can any one make a list of TOP 10 banks in the world?
city group only 6.2 billions worth now compare to 320billions last year!!! WTF!!!
Bank of america is same **** happend!! Wachovia is dead. and is the next one is wells forgo? or Chase bank?
what about japanese banks? and eroupean banks?
please make a list.

The 3 largest Chinese banks have now become the largest in the world. The Chinese were smart enough to stay away from the subprime and derivative crap in the US. The Japanese, American, and Europeans were not so lucky.


Bank Country Mkt Cap bil. USD
1 ICBC China 169.6
2 China Construction Bank China 118.4
3 Bank of China China 103.2
4 HSBC UK 91.4
5 JP Morgan Chase US 90.0
6 Wells Fargo US 62.6
7 Banco Santander Spain 53.6
8 Mitsubishi UFJ Financial Japan 52.5
9 Bank of Communications China 34.6
10 Intesa Sanpaolo Italy 31.8


http://finmanac.blogspot.com/2009/02/top-10-banks-in-world-by-market.html

To be honest, a part of the reason we dodged the subprime or related products was due to our "unsophisticatedness" in such complex derivative products. lol

-------------------------------------------------

Yep, still unbelievable how quickly the financial landscape changed. Government regulation saved the @ss of chinese banks while mighty bank of america and citi have fallen from top of the list to missing from the list lol.

------------------------------------
#1 way to ascertain that you've lost an argument: Resorting to personal attacks.

The new world order has begun.

Siege of Tobruk - One German POW said: "I cannot understand you Australians. In Poland, France, and Belgium, once the tanks got through the soldiers took it for granted that they were beaten. But you are like demons. The tanks break through and your infantry still keep fighting." Rommel wrote of seeing "a batch of some fifty or sixty Australian prisoners ... marched off close behind usimmensely big and powerful men, who without question represented an elite formation of the British Empire, a fact that was also evident in battle."


"As a Internet discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches one."

Current
Rank Previous
Rank BANK Assets
US$m + or -
(local curr) Capital
US$m Balance
Sheet
1 (1) The Royal Bank of Scotland Group plc , Edinburgh , UK *3,782,880 +118.09% 5,035.83 31.12.07
2 (2) Deutsche Bank AG , Frankfurt am Main , Germany *2,953,727 +27.51% 1,985.38 31.12.07
3 (3) BNP Paribas SA , Paris , France *2,477,272 +17.64% 19,695.91 31.12.07
4 (4) Barclays PLC , London , UK *2,442,996 +23.13% 3,286.23 31.12.07
5 (5) Crédit Agricole SA , Paris , France *2,067,577 +12.19% 31,480.99 31.12.07
6 (6) UBS AG , Zürich , Switzerland *2,007,224 -3.14% 182.83 31.12.07
7 (7) Société Générale , Paris La Défense , France *1,566,904 +12.01% 852.34 31.12.07
8 (8) ABN AMRO Holding NV , Amsterdam , Netherlands *1,498,849 +3.86% 1,586.26 31.12.07
9 (9) UniCredit SpA , Milan , Italy *1,493,799 +24.11% 9,770.00 31.12.07
10 (10) ING Bank NV , Amsterdam , Netherlands *1,453,382 +11.08% 767.54 31.12.07

http://www.bankersalmanac.com/addcon/infobank/wldrank.aspx

* These bank rankings are compiled from balance sheet information included on Bankersalmanac.com available at 29 October 2008.

Bank of Scottland, UBS, Citi... LOL
Deutsche Bank is not much better.

the private german banks came fine through the crisis until now, only the state run banks have shown up with worthless credits








Napoleon auf St. Helena: "Hätte der Himmel gewollt, dass ich als deutscher Fürst geboren wäre und hätten Sie mich einmal zu Ihrem Kaiser gewählt und ausgerufen so scheint mir noch Heute, dass Sie nie von mir abgefallen wären und ich Heute nicht hier sitzen müsste."

Only a few years ago, the west was predicting the collaspe of the Chinese banking system.....

Frog killer

The funny thing is it was the simplistic banking system and low risk investments that saved the Chinese banks. They are not exactly complex in the way they do business. It is this simplistic nature that has allowed them to basically weather the whole crisis relatively well... basically it is more luck and good timing... They are now however the largest banks, they will in the future be able to take advantage of this.

I wonder in 50 years how the financial world will be looking (so long as there is no resource collapse)...

Siege of Tobruk - One German POW said: "I cannot understand you Australians. In Poland, France, and Belgium, once the tanks got through the soldiers took it for granted that they were beaten. But you are like demons. The tanks break through and your infantry still keep fighting." Rommel wrote of seeing "a batch of some fifty or sixty Australian prisoners ... marched off close behind usimmensely big and powerful men, who without question represented an elite formation of the British Empire, a fact that was also evident in battle."


