Wala pong kinalaman kung magkapamilya o magkamag-anak ang humahaliling lider. Hindi po ito ang basehan sa pagpili ng humahaliling tagapamahalang pangkalahatan sa loob ng Iglesia Ni Cristo.
Sa tunay na bayan ng Diyos, ang Diyos ang naglalagay ng magiging lider gaya ni Josue na humalili kay Moises(Deut.1:38; 34:9)
Sa Iglesia Ni Cristo na siyang bayan ng Diyos sa mga huling araw na ito, ang Diyos din ang naglagay ng hahalili sa Kaniyang sugong lider(Kapatid na Felix Y. Manalo).
Nang dumating ang pagkakataon na malapit nang pagpahingahin ng Diyos ang kapatid na Felix Y. Manalo ay naghalal ng isang hahalili para maipagpatuloy ang gawain.
Nagkaroon ng isang pagpupulong ng mga Ministro at tagapamahala ng mga Dibisyon(Distrito) sa pangunguna ng kapatid na Felix Y. Manalo kung sino ang hahalili bilang tagapamahalang pangkalahatan ng Iglesia Ni Cristo.
Tatlo ang pinagpilian: Sila ay sina kapatid na: Isaias Samson, Isaias Reyes at Kapatid na Eranio Manalo. Ang lahat ay napagkaisahan na ihalal bilang susunod na tagapamahalang pangkalahatan ang kapatid na Eranio G. Manalo, ang kaisahan sa loob ng tunay na Iglesia ay may patnubay ng Espiritu Santo(Gawa 15:25,28).
Maging sa bayang Israel na siyang unang bayan ng Diyos ay nagkaroon din ng pagkakataon na si Haring David na siyang lider sa bayang Israel noon ay hinalinhan ng kaniyang anak na si Solomon at sumunod na hari ay ang anak ni Solomon.
Salamat po.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Salamat sa iyong kasagutan. Tama ka na hindi mahalaga kung kamag-anak o hindi, siguro nagkataon lang na si Erano Manalo ang napili at siguro magkakataon din na si Eduardo Manalo ang mapipiling susunod na Pinuno. Siguro wala lang talagang mas karapat-dapat kaysa sa mga lahi ni Felix Manalo. Sya ngapala Moses elected Joshua to replace him eventhough he has a son...
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Para hindi po tayo lumayo sa tunay na diwa ng forum na ito..
Tanong ko lang ADD fanatics (if you guys are still there), karapat-dapat ba talaga si G. Daniel Razon na humalili kay G. Eli Soriano kung sakaling siya ay pumanaw?
Malamang gayahin nila ang Iglesia ni Manalo. FYI there's no such thing as Iglesia Ni Manalo. I presume you got that crap thing from Eli Soriano and the rest of INC haters out there.
jason
(Login jasongapo)
Re: What Satan Doesn't Want You To Know
No score for this post October 8 2007, 10:50 PM
Salamat sa iyong kasagutan. Tama ka na hindi mahalaga kung kamag-anak o hindi, siguro nagkataon lang na si Erano Manalo ang napili at siguro magkakataon din na si Eduardo Manalo ang mapipiling susunod na Pinuno. Siguro wala lang talagang mas karapat-dapat kaysa sa mga lahi ni Felix Manalo. Sya ngapala Moses elected Joshua to replace him eventhough he has a son...
Vs.
jason
(Login jasongapo)
Re: What Satan Doesn't Want You To Know
No score for this post October 9 2007, 6:28 AM
Siguro. Kamag-anak ni Eli Soriano yun di ba? Malamang gayahin nila ang Iglesia ni Manalo. Kamag-anak Inc na ang mangyayari. Eli Soriano: "Ang taong nagkakakontra-kontra ang sinasabi, 'yung medyo may sira ulo 'non."
1 Paul, a servant of God and an apostle of Jesus Christ for the faith of God's elect and the knowledge of the truth that leads to godliness— 2 a faith and knowledge resting on the hope of eternal life, which God, who does not lie, promised before the beginning of time, 3and at his appointed season he brought his word to light through the preaching entrusted to me by the command of God our Savior,
Titus 1:1-3
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Did I say that? You tell me. Tell me that he knows how to lie. You know what? Please read my replies and analyze them carefully first before you say something.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
ALIEN said
"same logic as EFS...... ilan ba dios mo jason 1+1+1=1?, tunay ba lahat yan?...."
here read and analyze this alien:
John 10:31-36
31 Again the Jews picked up stones to stone him,
32 but Jesus said to them, "I have shown you many great miracles from the Father. For which of these do you stone me?"
33 "We are not stoning you for any of these," replied the Jews, "but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God."
34 Jesus answered them, "Is it not written in your Law, 'I have said you are gods'
35 If he called them 'gods,' to whom the word of God came—and the Scripture cannot be broken—
36 what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, 'I am God's Son?
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
huwebes, sabado at linggo : tupad ko ng P1, sabihin mo lang kung anong oras.
biyernes : bantay kapilya ako (simula 8pm fri till 6am sat)
lunes, martes, meyerkules : sabihin mo lang kung saang lugar ka malapit susunduin at ihahatid kita sa dako ng aming mga gawain.
bakit parang natameme ka?
what goes around comes around
Iglesia Ni Cristo
lokal ng lioan
Distrito ng Eklesiastico ng Cebu South
"Sapagka't may isang Dios at may isang tagapamagitan sa Dios at mga tao, ang taong si Cristo Jesus." - I Timoteo 2:5
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
I am not a member of that sect, I am not online 24/7. And I asked you to tell me if God knows how to lie. Answer me does God know how to lie?
C'mon somebody tell me.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
ilan ang dios mo? tunay ba lahat yan? sagutin mo ng diretso ilan? isa, dalawa o tatlo? tunay ba lahat? oo at hindi lang isasagot mo. bakit? hindi ka pa ba kumbinsido sa aral mo? ako kaya kung panindigan na iisa lang ang tunay na Dios at ang panginoong Hesukristo ay tunay na tao.
note: monitor mode muna
what goes around comes around
Iglesia Ni Cristo
lokal ng lioan
Distrito ng Eklesiastico ng Cebu South
"Sapagka't may isang Dios at may isang tagapamagitan sa Dios at mga tao, ang taong si Cristo Jesus." - I Timoteo 2:5
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Alien, I believe that God the Father is the True God and I also believe that his Son Jesus Christ is a God being the only begotten of the father(read Heb 1:5-9). Now you answer me, no tell me, does God the Father know how to lie?!
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Gawa 2:22 pahayag ni Apostol Pedro, kinilabutan ka ba?
Juan 8:4 ayon na mismo yan sa Panginoong Jesus, mas lalo ka bang kinalibutan?,
Juan 17:1-3 (Salita ng Buhay), pahayag ng Panginoong Hesukristo, siguro kilabot na kilabot ka na?
ilan ang tunay na Diyos? mas kilabutan ka sa sinasabi mo.
karagdagang kaalaman :
IPedro 2:21-22, Roma 5:12, Gawa 5:31, Gawa 2:36, I Tim 2:5, o ayan kung kulang pa sabihin mo lang.
KIKIKILABUTAN KA PA BA? wag ka mag alala karaniwang nararamdaman lang yan ng mga hindi nakakaunawa..
what goes around comes around
Iglesia Ni Cristo
lokal ng lioan
Distrito ng Eklesiastico ng Cebu South
"Sapagka't may isang Dios at may isang tagapamagitan sa Dios at mga tao, ang taong si Cristo Jesus." - I Timoteo 2:5
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Jason, if you want to speculate by throwing sarcasm be your best to twist the Scriptures. I can assure that you can't twist the scriptures by your sarcastic responses.
Titus 1:2
a faith and knowledge resting on the hope of eternal life, which God, who does not lie, promised before the beginning of time
Numbers 23:19 God is not a man, that he should lie, nor a son of man, that he should change his mind. Does he speak and then not act? Does he promise and not fulfill?
*
"For though although we walk in the flesh we do not war in the flesh for the weapons of our warfare are not fleshly but the power of God to destroy strongholds. We destroy arguments and every proud obstacle to the knowledge of God, and take every thought captive to obey Christ." - The Apostle Paul
If ye be reproached for the name of Christ, happy are ye; for the spirit of glory and of God resteth upon you: on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified. - 1 Peter 4:14
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Hey Alien, how are you doing? Have you already read and analyzed my replies? Have you read Heb 1:5-9 from any version of the Bible you'd like to read it from? Tell me something about it. Did you understand it or do you have your own complicated explanation about it? Does God know how to lie? You haven't answered that yet. So, Does he? C'mon tell me squarely, please.
By the way, about me attending your services, don't worry, been there, done that. And frankly, I'm not convinced.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Hebrews 1:5-9 does not teach that Christ was God himself.
So Jason, how do you understand these verses?
*
"For though although we walk in the flesh we do not war in the flesh for the weapons of our warfare are not fleshly but the power of God to destroy strongholds. We destroy arguments and every proud obstacle to the knowledge of God, and take every thought captive to obey Christ." - The Apostle Paul
If ye be reproached for the name of Christ, happy are ye; for the spirit of glory and of God resteth upon you: on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified. - 1 Peter 4:14
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Thank you very much Eagle Eye for that well said reply. See he does not lie and therefore he does not know how to lie. I rest my case. Again thank you.
By the way, about twisting the scriptures, you don't have to tell that to me coz I don't. You know who does that to suit their end. Heck they even came up with a formula about the "silence in heaven for about half an hour" Rev 8:1 to suit their claim, saying that half an hour corresponds to the number of days in between the 2 wars. Well how about the five months given the locusts that came out of the smoke of a great furnace to torment anyone(Rev 9:5) , does that have a separate computation?
Now you tell me who is twisting what to suit their end? Hmm.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Eagle's eye I gotta go but before I do, I think I owe it to you to give a reply bout my take on Heb 1:5-9, so here's my take on it.
You are correct, it does not teach that christ is THE God Himself but was called God by THE God who begot him (Heb 1:8) and that THE God who begot Him and who is His God (Heb 1:9, is Supreme than Him.
That my man is my take on it. Thanks. GTG
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Don't play safe by giving only verses, say what you are implying in true colors. My answer will only be depending on what you would be telling us about Hebrews 1:5-9. Anyhow you does not even introduce yourself to us or to what religious inclination you do have.
Yes I am an INC member.
Be back to you by 12 noon, I have work and meeting to attend.
In the meanwhile please let me know what is your take regarding Hebrews 1:5-9 so that I can reply accordingly.
*
"For though although we walk in the flesh we do not war in the flesh for the weapons of our warfare are not fleshly but the power of God to destroy strongholds. We destroy arguments and every proud obstacle to the knowledge of God, and take every thought captive to obey Christ." - The Apostle Paul
If ye be reproached for the name of Christ, happy are ye; for the spirit of glory and of God resteth upon you: on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified. - 1 Peter 4:14
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
jason
(Login jasongapo)
Re: What Satan Doesn't Want You To Know
No score for this post October 9 2007, 10:40 AM
Eagle's eye I gotta go but before I do, I think I owe it to you to give a reply bout my take on Heb 1:5-9, so here's my take on it.
You are correct, it does not teach that christ is THE God Himself but was called God by THE God who begot him (Heb 1:8) and that THE God who begot Him and who is His God (Heb 1:9, is Supreme than Him.
That my man is my take on it. Thanks. GTG
To summarize your arguments:
We can sense that something is very wrong here. God is calling someone else God and then telling this other God that He himself is this God's God. The Trinitarian mistranslation creates two Gods, one God speaking to the other God and telling the other God how well he has done so the first God is the God of the second God and anoints the second God.
