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India: 21st-century sea power

December 12 2011 at 6:21 PM

WAFFer  (Login AryanArya)
Satyameva Jayate (India)


http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2011/s3382579.htm

India: 21st-century sea power


MARK COLVIN: China is not the only rising superpower in Australia's region, though it is the one that gets the most attention. But India is coming up fast on the rails, not just as an economic power but a military one too.

The arms watchdog SIPRI (Stockholm International Peace Research Institute) this year named India as the world's biggest weapons importer. Another report forecasts that India will spend about $80 billion on military modernisation programs by 2015.

And the country has plans to spend $45 billion over 20 years on sea power, 103 new warships, including destroyers and nuclear submarines.

David Brewster, of the Strategic and Defence Studies Centre at the ANU (Australian National University), has written a new book called 'India as an Asia Pacific Power'. I asked him why India needed this expanded navy.

DAVID BREWSTER: The reality is that they're not under any specific threat of attack along their coastline. But they do see the need to be able to project power through their navy in an area right from Somalia to Singapore and beyond. And they've actually defined that as their area of strategic interest - from Somalia to Singapore and beyond.

MARK COLVIN: So when they have a navy of several hundred ships, what are they going to do with it?

DAVID BREWSTER: Well it's the ability to act as the regional constable or policemen. So if there is a problem in some small island state or some smaller country in the region, instability, they can go in and sort it out and keep the peace. Just like the Americans do all over the world. And just like the Australians do on a much smaller scale in our own area in the South Pacific.

MARK COLVIN: In a sense that makes them an imperial power eventually. What do the smaller nations in the area think of them - of that?

DAVID BREWSTER: Yeah well you could certainly express it in those terms. Luckily for India that they've been quite cautious and benign through much of their history and really haven't exerted much military power beyond South Asia.

So, beyond South Asia most countries are relatively comfortable with seeing an Indian warship coming into harbour. Whereas countries would be less comfortable in seeing a Chinese warship floating around, for example.

MARK COLVIN: So India and China are the two big rising powers, there's clearly a lot of potential for friction there.

DAVID BREWSTER: Yeah, and it is a complicated relationship because they are also - have a hugely expanding trading relationship and economic relationship. So there's a lot of cooperation going on one hand, but there's also a lot of friction on the other hand.

MARK COLVIN: And they have been to war with each other at least once before, in 1962.

DAVID BREWSTER: That's' right. And that's when the Indian army was absolutely humiliated and defeated by the Chinese. And that humiliation still rankles in New Delhi and there are many in New Delhi who want to see that righted, that wrong righted.

But more immediately is the Chinese support for Pakistan and the fact that the Chinese proliferated nuclear weapons to Pakistan some 10, or more like 20 year ago and effectively armed their longstanding enemy.

MARK COLVIN: It sounds like a fairly lethal cocktail, possibly, further down the track?

DAVID BREWSTER: It is, although I think most in New Delhi and Beijing are very careful to keep the competition and rivalry within certain bounds. So they will make shows of things, but don't - they're careful not to overstep the mark.

MARK COLVIN: But further down the track, as I say, when each country will have several hundred ships afloat, it could get pretty dangerous?

DAVID BREWSTER: Certainly, and also very complicated. Because it's not India versus China it's really a three or four way match, because there's the United States there. And certainly over the coming years the biggest area of competition will be between China and the United States. India is much smaller but obviously growing very, very fast.

MARK COLVIN: Is it in that light that we should see President Obama's recent announcement, when he was here, of the troop rotations through northern Australia?

DAVID BREWSTER: It's certainly part of it. The United States is making great efforts to bring all of its Asia-Pacific allies much closer. Not just Australia but all of its allies. And it's also trying to gradually bring India into that sphere, at the same time as encouraging closer relationships between India and Australia, and Japan and India.

MARK COLVIN: But is Kevin Rudd sensible to do what he's doing, to argue for a closer triangular India-Australia-US relationship? Is it worth the danger of annoying Beijing?

DAVID BREWSTER: Well I think that decision's already been taken when the Government allowed the US troops into Darwin. Certainly in 2007 Australia backed away from a relationship between the United States, India, Japan and Australia. We backed away then. And that was probably a mistake, and that

MARK COLVIN: That was because there was a danger that that four-party arrangement would have made China feel completely encircled in this region?

DAVID BREWSTER: That's what the claim was, but in fact all of those involved, including the United States, Japan and India and Australia got cold feet about it. But now the positions have hardened because China has been showing quite assertive behaviour towards all of its neighbours. So now I think there's a much greater consensus that there should be multilateral cooperation among the democracies around China.

MARK COLVIN: Some strategic thinkers are making comparisons with the early 20th century in Europe with the rise of Germany. When big power relationships shift to this degree, there's always dangers aren't there?