"As a Internet discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches one."

http://finmanac.blogspot.com/

Top 10 banks in the world by assets

The assets of some of the biggest banks of the world (from latest available balance sheet) is as follows:

Bank Assets
(million) Currency Date
The Royal Bank of Scotland Group
24,01,650 GBP 31-12-2008
Deutsche Bank 20,60,690 EUR 30-09-2008
BNP Paribas SA 20,75,550 EUR 31-12-2008
Barclays PLC 13,65,650 GBP 30-06-2008
Crédit Agricole SA 15,08,500 EUR 30-09-2008
UBS AG 19,96,720 CHF 30-09-2008
Société Générale 11,30,000 EUR 31-12-2008
UniCredit SpA 10,52,840 EUR 30-09-2008
ING Bank NV 13,75,810 EUR 30-09-2008
Mitsubishi UFJ Ltd 19,06,56,992 JPY 30-09-2008
Banco Santander SA 9,53,035 EUR 30-09-2008
JPMorgan Chase Bank 21,75,050 USD 31-12-2008
Bank of America NA 18,17,940 USD 31-12-2008
Citibank NA 19,45,260 USD 31-12-2008
HSBC Holdings
25,46,680 USD 30-06-2008
Credit Suisse Group 13,93,600 CHF 30-09-2008

The prevailing exchange rate of different currencies with USD:

EUR 1.2563
GBP 1.4044
JPY 0.01015
CHF 0.84933

At these rates the top 10 banks by assets when converted to USD are following:


Assets
trillion $
The Royal Bank of Scotland Group 3.37
BNP Paribas 2.61
Deutsche Bank 2.59
HSBC Holdings 2.55
JPMorgan Chase Bank 2.18
Citibank NA 1.95
Mitsubishi UFJ Ltd 1.94
Barclays PLC 1.92
Crédit Agricolé SA 1.90
Bank of America 1.82

Where are the chinese?

Where are the chinese?
========================================

day dreaming .......

SURRENDER OF PAKI ARMY IN 1971
1N 1971 A NEW HISTORY AS WELL AS A NEW NATION WAS CREATED BY WE THE INDIANS..

The funny thing is that a lot of the complex financial systems has been put in place by some French people because they are good in mathematic. French financial mathematicians work in banks all over the world to invent such complex systems and calculate the risks.

Eh eh eh, the plan to put down the anglos-bubble work pretty fine

-----------------------
Where are the chinese?
-----------------------
Why don't you keep up with the latest information . You taking taking from June 2008, almost 1 year ago and 6 months before the financial crises. And where are the French banks, probably too much in debt and just like the country.

As of Feb 2009 these are the largest banks. Top three are all Chinese and 4/10 are Chinese. Deal with it.

http://finmanac.blogspot.com/2009/02/top-10-banks-in-world-by-market.html

--------------------
day dreaming .......
--------------------
What truth hurts brown midget. Jealous that we accomplished something you can only wet dream about. By back talking about how you can decouple yourself from the world economy, and suprassing China because your service driven...lol...while your economy still is worse off.

The figure of 10 biggest banks by asset comes from your link idiot. Jut click on 'Home' in your link.

Asset is the equivalent of turnover for banks and your figure is just maket capitalization which worth nothing.

many of the assets of western banks, especially US banks are junk assets, they have a lot of value on paper and worth nothing for the banks, or even negative. These are the real problem.

Clear that the asset of the Royal Bank of Scotland don't worth much those days, LOL.

Lol, market cap is worth nothing? Market cap is the WORTH of the company, ie, you can purchase ownership of that company for that price.

So yeah you can point to high assets of western banks, but that's precisely what got them into the mess. Over 90% of a typical bank's assets are loans and securities. Plus it doesn't account for liabilities (ie. debt).

I don't think people need convincing that taking on risky loans and junk securities to increase assets is what caused the downfall of western banks. Consider why chinese banks are largest now: The Royal Bank of Scotland (which has the MOST asset, ie most junk securities and debt) had a annual LOSS of $25 billion, China's ICBC (which has the most market value and more cash on hand) had a annual PROFIT of $32 billion.

So you can make smirky comments like "where is china" on the list or chinese banks are "daydreaming", but they are making billions in profit while western banks who have the most "assets" are losing billions each year lol.



------------------------------------

#1 way to ascertain that you've lost an argument: Resorting to personal attacks.

The Royal Bank of Scotland Group 3.37
BNP Paribas 2.61
Deutsche Bank 2.59


LOL.

The market cap is the actual worth of the company. A bank's assets is the debt holding. Debt holdings are basically pieces of paper saying what you are owed. If your assets are mainly mortgage holdings, you are worth sh!t. LOL

If the worth of the assets is deemed recoverable, the market value would be extremely high. If the assets or debt are seem as empty pieces of paper, you can't get enough cash to pay for a loaf of bread. LOL

The "Royal Bank of Scotland Group" is the PERFECT example. If its assets were worth $3.37 trillion in really money terms, it would not be 70% owned by the British government today. LOL. It could have sold off its assets to raise the capital it needed. But it couldn't and needed a government bailout.

