Re: The "e;Official"e; JLA Thread (Part 3)
March 11 2004, 5:14 PM
With the way this book appears to be selling out, I'm interested to hear the numbers. What were the pre-order numbers for JLA #94? My comic book guy said he re-ordered, and they had copies available (DC still overprints- unlike Marvel, so people can get their comics when this stuff happens), but then those comics would not be computed in the initial orders. I bet with re-orders, they will run short of the demand. A second printing then? Wonder what the grand total will be?
I wondered that as well. I guess they ran out of room to review anything else after "Street Angel" #1, "Coup D'Etat: Afterword", "Quantum: Rock of Ages" #2 and the "Supreme Power" TPB.
Re: The "e;Official"e; JLA Thread (Part 3)
March 11 2004, 6:35 PM
okay, the JLA comics finally arrived here in Manila and I gotta say, it does not look like a JB comic at all! I hate the way Jerry Ordway put a lot of his stuff over JB's! I mean, I don't mind Jerry Ordway's work, he's a pretty competent pencilled and his style is nice, but I want to see JB's work, not Ordways! I think DC really made a big blunder over the decision to have Ordway ink the book. I mean, put Karl Kesel or Terry austin, or bob wiacek...hey even paul ryan and it'll stll look likeJB's work. I really wonder what the reaction would be when people buy the original artwork. If you put those on ebay, people would think it's an original ordway page. SIGH! what a waste! I really have so much anticipation for this book
Re: The "e;Official"e; JLA Thread (Part 3)
March 11 2004, 7:08 PM
"not sure if it's already been discussed, but does anyone else find Ordway's inks to be overpowering?...."
I had read a message to that effect yesterday, before I had a chance to see the final product. Since I like Ordway's work, I decided to wait until I saw for myself (imagine that!).
Now that I've seen it, I have to say I'm not thrilled. The book looks good, I think. However, I think JB's style has been overwhelmed by the inks. And since, of course, JB's style is one of the reasons I've looked forward to this book, I come away less than satisfied with the end product.
(Note that my dissatisfaction does not extend to the story, which has me intrigued so far. Nor would it keep me away from future issues. I do think the art looks good, it just doesn't look like I want it to).
Re: The "e;Official"e; JLA Thread (Pt III)
March 11 2004, 9:44 PM
Guys, you are skipping over the single most important part of pencilling, and it's not the surface art.
The penciller is the storyteller. He/she/it picks the composition, the angles, the backdrops. He's the director, producer, special effects artist and cheorographer all rolled into one. Nobody has more power over the finished product than the penciller.
Maybe the lines on the paper look like Ordway and maybe the script reads like Claremont, but never doubt that the story itself belongs to John Byrne.
Re: The "e;Official"e; JLA Thread (Pt III)
March 11 2004, 10:20 PM
"The penciller is the storyteller. He/she/it picks the composition, the angles, the backdrops. He's the director, producer, special effects artist and cheorographer all rolled into one. Nobody has more power over the finished product than the penciller."
Trevor:
While I didn't comment on it in my post, but I was all too aware that JB's layouts and storytelling was still coming through. I even found it interesting (considering that most artists are recognized by their drawing style as opposed to their storytelling style) just how much I recognized JB's storytelling throughout this issue. Panel layouts, pacing, camera angles, etc. all were very recognizable to me.
Re: The "e;Official"e; JLA Thread (Pt III)
March 11 2004, 11:11 PM
Don't most modern comic artists just look at Rebecca Romjin Stamos pictures and John Byrne comics and "borrow" them from the respective photographers and Mr Byrne?
I was SO used to purchasing a comic book and finishing it in about 3 minutes. And because there was such a nice buildup, I HAD to read it first when I got my order from my comic shop today.
In other words, thank you for an enjoyable reading experience. I like a comic book that has substance. Lately, the two that do this for me are the new Flash reboot and DC: New Frontiers. Lots of stuff to look at and read. Now JLA does it... again.
