Visiting Assistant Professor in the Department of Fine Arts):
Responsible for general surveys of Western Art and advanced undergraduate courses in
Baroque Art.
1996-1997 (with rank of Lecturer on the Trinity College Rome Program): responsible for
teaching on-site undergraduate courses in Renaissance and Baroque Art & Architecture.
Harvard University Art Museums, the Agnes Mongan Center for the Study of Prints,
Drawings, and Photographs (Cambridge, MA).
1998-1999: Philip and Lynn Strauss Curatorial Intern, Department of Drawings.
1999-2001: Guest Curator for the exhibition Verso: The Flip Side of Master Drawings.
Philadelphia Museum of Art, (Philadelphia, PA).
1997-1998: Research Assistant, Department of European Sculpture & Decorative Arts
1990-1993; 1995-96; Staff Lecturer, Department of Adult Education
The whole world including your own historians are in agreement that the Turks came outta central Asia.. I don't know who this nut job is that wrote such an obviously stupid story about some trojan general.. who just happened to escape a burning city that only existed in the head of a paid story teller, Homer..
If you're that embarrassed of your heritage.. Don't fret.. genetically your probably Greek.. So go to the phanar, and ask to be baptised and learn the mother tongue.. That way, you won't have to live the lie that is "Turkishness" and you can believe in story tellers all you like..without having to sound stupid..
This message has been edited by varangian on Jul 14, 2012 11:23 PM This message has been edited by varangian on Jul 14, 2012 11:19 PM
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It is so hard to communicate to a hard headed Greek. They probably can't digest that the Trojan war has been refought and Greeks have been kicked out of Anatolia. Trojans were asiatic people, they were not European.
I speakly proudly when I say no Greeks live in Anatolia anymore. It would not be right for Trojans, Hitittie(related to Trojans) and other people.
What historians have to say about Trojans and Turks:
Turk: We Turks are descendants of Troy...
Hellene: No you aren't, i have tons of proof..
Turk: We are Etruscans...
Hellene: But you came here much later from Mongolia.
Turk: Bah, Macedonia isn't Hellenic..
Hellene: No it is, i have tons of proof abou that too...
Turk: ARGGGGGGGGGGGGG! Gayreece suckzxx! Ottoman Empire FTW!
Hellene: The Ottoman Empire favored the Hellenes much more than the Turks...
Turk: FAKKKK THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE,they were traitors! Kemals faks the SULTAN!!! ARGGGGGGGGGGG!
What i can see from this thread is that Turks are ashamed by their Mongolian and Arab roots and want a connection to an older people...
Your ancestors would be ashamed of you denying your heritage...
The one good thing is that you indirectly accept the superiority of the Hellenic history and culture.
I'm sorry but not every nation can have such a grand history as Hellas...
Blood is blood and identity is identity...you can't change that...
Living in denial won't help...
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...sadly another by-product of Turkishness.. I guess when a people have no other achievements other than being good at stealing act this way.. Cultural theft is what this is.. But the retarded thing is that it's not even true.. Poor Desperate Turok's ..
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"I'm sorry but Turks own your entire late middle ages and early modern period. LOL!
I'm sorry but we had these lands for thousands of years and got many of them back with our glorious revolution.
BTW it was the Crusaders that destoyed Hellas not Turks...Turks didn't even give the final blow, it was the Ottomans that did that..In case you don't get the difference..
Hellenes in Ottoman Empire = Thriving, rich and mostly in high places
Turks in Ottoman Empire = considered inferior, poorer than the Hellenes , living in poor lands etc
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Unfortunately I provided sources. You Greeks can only name call and troll. At the end it won't change the facts because historians agree with me. Read the book I posted. ehmm Oh ****, Greek can't read hahaahahaha. Primitive gypsies.
The only people that have stolen are Greeks. They say they invented everything but in reality they stole everything from middle-eastern civilisations such as the Babylonians.
Greeks=Primitive gypsies that steal
-----------------------------
Next week in cinema: Hungry Dancing
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This message has been edited by hiddenwolf on Jul 15, 2012 12:06 AM
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HunnicTurk (Login HunnicTurk) The Conquerors (Turkey)
Re: Are Turks In Fact Trojans?
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July 15 2012, 12:06 AM
Here another western historians' description about Trojans;
"Turks as Trojans, Trojans as Turks: visiual imagery of the Trojan War and politic of cultural identity in fifteen century Europa. Gilio Romano fully aware of the theory of the Trojan orgin of the Turks, deploys the connection in reverse to cast the Trojans as enemies and flatter the GRECOPHILE ducal family ( Ancient Greek Colonies).Greeks as representive of Europe and the Trojans surrogates for the Turks"
Postcolonial Approaches To The European Middle Ages: Translating Cultures
Ananya Jahanara,Deanne Williams
Read this book, too. I showed the university theses and real history books. But you lazy idiots show me the fake sourche same as wikipeadia. Trojans were Greeks, didn't them you retard albenians.