DAVID BREWSTER: Absolutely. And that's - there's very clear analogies there. In Europe there was the rising power of Germany that was butting up against the great world power of Britain. And there were, you know, a lot of other things happening.

So that's certainly a very easy analogy to make, but the hope is that we learnt our lesson from what happened there and we can create structures that bring China gradually into the international community in a measured way.

MARK COLVIN: David Brewster of the Strategic and Defence Studies Centre at the ANU. His new book is 'India as an Asia Pacific Power'.



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Krinvanto Vishwam Aryam
(Make this World Noble)

- Rigveda


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AuthorReply

(Login oneman28)
WAFFer

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 12 2011, 10:16 PM 

In the end of 21st century, any country could be a power. it is funny to talk a country that can't even make a quality rifle would be a sea power.[linked image]

 
 
WAFFer
(Login zergcerebrates)
Middle Kingdom (China)

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 13 2011, 12:22 AM 



The developments of India and China regarding to its navy would be quite interesting in the next 20yrs. I doubt there could be anything serious happening between these two countries. The chances of China having a conflict with the US is way higher than that with India, and India with Pakistan.

 
 

AryanArya
(Login AryanArya)
Satyameva Jayate (India)

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 14 2011, 5:10 PM 


http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/indias-navy-holding-maritime-patrol-aircraft-competition-updated-01991/


Indias Navy Picks Its Future High-End Maritime Patrol Aircraft

Dec 06, 2011 11:29 EST


Indias fleet of Soviet-era maritime patrol aircraft has been upgraded, but it needs to be replaced. Indian naval responsibilities are growing, and the 2008 terrorist atrocities in Mumbai made it crystal-clear that control of their coasts was a necessity. Fortunately, they already had a competition underway. In December 2005, after an attempted buy of Lockheed Martin P-3s fell through, Indias navy had floated an RFP for at least 8 new sea control aircraft. Bids from a variety of contenders, including Lockheed Martin, were submitted in April 2007. Subsequent statements by Indias Admiral Prakash suggested that they could be looking for as many as 30 aircraft by 2020.

The plan had been for price negotiations to be completed in 2007, with first deliveries to commence within 48 months. Indias Ministry of Defence has extreme problems with announced schedules, but their existing fleet was wearing out, international requests for Indias maritime patrol help are rising, and Mumbais events provided an extra shove. By January 2009, India had picked its aircraft: the 737-derivative P-8i Neptune, a variant of the P-8A thats readying for service as the P-3s successor within the US Navy. DID discusses the geopolitical drivers, the current fleet, the known competitors, Boeings P-8i, and key contracts and events


With Growing Naval Power Comes Growing Naval Responsibility


The competition and refurbishment efforts are being given greater impetus by international developments. In February 2006, IPT reported that warning bells have been sounded at an international summit over the mounting terrorist threats to sea lanes around Indonesia and the Straits of Malacca, which serves as a choke-point for a significant percentage of global shipping. At a subsequent high-level meeting in the United States that included Australia, Singapore, Malaysia, Indonesia, Japan and others, Stratfor reported that India was asked to play a major policing role against sea-piracy in the region.

Successful procurement of modern maritime patrol aircraft would certainly expand Indias capabilities, as its naval responsibilities undergo rapid growth. To the west, India is also undertaking anti-piracy efforts on the East African coast, with a base in Madagascar and a recent military co-operation agreement with Mozambique that includes coastal patrol responsibilities.


The Indian Navy currently relies on its fleet of around 15 Dornier 228-101 aircraft and 12 Israeli Searcher Mark II and Heron unmanned aerial vehicles to monitor Indias 7,516 km long coastline, 1,197 islands and a 2.01 square km exclusive economic zone.

Additional patrols and interdiction within and beyond that area are undertaken by its 8 ultra-long-range TU-142 Bear aircraft and its remaining IL-38 May maritime surveillance aircraft, which have been upgraded to IL-38SD status. The IL-38SDs was expected to rise to 5 operational planes the by end of 2008, but the planes have been a flashpoint for controversy due to a May 14/07 report from Indias Comptroller and Auditor General (CAG) which said that the first 2 are missing essential avionics and weapon systems that are seriously limiting their operational capabilities.

New resources are needed. At the low end, India is buying Dornier 228NGs. At the high end, they decided that the Boeings P-8is fast long-range cruise, and advanced ground and ocean monitoring systems, made it their best option for patrolling the Indian Oceans expanses.




===========================================
[linked image]

Krinvanto Vishwam Aryam
(Make this World Noble)

- Rigveda


-------------------------------------------
[linked image]

 
 
Hawkssss
(Login Hawkssss)
Elite WAFF Vet Club

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 15 2011, 4:34 AM 

you can't become a serious power by buying from others....yeah, yeah, I know you got all the most advanced nuke subs, destroyers, carriers under construction, but other than indians, nobody believes they will be entering service in a decade....