Re: The "e;Official"e; JLA Thread (Pt III)
March 12 2004, 12:00 AM
I think even some of the Byrne lynchmob over at the DC Boards liked JLA# 94, but they can't admit it...not totally anyway. They're being all wishy-washy in their praise/criticism. Again...I really liked this issue and as I said...I don't like the JLA(for the most part...except the cartoon).
Re: The "e;Official"e; JLA Thread (Pt III)
March 12 2004, 12:57 AM
I wrote to Randy Lander over at Fourth Rail and asked why they didn't review JLA #94 and he said that they really had no interest in it, and that they might have checked it out if it was included in DC's First Look pack.
Re: The "e;Official"e; JLA Thread (Pt III)
March 12 2004, 1:01 AM
I'd ask who or what Fourth Rail is, since I don't know. But since they have no interest in checking out new material that's not a freebie, I'm sure I have no reason to be interested in them.
I enjoy reviews, especially when the reviewer looks at it with an open mind.
So, given my participation in this forum, I have bravely struggled against my inherent cheapness and actually bought myself a copy of JLA#94. However, in the interest of giving myself something to look forward to, I'm using every iota of willpower at my command to hold off reading it until Saturday night, when I can get in the right...er..."frame of mind," so to speak, and thoroughly enjoy it. Which I suppose is just as well, since I wouldn't be commenting on it until I've read all six issues anyway. After all, any comments made before I've had a chance to digest the entire story wouldn't mean much, would they?
However, I did want to note one thing. As I was making my purchase on Wednesday, the clerk at the comic book store mentioned that he had just finished reading it. When I asked him if the Byrne/Claremont reunion was worth the 25 year wait, he responded enthusiastically that it was, indeed. So you've got at least one vendor in Oregon on your side, JB, and I suspect that's just the tip of the positive critical reception iceberg.
Re: The "e;Official"e; JLA Thread (Pt III)
March 12 2004, 11:39 AM
Just picked this up, walked over to the coffee shop and read it. Seems like a fun story so far. I look foward to the rest.
I have to agree with the rest of the board, tho, on how overpowering Ordway's inks are - expecially on the charactors' faces. I've never cared for how Jerry draws Superman's face.
Other than that, it was pretty good. I enjoyed watching Batman at work, as well as the Atom.
Question: Who are Raven and Faith? I haven't read the JLA since Morrison's horrible WW3 story.
Re: The "e;Official"e; JLA Thread (Pt III)
March 12 2004, 1:05 PM
John- I do have another question regarding JLA #94.
I notice that you cut scenes a few times in the middle of pages. From the DPatrol scene to the Badlands scene and from the Crucifer/Superman scene to the Atom scene.
How did this come about? And what do you think of the overall flow that came about from doing those scenes in that way?
Re: The "e;Official"e; JLA Thread (Pt III)
March 12 2004, 1:41 PM
>>You know as much as you need to know. As the story progresses, you will learn more.
Ok, that's cool, but if I may - they were pre-existing characters, right? When I first read the issue, I was kind of put off - like, hey! Who are these guys?! I want to see Superman and Batman, etc, but by about the 20th read (and counting) I find myself really excited to find out more about the characters! Are they recent creations? Are they official members of the league? Eh! You just told us that we know as much as we need to know, so... I'll let those questions sit, but...
How about this - do I recall correctly that Faith will have something to do with the Doom Patrol? And did I get it right that she lives in Sunny San Francisco? So, can I offer up my humble abode for JB to come and visit if he wants some really cool references of SF City living????
Or at the least, I can always take some digital photos and send them to you. What do you say, JB - want some pics of SF from a native??
Besides, we have hot and cold running brunettes at my place - two single ones! And, well.... one who isn't single, but, you know, I'd be willing to let JB dance with my girl once or twice - but you have to keep your hands where I can see them!!
I love the JLA, and the first part of this story was amazing from cover to cover. My question is why the paper is not the better quality, like the kind used in Generations? Surely a collaboration of this magnitude deserves DC's finest paper. Any reason why this paper was seleced? Also, who selected the colorist for the series? I loved Sinclair on Generations. Do you chose JB? Thanks.