"After Troy has fallen,Trojan armies were seperated by Two groups.
One group had followed King Priamos's granchild Francon from Hector,other group had followed King Priamos's grandchild Turkus from Troilus.Therefore there are two nations whose names are "Franks" and "Turks" in the world at the moment."
Vincent de Beauvais ( The French Dominican friar Vincent of Beauvais, wrote the Speculum Maius, the main encyclopedia that was used in the Middle Ages)
"Turks' homelands are behind of the Caucassian Mountains.Their roots come from Trojan King Priamos's son Troilos's son Turkos.Turkos and his people migrated these area after Troy city has fallen."
Andrea Dandolo ( Venetian law professor and historian studied at the University of Padua. The Dandolo family is part of the Italian aristocracy and carries the title of count.The branch of the Dandolo family that currently lives in France descends directly from Andrea Dandolo)
"Therefore the heroes of those lands Turkish men and women comes from Hektor's race who was very brave and strong."
l'histoire de Rome
Sebastien Mamerot ( French Historian)
"Turks came back from deepnesses of Asia to take Troy's vengance from Greeks"
Jean Pouchet
"When Trojans had come to Europe, they separated into two ways.
One of them was Francions, the predecessors of Franks and the other one was Turcoths, the predecessors of Turks. Franks had gone to Rhône area while others had stayed in Tisza area.
The others did choose a king for themselves and named him as 'Turcoth', which later formed the name, the Turks, recent forms of nation known as recent Turkish countries..
Frédégaire
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"I'm sorry but we had these lands for thousands of years and got many of them back with our glorious revolution."
No, never. Western Anatolia is as Greek as Southern France, Southern Italy, Eastern Spain and North-East Africa. Eastern Roman Empire was expanded by Romans and Alexander Empire is the short cont of Persian Empire. Modern Grecomen have nothing to do with Ancient Greeks as well. Even they were Arnavites who revolted against Ottoman Empire.
"BTW it was the Crusaders that destoyed Hellas not Turks...Turks didn't even give the final blow, it was the Ottomans that did that..In case you don't get the difference.."
No, never. Byzantines re-captured what they left for crusaders. Turks destroyed both Crusaders and Byzantine Empire.
"Hellenes in Ottoman Empire = Thriving, rich and mostly in high places"
That's the way of the merchant and a state policy which caused Turkification of Anatolia overnight. You got used to leeching and that's why you can't even produce a nail now.
"Turks in Ottoman Empire = considered inferior, poorer than the Hellenes , living in poor lands etc"
As a result, Turks hold the greatest share of Ottoman Empire including all the capitals, paid all it's debts, much richer than Hellenes and 50 years ahead of Hellenistan now.
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Romulus, what you say Greek culinary had been brought by Anatolian immigrants in 1923 (just like rest of the culture) because they are Turkish in fact.
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HunnicTurk (Login HunnicTurk) The Conquerors (Turkey)
Re: Are Turks In Fact Trojans?
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July 15 2012, 12:22 AM
The enigma of Italy's ancient Etruscans is finally unravelled
DNA tests on their Italian descendants show the 'tuscii' came from Turkey
John Hooper in Rome
The Guardian, Monday 18 June 2007
"The DNA samples from Murlo and Volterra are much more highly correlated to those of the eastern peoples than to those of the other inhabitants of [Italy]," said Alberto Piazza of the University of Turin, who presented the research. "One particular genetic variant, found in the samples from Murlo, was shared only with people from Turkey."
Herodotus's story about the drawing of the lots may or may not be true, but the genetic research indicates that some Lydians did, as he wrote, leave their native land and travel, probably via Lemnos, to Italy.
There, they were called "tuscii" in Latin. The obvious explanation for this has always been their fondness for building tower-like, walled, hilltop towns like those still to be seen scattered across Umbria and Tuscany.
But the latest conclusions may add weight to a rival, apparently more fanciful, theory that links their name to Troy, the "city of towers" and a part of the Lydian empire. The most likely date for the fall of Troy, as described by Homer, is between 1250 and 1200 BC.
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HunnicTurk (Login HunnicTurk) The Conquerors (Turkey)
Re: Are Turks In Fact Trojans?