With the sliced up mortgage securities and the credit default swaps, banks assets are meaningless. The only thing that means anything is the liquid cash and redeemable debt, if you have those your market value will reflect it.

The Chinese banks ARE the largest in the world at this point. They are the only ones still making massive loans.

-------------------------------------------------

Mark my words, within 3 years China will have a serious depression.


Mobile airpower

"The enemy dies relaxed," observed a Lockheed Martin manager.

Lol 2008 net income numbers for some top 10 banks in assets

The Royal Bank of Scotland Group -25 billion
Deutsche Bank AG -4 billion
BNP Paribas SA +4 billion
Barclays PLC +5 billion
Crédit Agricole SA +2 billion
UBS AG -3 billion
Société Générale -1 billion
UniCredit SpA +5 billion
ING Bank NV +2 billion

chinese banks 2008 income who didn't bulk up their assets by making risky loans

Industrial and Commercial Bank of China +32 billion
China Construction Bank China +29 billion
Bank of China +20 billion


------------------------------------
#1 way to ascertain that you've lost an argument: Resorting to personal attacks.

That's like saying in three years China will be in a serious economic boom. LOL

Anything could happen in three years. LOL



-------------------------------------------------

chinegooks bro, not tryings to denigrate chinegooks bankings

and its clear westrns nudity anali threesome orgy upskirt fellation children backside europa anglo amerikunts zionazis topless incestuous bestiality faggotry its jungle culture?
are in bankings crisis

but is market caps really the only true index of bank size? or any firm size?

actually its very volatiles and beings too much dependents on perception, which also makings it susceptibles to rumour hearsay etc causings spike in share price and market caps etc.

asset size is goods indicator, problem is we needs unbiased auditings of what % of assets are worth anythings, what % are junk?

another good measures is revenues indicatings if its makings good profit/losses?

at the ends of day, banks are always a little tricky because its dealings in money and also all its indices of good/bad performances also measureds in money

for other industries, its different.

===========================================
I am old Christiankiller
Sorry for offensive to our good religion christian brothers
I am not hating christians

Yeah, neither market cap nor assets are good measures, especially now considering banks are desperately trying to rid themselves of bad assets. Like any business, profit/net income is what counts.


------------------------------------
#1 way to ascertain that you've lost an argument: Resorting to personal attacks.

LOL. In today's recession, bank assets is FAR less an indicator of wealth than the market cap.

If you are making a profit or have a consistent revenue flow, it would be reflected in your market capitalization.

The market reflects the health of your bank. Pure and simple.

Anyone who thinks that bank assets are even worth counting today has no understanding of the recession we're going through now. You can simply dismiss that person's opinion as babbling from a person who doesn't even know what is going on in this very fvcking moment.

ALL of the problems we're having right now stems from the fact that bank assets (subprime, option-arms, credit default swaps, etc.) might be worth nothing.

If the assets the biggest banks are holdings were worth trillions, the Royal Bank of Scotland and Citi Corp wouldn't be in danger of being nationalized today. You would liquidate a trillion or so of your assets for cash and get yourself out of this mess.

The reason they don't is no one believes that their assets is worth any money so you can't liquidate anything.

If you don't even understand the root cause of the current fvcked up situation, you should STFU. LOL

-------------------------------------------------

Profits don't mean anything too if you go that way.

British Bank of Scotland made good profits last year, so did AIG, EMRON the year before it collapsed and GE was quoted as a model not long ago.

Risky behaviors can make good profits until...

Also chinese acountability are probably about as manipulated as their currency LOL. I won't be surprised if those folks could invent huge profits just to keep a positive attitude LOL. Talk about transparency here...

Anyway, BNP Paribas is world n° 2 in asset, made 5 bilion profits and has just bought Fortis (that's it: they make their market while the values are low)

That just show that they prefer to invest than make short term profits which is the way to go.

Last but not least: the quality of the asset is also shown by the profit/loss of a bank because they must write down in their book the fall of the value of their asset.

STFU, Frenchie. Your stupidity in pushing the Royal Bank of Scotland data already shown you to be absolutely clueless about the current financial state of the world.

Even a dumb fvck wouldn't put up the RBS data. That fvcking bank in a state of nationalization because its nominal assets are currently like so many sheets of toilet paper. LOL

You can take your voodoo understanding of economics elsewhere, kid. LOL


-------------------------------------------------

Well if the French are proud of holding massive toxic subprime and derivative assets, rather than being the largest in market value (ie. worth the most and valuable) let them. With that economic mentality no wonder they've been in a recession for so long and don't know how to fix it...lol

Let's not turn this into a country bashing thread.

Also chinese acountability are probably about as manipulated as their currency LOL. I won't be surprised if those folks could invent huge profits just to keep a positive attitude LOL. Talk about transparency here...

@c-seven, you gotta back this up this claim. Banks != chinese government. China's largest bank ICBC is a publicly traded company and thus is required to follow international accounting guidelines and must be audited. Unlike western banks that rely on government bailout to do fuzzy accounting lately, ICBC has not required any.