It does not makes sense for God to be calling the Son God and then telling the Son in that very context that he is the God of that God. And we can see the intention in the passage is to show Jesus has been exalted above the angels and so he is better than the angels. Being better than the angels does not result in being God. Indeed, we ourselves will be judging angels.
The force of the context of Hebrews is powerful and indicates that the proper interpretation of Hebrews 1:8 is to understand that Jesus has ascended to the throne of God and sits at God's right hand in power. Any other interpretation seriously does violence to the context of the written word. The entire theme of the passage is that the human being Jesus, who was made lower than the angels, and suffered for our sins, ascended to the right hand of the throne of God and for this reason he is over the angels. There is absolutely no reason whatsoever to suppose Hebrews 1:8 is suggesting Jesus is God. None. What does the Trinitarian have at Hebrews 1:8 in support of his doctrine? Absolutely nothing but his own desire to have the passage appeal to his doctrine of the Trinity, but unfortunately it doesn't.
"To which of the angels did He ever say... 'the throne of you the God to the age of the age" (1:5-8).
Just five verses before verse 8 and five verses after verse 8, the writer of Hebrews says the very same thing with slightly different words:
"Having made purification for our sins, sat down at the right hand of Majesty on High." (1:3).
"To which of the angels did He ever say, "Sit at my right hand until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet" (1:13).
The honest mind knows the truth here. Hebrews 1:8 obviously means that Jesus' authority is the authority of sitting at the right hand of the throne of God until the end of the age and he obtained that authority by virtue of his resurrection glory. His throne is God's throne, that is, his throne is the authority of his deified risen nature.<
"Having made purification for our sins, sat down at the right hand of Majesty on Highhaving become so much better than the angels as much as he has inherited a better name than them." (Verse 3).
"To which of the angels did He ever say... 'the throne of you the God to the age of the age" (Verse 5-8).
"To which of the angels did He ever say, "Sit at my right hand until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet" (Verse 13).
*
"For though although we walk in the flesh we do not war in the flesh for the weapons of our warfare are not fleshly but the power of God to destroy strongholds. We destroy arguments and every proud obstacle to the knowledge of God, and take every thought captive to obey Christ." - The Apostle Paul
If ye be reproached for the name of Christ, happy are ye; for the spirit of glory and of God resteth upon you: on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified. - 1 Peter 4:14
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Mornin Eagle's Eye!
Your analysis is inaccurate. You just have to read the verses and try to analyse it with an open mind. Anyway, let me expound on my reply yesterday.
You said:
"It does not makes sense for God to be calling the Son God and then telling the Son in that very context that he is the God of that God." Did you read the verse carefully? I don't think you understood it fully. Part of verse 9 states, "THEREFORE GOD, YOUR GOD, HAS ANOINTED YOU" in this statement THE GOD, who is the Father, is telling the Son whom THE GOD called God (and not necessarily HIS god), that HE has anointed Him, the Son with oil. That is what the statement means. The verse does not say nor imply that the son is the God of THE GOD, HE just called his son god, plain and simple. Can you please read verse 9 again, and then reassess your understanding of the verse? If you want, you can use a Tagalog Bible for easy understanding.
NOW Qouting the translation that you gave "To which of the angels did He ever say... 'the throne of you the God to the age of the age" , when the author used the pronoun He, who did you think was he referring to? Isn't it THE GOD who is the Father of Jesus? Now proceeding to verse 8 the author wrote, " But of the son HE says, Your throne, O God is forever and ever, and the righteous scepter is the scepter of His kingdom. Now tell me, who is the author alluding to again with the pronoun HE on the phrase "but of the Son HE says? Isn't it The GOD? And what did that HE said? Well HE said, YOUR THRONE, O GOD, IS FOREVER AND EVER,AND THE RIGHTEOUS SCEPTER IS THE SCEPTER OF HIS KINGDOM.
and continuing to verse 9, that HE continued by saying;
YOU HAVE LOVED RIGHTEOUSNESS AND HATED LAWLESSNESS; THEREFORE GOD, YOUR GOD, HAS ANOINTED YOU WITH THE OIL OF GLADNESS ABOVE YOUR COMPANIONS."
And what's wrong with THE GOD, who is the Father, calling the Son a God on that verse? If you will read John 10:34-35 it says;
34 Jesus answered them, "Has it not been written in your Law, I SAID, YOU ARE GODS?
35 "If he called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be broken),
why did Jesus said that? Because the JEWS then were about to stone Jesus as was written on John 10:33
33 The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God."
Are you a Jew? I don't think so.
PS
Maybe you should try reading the Bible yourself and not depend so much on somebody reading it for you, only thing is, you people use different Bible versions for each verse that you think is convenient and agreable to your beliefs and doctrine. i.e. ACTS 20:28 which your pastors read out of the version of Lamsa, because that is the only version that says Church of Christ instead of Church of God. By the way do you know that Lamsa's version is regarded by most Bible scholars as dubious and fraudulent? You don't know that, do you?
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
You know what I would want to call myself a Christian because that is how a person who believes in Christ and does what Christ commands should be called however my deeds sometimes betray me, because up to now I still sin.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
jason
(Login jasongapo)
Re: What Satan Doesn't Want You To Know
No score for this post October 10 2007, 5:02 AM
i3answer asked:
Then what religion do you belong?
You know what I would want to call myself a Christian because that is how a person who believes in Christ and does what Christ commands should be called however my deeds sometimes betray me, because up to now I still sin. I'm not asking how do you call or consider yourself. I'm asking you what religion do you belong (i.e. Catholic Church, Seventh-Day Adventist, Jehovah's Witnesses)
It would be extremely unfair if you know our religion but we don't know yours.
Ang Dating Daan Abuluyan - Bernardo Santiago (Former Ang Dating Daan Officer in Charge)
No score for this post
October 10 2007, 6:29 AM
Bernardo Santiago: (Former Ang Dating Daan Officer in Charge) "Bilang...ako po ay dating manggagawa at 'myembro ng samahang Ang Dating Daan na pinamumunuan ni Ginoong Eliseo Soriano, marami po akong natuklasang maling doktrina at maling aral na naging dahilan ng aking pag-iwan sa aking dating religiong kinaa-aniban iyan. Unang-una po, 'yung sinasabi 'nya na kapag daw po ang tao ay magbi-bigay ng abuloy, dapat daw po kusang loob. At hindi raw po dapat sabihin ng isang ministro ang pangangaylangan, hindi raw po dapat mag-bigay ang myembro dahil sa pangangaylangan, pero kitang-kita po natin 'yung kanyang mga pahayag na maliwanag 'nyang sinasabi na siya'y nangangailangan ng dawalampung milyon. Kaya siya po mismo ang kumo-kontra doon sa kanyang itinuturo 'din'.
Isa pa pong bagay na nais ko pong ipapansin sa ating mga taga-subaybay na...'dyan po sa samahang iyan ng Ang Dating Daan na pinangungunahan ni ginoong Eli Soriano, hindi lamang 'yung salita ng Dios ang kanyang kinakalakal, kundi maging iyong kanyang mga myembro ay ginagawa 'nyang kalakal, sa paano pong paraan? Nanawagan kami sa mga myembro, sinabi namin na makukulong si brod Eli kung hindi tayo magbibigay ng pera. Kaya ho ang aming mga myembro noon ay talagang naglalabas sila ng pera. Sinasabi namin: "Any cash, anything na pwedeng maging pera, itulong natin kay brod Eli". 'Yan ho ang aming sinasabi, na iyan po ay aming ginawa dahil sa pag-uutos 'nya sa amin..."
Ang Dating Daan Abuluyan - Marianito Cayao, Jr. (Former Ang Dating Daan District Servant)
No score for this post
October 10 2007, 6:36 AM
Marianito Cayao, Jr.: (Former Ang Dating Daan District Servant) quot;Akin pong ipaglilingkod sa inyo sa pagkakataong ito, sa pangalawang pagkakataon. Paano nilikom ng samahang Ang Dating Daan ang abuluyan o tulungan sa kanilang samahan. Bago ka maanib sa samahang Ang Dating Daan, dadaan ka muna sa isang tinatawag na doktrina. 'Yung dinu-doktrina sa mga ibig umanib o 'yung nagsuri, iba doon sa actual na pangyayari. Ang doktrina ng abuluyan na itinuturo ni Ginoong Soriano sa kanyang ibig umanib ay ganito mga ababayan...
Ang abuluyan ay dalawa lang. Abuluyan sa pagsamba, abuluyan sa pasalamat. Pero ng mabautismuhan na't maanib, ganito ngayon ang pangyayari...bago ko isa-isahin sa inyo mga kababayan, mas mabuti siguro kumuha muna kayo ng panulat at papel, dahil sa dami nito baka hindi ninyo matatandaan lahat...
Ang una pong abuluyan, ganon parin, abuluyan sa pagsamba, una 'yan. Abuluyan sa pasalamat, dalawa na. Marami ng madagdag 'dyan, naanib ka na eh, sumampalataya ka na, ano ang mga nadagdag? Heto ngayon,...
Hain sa Pasalamat ng buong kapatiran, no. 3.
No. 4. Hain sa Pasalamat, Mid Year
No. 5. Hain sa Pasalamat ng Division
No. 6. Hain sa Pasalamat sa Distrito
No. 7. Hain sa Pasalamat ng Lokal
No. 8. Gugol sa Pasalamat ng buong kapatiran
No. 9. Gugol parin sa Pasalamat ng Mid Year
No. 10.Gugol sa Pasalamat ng Division
No. 11. Gugol sa Pasalamat ng Distrito
No. 12. Gugol sa Pasalamat ng Lokal
Hindi ko na isinama 'dyan 'yung mga pagpapasalamat ng mga indibidwal na kung saan mayroon paring hain at gugol. Dose na po 'yon. Ano pa 'yung iba?
Upa o rental sa mga coordinating center, panglabing-tatlo
No. 14. Maintainance sa Coordinating Center. Kalakip 'dyan, telephone bill, water bill, electric bill. Maliban 'don, meron pang tulungan o abuluyan parin sa Mass Indoctrination.
Abuluyan sa Pag-Bautismo.
Kasi mula mag-umpisa ka magpa-doktrina hanggang mabautismuhan ka, pinakakain ka ng mga myembro. Nang maanib ka na ngayon, ingat ka! Ikaw na ngayon ang kakainin. Ano pa?
Ito pang isa...napaka-halaga, 'yung "KAPI". Capital K, A, P, I, na Ang kahulugan..."Kabalikat sa Pamamahayag International". Ang bawat share ay nagkakahalaga ng isang libong piso. Pwedeng buhuin ng apat na kapatid, pwede dalawang kapatid at mas mabuti at maige kung isang kapatid bawat share, isang libo po 'yon. sa SBN21, sa radio at sa internet. Ilan na po lahat mga kababayan? Labing-pito na. 'Yan ay regular pa lang 'yan, regular na abuloy na nililikom 'don sa mga myembro na walang kakayahan, walang masyadong magandang hanap-buhay.
Pero 'yung mga kapatid mga myembro na sapat ang kakayahan upang tumugon sa ilan pang uri ng abuluyan, may mga karagdagan,...alin 'yung mga karagdagan? Ang World Wide Bible Exposition...'yan ay ginaganap sa mga Division. Kung ikaw ay maging host sa gaganapin World Wide Bible Expo, kailangan mo ng kalahating milyon. Papaano lilikumin 'yung kalahating milyon upang maging host ka sa ganong programa? Mag-aambagan ngayon 'yung mga kapatid na may kaya sa buhay, may mga trabaho...minsan dalawang libo, dalawang libo't kalahati upang makalikom ng sapat na halaga na kalahating milyon, upang maganap at mai-daos 'yung tinatawag na World Wide Bible Expo sa iba't-ibang samahan, iba't-ibang mga lokal, lalo na rito sa Metro Manila.