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July 15 2012, 12:30 AM
Etruscans Were Immigrants From Anatolia In Ancient Turkey
by Staff Writers
Nice, France (SPX) Jun 20, 2007
Etruscan culture was very advanced and quite different from other known Italian cultures that flourished at the same time, and highly influential in the development of Roman civilisation. Its origins have been debated by archaeologists, historians and linguists since time immemorial.
Now modern genetic techniques have given scientists the tools to answer this puzzle. Professor Piazza and his colleagues set out to study genetic samples from three present-day Italian populations living in Murlo, Volterra, and Casentino in Tuscany, central Italy.
"We already knew that people living in this area were genetically different from those in the surrounding regions", he says.
"Murlo and Volterra are among the most archaeologically important Etruscan sites in a region of Tuscany also known for having Etruscan-derived place names and local dialects. The Casentino valley sample was taken from an area bordering the area where Etruscan influence has been preserved."
The scientists compared DNA samples taken from healthy males living in Tuscany, Northern Italy, the Southern Balkans, the island of Lemnos in Greece, and the Italian islands of Sicily and Sardinia. The Tuscan samples were taken from individuals who had lived in the area for at least three generations, and were selected on the basis of their surnames, which were required to have a geographical distribution not extending beyond the linguistic area of sampling. The samples were compared with data from modern Turkish, South Italian, European and Middle-Eastern populations.
"We found that the DNA samples from individuals from Murlo and Volterra were more closely related those from near Eastern people than those of the other Italian samples", says Professor Piazza. "In Murlo particularly, one genetic variant is shared only by people from Turkey, and, of the samples we obtained, the Tuscan ones also show the closest affinity with those from Lemnos."
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HunnicTurk (Login HunnicTurk) The Conquerors (Turkey)
Re: Are Turks In Fact Trojans?
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July 15 2012, 12:54 AM
"That the Etruscans were Turanians, and that they belonged to the North Turanian or Altaic branch of the Turanian stem, cannot be denied."
(Victoria Institute (Great Britain), Journal of the Transactions of the Victoria Institute, Or Philosophical Society of Great Britain, Band 10, BiblioBazaar, 2009, p.200)
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well to be more accurate Trojan horses are different from a virus in the sense that they dont attempt to inject themselves in various files, they are masquerading as a legitimate file or program
however they do make copies of themselves and they try to steal information or to install unwanted programs at your computer
anyway thats the best definition of a Turk
ODYSSEUS KILLING THE SUITORS
This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 15, 2012 1:05 AM
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Homer insinuates, that the Trojans were ethnic Greek.. they lived in a great city.. that didn't see Turks for at least 2000 years.. tell me.. many Turkish built "great cities" in central Asia? LOL
These Turks and their complex natures..
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'Homers narative of the Trojan Wars was set around 1200 BC.. Tell me Hunnic.. where were the Turks and were they even atribe at the time?'
About 1200 BC They lived between Siberia and Central Asia area from Altai to Tengri Mountains. Read the Turanic Afenesavo and Andronova cultures. Some historians belive that General Turcos established Scyhtia (Turkish Saka) with local proto turks. Some historians wrote that Turcos was the first Scytian King other name was Alp Er Tunga.
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HunnicTurk (Login HunnicTurk) The Conquerors (Turkey)
Re: Are Turks In Fact Trojans?
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July 15 2012, 1:50 AM
Throughout history, Turks founded a total of 113 states, 16 of which are deemed to be large. These states and empires came to dominate large sections of world geography at different times in history. The Legend of Oghuz Khan is a monumental work on the idea of state in Turks and the image of the heroic alp, who accomplished great conquests. This extraordinary talent for organizing and molding states is unprecedented as compared to other world nations throughout history.
First Turk, fed by a femele gray wolf, was born in the foothills of the Tengri Mountains. The so-called Ergenekon Legend, which is thought to have been created by the Göktürks, could indeed be interpreted as an explanation for the springing forth and spreading of the entire Turkish civilization.
Turks possess one of the oldest cultures and civilizations in the world. It is hard to precisely specify the beginning of Turkish history. There is a high probability that the oldest culture of Central Asia, the so-called Anav Culture, which was unearthed at the end of toilsome archaeological and anthropological research and has a history that goes back to 4000 B.C., has ties to proto-Turks. As we move forward into the more recent millennia of history, we more clearly see the linkage between the cultures of Kelteminar and Afenesavo (3000 B.C.), Andronova (1700 B.C.), Karasuk (1200 B.C.), Tagar and Tashtyk (700 B.C.) and proto-Turks. There is plenty of scientific evidence proving this linkage, most notably among archaeological findings obtained from the Pazyryk and Issyk mounds.