------------------------------------

#1 way to ascertain that you've lost an argument: Resorting to personal attacks.

Face it, the Chinese banks have weathered the financial crisis well (so far, and probably well into the future). The bigger problem is the economic recessions in the Western world which will have a effect on China's economy due to it being export driven.

China is desperately trying to stimulate the economy by turning it into internal consumption. I hope for the Chinese sake they can achieve this, because unless they do and great deal of people will lose their jobs and these will be the most needy.

The banks are doing fine, I'm more worried about the people and the effects it'll have on Australia (who's banks also have been fairly well off).

Australia has just recorded negative growth for the last quarter... Unfortunately I believe this means we are already in recession.

Siege of Tobruk - One German POW said: "I cannot understand you Australians. In Poland, France, and Belgium, once the tanks got through the soldiers took it for granted that they were beaten. But you are like demons. The tanks break through and your infantry still keep fighting." Rommel wrote of seeing "a batch of some fifty or sixty Australian prisoners ... marched off close behind usimmensely big and powerful men, who without question represented an elite formation of the British Empire, a fact that was also evident in battle."


"As a Internet discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches one."

hey. the funy thing is western banks need people to help them in economic hard time.
and chinese banks now trying to helping people in economic hard time.

and francheese you are idiot. if the profit is not importand for a company. why people creat this company?
for losing money? they are crazy? no mater a interprise is a big or small, if it make good profit then it is a good company. a company can't make profit, no mater how large is it, it is a sucks company.

you c GM? city? bank of america? are they all huge? so? can't make money and keep losing money, then they need to shut off!!!

and rightnow, if chinese bank want to buy city or bank of america, then they will be the hugest asset bank in the world, but chinese people aren't stupid. hehehe. they don't want to kill themself with this action. Bank of america is stupid!!!

Face it, the Chinese banks have weathered the financial crisis well (so far, and probably well into the future). The bigger problem is the economic recessions in the Western world which will have a effect on China's economy due to it being export driven.







What a load of bull. The Chinese banks can only do well momentarily despite the crisis because they have had a growing pool of clients out of a massive population to draw from. Their banks can only be big in absolute term, but inferior in any other term since they are inefficient as all things Chinese usually are.


Their economy is gonna grow by 6% next year, down from 10%. Think this is good. This is a disaster for a piss-poor country with a GDP per capita of only $6,100 dollars. Worse, there's a collapse inf manufacturing worldwide. The Chinese, Japanese and German economies are the ones going to the drain.



This crisis is what will stop China from become a world power. You think the West will sit their asses while some vicious, amoral people take over the world. Mankind is only where it is because of Western civilizations. You can't leave it to a race with no creativity to rule the world as this will lead us to a dead-end. No to Free trade as it favours Chinese industry and since Chinese factories release too much pollution, it is therefore not in the interest of mankind as a whole to allow the following trend to continue.











---------------------------











De Gaulle to the General Koenig, Norman hero of Bir Hakeim: "Hear and tell your troops: the whole of France is watching you, you are our pride."[

i'm very sorry for this franchies fries.
china GDP per capita is $3300 at the moment, not 6000+.
china growing 6% while western nations like franch is -3%.
damn. that's like 9% growing if china compare to you. got it?
that makes china become superpower quickly. you idiot. hahaha

I can't imageing you franch IQ is damn that low...... wow. now I got it.. hehe.
I got it!!!!

and let's look, the worsetest time haven't come yet. let's wait and see how you franch gona resisting this economic crisis, maybe sarcozy have some great idea. hahaha a such idiot president rules such low IQ people, that make this nation more hopeless... no future... sarcozy even worst them bush.

congratulation franchies!!!! you got a damn Idiot president!!!! hahaha

"This crisis is what will stop China from become a world power"


wow, some morons are really out of touch with reality.....

-------------------------------------------------

"LOL.



The market cap is the actual worth of the company. A bank's assets is the debt holding. Debt holdings are basically pieces of paper saying what you are owed. If your assets are mainly mortgage holdings, you are worth sh!t. LOL "





------------



Have to agree with panda... Market cap is what truly counts.. balance sheet items are for accountants... lacks reality check...



Is like you buy a ferrari for 1M USD... and write it up on your own private balance sheet... and first day you drive it and you smash you ferrari into a wall... on your books your ferrari is still worth 1M USD (before you write it down by the end of the fiscal year)... but try to sell it on the streets see how many people are willing to pay 1M USD for a smashed up ferrari... again this is the difference between finance and accounting!



Accounting = Book value (mostly concerned over tax issues and sometimes cost of capital)

Finance = Acutal value (mostly concerned with market value -how much things really are worth)



__________________________________________

No Matter Who Wins, our troops are always in Good Hands!

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aiKp5hXbp9os&refer=home


ICBC Becomes World's Most Profitable Bank on Loans


Aug. 21 (Bloomberg) --Industrial & Commercial Bank of China Ltd earned a record 64.5 billion yuan ($9.42 billion) in the first half to become the world's most profitable bank as a focus on domestic lending helped it avoid the global credit crisis.