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(Login Free_Nation)

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 15 2011, 11:12 AM 

but you can become a serious super power by making recycled junk and selling cheap sweatshirts made in sweatshops eh?

=================================================================
Quotations by global leaders on phuckistan wink.gif

British PM David Cameron: There will be lots of questions about what support system bin Laden had in Pakistan, and we need those questions answered

White House counterterrorism chief John Brennan: Certainly his location there outside of the capital raises questions. We are talking to the Pakistanis about this. It's inconceivable that bin Laden did not have a support system in the country that allowed him to remain there for an extended period of time

Our government is in fiscal distress. To make contributions to a country that isn't going to be fully supportive is a problem for many, said US senate intelligence committee chair Dianne Feinstein

German chancellor Angela Merkel: The al-Qaida leader's death has exposed some gaps in antiterrorism campaign

French foreign minister Alain Juppe: I find it a little difficult to imagine that the presence of someone like bin Laden ... in a relatively small town could go completely unnoticed. Pakistans position lacks clarity in our view

http://epaper.timesofindia.com/Default/Client.asp?Daily=CAP&showST=true&login=default&pub=TOI&Enter=true&Skin=TOINEW&AW=1304526620083

 
 
Hawkssss
(Login Hawkssss)
Elite WAFF Vet Club

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 15 2011, 3:32 PM 

Yes, china can. India can't. History has proven it.

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AryanArya
(Login AryanArya)
Satyameva Jayate (India)

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 15 2011, 9:38 PM 

The chinese navy like the Indian navy is a up coming navy. To pretend other wise is wrong. And i dont understand what has history proved ?

===========================================
[linked image]

Krinvanto Vishwam Aryam
(Make this World Noble)

- Rigveda


-------------------------------------------
[linked image]

 
 
WAFFer
(Login dzhuang)
Middle Kingdom (China)

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 17 2011, 3:03 PM 

^^^It's amazing how indians are so desperate to group themselves with China

 
 

AryanArya
(Login AryanArya)
Satyameva Jayate (India)

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 18 2011, 2:13 AM 

Who wants to group with whom ? No one even brought China into the picture until the chinese themselves started trolling in this thread and started flaming. The chinese members in this forum are so obssesed with flaming about anything India that like a psychological patient they dont even realise about their obsession and thinks that its the Indians who want to group with them ! And even if anybody even do try to compare with china, then what exactly is the problem ? Have you seen any Indian making a big issue when the pakistanis try to group with Indians or the Americans made a big issue when a chinese try to group with Americans ? The chinese are the only ones who make a big issue out of such silly things. Tells a lot about the obsession about hierarchy in chinese thinking.


===========================================
[linked image]

Krinvanto Vishwam Aryam
(Make this World Noble)

- Rigveda


-------------------------------------------
[linked image]

 
 
WAFFer
(Login dzhuang)
Middle Kingdom (China)

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 18 2011, 3:59 AM 

^^^Everyone can see how much in denial and dellusional you are about the difference between iindia and China...just by looking at your responces, how you constanlty make excuses and understate the difference between the two...no wonder the gap between China and india is getting larger..lol

 
 

AryanArya
(Login AryanArya)
Satyameva Jayate (India)

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 18 2011, 4:11 AM 

Who is in denial or in delusion about the difference between India and China ? I will be the first to admit that China is ahead of India in many spheres from economy to military. But if you think that my statement that India and China are both up coming navies is ignoring the difference between India and China, then its not me but you who is living in delusion !


===========================================
[linked image]

Krinvanto Vishwam Aryam
(Make this World Noble)

- Rigveda


-------------------------------------------
[linked image]

 
 
WAFFer
(Login dzhuang)
Middle Kingdom (China)

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 18 2011, 5:35 AM 

^^^More chatter and double talk from delusional indians....just look at her previous statements...one post "China is ahead"...the next four post "China and india are the same"...blah blah blah...so sad

 
 

AryanArya
(Login AryanArya)
Satyameva Jayate (India)

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 18 2011, 3:31 PM 

Where in this entire thread did i say that India and China are equals ? You are displaying lack of reading comprehensive skills . With respect to my statement that IN and PLAN are up coming navies, are you denying that PLAN is not a up coming navy ? or do you beleive that PLAN is already a superpower navy ?

===========================================
[linked image]

Krinvanto Vishwam Aryam
(Make this World Noble)

- Rigveda


-------------------------------------------
[linked image]

 
 

(Login Free_Nation)

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 19 2011, 12:22 PM 

^^^It's amazing how indians are so desperate to group themselves with China

China owes its heritage to India and you think we would be obliged to a bunch of cultureless, uncivilised baboons like you?

Your religion, culture everything is inspired by India.

What has ever come out of china, in philosophy, medicine, science, literature everything we are ahead of you.

go and remain a japanese slave, thats what you are good at.