Meron pa silang Unang Hirit. Bago 'yan na-launch...last year, ipinarating ni Ginoong Soriano sa buong kapatiran na magkakaron 'sya ng kolum sa ganong Tabloid, ang kapalit, tatangkilikin ng mga kaanib ng samahang Ang Dating Daan. Ang katunayan 'nyan, ang mga kaanib ngayon lalo na dito sa Metro Manila ay nagkaka-utang na ng mga beinte-mil. 'Yung beinte-mil na utang na 'yan, lalo na me' memorandum aggreement sila, hinahati-hati...ng mga kapatid sa ganong lokal.
Meron pa, 'yung Oplan Bulletproof, isang bulletproof na sasakyan para kay Ingkong.
Ilan po lahat ng abuluyan? Ang regular, disi-syete (17). Kung buhuin mong lahat ng dalawampung abuluyan. Eh bakit patuloy parin siya hanggang ngayon sa pag-tuligsa ng INC? Dito siya nakilala. Dito lumutang ang kanyang ngalan'. Tuso si Ginoong Soriano mga kababayan, kaya kung kayo hindi mag-iingat sa inyong mga pagsusuri...nang maanib kayo sa samahang Ang Dating Daan, para kayong nahulog sa ilog na puno ng linta. Huhuthutin ang buo 'nyong kabuhayan 'dyan. Kawawa kayo pag-maanib pa kayo sa samahang Ang Dating Daan, iwasan ninyo 'yan, 'yan ay landas patungo sa kapahamakan"
"Isa pa po sa ugali ni ginoong Soriano, pag po nanghihiram siya ng pera" - Robinson Rivera
No score for this post
October 10 2007, 6:43 AM
Nieves Avila: (Former Ang Dating Daan Member) "If you have to go to a place, na sinasabi mong holy place...it is expected na iyon ay talagang holy na ang gagawin lang 'don po ay manalangin, sumamba sa ating panginoong...ano po. Pagkatapos sinasabi tungkol sa lahat ng kanyang mga ah...gastusin sa iglesia, ah...kayong mga mayayaman...sinasabi na mag-abuloy kayo ng ganito kasi sasarado na SBN 21 po..."
Eli Soriano: (puno sa Ang Dating Daan) "Sana nga hihiling lang ako sa inyo mga kapatid eh na...sana naman tulungan ninyo ako baka meron naman kayong magagawa. Ang pinaka-malaking burden nang aking kaisipan 'yung ating mga ubligasyon. Paragdag nang paragdag, parami nang parami...marami na. Interest lang napakalaki ho nang binabayaran ko baka naman kayo'y meron dyan pu-pwedeng ituwang sa akin, sana tuwangan 'nyo ako". Sana katukin ng ng Dios ang mga kalooban ninyo mga kapatid. Please...nakiki-usap ako sa inyo, ease me with my burden. Tulungan ninyo ako, napaka-bigat na po, napakabigat na, nagkaka-patong-patong na ang aking pasan-pasan...financial..."
Robinson Rivera: (Former Ang Dating Daan Member) "Si Ginoong Soriano po, Magpasalamatan sa Apalit, lagi po siyang dumadaing sa mga myembro na puno na daw po kami ng utang, na hindi na kayang bayaran...kaya humihingi siya lagi sa'min ng tulong, lahat daw nang myembro, sa dami namin na 'yon, mahigit daw po kaming...20 thousand. Tig-iisa-isang-daan o tig-iisa-isang-libo, maso-solve na po daw iyong problema namin..."
Eli Soriano: "Pero humihingi lang 'kong tulong, dalawampung milyon lang ang kaylangan ko para maalisan ako nang isipin. Ewan ko kung a...'yun palang dalawampung milyon, dalawampung libong myembro lang na tig-iisang libo me' dalawampung milyon na eh. Eh mahigit naman tayo sa twenty thousand, tig-iisang libo lang eh meron nang dalawampung milyon"
Aristotle Huet: (Former Ang Dating Daan Member) "Lagi po nga nilang binabanggit iyong nangyari sa mga gawa, 'yung may mag-asawa pong nagbenta ng ano...ng lupa na hindi ibinigay lahat 'yung pinagbentahan, kaya sinabi ni Apostol Pedro paglabas ninyo mamamatay kayo. Parang...sa isip ko, laging po 'nyang binabanggit 'yon, pagka-prayer meeting, pagka...parang pong tinatakot 'nya 'yung mga tao na kailangan ibigay na 'nya lahat 'yung nasa bulsa 'nung mga tao...doon"
Rosario Daquil: (Former Ang Dating Daan Member) "Tapos lumapit po sa mga myembro para humingi po siya ng tulong na...kaylangan mabayaran 'nya 'yung ganong...o pagkaka-utang 'nya. Nangutang pa nga po kami sa Bangko non' eh. Ah marami po kaming magkakasama, nagkita-kita kami sa bangko. Ang sabi nila, ay may problema daw si ka Eli Soriano, kaya para maibigay daw po namin na tulong sa kanya. Nagsanla po kami ng...trycle...nagsanla po si...Ako po'y...'yung...dalawa po kami 'don eh, nagsanla po kami ni...sinanla po namin 15 thousand 'yung ano 'nya, trycle, naghati kami, tigse-seven thousand...kami
Eli Soriano: Para patunayan ko sa inyo ang mabuting layunin ng aking kalooban, Ako hindi ako nagtuturong magbenta kayo. Nakiki-usap ako magsanla tayo't babayaran pa namin. Eh aanhin mo 'yan? madadadala mo ba 'yan sa langit? Hindi! Hindi mo madadala sa langit 'yan! Naninindigan pa rin ako sa isang matapat na konsensya ng pag-akay sa kapuwa.
Robinson Rivera: Isa pa po sa ugali ni ginoong Soriano, pag po nanghihiram siya ng pera o cheke sa mga kapatid, pag hindi po siya napahiram, nagagalit na po siya. Pag sinasabi 'nya na...hindi ninyo ako mahal, wala akong k'wenta...eh ang gusto 'nya po, maawa sa kanya..."
Eli Soriano: Eh dito sa atin mayron mayayaman di' man lang makatulong ng kaya eh. Di' mo man lang masabi 'yung abuloy niya eh kaya eh. 'Yung sa Macedonia hingit sa kaya. Dito may mayaman kuripo eh, bakit? Walang tiwala. Alam na gipit na gipit ka na singil pa ng singil. Eh nangangako naman akong magbabayad eh, di ba no? Ako alam ko gipit ako, gipit 'yung ibang mga kapatid hindi na ako naniningil. Ang dai kong pautang sa kapatid. Eh ako naman pag-ako me' utang wala akong ginawa kundi pasabi ng pasabi, pasabi rito, pasabi 'ron. Kung may tiwala lang sana, hindi ka pa naman mamamatay sa gutom. Ang tinulungan mo nama'y hindi ako, ang gawain. Sana huwag ka naman sana mahigpit maningil ano?"
Aristotle Huet: (Former Ang Dating Daan Member) "Meron po siyang doktrina na ang bibig pagka-ginagamit mo sa pagpupuri sa Dios, ang sabi 'nya po, wag' mong gagamitin sa panlalait, sa mga ginawa ng Dios sa wangis 'nya, samantalang siya po nakikita po nating ganito na nanonood..."
Eli Soriano: (puno ng Ang Dating Daan) "SINUNGALING! GAGO! (tawanan) TARANTADO! (tawanan) MANLOLOKO!
Remigia Necida: (Former Ang Dating Daan) "Iyong
pagtuturo po, kasi si Soriano po lagi po siyang nagtutungayaw sa mga tao..."
Eli Soriano: Tanga ka Michael! Gago ka pa rin
Josel Mallari: Hahaha! Kahiya-hiya kayo dayukdok kayo! Kayo dayukdok Michael, Polpol...
Eli Soriano: GAGO KA PAUL! GAGO KA! TARANTADO...(palakpakan pa habang nagtutungayaw si Eli Soriano)
Eli Soriano: Napakawa-walanghiya nitong magkakasamang 'to!
Josel Mallari: Masamang paratang 'yan
Eli Soriano: Sabihin mo nangho-hostage kami, GAGO KA BULARAN! GAGO KA! (palakpakan at hiyawan
pa habang nanunungayaw si Eli Soriano)
Leticia Diocareza: (Former Ang Dating Daan) "Hindi po tama iyong ginagawa 'nya. 'Yung mga kapatid na kasama don', pagka nag...mumura 'sya nagpapalakpakan pa! Kami hindi kami nag-aano, para kaming napapa...ano!...Ano ba 'to, walang masamang maituturo sa mga bata itong ganitong...pagmumura! Pagkagalit, kahit anong oras niya magustuhang magmura..."
"I'm not asking how do you call or consider yourself. I'm asking you what religion do you belong (i.e. Catholic Church, Seventh-Day Adventist, Jehovah's Witnesses)
It would be extremely unfair if you know our religion but we don't know yours."
Oh I get it, so you are asking what sect of the Christian religion I belong. Well honestly, I am a member of your sect. I was baptized in 2005 at the Central. I have not been attending church though for a couple of months already.
Surprised? I told you, I've been there, done that, didn't I?
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
PS
Maybe you should try reading the Bible yourself and not depend so much on somebody reading it for you, only thing is, you people use different Bible versions for each verse that you think is convenient and agreable to your beliefs and doctrine. i.e. ACTS 20:28 which your pastors read out of the version of Lamsa, because that is the only version that says Church of Christ instead of Church of God. By the way do you know that Lamsa's version is regarded by most Bible scholars as dubious and fraudulent? You don't know that, do you?
__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
And what is this? Is this not a version of the Bible?
"Therefore, take care of yourselves, and of all the congregation in which you have been appointed through the holy Spirit as bishops, to shepherd the church of Jesus Christ, that which he established* by his blood".
(Acts 20:28- Aramaic Bible Translation-Victor Alexander)
Know what guys, you keep on ranting about soriano's and his cohorts' sins but you do not even bother to look at your own. Remember what Jesus said? He said, "He who is without sin among you, let him be the first to throw a stone at her." (John 8:3-7). Are you not without sin i3answer or maybe even any short comings? Hmmm
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
I hate to rain on your parade, but do you know that the Acts of the Apostle's was not written in Aramaic but was originally written in Greek, if that Bible version is an Aramaic version, I think you should doubt where that author got his manuscript.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Yes, of course we do know that Acts of the apostles was written in Greek, also the whole new testament. But what I’m trying to give emphasis is on what you have stated previously that “Lamsa is the only version that says Church Of Christ”.
I presented you another version, and you did accept that this is a Bible version.
Therefore, aside from Lamsa translation, there is other version of the Bible which we can read “Church Of Christ or Church of Jesus Christ, right?
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
JASON:
Oh I get it, so you are asking what sect of the Christian religion I belong. Well honestly, I am a member of your sect. I was baptized in 2005 at the Central. I have not been attending church though for a couple of months already.
Surprised? I told you, I've been there, done that, didn't I?
___________________________________________________________________
Apocalipsis7:
Tanong lang po kay Jayson:
1. Kailan po kayo nabautismuhan sa Central (month-day-year)
2. Sino po ang nagdoktrina sa inyo?
salamat po...