Net income rose 57 percent, the Beijing-based bank said in a statement today, topping the $7.72 billion earned by closest rival HSBC Holdings Plc. Earnings per share rose to 0.19 yuan.

Chairman Jiang Jianqing has more than doubled ICBC's profit since 2005 as annual economic growth of more than 10 percent bolstered corporate loans and services to the nation's growing number of wealthy people. ICBC's domestic bias shielded it from the U.S. subprime crisis that has led to more than $500 billion of writedowns and losses at financial institutions globally.

``This shows the rise of economic power in China,'' said Yuk Kei Lee, an analyst at Core Pacific-Yamaichi International in Hong Kong. ``ICBC's earnings power has already overtaken other global giants but we need time to see if this achievement can be sustained.''

The shares closed 2.9 percent lower in Hong Kong today. ICBC's Hong Kong shares trade at about 2.5 times analysts' consensus estimates for book value, compared with 0.84 times for Citigroup Inc. and 1.46 times for HSBC's Hong Kong-traded shares. The state-controlled bank's net income may swell to $17.5 billion this year, according to analyst estimates.

Lending Grows

After a government bailout three years ago, ICBC is now the world's biggest bank by market value. It has 16,476 branches nationwide and 112 branches outside China, and 170 million personal customers -- equivalent to the populations of Russia and Canada combined -- offering the potential for growth in services.

Profit matched the 64.8 billion yuan average estimate of eight analysts surveyed by Bloomberg News. ICBC increased lending by 7.1 percent in the first half to 4.36 trillion yuan. Non-performing loans accounted for 2.41 percent of total advances as of June 30, down from 2.74 percent at the end of 2007.

The bank's net interest margin, a measure of lending profitability, widened to 3.01 percent from 2.8 percent in full year 2007, according to today's statement.

The expansion comes after government efforts to cool credit growth by imposing loan quotas, raising interest rates and telling banks to set aside record amounts of deposits as reserves. These measures may start to bite in the second half.

Financial Services

``The biggest risk to the banking industry is the macro economic uncertainty, no banks -- no matter how well managed -- can be immune from a slowdown,'' said Zhang Xiaojun, who manages the equivalent of $1.8 billion at Shenzhen-based Bosera Fund Management Co., including ICBC shares. ``Big banks like ICBC will do better than smaller ones because of their more diversified loan portfolio.''

ICBC's profit rose 41 percent to 31.4 billion yuan in the second quarter from a year earlier. The figure was calculated by subtracting first-quarter earnings from first-half profit. The growth slowed from 77 percent in the first quarter.

``There's still the second half and we'll continue to work hard,'' Jiang Jianqing, Chairman of ICBC, said at a press conference today. ``We're confident to be the most profitable for the full year but we'll have to wait till the end to see who gets the gold medal.''

Global Rivals Struggle

Other banks have posted higher first-half profits in previous years. Citigroup Inc., the largest U.S. bank by assets, earned at least $9.5 billion in the first halves of 2005, 2006 and 2007. Bank of America Corp., the second-largest U.S. bank, earned more than $10 billion in the first halves of 2006 and 2007, as did HBSC, Europe's largest bank, in the first half of last year.

ICBC's net interest income gained 29 percent to 131.8 billion yuan in the first half as income from loans outpaced interest paid on deposits. Net fee and commission income from services such as credit cards, wealth management and insurance sales rose 48 percent to 24.5 billion yuan.

ICBC was the largest national distributor of insurance policies, mutual funds, government bonds and wealth management products in 2007. The bank has diversified into fund management, financial leasing and is now seeking an insurance license. The bank also owns over 1,100 premier wealth management centers to serve high-net worth customers.

Higher Return

ICBC's return on equity is 22.8 percent, higher than HSBC's 13 percent and JPMorgan Chase & Co.'s 8.7 percent. The bank has $1.4 trillion of assets and held $1.21 billion of U.S. subprime- related securities at the end of June. ICBC had written off $702 million on the investments by the end of the second quarter.

It has $2.7 billion of debt issued by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, the two biggest U.S. home loan companies, and $651 million of Alt-A residential mortgage-backed securities after cutting such investments by $8 billion in the first half, Jiang said.

By comparison, mortgage-related writedowns totaled $55.1 billion at Citigroup and $44.2 billion at UBS since the start of 2007, according to Bloomberg data, as the worst U.S. housing market since the Great Depression fanned out into credit markets.

Profit at London-based rival HSBC, Europe's biggest bank by market value, fell 29 percent in the first half on record subprime mortgage defaults in the U.S.

The Chinese lender last year overtook Citigroup Inc. as the world's biggest bank by market value. Its Hong Kong-traded shares are the best performer in the Hang Seng Finance Index. ICBC's Shanghai-traded shares have fallen 41 percent.