=================================================================
Quotations by global leaders on phuckistan wink.gif

British PM David Cameron: There will be lots of questions about what support system bin Laden had in Pakistan, and we need those questions answered

White House counterterrorism chief John Brennan: Certainly his location there outside of the capital raises questions. We are talking to the Pakistanis about this. It's inconceivable that bin Laden did not have a support system in the country that allowed him to remain there for an extended period of time

Our government is in fiscal distress. To make contributions to a country that isn't going to be fully supportive is a problem for many, said US senate intelligence committee chair Dianne Feinstein

German chancellor Angela Merkel: The al-Qaida leader's death has exposed some gaps in antiterrorism campaign

French foreign minister Alain Juppe: I find it a little difficult to imagine that the presence of someone like bin Laden ... in a relatively small town could go completely unnoticed. Pakistans position lacks clarity in our view

http://epaper.timesofindia.com/Default/Client.asp?Daily=CAP&showST=true&login=default&pub=TOI&Enter=true&Skin=TOINEW&AW=1304526620083

 
 
WAFFer
(Login dzhuang)
Middle Kingdom (China)

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 19 2011, 1:55 PM 

^^^Another example of blow hard, do nothing, delusional indians...constant source of amusement on WAFF

 
 

AryanArya
(Login AryanArya)
Satyameva Jayate (India)

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 19 2011, 6:37 PM 


So you are going to ignore the question whether chinese navy is a up coming navy like i said or do you think its already a superpower navy and thinks everyone are in delusions and ignore your own delusion ?

===========================================
[linked image]

Krinvanto Vishwam Aryam
(Make this World Noble)

- Rigveda


-------------------------------------------
[linked image]

 
 
WAFFer
(Login dzhuang)
Middle Kingdom (China)

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 20 2011, 4:25 AM 

^^^If you're going to compare navies to the only super power (USA) then every nation is "up and coming"....Ayran you're know for your double talk and being pedantic in order to create excuses for india's short falls...don't try to group China together with india considering we are years ahead of you...sorry to crush your wet dreams.

 
 

(Login Free_Nation)

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 20 2011, 5:52 AM 

^^^Another example of blow hard, do nothing, delusional indians...constant source of amusement on WAFF

keep dreaming, when in reality Sanskrit is the oldest written language and Indian history is older than china.

your history began with genghiz khan after all.

=================================================================
Quotations by global leaders on phuckistan wink.gif

British PM David Cameron: There will be lots of questions about what support system bin Laden had in Pakistan, and we need those questions answered

White House counterterrorism chief John Brennan: Certainly his location there outside of the capital raises questions. We are talking to the Pakistanis about this. It's inconceivable that bin Laden did not have a support system in the country that allowed him to remain there for an extended period of time

Our government is in fiscal distress. To make contributions to a country that isn't going to be fully supportive is a problem for many, said US senate intelligence committee chair Dianne Feinstein

German chancellor Angela Merkel: The al-Qaida leader's death has exposed some gaps in antiterrorism campaign

French foreign minister Alain Juppe: I find it a little difficult to imagine that the presence of someone like bin Laden ... in a relatively small town could go completely unnoticed. Pakistans position lacks clarity in our view

http://epaper.timesofindia.com/Default/Client.asp?Daily=CAP&showST=true&login=default&pub=TOI&Enter=true&Skin=TOINEW&AW=1304526620083

 
 
WAFFer
(Login dzhuang)
Middle Kingdom (China)

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 20 2011, 7:03 AM 

^^^It's amazing the lies indians have to tell themselves to make them feel important....lol...keep dreaming monkies..

 
 

AryanArya
(Login AryanArya)
Satyameva Jayate (India)

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 20 2011, 3:58 PM 



\\If you're going to compare navies to the only super power (USA) then every nation is "up and coming"....Ayran you're know for your double talk and being pedantic in order to create excuses for india's short falls...don't try to group China together with india considering we are years ahead of you...sorry to crush your wet dreams.\\


Even if you take out the US, the Chinese navy is still an up and coming navy. Does the Chinese navy can compare itself with say the British, French or Japanese navies ? You think only China and India are the only countries in this planet ? Even if you compare Indian and Chinese navies, the Chinese are not ahead in all aspects of naval spheres. The chinese are ahead in submarine experience while the Indians are ahead in carrier experience although over all, china is ahead because of comparatively more budget and earlier development of SSBN.



===========================================
[linked image]

Krinvanto Vishwam Aryam
(Make this World Noble)

- Rigveda


-------------------------------------------
[linked image]

 
 

(Login w00tness)
Satyameva Jayate (India)

Re: India: 21st-century sea power

December 23 2011, 8:12 PM 

LOL...chingeloos dreaming of being a hyper power when their only carrier has just started Sea trials. What a joke...LOL!

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