“ That they may see and know, And consider and understand together, That the hand of the Lord has done this, And the Holy One of Israel has created it. ” — Isaiah 41:20 (nkjv)
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
jason
(Login jasongapo)
Re: What Satan Doesn't Want You To Know
No score for this post October 10 2007, 4:04 AM
Mornin Eagle's Eye!
Your analysis is inaccurate. You just have to read the verses and try to analyse it with an open mind. Anyway, let me expound on my reply yesterday.
You said:
"It does not makes sense for God to be calling the Son God and then telling the Son in that very context that he is the God of that God." Did you read the verse carefully? I don't think you understood it fully. Part of verse 9 states, "THEREFORE GOD, YOUR GOD, HAS ANOINTED YOU" in this statement THE GOD, who is the Father, is telling the Son whom THE GOD called God (and not necessarily HIS god), that HE has anointed Him, the Son with oil. That is what the statement means. The verse does not say nor imply that the son is the God of THE GOD, HE just called his son god, plain and simple. Can you please read verse 9 again, and then reassess your understanding of the verse? If you want, you can use a Tagalog Bible for easy understanding.
NOW Qouting the translation that you gave "To which of the angels did He ever say... 'the throne of you the God to the age of the age" , when the author used the pronoun He, who did you think was he referring to? Isn't it THE GOD who is the Father of Jesus? Now proceeding to verse 8 the author wrote, " But of the son HE says, Your throne, O God is forever and ever, and the righteous scepter is the scepter of His kingdom. Now tell me, who is the author alluding to again with the pronoun HE on the phrase "but of the Son HE says? Isn't it The GOD? And what did that HE said? Well HE said, YOUR THRONE, O GOD, IS FOREVER AND EVER,AND THE RIGHTEOUS SCEPTER IS THE SCEPTER OF HIS KINGDOM.
and continuing to verse 9, that HE continued by saying;
YOU HAVE LOVED RIGHTEOUSNESS AND HATED LAWLESSNESS; THEREFORE GOD, YOUR GOD, HAS ANOINTED YOU WITH THE OIL OF GLADNESS ABOVE YOUR COMPANIONS."
Psalm 45:7
Hebrews 1:8-9 is a quotation of the Septuagint translation of Psalm 45:6-7. The original Hebrew does not help us figure out what this passage should say since it has the same difficult peculiarities as the Greek translation. The 45th Psalm is a love song for the Davidic king's marriage to a foreign princess from Tyre in Phoenicia. The following represents how an English translation would look by translating the verse as "Your throne O God." Remember, this is being said to the human Davidic King.
"You are the fairest of the sons of men. Grace is poured upon your lips; therefore God has blessed you forever. Gird your sword on your thigh, O mighty one, In your splendor and your majesty! And in your majesty ride forth victoriously, for the cause of truth and meekness and righteousness; Let your right hand teach you awesome things. Your arrows are sharp; the peoples fall under you; Your arrows are in the heart of the King's enemies. Your throne, O God, is forever and ever; A scepter of uprightness is the scepter of Your kingdom. You have loved righteousness and hated wickedness; therefore God, your God, has anointed you With the oil of joy above your fellows. All your garments are fragrant with myrrh and aloes and cassia; out of ivory palaces stringed instruments have made you glad. Kings' daughters are among your noble ladies; at your right hand stands the queen in gold from Ophir. Listen, O daughter, give attention and incline your ear: Forget your people and your father's house; Then the King will desire your beauty. Because he is your Lord, bow down to him. The daughter of Tyre will come with a gift; the rich among the people will seek your favor. The King's daughter is all glorious within; her clothing is interwoven with gold. She will be led to the King in embroidered work; the virgins, her companions who follow her, will be brought to You. They will be led forth with gladness and rejoicing; they will enter into the King's palace. In place of your fathers will be your sons; you shall make them princes in all the earth. I will cause your name to be remembered in all generations; therefore the peoples will give you thanks forever and ever. (Psalm 45)".
This passage has to apply to a human King. Now it should be rather obvious to most people that God would not be referring to the Davidic human King as "God." The RSV translates the passage as "Your divine throne endures forever and ever." This captures the sense of the passage. Also notice verse 11, "because he is your Lord bow down to him." One bows down to the Davidic King because he is Lord. This is a common concept in the Old Testament. The same thing is occurring here in Hebrews chapter one (see Acts 2:36).
God does not recognize any other God
Why is it wrong to believe that the Father called Christ God in Hebrews 1:8? This because God does not recognize any other God:
"Consult together, argue your case, and state your proofs that idolworship pays. Who made these things known long ago? What idol ever told you they would happen? Was it not I, the Lord? For there is no other God but me -a just God and a Savior -no, not one!" (Is. 45:21, New Living Translation, emphasis ours)
God himself teaches that there is no other God besides Him. This one God who does not recognize any other God is the Father who created everything:
"Have we not all one Father? Has not one God created us?" (Mal. 2:10, NKJV)
Not only does God not recognize any other God, but He declared His uniqueness, proclaiming there is none like Him:
"Remember the former things of old, For I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me." (Isa 46:9)
In fact, the next verse, Hebrews 1:9, in reference to Christ, clearly shows that Christ the Son recognizes God:
"You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness; there God, Your God, has annointed You with the oil of gladness more that Your companions."
Take note of the phrase "Your God." If the Son or Christ were God, it would appear that God has a God, and thus there would be two Gods.
While the Father recognizes no one else as God, Christ recognizes the Father as His God:
"Jesus said to her, 'Do not cling to Me, for I have not yet ascended to My father; but go to My Brethren and say to them, "I am ascending to My Father and your Father, and to my God and your God"'" (Jn. 20:17)
And what's wrong with THE GOD, who is the Father, calling the Son a God on that verse? If you will read John 10:34-35 it says;
34 Jesus answered them, "Has it not been written in your Law, I SAID, YOU ARE GODS?
35 "If he called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be broken),
why did Jesus said that? Because the JEWS then were about to stone Jesus as was written on John 10:33
33 The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God."
Are you a Jew? I don't think so.
Sarcasm is a way for not so intelligent people to get away with their dubious intentions, was'nt it?
Anyway, your sarcastic tactic will not intimidate me after all!
The first thing that we must see is that the writer of Hebrews is emphasizing what happened when Jesus of Nazareth ascended to heaven upon his resurrection. We will first notice in verse 1:3 that Jesus, having already made purification for sins, sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on High, that is, at the right hand of the throne of God in the heavens. In verse 4, the passage says that Jesus inherited a much better name than the angels. Now when did this happen? If we look ahead to chapter 2, we will see the writer expand on this idea and how Jesus at one time was made a little lower than the angels in his incarnation. In the ancient mind, the human being was a commoner in contrast to the nobility of the angels also known as the sons of God. Heavenly beings were noble in contrast to earthly beings. This is why ancient pagan kings would refer to themselves as a "son of God." Humanity is a state of humiliation and servanthood as is also seen at Philippians 2:5-9 and 3:20-21. But Jesus ascended through the heavens and not only above all men, but also above the angelic rule right up to the throne at the right hand of God and as such is above all angelic rule and all created things are now therefore subject to him as Lord of all (see also Mt 28:18; Acts 2:36; 1 Peter 3:22). Upon his resurrection, the man Jesus inherited a much better name than the angels since God then gave him the name above every name. The same idea is expressed at Philippians 2:5-11.
Now in Hebrews 1:5 the writer continues in the same vein of thought. The verse that says "You are my Son, Today I have begotten you" refers not to his incarnation, nor to God begetting Jesus in eternity, but to begetting Jesus at his resurrection. Jesus is the "firstborn" or the "first begotten" out of the dead. The very same idea is found at Acts 13:30-33 which says:
""But God raised Him from the dead....God has fulfilled this promise to our children in that He raised up Jesus, as it is also written in the second Psalm, 'You are my Son, today I have begotten you.'" (Acts 13:30-33).
PS
Maybe you should try reading the Bible yourself and not depend so much on somebody reading it for you, only thing is, you people use different Bible versions for each verse that you think is convenient and agreable to your beliefs and doctrine. i.e. ACTS 20:28 which your pastors read out of the version of Lamsa, because that is the only version that says Church of Christ instead of Church of God. By the way do you know that Lamsa's version is regarded by most Bible scholars as dubious and fraudulent? You don't know that, do you?
On the contrary, maybe you should be telling this to your ownself. "You don't know that, do you?"
Anyway, do you know that the Acts 20:28 is originally Church of the Lord? "You don't know that, do you?"
Trinitarian apologists conveniently forget to inform people that the passage may be a scribal error, or it may just be a case of Trinitarian mistranslation. It is a well known fact that some early manuscripts do not read "Church of God" but instead have "Church of the Lord." Does the Trinitarian tell anyone these things? I don't think so! ...TOINK!...TOINK!...TOINK!
Here's one Trinitarian translation:
"the church of the Lord which he purchased with his own blood." (ASV).
Here's one of the early writings and witness:
early Christian apologist Irenaeus who wrote Against Heresies around 180-185 A.D. He writes:
"Take heed, therefore, both to yourselves, and to all the flock over which the Holy Spirit has placed you as bishops, to rule the Church of the Lord, which He has acquired for Himself through His own blood." (Book III, 14).
Obviously, Irenaeus was quoting from a very early scroll of Acts which read "Church of the Lord" and not "Church of God." The fact that Irenaeus quotes it as "church of the Lord" is enough to completely render the Trinitarian use of Acts 20:28 as unreliable evidence for Trinitarian claims. We do have manuscripts that read "church of the Lord" and this evidence from Irenaeus suggests a very strong indication that this may have been what Luke actually wrote at Acts 20:28 and unless a Trinitarian can undeniably prove otherwise he has no business using Acts 20:28 as Scriptural evidence for his doctrine. But let us not stop here. Let us suppose the passage is intended to say "church of God" and see if the Trinitarian would have anything to support his doctrine.
If Acts 20:28 said what Trinitarians want it to say, they also have a dilemma on their hands: God's blood. It sounds odd to anyone. According to Trinitarian doctrine, Jesus did not have blood in his divinity but in his humanity. In order to explain away the problems created by their own translations of this passage, Trinitarians needed to invent another idea called communicatio idiomatum.
Although they shout hypostatic union on one hand, they necessarily divide the natures of Christ on the other when it becomes suitable to their agenda. Any intelligent mind can see the severity of the contriving here that was necessary for them is a very big red flag. Trinitarians interpretation is at dead end!
Why I beleive in Lamsa Translation when it comes to rendering of Acts 20:28?
Mr. George Lamsa explained why he used the expression "church of Christ." In the New Testament Commentary, he said:
"Jesus was not called God in those early days. The term generally used by his disciples and their followers was Maran, 'our Lord', and Eshoo, 'Jesus'. Peter, on the day of Pentecost, called him "Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs'...(Acts. 2:22).
"Jewish Chistians could not have used the term God, because in their eyes God is spirit, and spirit has no flesh and blood." (p. 149)
The Church of Christ upholds that the Lamsa's translation, which uses "church of Christ," is the accurate one. As he explained, "Lord" in this verse cannot refer to God, for God is spirit in nature (Jn. 4:24). A spirit has no flesh and bones as taught by Christ Himself:
"Now as they said these things, Jesus Himself stood in the midst of them, and said to them. 'Peace to you'. But they were terrified and frightened, and supposed they had seen a spirit. And He said to them, 'Why are you troubled? And why do doubts arise in your hearts? Behold My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself. Handle Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see I have'." (Lk. 24:36-39, NKJV)
Spirits have no flesh and bones. Neither do they have blood. This being the case, the "Lord" referred to in Acts 20:28 cannot be the Lord God but the Lord Jesus Christ who was crucified (Acts 2:36) and shed His blood to wash away the sins of the members of His Church (Rev. 1:5).