Goldman Sachs Group, Allianz AG and American Express, which bought a combined 7.2 percent in ICBC in January 2006, nine months before its initial public offering, have seen the value of their investments increase more than fourfold.

You think the West will sit their asses while some vicious, amoral people take over the world. Mankind is only where it is because of Western civilizations.

Actually, when you say "Western" it's really Anglo-American culture. France has sh!t to do with Western dominance. Not any more than Belgium or Luxembourg.

So SFTU and stop pretending like France is relevant, you froggie cvnt.

-------------------------------------------------

I remember when c-seven tried to relate PPP with currency manipulation!

Frog killer

hahaha

Frog killer

Why don't all these chinese clones go back to their nearest Carrefour supermarket and shut their big mouth?

So we have banks with no assets but who are the biggest banks of the world by profit? Don't make me laugh.

There's a bug somewhere.

Either way the exporter HAVE to work with one of those banks and that's a way for the state to collect taxes or something like that, or it's a temporary situation or it's a pure propagnada mean but it doesn't make it.

Also profit one year doesn't say that you're not gona be in bankrupcy the following year.

Assets AND profits means more (i-e assets that don't loose value in the counts).

"The market reflects the health of your bank. Pure and simple. "

sorry chinegooks bro its not being as simple as thesed.

its only anglo amerikunts westrns europa topless anli threesome orgyieds upskirt pole dildo dancings fellation children backside its jungle culture? propagandas

they are always beings sayings market automatically seekings equilibria but realityeds its need human agents doings these works

market values can being affectings by propaganda, rumours, news, miscalculations, wrong estimations etc etc

otherwise also the markets could have predictings amerikunts toxic waste assets of fatso obesity cowboys incestuous faggetry its jungle culture? and evaluateds them accordingly

===========================================
I am old Christiankiller
Sorry for offensive to our good religion christian brothers
I am not hating christians

Notan was right all along. lol.

F.uck an eye for an eye. You take my eye, and I will kill you, and all those you care about. That is our policy.

Why don't all these chinese clones go back to their nearest Carrefour supermarket and shut their big mouth?


Why don't you and your irrelevant nation STFU, froggie.

Do you even understand what is going on in the fooking financial world today? Bank assets are deemed worthless because of the chopped mortgaged secuities which is why their market caps have gone down the sh!tter.

If those assets were worth anything, it would be reflected in the marketplace. If they were worth anything, the fooking government of the US and UK wouldn't have to through tax-payers' money at Citigroup or RBS to keep them afloat (I have no idea what France is doing because I don't fooking care because France is fooking irrelevant in the world of high finance.)

If can't even fooking figure out what is happening to our fvcking world today, you should STFU and leave this thread.


-------------------------------------------------

BigFatPandaBear
Do you even understand what is going on in the fooking financial world today? Bank assets are deemed worthless because of the chopped mortgaged secuities which is why their market caps have gone down the sh!tter.

If those assets were worth anything, it would be reflected in the marketplace. If they were worth anything, the fooking government of the US and UK wouldn't have to through tax-payers' money at Citigroup or RBS to keep them afloat


The market is always right but you know perfectly well that in the short run it over react heavily and is all emotional specially in crisis periode.

if the market capitalisation means something, so is the result and the asset.
1) the value of the asset is evaluated in the account,
2) the variation of the asset value appear in the result.

So don't do as if you knew that much about the subject.

(I have no idea what France is doing because I don't fooking care because France is fooking irrelevant in the world of high finance.)

France's finance is relevant enough so that if you had any clue about finance, you would have an idea about it.

France finance is less affected than Brit, US and German one.
I read some moron say BNP Pariba is responsible of the crisis because beginning 2008 the boss decided the subprimes were junk and sold them all. He sold them a good price but it rocked the market a bit

hahaha.. damn idiot freedom frieds!!! hahaha

OMG!!! hahaha.... francheese freids......

can I ask you a question? are franchies are same like you?

what did you learned from franch school? how can you guys low IQ like that? that's amazying.... ****... hahaha

OKOK. I got it... ok I got it!!! brainstocked franchies!!!

The market is always right but you know perfectly well that in the short run it over react heavily and is all emotional specially in crisis periode.

Yes, it's all emotional when the fvcking UK government owns 70% of the Royal Bank of Scotland.

Are you fvcking crazy or just clueless?

One, emotions last days not fooking five months. When things are down five months, it's reality. If those assets were worth anything, those banks would be good bargains and people would buy them as as sure thing or safe havens.

Two, and this is what a monkey should understand, the government would NEVER put billions into a bank and risk taxpayers' money if the assets were worth anything.

Now get the fvck off of this thread if you're going to be that fvcking stupid about it.