Re: The "e;Official"e; JLA Thread (Pt III)
March 12 2004, 2:03 PM
Remember, back in the day, when the Baxter paper was for "special" titles? Now, we get the JLA run on "plain" (Baxter) paper. I don't much care for the shiny paper, except in the trades.
And yet the books still cost the consumer the same.
I noticed that on the DC Message Boards you mention, posting as DrNilesCaulder, that the X motif on the covers of the JLA arc is a nod from Chris and me to our X-MEN work.
Once again (and perhaps again and again) I must reiterate that the story of the Tenth Circle, and the attendant Roman Numeral 10 motif, was all worked out before Chris came anywhere near the project. Heck, it was largely worked out before this was even a JLA story!
There are no deliberate X-MEN riffs or motifs in this story. Honest.
Re: The "e;Official"e; JLA Thread (Pt III)
March 12 2004, 3:55 PM
But it is a delicious coincidence.
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Probably not even that. I am sure the X motif was at least partially responsible for placing in Carlin's noggin the idea of getting Chris to script this.
Re: The "e;Official"e; JLA Thread (Pt III)
March 12 2004, 4:08 PM
I just had a thought JB: did your recent "conversion" to Buffy and Angel spark an interest in doing a vampire-related story?
*****
Partly. I'd had the Tenth Circle whirling 'round in my brain for a couple of years. (Some of you may recall I almost did a GOTHAM KNIGHTS story a while back -- germs of this tale began there.)
Certainly the interest in Buffy and Angel pushed this one back to the front burner, tho.
Re: The "e;Official"e; JLA Thread (Pt III)
March 12 2004, 4:17 PM
I can see fanboys seizing upon that coincidence as a cry for "recycling old X-Men stories."
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If there is one thing the fanboys do better than anything else, it is demonstrating what very, very bad writers they would be.
When I did BABE, there were detractors who declared the book contained what were "obviously warmed over SHE-HULK stories" -- tho no one was quite able to define how the stories I did in BABE would have worked for She-Hulk.
Ditto, when I did WONDER WOMAN, there were those who (sight unseen, of course), predicted I would be using there the stories I had not used in SHE-HULK (apparently forgetting I had used them in BABE!) without considering that a She-Hulk story might not convert very well into a Wonder Woman tale. "I'll give it a look," said on online idiot, "but the first time Diana breaks the third wall, I am out of here!" (Yes, he said third wall.)
Now I am sure there will be -- probably already are, in fact -- people who will imagine the JLA arc is something Chris and I never got around to in our X-MEN days ("Faith is like, so obviously Phoenix, d00d. . . ").
In doing so they demonstrate only (and once again) their utter lack of imagination.
But man...I would have liked to see a just pencils version...I really dont think his inks did your art credit..but the story rocked...thanks for making JLA readable again
Re: The "e;Official"e; JLA Thread (Pt III)
March 13 2004, 12:59 AM
Ah, finally a comic I can read! The characters looked and acted like they are always did. I don't buy many comics anymore and was waiting fot JLA #94 and I wasn't disapointed. I go to the comic store and look to buy something and all my heroes are unrecognizable, not when JB does a book! As for the art, I think that Ordway puts too much of his style in the faces, but that is what he does, so it was expected. I can't wait for the next issue!
If I recall correctly..didn't they publish a pencil only version of George Perez's Avengers #1..was beautiful...would DC maybe do the same for JLA #94??
"At the top of my head, the Justice League in alleged continuity books hasn't looked this good since--never."
"Every iota of artwork is a lush treat to the eyes."
"The pacing to "Tenth Circle" is quick. It lacks padding and contrived impediments to slow down the League's progress. In addition, the creative team conveys a sense of urgency that heightens the suspense. You do not listlessly turn these pages. This story generates excitement. You run out of pages."
""The Tenth Circle" in JLA indeed deserves to be lauded. While the usual lack of DC continuity causes mild headaches and Superman is caught too easily, the story's quality, the artwork's beauty and the handling of the characters offer the best read since Grant Morrison left the book."