*
"For though although we walk in the flesh we do not war in the flesh for the weapons of our warfare are not fleshly but the power of God to destroy strongholds. We destroy arguments and every proud obstacle to the knowledge of God, and take every thought captive to obey Christ." - The Apostle Paul
If ye be reproached for the name of Christ, happy are ye; for the spirit of glory and of God resteth upon you: on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified. - 1 Peter 4:14
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
thanks 13answer, i think jason will be enlightened by this..it we believe what jason said then it will show that there are many Gods, and this is not true.Christ called upon God when he was in the cross.. the logic there is if Christ is God, it will show that there will be two God, the one that called and the one that was called..Jason, I hope you will be enlightened..
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
thanks 13answer, i think jason will be enlightened by this..it we believe what jason said then it will show that there are many Gods, and this is not true.Christ called upon God when he was in the cross.. the logic there is if Christ is God, it will show that there will be two God, the one that called and the one that was called..Jason, I hope you will be enlightened..
Do you folks know how to use an article, like the articles the and a? They are words that combines with a noun to indicate the type of reference being made by the noun. Point being, a God is different from the God.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Hebrews 1:8-9 is a quotation of the Septuagint translation of Psalm 45:6-7. The original Hebrew does not help us figure out what this passage should say since it has the same difficult peculiarities as the Greek translation. The 45th Psalm is a love song for the Davidic king's marriage to a foreign princess from Tyre in Phoenicia. The following represents how an English translation would look by translating the verse as "Your throne O God." Remember, this is being said to the human Davidic King.
"You are the fairest of the sons of men. Grace is poured upon your lips; therefore God has blessed you forever. Gird your sword on your thigh, O mighty one, In your splendor and your majesty! And in your majesty ride forth victoriously, for the cause of truth and meekness and righteousness; Let your right hand teach you awesome things. Your arrows are sharp; the peoples fall under you; Your arrows are in the heart of the King's enemies. Your throne, O God, is forever and ever; A scepter of uprightness is the scepter of Your kingdom. You have loved righteousness and hated wickedness; therefore God, your God, has anointed you With the oil of joy above your fellows. All your garments are fragrant with myrrh and aloes and cassia; out of ivory palaces stringed instruments have made you glad. Kings' daughters are among your noble ladies; at your right hand stands the queen in gold from Ophir. Listen, O daughter, give attention and incline your ear: Forget your people and your father's house; Then the King will desire your beauty. Because he is your Lord, bow down to him. The daughter of Tyre will come with a gift; the rich among the people will seek your favor. The King's daughter is all glorious within; her clothing is interwoven with gold. She will be led to the King in embroidered work; the virgins, her companions who follow her, will be brought to You. They will be led forth with gladness and rejoicing; they will enter into the King's palace. In place of your fathers will be your sons; you shall make them princes in all the earth. I will cause your name to be remembered in all generations; therefore the peoples will give you thanks forever and ever. (Psalm 45)".
This passage has to apply to a human King. Now it should be rather obvious to most people that God would not be referring to the Davidic human King as "God." The RSV translates the passage as "Your divine throne endures forever and ever." This captures the sense of the passage. Also notice verse 11, "because he is your Lord bow down to him." One bows down to the Davidic King because he is Lord. This is a common concept in the Old Testament. The same thing is occurring here in Hebrews chapter one (see Acts 2:36)."
-My friend you are making it too complicated, like the habit of the ministers and the management, when it doesn't have to be, do you know that? Hebrews 1:1-9 is very simple, I know that it was a qoute from the Book of Psalms, but you do not have to go and take a look at that anymore because Apostle Paul used that line to explain Jesus' divinity. Is it hard for you to understand. Read it word for word for crying out loud and read it with an open mind, not the mind of a zealot. Paul qouted, that line from Psalm 54 and implied in plain simple words that the Father regarding His Son said, YOUR THRONE, O GOD, IS FOREVER AND EVER, AND THE RIGHTEOUS SCEPTER IS THE SCEPTER OF HIS KINGDOM. Are you to dispute the very words of Paul? Man.
By the way I one of you commented that there is another version of the Bible in Aramaic, translated by Victor Alexander, he is correct on that. And if he agrees that that version is correct or precise and faithful translation of the Bible you should read Heb 1:1-9 using that Bible, and also go online using this link: http://www.v-a.com/bible/letters/hebrews.html and see what Mr Alexander has to say about The Book of Hebrews.
Eagle's eye also said:
"God does not recognize any other God
Why is it wrong to believe that the Father called Christ God in Hebrews 1:8? This because God does not recognize any other God:
"Consult together, argue your case, and state your proofs that idolworship pays. Who made these things known long ago? What idol ever told you they would happen? Was it not I, the Lord? For there is no other God but me -a just God and a Savior -no, not one!" (Is. 45:21, New Living Translation, emphasis ours)
God himself teaches that there is no other God besides Him. This one God who does not recognize any other God is the Father who created everything:
"Have we not all one Father? Has not one God created us?" (Mal. 2:10, NKJV)
Not only does God not recognize any other God, but He declared His uniqueness, proclaiming there is none like Him:
"Remember the former things of old, For I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me." (Isa 46:9)
In fact, the next verse, Hebrews 1:9, in reference to Christ, clearly shows that Christ the Son recognizes God:
"You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness; there God, Your God, has annointed You with the oil of gladness more that Your companions."
Take note of the phrase "Your God." If the Son or Christ were God, it would appear that God has a God, and thus there would be two Gods.
While the Father recognizes no one else as God, Christ recognizes the Father as His God:
"Jesus said to her, 'Do not cling to Me, for I have not yet ascended to My father; but go to My Brethren and say to them, "I am ascending to My Father and your Father, and to my God and your God"'" (Jn. 20:17)"
You really are a complicated person, you are making it hard for yourself to understand. I agree with you on this one but do you not recall or read John 10:34-35 wherein it said " 34Jesus answered them, "34 Has it not been written in your Law, I SAID, YOU ARE GODS? 35 If he called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be broken)," Jesus said that when the Jews are about to stone him when He said " 30 I and the Father are one", so on verse 33 "33 The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God."
There you go...simple as that is my answer to your complicated understanding.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Do you folks know how to use an article, like the articles the and a? They are words that combines with a noun to indicate the type of reference being made by the noun. Point being, a God is different from the God. So where's your reference regarding that?
And by the way why are you afraid to answer Bro. Apocalipsis' question? Apocalipsis7
(Login Apocalipsis7)
Tanong lang po kay Jason...
No score for this post October 10 2007, 11:01 AM
_________________________________________________________
Apocalipsis7:
Tanong lang po kay Jayson:
1. Kailan po kayo nabautismuhan sa Central (month-day-year)
2. Sino po ang nagdoktrina sa inyo?
salamat po... JASON:
Oh I get it, so you are asking what sect of the Christian religion I belong. Well honestly, I am a member of your sect. I was baptized in 2005 at the Central. I have not been attending church though for a couple of months already.
Surprised? I told you, I've been there, done that, didn't I? Let us compare: jason
(Login jasongapo)
Re: What Satan Doesn't Want You To Know
No score for this post October 9 2007, 6:28 AM
Siguro. Kamag-anak ni Eli Soriano yun di ba? Malamang gayahin nila ang Iglesia ni Manalo. Kamag-anak Inc na ang mangyayari.
(Login jasongapo)
Re: What Satan Doesn't Want You To Know
No score for this post October 9 2007, 8:36 AM
ALIEN said:
"ako kaya kung panindigan na siang panginoong Hesukristo ay tunay na tao."
Kilabutan ka sa sinasabi mo. man, you make me shiver to the bone. Jason's claim of being a member of INC is highly questionable.. at least at this point.
Danilo Olitoquit: (Former Ang Dating Daan Member) "Maliwanag naman po sa Biblia na iisa lamang ang Dios, katulad ng nakasaad sa Juan 17: 1-3 na ang ating panginoong Ama ang iisa lamang Dios natin. Ang itinataguyod ni Mr. Soriano ay napakarami daw pong Dios. ah...maski daw po maging isang baranggay ang Dios eh wala daw problema, ito po ay salugat na salungat sa...itinuturo sa Bibla na iisa lamang ang tunay na Dios at walang iba liban sa kanya"...
Eli Soriano: Pag ang tanong sa iyo, ilan ang Dios? Ang sagot, marami. Iyon ang mababasa eh. Pag tinanong ka, ilan ang Dios Ama? Iisa.
Kasama ni Eli: Opo
Eli Soriano: Pag tinanong ka uli, eh ilan ang Anak? Iisa pa rin. Iyon lamang ang sagot at iyon din ang tamang tanong. Pero tatanungin ka, eh ilan ika ang Dios? Eh tunay ba ika lahat iyon? TUNAY LAHAT IYON, di' ba?
Kasama ni Eli: Opo
Robinson Rivera: (Former Ang Dating Daan Member) "Kaya po ako umalis sa...ah...kay ginoong Soriano sa dahilan pong mga maling doktrina. Unang-una pong inayawan ko sa kanyang mga doktrina ay ang...maraming dios, sapagka't ang doktrina sa mga kaanib sa Ang Dating Daan, kahit maging isang baranggay man ang Dios walang problema"
Eli Soriano: (puno sa Ang Dating Daan) "Kahit maging isang libo ang Dios, ano? Basta hindi naman nawawala 'yung paniniwala natin 'dun sa isang Ama, ano? Eh hindi naman tayo maliligaw"
Lino Diocareza: (Former Ang Dating Daan Member) "Ba' eh sa kanya maraming Dios, mga tunay raw lahat 'yon eh...Eh samantalang sa Biblia nakalagay eh...isa lamang ang tunay na Dios eh, pa'nong dadami 'yan?..."
Eli Soriano: (puno ng Ang Dating Daan) "Masama bang dumami ang mga Dios, ha? Masama ba ayon sa Biblia? Makapeperhuwisyo ba sa kaligtasan kung dadami ang mga Dios?"
Nagtatanong: "Kung si Jesus po ay Dios din, tapos ang Ama Dios eh...dalawa na po ang Dios ho?
Eli Soriano: (puno ng Ang Dating Daan) "Walang problema! Eh ano kung maging tatlo, apat, lima, anim, pito? Hindi naman masama eh! Pakinggan mo..."mas maganda kung marami ang Dios""
Roman A. Marasigan: (Former Ang Dating Daan Member) "Sa pangangaral ni Soriano sa TV naakit po ako, kusa po akong pumunta po doon sa kanilang coordinating center
ATD: Saang lugar ho 'yon?
Roman A. Marasigan: Dito po sa...Montilla Blvd. Ext.. Mga 'kwan po 'yon...April 1, 2001
ATD: April 1, po?
Roman A. Marasigan: Oo, 2001.
ATD: Tapos po naging masigla po kayong myembro?
Roman A. Marasigan: Naging masigla po ako pero hindi naman po nagtagal kasi...marami nga po akong mga bagay na hindi ko ho nagugustuhan, isa na po dito 'yung...kanyang pagmumura...at pangalawa po, parang di' po bumabagay sa kanya ang pangangaral kasi...pagka salita 'nya ng maraming hindi magagandang mga bagay eh pagka-dumating naman po 'yung...last prayer po namin, closing prayer eh halos umiiyak naman po! So...naisip ko po na parang me' pagka...kwan' po ito...parang hindi po totoo. At saka po habang tumatagal dumadami po 'yung aming...mga...kwan', mga contribution. Mga binabayaran, ganon po
ATD: Kahit po dito sa ano...?