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a bank has assets 2000billions, that means this bank controled 2000billions worth money on the bookmarks, or you can say this bank lend out 2000billions worth money, those money aren't bank's, they are from all the people who deposited in to thire account in this bank, and this bank lend out 1900billions cash in house and other markets,and hold only 100billions on hand for daily use) it looks like damn good profit,(people deposited interest rate 2.5%, and bank lend out for 5.5%, 1900billions X 5.5= 104.5billion income, and they pay interest to thire deposit accounts customers for 2000billions X 2.5% = 40billions, also they need to spend 25billions for wage, rent, electric.... ext. so they think this is a great bussinese, big profit, and all of western bank geting mad, most people don't need to pay any downs, and almost all of them can lend $ from the banks,

now, the house price won't increase forever, the market geting cool down, and the trouble coming, house price decrease 30% and they are hard to sell out now, so, alot of people geting broken, and the banks take back the house. now the bank lend out 1900 billions on house and other properties, and now they only worth 1500 billions........ and the house markets looks like still keep cold down...... more and more people geting broken...... 1900billions now only worth 1500billions and the # is just keep going down...... so. the bank lose 400billions in fact... now you got it? more assets could means more lose. if the problem is only that, that could be just ok.

now, people who opened a deposit account on this bank hear this news...... and they will come to the bank and take away $ from the bank, now you know this bank aready lend out 95% of the $ in house market, so they don't have $ in hand. and houses are hard to sell now...... what can they do? they asking the goverment to help them out, other wise........ say: we are broken!!!

and look at chinese banks, each lender need to pay 30-40% down if you want to loan money from the banks to buy a house. so the chinese banks won't have this heppend. and they keep making big $.

now can you understand what happend now idiot franchies?

Here's a video to explain the crisis to the dummies because those chinese cloned panda above are fùcking retarded. Either way they don't understand anything, or play Mr. obvious and lecture us that 2 and 2 make 4 or mix up the anglos problem of subprime with french case.

http://vimeo.com/3261363

Whatever makes you happy, surrender monkey....Facts remain Chinese banks are the most valuable....you may have more assets, but investors discount the value of your assets. So go play surrender monkey.

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now you franchies must be know alot of your banks aren't worth a panie.
HSBC stock fall 25% today. you idiot

Big Fat Panda Bear



Two, and this is what a monkey should understand, the government would NEVER put billions into a bank and risk taxpayers' money if the assets were worth anything.




The variation of asset appear in the result and if the asset got devaluated it lower it's capital ratio.


capital ratio:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_requirement

Depository institutions are subject to risk-based capital guidelines issued by the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System (FRB). These guidelines are used to evaluate capital adequacy based primarily on the perceived credit risk associated with balance sheet assets, as well as certain off-balance sheet exposures such as unfunded loan commitments, letters of credit, and derivatives and foreign exchange contracts. The risk-based capital guidelines are supplemented by a leverage ratio requirement. To be adequately capitalized under federal bank regulatory agency definitions, a bank holding company must have a Tier 1 capital ratio of at least 4%, a combined Tier 1 and Tier 2 capital ratio of at least 8%, and a leverage ratio of at least 4%, and not be subject to a directive, order, or written agreement to meet and maintain specific capital levels. To be well-capitalized under federal bank regulatory agency definitions, a bank holding company must have a Tier 1 capital ratio of at least 6%, a combined Tier 1 and Tier 2 capital ratio of at least 10%, and a leverage ratio of at least 5%, and not be subject to a directive, order, or written agreement to meet and maintain specific capital levels. These capital ratios are reported quarterly on the Call Report or Thrift Financial Report.



I prefered when the Chinese were all humble.

QQ007
now you franchies must be know alot of your banks aren't worth a panie.
HSBC stock fall 25% today. you idiot

HSBC is not french yet.

Frenchie,

What are you trying to say here with that excerpt? Chinese banks are better capitalized than any bank in the world because these are state-owned banks with unlimited capital backed by China's huge reserves and full faith and credit. No bank can compete with that. More importantly, because they are state owned, China is able to separate out any bad loans they generate and replenish their capital base, be it tier-1 or tier-2 capital. Each of the four chinese banks has a NPL management company, which recently are in need of more capital injection which is not much really.

This is exactly what US and UK and others are doing through nationalizing their banks and creation of good bank and bad bank; only chinese banks are nationalized in the first place and had the good bank and bad bank model in the first place, even though global investors hold their shares.

Another advantage Chinese banks have is the governmetn sets the net interest margin, which is the spread between the cost of funding for banks and the rates they charge on their loans. No other banks, even after western banks being nationalized, can do that. Basically, it's guaranteed profit.

That's why our banks are worth a lot more than lousy french banks, even though you have more assets. The risk-adjusted net interest margin (profit for banks) that you can generate from your asset is what matters, not just the size of your balance sheet.


Frenchie, you shouldn't really dabble where you don't belong.....Now, run along and play surrender monkey.

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Hawkssss
What are you trying to say here with that excerpt? Chinese banks are better capitalized than any bank in the world because these are state-owned banks with unlimited capital backed by China's huge reserves and full faith and credit. No bank can compete with that. More importantly, because they are state owned, China is able to separate out any bad loans they generate and replenish their capital base, be it tier-1 or tier-2 capital. Each of the four chinese banks has a NPL management company, which recently are in need of more capital injection which is not much really.