In the meantime, research carried out over the last several years supports the argument that the Scythian civilization that emerged in the eighth century B.C. was a Turkish empire. There is not much doubt among historians about the Turkish nature of the Great Hun Empire, which ruled between 318 B.C. and 216 A.D., as well as that of its predecessor proto-Huns, whose presence was confirmed by Chinese sources. The Great Hun Empire, the Western Hun Empire and especially the European Huns were examined comprehensively by Western historians. There are not many people who do not know the story of the Great Hun Emperor Mete Khan (Oghuz Khan according to Turkish epics) and the glorious Turkish Khan Atilla. European Huns changed the course of world history as a result of the Germanic Migrations.
The best-known part of the Turkish history can be traced back to the Göktürks.It was the Göktürks who first used the word Turk in the official name of their state.Following the Göktürks were the Uyghurs, who presented the best examples of Turkish sedentary culture; the Kyrgyz, Qarluks, Turgish, Tatars and other Turkish tribes of Central Asia; the Khazars, who turned their country into an attractive center of trade; the Bulgars, who shaped todays Eastern Europe; and then the Oghuz, Avars, the Pechenegs, and the Qumans. They all took their places in Turkish history, one after another.
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HunnicTurk (Login HunnicTurk) The Conquerors (Turkey)
Re: Are Turks In Fact Trojans?
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July 15 2012, 2:16 AM
'Homer insinuates, that the Trojans were ethnic Greek.. they lived in a great city.. that didn't see Turks for at least 2000 years.. tell me.. many Turkish built "great cities" in central Asia'
4 BC Kadimkala (Karakalpakistan, Uzbekistan)
Koi Krylgan Kala
4 BC Toprak Kala ( Uzbekistan)
Ancient Semerkant City in Uzbekistan
Ancient Tuva Castle (siberia)
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HunnicTurk (Login HunnicTurk) The Conquerors (Turkey)
Re: Are Turks In Fact Trojans?
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July 15 2012, 2:32 AM
'Just because we left our DNA in the Turkish population does NOT mean you have rights to our heritage, Hunnic the Mongol..'
The University of Turin-Italy, who presented the research. "One particular genetic variant, found in the samples from Murlo, was shared only with people from Turkey."
lol. This is self ownage Vajinagian. If you left your DNA in the Turkish population tell me why Etrusc DNAs' not pair with Greeks, but only shared with Turks, you moron. You haven't got any link with Turks, Etruscs or Trojans. If I were you I shut my mouth and respect to my master.
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...none of the cities you posted pictures of.. were ever built by Turks.. in fact, none even where around the time of Mythical Troy.. let me explain something to you.. the Turks didn't just appear out of thin air.. BUT saying that you Turks are somehow related to us Greeks is utter non-sense.. other than a bias Brit.. there is absolutely NO evidence to support such outlandish claims as Turks claiming a direct link to the MYTHICAL city of Troy..the fact is.. the Turks are a central Asian nomadic tribe that was expelled by the Chinese and Mongols.. with NO written script OR institutes of Learning i find it VERY hard to believe that such barbaric people.. ignorant on the laws of physics and building codes could even build something.. let alone settle and defend such a city..
"Genetic research made public at the weekend appears to put the matter beyond doubt, however. It shows the Etruscans came from the area which is now Turkey - and that the nearest genetic relatives of many of today's Tuscans and Umbrians are to be found, not in Italy, but around Izmir."
All this ^^^ shows is that the Hellenic genes specific to the coast of modern day Turkey are still present.. and that the Etruscans were Hellenic stock and NOT Turkish.. in fact if you want to impress me, try proving that Turks from central Asia were around that same time.. In fact, i wonder if we compare DNA from the "Turks of Izmir.. do you think they'd be closer to mainland Greece of Kazakhstan..
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"Modern Grecomen have nothing to do with Ancient Greeks as well"
I am sorry but the rest of the world thinks otherwise.
The following pictures may frustrate the Turks. But they must get used to them, because they will see them in 2 months in the Olympic Games of London.
Winter Olympic Games 2010: The Olympic Movement pays tribute to the nation who founded the Olympic Games and the Western Civilization:
In the Opening Ceremony of the Olympic Games, the Olympic Team of MODERN GREECE is always the first to enter the Stadium and lead the Parade.
Why? Why are we given such honors?
The rest of the World knows VERY WELL who we are, what our ancestry is, and where we are descended from.
Sidney 2000 Opening ceremony:
The Olympic Team of MODERN GREECE and the Greek flag enters the Stadium first in ALL Olympic Opening Ceremonies: Why?
Sidney 2000 closing ceremony:
The National Anthem of Greece is always performed together with the anthem of the host nation(in this case Australia). Why?