Roman Marasigan: Oo, marami po. Napapansin ko pong mga contribution na aming ibinibigay, bukod pa po itong sigeng paramdam sa mga...TV, na bayad sa radio, mga kung ano-ano pa
ATD: Ano po ang inyong ibig sabihin na nagpaparamdam pa?
Roman A. Marasigan: Eh...sinasabihan po kami na...magbayad naman kayo para sa ating TV, sa ating kwan'...radio, kasi malaki po ang bayad namin dito, ganon..."
Why I beleive in Lamsa Translation when it comes to rendering of Acts 20:28?
That's just the thing with you folks, you use a certain Bible version when it suits your tenets and doctrines. Selective is your style and for me it's deceit in a subtle way. And you are an intelligent person, aren't you all?
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
(Login jasongapo)
i3answer reply
No score for this post October 9 2007, 7:26 AM
Kontradiksyon ni Jason
It seems that i3answer does not know how to read between the lines. He did not understand what I was implying. That was a sarcasm, man. Analyze it. Say that to yourself instead.
(Login jasongapo)
Re: What Satan Doesn't Want You To Know
No score for this post October 15 2007, 6:41 AM
i3answer said:
And by the way why are you afraid to answer Bro. Apocalipsis' question?
What makes you say that i am afraid to answer that question? Palabintangin ka talaga. That's bad. Then why don't you stop fooling around and answer the questions directly? If you don't, then that means you're a liar.
(Login jasongapo)
Re: What Satan Doesn't Want You To Know
No score for this post October 15 2007, 6:37 AM
Why I beleive in Lamsa Translation when it comes to rendering of Acts 20:28?
That's just the thing with you folks, you use a certain Bible version when it suits your tenets and doctrines. Selective is your style and for me it's deceit in a subtle way. And you are an intelligent person, aren't you all? So where in the Bible can you read that God has a blood?
Why aren't you answering my question? Where in the biblie can you read that God has a blood if we're going to follow your argument regarding Acts 20:28?
Reynaldo Reyes: (Former Ang Dating Daan Member) "...Naging myembro po ng Ang Dating Daan 1998, Nov. 13, hanggang 2002.
ATD: Paano po kayo...naging myembro sa Ang Dating Daan?
Reynaldo Reyes: Sa pakikinig ko po sa TV...nabuksan ko 'yung Itanong mo kay Soriano. Ngayon sa pakikinig ko sa kanya sinabi 'nya na:..."kung meron kayong makitang isang mali, lumayas kayo"...Dalawang mali po nakita ko eh. 'Nung una, 'yun sa 'kwan nga, 'yun sa...tig-iisang libo bawat isang myembro, pero hindi po ako umano 'don...sumang-ayon, parang pledges po iyon eh, kasi sabi 'nya walang pledges sa duktrina eh. Ngayon, hinayaan ko lang 'yon, pero hindi ako umano...hindi ako sumang-ayon 'don. Tapos naano ko...kumandidato! Eh samantalang sinasabi 'nya, hindi dapat kumandidato ang isang mangangaral ng Dios sasama 'don sa pulitika, marumi raw ang pulitika. 'Yon 'don na ako nag-umpisa, nanlamig na ako, hindi na ako sumama, hindi na ako nagku-'kwan...nag-a-attend"
Reynaldo Reyes: (Former Ang Dating Daan) "Kaya kayo...mag-isip-isip na kayo, me' pang-unawa naman kayo eh, gamitin ninyo ang pang-unawa! At gamitan ninyo ng katotohanang salita ng Dios at makikita 'nyo ang pagkaka-iba. Naaawa ako sa inyo eh, ako nagpapasalamat sa Dios hangga't buhay ako, kahit na matanda na ako hindi 'nya ako hinayaang mapariwara sa pananampalataya, inakay 'nya ako. Binigay 'nya sa akin ang katotohanan. At ang hiling ko sa kanya, bigyan 'nya ako ng pang-unawa sa kanyang salita at katotohanan. Nagkamali ako, nagkamali ang maraming kaanib natin diyan, sa katunayan kung makikinig kayo sa Ang Pagbubunyag, mga manggagawa 'yan, higit na nakaka-alam kung tama ang ginawa ni Soriano o hindi, makinig kayo sa kanila at makikita 'nyo ang pagkakaiba at makikita 'nyo ang katotohanan...papalayain kayo ng katotohanan...salamat sa inyo."
Reynaldo Reyes: (Former Ang Dating Daan) "T'saka ang duktrina 'nya pabago-bago, papano 'yung una ang duktrina 'nya noon at saka sa bago ngayon makakaharap ko...maglalaban kami. Eh 'nung una iba ang duktrina, pangalawa iba na naman duktrina 'nya, ayon sa TV nakalagay eh. Katulad 'nung...sinabi 'nya na...sa exposition na...si Marcos daw 'kwan...'yung hubad! Tapos may nagtanong naman, 'yun daw may kuliling. Di' ba malaking kalapastanganan sa duktrina na itinuturo 'nya? Eh siya rin pong me' sabi!...'Na ang pabago-bago sira ulo. Kasi siya ang nagsabi eh, makakita ka lang ng isang mali, layas! Eh ako eh dalawang mali nakita ko binigyan ko pa siya ng isa eh, dalawa eh, umalis na ako!"
(Login jasongapo)
Re: What Satan Doesn't Want You To Know
No score for this post October 15 2007, 6:37 AM
Why I beleive in Lamsa Translation when it comes to rendering of Acts 20:28?
That's just the thing with you folks, you use a certain Bible version when it suits your tenets and doctrines. Selective is your style and for me it's deceit in a subtle way. And you are an intelligent person, aren't you all? So you too believe in the Lamsa translation.
So what's you point of accusing us of being selective?
Anonymous
(Login jasongapo)
Re: What Satan Doesn't Want You To Know
No score for this post October 15 2007, 5:59 AM
-My friend you are making it too complicated, like the habit of the ministers and the management, when it doesn't have to be, do you know that? Hebrews 1:1-9 is very simple, I know that it was a qoute from the Book of Psalms, but you do not have to go and take a look at that anymore because Apostle Paul used that line to explain Jesus' divinity. Is it hard for you to understand. Read it word for word for crying out loud and read it with an open mind, not the mind of a zealot. Paul qouted, that line from Psalm 54 and implied in plain simple words that the Father regarding His Son said, YOUR THRONE, O GOD, IS FOREVER AND EVER, AND THE RIGHTEOUS SCEPTER IS THE SCEPTER OF HIS KINGDOM. Are you to dispute the very words of Paul? Man.
You agreed that Hebrews 1:1-9 was a quote from Psalms, and I have pointed out how a Trinitarian selectively lifting Bible translations to promote his 325 AD Nicean doctrine.
Don't you think that when you say zealot, you are referring it to you own self?
If I will follow your line of thinking then maybe I'm a zealot who just reads Bible version and does not examine things out why these translators uses such words
The same thing is occurring here in Hebrews chapter one (see Acts 2:36). We can see from a review of the original passage that God is not calling this Davidic King "God" but is referring to that fact that he sits upon a divinely established throne. This is similar to 1 Chronicles 29:23 which says, "Then Solomon sat on the throne of YAHWEH as king instead of David his father; and he prospered, and all Israel obeyed him." This is the divinely established throne God established through his covenant with David, "Your house and your kingdom shall endure before Me forever; your throne shall be established forever" (2 Samuel 7:16), and concerning Jesus the Messiah we are reminded of this same covenant promise by Luke, "He will be great and will be called the Son of the Most High; and the Lord God will give Him the throne of His father David" (1:35). Clearly, this passage is not a reference to the King as "God" but to the divine establishment of his throne. We have the very same situation here in Hebrews 1:8.
The entire theme of Hebrews 1 is to illustrate that Jesus has greater authority and power than angels because they are only ministering servants (1:14) and he is the son of God (3:1ff.) ascended to the right hand of the throne of God.
Notice the consistent theme of Hebrews is that Jesus is our great High Priest because he has sat down at the right hand of the throne of God in the heavens above the servant angels. Also notice the similar language and how the writer sums up what he has been saying all along at Hebrews 8:1.
"Having made purification for our sins, sat down at the right hand of Majesty on High having become so much better than the angels." (1:3).
"To which of the angels did He ever say, "Sit at My right hand until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet" (1:13).
"Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession. For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but One who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin. Therefore let us draw near with confidence to the throne of grace, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need" (4:14-16).
"And the sum concerning the things having been said: we have such a high priest, who has sat down at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens" (8:1).
"Fixing our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of faith, who for the joy set before Him endured the cross, despising the shame, and has sat down at the right hand of the throne of God" (12:2).
"And He, having offered one sacrifice for sin once for all time sat down on the right hand of God" (10:12)
"Having made a purification for our sins, sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on High" (1:3).
"To the Son He says, 'The throne of you the God to the age of the age. The sceptre of righteousness the sceptre of your kingdom/kingship" (1:8).
Especially take note of the language of 1:3 and 8:1 and 12:2 in comparison to Hebrews 1:8, "at the right hand of the throne of Majesty/God."
By the way I one of you commented that there is another version of the Bible in Aramaic, translated by Victor Alexander, he is correct on that. And if he agrees that that version is correct or precise and faithful translation of the Bible you should read Heb 1:1-9 using that Bible, and also go online using this link: http://www.v-a.com/bible/letters/hebrews.html and see what Mr Alexander has to say about The Book of Hebrews.
You really are a complicated person, you are making it hard for yourself to understand. I agree with you on this one but do you not recall or read John 10:34-35 wherein it said " 34Jesus answered them, "34 Has it not been written in your Law, I SAID, YOU ARE GODS? 35 If he called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be broken)," Jesus said that when the Jews are about to stone him when He said " 30 I and the Father are one", so on verse 33 "33 The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God."
There you go...simple as that is my answer to your complicated understanding.
Then who's the zealot here? was it you?
You keep finding ways to believe in the 325 Nicean doctrine..LOL!
You have embraced a Trinitarian points of view by giving Victor Alexander comment more weight than what Apostle Paul was really conveying to us.
Who shall we believe Victor Alexander or Apostle Paul? Make your choice...man!
APOSTLE PAUL's GOD
Carefully consider the following evidence from Scripture and for each verse ask yourself if Paul's God was a three person being or a one person being.
And immediately [Paul] began to proclaim Jesus in the synagogues, saying, "He is the Son of God." (Acts 9:20).
Of [David's] seed God has brought to Israel a Savior, Jesus, as he promised... God raised him from the dead; and for many days he appeared to those who came up with him from Galilee to Jerusalem, who are now his witnesses to the people. And we bring you the good news that what God promised to the fathers, this he has fulfilled to us their children by raising Jesus; as also it is written in the second psalm, "You are my Son, today I have begotten you.' And as for the fact that he raised him from the dead, no more to return to corruption, he spoke in this way, "I will give you the holy and sure blessings of David.' Therefore he says also in another psalm, "You will not let your Holy One see corruption.' For David, after he had served the counsel of God in his own generation, fell asleep, and was laid with his fathers, and saw corruption; but he whom God raised up saw no corruption. (Acts 13:23-37).
The God who made the world and everything in it, being Lord of heaven and earth, does not live in shrines made by man, nor is he served by human hands, as though he needed anything, since he himself gives to all men life and breath and everything. And he made from one every nation of men to live on all the face of the earth, having determined allotted periods and the boundaries of their habitation, that they should seek God, in the hope that they might feel after him and find him. Yet he is not far from each one of us, for "In him we live and move and have our being'; as even some of your poets have said, "For we are indeed his offspring.' Being then God's offspring, we ought not to think that the Deity is like gold, or silver, or stone, a representation by the art and imagination of man. The times of ignorance God overlooked, but now he commands all men everywhere to repent, because he has fixed a day on which he will judge the world in righteousness by a man whom he has appointed, and of this he has given assurance to all men by raising him from the dead." (Acts 17:24-31).
Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called apostle, set apart for the gospel of God, which He promised beforehand through His prophets in the holy Scriptures, concerning His Son, who was born of the seed of David according to the flesh, fixed Son of God in power by the resurrection from the dead, according to the Spirit of holiness, Jesus Christ our Lord. (Romans 1:1-4).
Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. (Romans 1:7).
For God is my witness whom I serve in my spirit in the preaching of the gospel of His Son. (Romans 1:9).
For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, now that we are reconciled, shall we be saved by his life. (Romans 5:10).
For we know that Christ being raised from the dead will never die again. Death no longer lords over him. The death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God. (Romans 6:9-10).
For what the Law was not able to do, in that it was weakened through the flesh, God did, sending His own Son in the likeness of the flesh of sin, and concerning sin, condemned sin in the flesh. (Romans 8:3).
If God is for us, who is against us? He who did not spare His own Son, but delivered Him over for us all, how will He not also with him freely give us all things? (Romans 8:32).
Now may the God of patience and comfort grant you to be like-minded toward one another, according to Christ Jesus, that you may with one mind and one mouth glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ" (Rom 15:5).
To the only wise God through Jesus Christ be the glory forever. Amen. (Romans 16:27).
Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. (1 Corinthians 1:3).
God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord. (1 Corinthians 1:9).
You are of Christ and Christ of God. (1 Corinthians 3:23).
There is no God but one.... For us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things and we from Him and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and we through Him. (1 Corinthians 8:6).
The head of every man is the Christ, and the head of a woman is the husband and the head of Christ is God (1 Corinthians 11:3).
If Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is vain, your faith also is vain. Moreover we are even found to be false witnesses of God, because we testified against God that He raised Christ, whom He did not raise. (1 Corinthians 15:14-15).
Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. (2 Corinthians 1:2).
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the father of mercies and God of all comfort who comforts us in all our affliction, so that we may be able to comfort those who are in any affliction, with the comfort with which we ourselves are comforted by God." (2 Corinthians 1:3-4).
Now He who establishes us with you in Christ and anointed us is God. (2 Corinthians 1:21).
For we are a fragrance of Christ to God. (2 Corinthians 2:15).
Such confidence we have through Christ toward God. (2 Corinthians 3:4).
The light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God. (2 Corinthians 4:4).
For God, who said, "Light shall shine out of darkness," is the One who has shone in our hearts to give the Light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Christ. (2 Corinthians 4:6).
Now all these things are from God, who reconciled us to Himself through Christ and gave us the ministry of reconciliation, namely, that God was reconciling the world to Himself in Christ. (2 Corinthians 5:18-19).
The God and Father of the Lord Jesus (2 Corinthians 11:31).
For he was crucified in weakness, but lives by the power of God (2 Corinthians 13:4).
The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you all. (2 Corinthians 13:14).
Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. (Ephesians 1:2).
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ (Ephesians 1:3).
The God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory. (Ephesians 1:17).
There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call, one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of us all, who is above all and through all and in all. (Ephesians 4:4-6).
Do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. (Ephesians 4:30).
Peace be to the brethren, and love with faith, from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. (Ephesians 6:23).
Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. (Philippians 1:2).
We give thanks to the God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ. (Colossians 1:3).
[We give] thanks to the Father, who has qualified us to share in the inheritance of the saints in Light. For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son. (Colossians 1:12-13).
He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation, For in him all things were created, things in heaven and upon earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or lordships or rulers or authorities; all things were created through him and unto him. And he is before all things, and in him all things subsist. (Colossians 1:15-17).
Having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised up with Him through the faith God working, who raised him from the dead. (Colossians 2:12).
Therefore if you have been raised up with Christ, keep seeking the things above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God. (Colossians 3:1).
Whatever you do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks through Him to God the Father. (Colossians 3:17).
For this reason also, God highly exalted him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, so that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. (philippians 2:9-11).
Now to our God and Father be the glory forever and ever. Amen. (Philippians 4:20).
To the church of the Thessalonians in God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ: Grace to you and peace. (1 Thessalonians 1:2).
For they themselves report about us what kind of a reception we had with you, and how you turned to God from idols to serve a living and true God, and to wait for His Son from heaven, whom He raised from the dead, that is Jesus, who rescues us from the wrath to come. (1 Thessalonians 1:9-10).
Now may our God and Father Himself and Jesus our Lord direct our way to you... establish your hearts without blame in holiness before our God and Father at the coming of our Lord Jesus with all His saints. (1 Thessalonians 3:11-12).
Grace to you and peace from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. (2 Thessalonians 1:2).
The name of our Lord Jesus will be glorified in you, and you in Him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ. (2 Thessalonians 1:12).
Now may our Lord Jesus Christ himself and God our Father, who has loved us and given us eternal comfort and good hope by grace, comfort and strengthen your hearts in every good work and word. (2 Thessalonians 2:16-17).
Grace, mercy and peace from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Lord. (1 Timothy 1:2).
Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only God, be honor and glory forever and ever. Amen. (1 Timothy 1:17).
For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus. (1 Timothy 2:4).
I solemnly charge you in the presence of God and of Christ Jesus and of His elect angels. (1 Timothy 5:21).
That you should keep the commandment unstained and irreproachable until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ and this will be made manifest at the proper time by the blessed and only Power, the King of kings and Lord of lords, who alone has immortality and dwells in unapproachable light, whom no man has ever seen or can see. To him be honor and eternal dominion. Amen.(1 Timothy 6:14-16).
Grace, mercy and peace from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Lord. (2 Timothy 2:2).
I solemnly charge you in the presence of God, and of Christ Jesus who is to judge the living and the dead. (2 Timothy 4:1).
Grace and peace from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Savior. (Titus 1:4).
But when the kindness of God our Savior and His love for mankind appeared, He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit, whom He poured out upon us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior. (Titus 3:4-6).
Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. (Philemon 1:3).
About your interpretation on John 10:33
Trinitarian really amaze me how they translate God with a capital "G", how they shift from misleading readers of the actual context.
The Missing Article
The definite article is missing at John 10:33 which is why it should be translated here as "a god." The grammar and context absolutely demands it. First, the word theos here is obviously not qualitative but quantitative. The Jews are contrasting Jesus as a god to Jesus being a man. Moreover, Jesus would simply not have responded the way he did if the Jews had said, "You being a man make yourself out to be [the] "God." If that is indeed what the Jews had said, why is Jesus babbling on about "gods?" He would be making an absolutely irrelevant point if that were the case, and this is precisely what the Trinitarian has our Lord doing - aimlessly babbling on about "gods" when they claim the Jews had said he made himself out to be "the" God.
Trinitarians render the words kai hoti su anthropos (no definite article) as "a man" but they will turn right around and say you can't translate "poieis seauton theon in the exact same manner as "a god! Why? Because it does not suit their agenda. There is no other reason.
No matter which way you look at it, the Jews certainly did not say that Jesus was making himself out to be the one and only God. The Jews never make such an accusation throughout the whole gospel of John and they eventually charge him with claiming to be the son of God. If we translated this passage as Trinitarians are wont to do, the entire passage becomes non-sensical. If these monotheistic Jews had charged Jesus was making himself "God" then why would Jesus be responding by discussing other "gods?" It makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.
*
"For though although we walk in the flesh we do not war in the flesh for the weapons of our warfare are not fleshly but the power of God to destroy strongholds. We destroy arguments and every proud obstacle to the knowledge of God, and take every thought captive to obey Christ." - The Apostle Paul
If ye be reproached for the name of Christ, happy are ye; for the spirit of glory and of God resteth upon you: on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified. - 1 Peter 4:14
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Jason
(Login jasongapo)
Re: What Satan Doesn't Want You To Know
No score for this post October 15 2007, 6:37 AM
Why I beleive in Lamsa Translation when it comes to rendering of Acts 20:28?
That's just the thing with you folks, you use a certain Bible version when it suits your tenets and doctrines. Selective is your style and for me it's deceit in a subtle way. And you are an intelligent person, aren't you all?
Are you saying that you are not an intelligent person? come on don't be harsh to your own self!
You can't argue man to man, so you are resorting to sarcasm and sarcastic responses and that for me was a sign of rattled person who has no solid ground to stand at.
The objective is to fairly uncover the facts without prejudice. The purpose is to conform to the genuine truth without bias. The objective is to be impartially honest with ourselves. Now tell us honestly are these your intentions? Or are you just here trying to go against our belief?
If you want to uncover the truth then, give us your supporting verses and stop grinding your hachet by throwing us answers that are not relevant to the topic.
Here are the main discussions that I can prove to be true:
The facts will conclusively prove the one God is the Father of Jesus Christ and the Father alone.
The facts will unquestionably confirm the three person Triune God is a complete fabrication artifically crafted by wayward men long ago.
The facts will reveal the devasting evidence that this alleged three person God is never even mentioned in the sacred book where God is the main character.
The facts will show the unsettling suspicious character of Trinitarian translations and interpretations.
The facts will clearly demonstrate the apostles never handed down any teaching which remotely resembles this Trinuine God doctrine.
The facts will also show how these Trinitarian argumentation methods are nothing but crafty word game illusions designed to bamboozle human minds. The facts will also lay bare how these clever schemes are executed and thereby hoodwink unsuspecting people.
Trinitarians CRIED OUT LOUD!!! that we are selectively using Bible translations. Oddly they are the one doing it to suit their own agenda.
Hear yeah...hear yeah....Trinitarians!!!
You will ask yourself why Trinitarians refuse to translate the Hebrew word EL as "mighty" or "power" at Isaiah 9:6 just as they translated it when it referred to King Nebuchadnezzar, other men, mountains, and trees. You will see how their preferred translation of Zechariah 12:10 amounts to a senseless and absurd statement and how recent insight into the Hebrew language is also showing their claim here to be absolutely bogus. You will see how Trinitarians insist the missing definite article in the Greek text of John 1:1 is significant and then declare it is quite insignificant in the next breath. You will see how well known Trinitarian scholars rightly say the phrase means one thing but then turn right around and use an English writing convention that suggests to the reader another meaning altogether. You will see how they translate John 10:33 in a way that is entirely inconsistent and without any regard for the context which reveals what was intended.
And you will see how much Scriptural evidence is overtly denied where it shows Trinitarian doctrine to be false. You will also see how fallacious but clever sounding contrivances are woven together to try and justify their doctrinal position. And you will also see quite vividly why they are meaningless farces and how these fallacies are accomplished. You will even see how they blantantly nullify Scripture verses for the sake of their Trinitarian tradition. You will also understand clearly how the definition of the word "God" in Jesus' own words to his Father, "You, the only true God," are suggestively redefined to shelter Trinitarian doctrine. You will see how other fallacious contrivances were designed to avoid the implications of Paul's words, "there is one God, the Father," and "one God and Father of all," and "there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Jesus Christ," and the like.
*
"For though although we walk in the flesh we do not war in the flesh for the weapons of our warfare are not fleshly but the power of God to destroy strongholds. We destroy arguments and every proud obstacle to the knowledge of God, and take every thought captive to obey Christ." - The Apostle Paul
If ye be reproached for the name of Christ, happy are ye; for the spirit of glory and of God resteth upon you: on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified. - 1 Peter 4:14
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Thanks for the lengthy explanation. I'm impressed, looks like you did your homework, but just want you to know that I did not say that God is a three person being, did I? If I said that, now that's being trinitarian of me and I am not. And I did not say it that way. Obviously what we have here is a failure to communicate. Let me alter your program a bit, okay. What I said is that Jesus, being begotten by God Himself (Heb 1:5) is also a God, but he is not the God who is His Father, the Majesty on High. Is that hard to understand. It's quite simple, isn't it? The problem with you is you tend to get lost in your intelligence. KISS. You drown yourself with knowledge, heck I may even compare you with Irenaeus, he knows a lot of things, like you. You call him a trinitarian apologist and what does that make you? An Arian apologist?