This is exactly what US and UK and others are doing through nationalizing their banks and creation of good bank and bad bank; only chinese banks are nationalized in the first place and had the good bank and bad bank model in the first place, even though global investors hold their shares.

Another advantage Chinese banks have is the governmetn sets the net interest margin, which is the spread between the cost of funding for banks and the rates they charge on their loans. No other banks, even after western banks being nationalized, can do that. Basically, it's guaranteed profit.


those are some good points but there is something I don't get: the Chinese banks are state owned, I guess only a small part of the capital is on the market and I'm not even sure if foreigners can buy them.
But previously you said that what matter the most is the stock value on the market. How can it be that significant when only a tiny part of the shares are floating ?

You got to admit it: what matter is both the market value, the result and the value of the asset. Is it that complicate to understand or are you afraid you're going to lose face if you admit it ?

Frenchie, you shouldn't really dabble where you don't belong.....Now, run along and play surrender monke

Seems like the new generation of Chinese is most arrogant and unpolite.

It's very easy to look up the free float of these state-owned banks. Major international banks and institutional investors own large trunks of these banks. It is a prerequesit for most stock exchanges to require public companies have minimum free float (for example 35%-45%, etc.) These are public companies with ADR and listing in major international exchanges such as Hong Kong and US and they have to abide by reporting rules of their listing boards like any other public company (semi-annual financial reporting in Hong Kong and quarterly in the US).

Yes, market cap is important because it is a reflection of the profit-making potential of the company. It is usually a leading indicator. Of course, market cap is often manipulated or skewed due to mis-information, but still it is probably the best indicator of a company's value.

Of course, the balance sheet or asset size matters, but at the end what matters is the profit generation ability of these assets. For example, a huge asset base with a negative net interest margin means trouble vs a small asset base with a positive NIM. of course, NIM here is risk-adjusted and loss-adjusted.

As for being unpolite, some of your compatriats aren't much better.

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HSBC is not french yet
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did I ever said HSBC is franch's?
you franch don't have any banks good as HSBC, sucks. hahaha
as what I know. franch banks got biger problelm then HSBC.
face to the fact. you got many many big trouble in next few years.

Seems like the new generation of Chinese is most arrogant and unpolite.

It's worst than this. Man, look at this post:

******hahaha.. damn idiot freedom frieds!!! hahaha

OMG!!! hahaha.... francheese freids......

can I ask you a question? are franchies are same like you?

what did you learned from franch school? how can you guys low IQ like that? that's amazying.... ****... hahaha

OKOK. I got it... ok I got it!!! brainstocked franchies!!!******

Isn't it completelly retarded that?

The guy is trisomic 21 or what?

It's better his mom' doesn't see what her fat retard does on the internet otherwise she's gona sell him out for one yuan to a american couple who can't have childen LOL.

Not even talking about the other imbecile who quote HSBC - a anglo-chinese bank - as an example of french bank problems because it loose 25% on Hong Kong Index ROLFMAO!

Even the original Panda is about as stupid as his clones on that one. I had a little bit of respect for him but the poor guy is going stupidier and stupidier by the day.

Irelevant french banks?

Let see. We have #2 (BNP), #5 (Crédit Agricole) and #7 (Société Général) in the top 10, and BNP has just bought the #19 (Fortis bank) which make it now the world #1 of private banks with 2,477,272+1,121,656=~3,600,000 $m .... and Caylyon is now owned by Crédit Agricole which push it to the third or 2nd place.

So we're going to repeat it very slowly, to let those slow brains to go to bed less retarded than they woke up:

1- with the highest saving rate of the western world (17%) the french don't need money from anybody
2- the anglos mortage problem is THEIR problem and the impact is negligible on our banks, especially since BNP sold all the anglos junks just before everybody (which ignited the crisis, LOL)
4- since all the foreigner around are going down the drain, we just had to wait for their fall to become #1, 3 and 7 for banking, LOL,
5- concerning insurances: AXA is still world #1 and made very decent profilt this year (compare to AIG re-LOL). Oh, I forgot: acually BNP was engaged with AIG.... a sad story.... but has just recieve a 5.5 $billion check from the american tax payer with the lastest plan to save this junk

Talk about irrelevance...

What's going on in this in this middle kindom group? really that's a pitty. No bosses anymore since Dragon left and here we are. The mess. Imature trolls with no respect who make their ancestors ashame for 14 generations as soon as they open their mouth.

Ok, now you can switch back in 'Ignore mode', talk about 'irrelevance' and Fùck off.

Frenchie, you shouldn't really dabble where you don't belong.....Now, run along and play surrender monke

BTW: how do you say "Son Of a B..." in chinese? I mean with the Confort Woman and all that you know? Just asking.

Frenchie is getting desparate.

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That fooking French idiot needs to get the fook off this thread. He's fooking clueless as to what's going on in the world.

Then again, France means sh!t to the rest of the world.

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