I give my final answer to the Turks through the words of Greek-Roman Emperor Julian the Philosopher:
"HMIN ANHKOYSIN H EYGLOTTIA KAI AI TEXNAI THS ELLADOS KAI H TON THEON AYTHS LATREIA,YMETEROS DE KLHROS H AMATHIA KAI H AGROIKIA KAI OYDEN PLEON. AYTH ESTI H SOFIA YMON."
Emperor Julian the Philosopher, 362 AD
Translation from Ancient Greek:
"To us they do belong the eloquence, art and philosophy of Greece, and the worship of her beautiful gods. To you belong the ignorance, the coarseness, and nothing more . That is your wisdom."
No offence pal........
..
"The Turkish Cypriots looted, robbed and ravaged Greek Cypriot properties. They must start producing instead of being mere consumers. The Turkish Cypriots wanted to live without working!"
Major-General Bedrettin Demirel (1917-1988)
Commander of the Turkish Invasion Forces in 1974
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"You got used to leeching and that's why you can't even produce a nail now."
One day I will start a thread regarding 20th century Greek Achievement vs 20th century Turkish Achievement. Especially in the fields of Art and Science.
We will laugh a lot then.
" As a result, Turks hold the greatest share of Ottoman Empire including all the capitals, paid all it's debts, much richer than Hellenes and 50 years ahead of Hellenistan now."
We will not go through the same things again: Turkey defaulted on its debt and went bankrupt in 1878, 1915, 1931, 1940, 1978, 1980.
Says who? Says Kenneth Rogoff, former scientific director of the IMF in his book "This time is different"
Regarding the Turkish Economy, I advise more humility, because the moment of truth is coming, and the landing will be harsh.
An interesting fact: Turkey still has 3rd world infant mortality rate. Helladistan has the same infant mortality as Italy. Shall I start posting figures?
..
"The Turkish Cypriots looted, robbed and ravaged Greek Cypriot properties. They must start producing instead of being mere consumers. The Turkish Cypriots wanted to live without working!"
Major-General Bedrettin Demirel (1917-1988)
Commander of the Turkish Invasion Forces in 1974
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@wet vagina: you cant answer the question, you know you cant have any claims to these lands. Get the fvck out before the ownage gets bigger malaka
No matter the era, whichever the society, people always gaze at the stars when young. Then they stretch out their hands and try to catch them. And then one day, they realize their arms are not long enough to catch the stars, and thats when they grow up.
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You haven't, don't add "hahaha" at the end of your sentence, I know you aint laughing and it sounds really lame.
No matter the era, whichever the society, people always gaze at the stars when young. Then they stretch out their hands and try to catch them. And then one day, they realize their arms are not long enough to catch the stars, and thats when they grow up.
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Greeks are interesting beings, when in fact they look arab and have been raped for 500 years and have no greek in them..... when they see something they like, such as an ancient civilization they will say it is ancient greek while no Historian or Anthropologist supports them. As we can see we provided tons of evidence and all they did was skip the material we posted and keep repeating the same old lines. We have to keep in mind that education in Greece is very low.
-----------------------------
Next week in cinema: Hungry Dancing
New Greek multinational firm:
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Well Ataturk, loved alcohol too much, and when he was drunk he would say a lot of absurd things.
When he was sober (not very often) he was indeed a smart man.
..
"The Turkish Cypriots looted, robbed and ravaged Greek Cypriot properties. They must start producing instead of being mere consumers. The Turkish Cypriots wanted to live without working!"
Major-General Bedrettin Demirel (1917-1988)
Commander of the Turkish Invasion Forces in 1974
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turks invade anatolia and get mixed,totay turks are more mediteranean than turkic but they speak for great turan
turks get mixed with anatolian populations and now they thing they are decendants of troyans
turks try to find a link to the past
i am sorry to destroy your dream but you are neither turk,neither anatolian,neither slav,neither greek,niether albanian neither arab....
but maybe i am mistaken propably you are all of them mixed.....with indentity crisis...
the sure thing you are bastards.......
............................................
""Maniots, known for their martial qualities, were the first to join the Greek liberation movement. The society called the Filiki Eteria ("Company of Friends") sent their representatives Perrevos and Chrisospathis to organize the Maniots. On March 17, 1821, 12,000 Maniots gathered in the church of Taxiarchs (Archangels) of Areopoli and declared war against the Ottoman Empire. The flag of the revolution was white with a blue cross in the center. On top of the flag there was a sign, "Victory or death". The Maniots were responsible for writing "Victory" and not "Freedom" on their banner since Mani was always free. On the bottom of the flag lied an ancient inscription, "With the shield or on the shield."
...........................................
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