By the way, on your past replies, if I remember correctly, you are trying to say that when I mentioned Heb 1:1-9, I am implying that God the father of Jesus is calling Him, Jesus Christ, his God. I did not say that nor implied that. You see, that is the common mistake of intelligent people compared to a simpleton like me. You can't seem to get your act together? You're even having a hard time understanding my simple arguments. You can drown me with your knowledge of history of the church all you want, I just hope that you are referring to the Christian Church that was founded by Jesus Christ and to which He said the gates of hell, would not prevail against. Not your church which was founded in 1913 by Felix Manalo Ysagun, who claimed to be a messenger of God, but has the nerve to lie to his members about his sojourn in the States by claiming that he attended a prestigious Bible school when in fact he did not.
I guess maybe that is why you think God knows how to lie. KISS, toink!
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Jason
(Login jasongapo)
Re: What Satan Doesn't Want You To Know
No score for this post October 15 2007, 11:48 AM
Thanks for the lengthy explanation. I'm impressed, looks like you did your homework, but just want you to know that I did not say that God is a three person being, did I? If I said that, now that's being trinitarian of me and I am not. And I did not say it that way. Obviously what we have here is a failure to communicate. Let me alter your program a bit, okay. What I said is that Jesus, being begotten by God Himself (Heb 1:5) is also a God, but he is not the God who is His Father, the Majesty on High. Is that hard to understand. It's quite simple, isn't it? The problem with you is you tend to get lost in your intelligence. KISS. You drown yourself with knowledge, heck I may even compare you with Irenaeus, he knows a lot of things, like you. You call him a trinitarian apologist and what does that make you? An Arian apologist?
By the way, on your past replies, if I remember correctly, you are trying to say that when I mentioned Heb 1:1-9, I am implying that God the father of Jesus is calling Him, Jesus Christ, his God. I did not say that nor implied that. You see, that is the common mistake of intelligent people compared to a simpleton like me. You can't seem to get your act together? You're even having a hard time understanding my simple arguments. You can drown me with your knowledge of history of the church all you want, I just hope that you are referring to the Christian Church that was founded by Jesus Christ and to which He said the gates of hell, would not prevail against. Not your church which was founded in 1913 by Felix Manalo Ysagun, who claimed to be a messenger of God, but has the nerve to lie to his members about his sojourn in the States by claiming that he attended a prestigious Bible school when in fact he did not.
I guess maybe that is why you think God knows how to lie. KISS, toink!
KISS was the only word you can think of...your bogus doctrine was alluding your insight as well.
KISS is for you...stop non sensical bashing and defend your belief...simple and fair enough. Your out of the topic bashing will not help you know what KISS was right there dude!
Don't you have a solid ground to stand with? it seems the only escape you know was to hurl sarcasm at your opponent. Be a man dude!
The problem with you was that you only sees one side of the coin, was it hard for you to understand that you are using Trinitartian based translation promoting the Jesus is God doctrine of 325 Nicean doctrine! The Book of Hebrews is very consistent in its flow of thought as I have explained above and yet it was hard for you to grasp what is the real message Apostle Paul wishes to say.
You might ask yourself, "Why it is so complicated? Isn't the truth sublimely simple?" Indeed it is. The truth is a very simple thing and the truth the Bible presents on the identity of God is likewise very simple and easy to understand. However, we are here examining the truth about a deception. The doctrine of "325 AD Nicean Doctrine" is a huge ball of knots carefully woven together and we must now carefully untie each knot so that you can see the truth for yourself - how this tangled web of deception was weaved together. It takes great patience to untie a big ball of knots. And this will require patience on your part. And when all is done you will see nothing but the straight line of truth.
Jesus spake "Father... this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You sent."
May the God of Jesus bless you richly.
*
"For though although we walk in the flesh we do not war in the flesh for the weapons of our warfare are not fleshly but the power of God to destroy strongholds. We destroy arguments and every proud obstacle to the knowledge of God, and take every thought captive to obey Christ." - The Apostle Paul
If ye be reproached for the name of Christ, happy are ye; for the spirit of glory and of God resteth upon you: on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified. - 1 Peter 4:14
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
I3answer gusto kong ireport to, ang alias ko ay ginawang anonymous (jasongapo) dapat sana santos 102,para ipalabas na umiba ako nang idea...please be aware
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Mga bro. yung JOHN 1:1 issue ni jason kayo siguro ang sumagot, para maliwanagan sya medyo mali ang pag interpret niya eh..yung talatang yun ang ginagawa niyang fallback...
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Anonymous
(Login santos102)
Re: What Satan Doesn't Want You To Know
No score for this post October 15 2007, 1:36 PM
I3answer gusto kong ireport to, ang alias ko ay ginawang anonymous (jasongapo) dapat sana santos 102,para ipalabas na umiba ako nang idea...please be aware Bro, 'wag po kayong mag-alala, ang default alias ng lahat ng login names sa forum na ito ay "Anonymous" - ibig sabihin kapag blank ang "Your Name" bar sa message reply, "Anonymous" ang magiging alias.
1. Kailan po kayo nabautismuhan sa Central (month-day-year)
2. Sino po ang nagdoktrina sa inyo? class AnakBaNgDiyablo {
String monthBautismo, nagdoktrina, dayBautismo, yearBautismo;
void checkResponse() {
if (monthBautismo = "") && (dayBautismo = "") && (yearBautismo = "") && (nagdoktrina = "") {
System.out.println("Si Login jasongapo ay anak ng diyablo - Juan 8:44");
}
}
}
class printResults() {
public static void main(String [] arguments) {
AnakBaNgDiyablo jasongapo = new AnakBaNgDiyablo();
System.out.println("Login jasongapo:");
System.out.println(jasongapo.monthBautismo);
System.out.println(jasongapo.dayBautismo);
System.out.println(jasongapo.yearBautismo);
System.out.println("Nagdoktrina: " + nagdoktrina);
jasongapo.checkResponse();
}
} Output:
Login jasongapo:
"Kayo ay sa inyong ama, ang diyablo. Ang mga masasamang hangarin ng inyong ama ang nais ninyong gawin. Siya ay mamamatay-tao buhat pa nang pasimula. Siya ay hindi nananatili sa katotohanan sapagkat walang katotohanan sa kaniya. Kapag siya ay nagsasalita ng kasinungalingan, siya ay nagsasalita sa ganang kaniya. Siya ay sinungaling at ama ng kasinungalingan."
Talakayan ng mga duktrina at sinasabi ni Eli Soriano at ng kanyang Ang Dating Daan.
Ano mang mga isyu tungkol kay Eli Soriano ng Ang Dating Daan ay pwedeng pag-usapan dito. Lahat ng taga-pagtangol ng Ang Dating Daan ni Eli Soriano ay ina-anyayahan na ipagtangol ang anumang sa inaakala nyong di wasto ang mga sinasabi dito sa forum na ito at makaka-asa kayong di mawawala o di mabubura ang inyong mga kasagutan.
Ang maaari lang mabura o ma-delete ay ang mga sumusunod....
1.Malicious codes
2.Mga pics na hindi na katangap-tangap
3.Nang-gugulo lamang sa forum
Listahan ng IP Kaanib sa Ang Dating Daan ni Eli Soriano na nangugulo dito sa forum.....
Bernardo Santiago: (Former Ang Dating Daan Officer in Charge) "Bilang...ako po ay dating manggagawa at 'myembro ng samahang Ang Dating Daan na pinamumunuan ni Ginoong Eliseo Soriano, marami po akong natuklasang maling doktrina at maling aral na naging dahilan ng aking pag-iwan sa aking dating religiong kinaa-aniban iyan. Unang-una po, 'yung sinasabi 'nya na kapag daw po ang tao ay magbi-bigay ng abuloy, dapat daw po kusang loob. At hindi raw po dapat sabihin ng isang ministro ang pangangaylangan, hindi raw po dapat mag-bigay ang myembro dahil sa pangangaylangan, pero kitang-kita po natin 'yung kanyang mga pahayag na maliwanag 'nyang sinasabi na siya'y nangangailangan ng dawalampung milyon. Kaya siya po mismo ang kumo-kontra doon sa kanyang itinuturo 'din'.
Marianito Cayao, Jr.: (Former Ang Dating Daan District Servant) quot;Akin pong ipaglilingkod sa inyo sa pagkakataong ito, sa pangalawang pagkakataon. Paano nilikom ng samahang Ang Dating Daan ang abuluyan o tulungan sa kanilang samahan. Bago ka maanib sa samahang Ang Dating Daan, dadaan ka muna sa isang tinatawag na doktrina. 'Yung dinu-doktrina sa mga ibig umanib o 'yung nagsuri, iba doon sa actual na pangyayari. Ang doktrina ng abuluyan na itinuturo ni Ginoong Soriano sa kanyang ibig umanib ay ganito mga ababayan...
Nieves Avila: (Former Ang Dating Daan Member) "If you have to go to a place, na sinasabi mong holy place...it is expected na iyon ay talagang holy na ang gagawin lang 'don po ay manalangin, sumamba sa ating panginoong...ano po. Pagkatapos sinasabi tungkol sa lahat ng kanyang mga ah...gastusin sa iglesia, ah...kayong mga mayayaman...sinasabi na mag-abuloy kayo ng ganito kasi sasarado na SBN 21 po..."
Robinson Rivera: (Former Ang Dating Daan Member) "Si Ginoong Soriano po, Magpasalamatan sa Apalit, lagi po siyang dumadaing sa mga myembro na puno na daw po kami ng utang, na hindi na kayang bayaran...kaya humihingi siya lagi sa'min ng tulong, lahat daw nang myembro, sa dami namin na 'yon, mahigit daw po kaming...20 thousand. Tig-iisa-isang-daan o tig-iisa-isang-libo, maso-solve na po daw iyong problema namin..."
Aristotle Huet: (Former Ang Dating Daan Member) "Lagi po nga nilang binabanggit iyong nangyari sa mga gawa, 'yung may mag-asawa pong nagbenta ng ano...ng lupa na hindi ibinigay lahat 'yung pinagbentahan, kaya sinabi ni Apostol Pedro paglabas ninyo mamamatay kayo. Parang...sa isip ko, laging po 'nyang binabanggit 'yon, pagka-prayer meeting, pagka...parang pong tinatakot 'nya 'yung mga tao na kailangan ibigay na 'nya lahat 'yung nasa bulsa 'nung mga tao...doon"
Rosario Daquil: (Former Ang Dating Daan Member) "Tapos lumapit po sa mga myembro para humingi po siya ng tulong na...kaylangan mabayaran 'nya 'yung ganong...o pagkaka-utang 'nya. Nangutang pa nga po kami sa Bangko non' eh. Ah marami po kaming magkakasama, nagkita-kita kami sa bangko. Ang sabi nila, ay may problema daw si ka Eli Soriano, kaya para maibigay daw po namin na tulong sa kanya. Nagsanla po kami ng...trycle...nagsanla po si...Ako po'y...'yung...dalawa po kami 'don eh, nagsanla po kami ni...sinanla po namin 15 thousand 'yung ano 'nya, trycle, naghati kami, tigse-seven thousand...kami
