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Re: Lilly research

February 22 2018 at 8:36 AM
Michael Griffin  (no login)

Hey Paul Davies, Ron Spitz, Matt Forte and Lyle Wilkerson

Thank you for this download. My question is during your research did you ever come across a Lilly fig 8? I ask because over the years I have had several collectors tell me they either saw one or knew of one and yet, nothing.

It may be a sasquatch kinda cuff (just a blurry recollection) However, it would be cool if there was one that came into a collection.

Again, thanks for the Lilly Report.

Best
Michael

 
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Ron Spitz
(no login)

Re: Lilly research

February 22 2018, 11:07 AM 

Our research was confined to the identity of Lilly and who made the shackles. There are still areas of search for info on the shackles that may be found someday. There were many bits of information that we found that were not included in the paper which was limited to Lilly.

It was a heck of a history lesson.


Ron

 
 
Mark Lyons
(no login)

Re: Lilly research

March 21 2018, 8:26 PM 

Found this item on Facebook- courtesy of Kevin Conway.

A 1900 Houdini letter.

[linked image]

I find the most interesting thing contained in the letter (besides the workings of a German cuff) is that Houdini refers to a similar looking American cuff as the "Lilly".
Without rereading this nice article/research paper, I believe the subject of when the Lilly was called this was discussed.
Now we know that it was known as a Lilly since 1900 or earlier.

This Houdini letter is estimated to bring in $20,000 in an upcoming auction.

I don't see this amount as plausible as I am not seeing a signature but who knows? Maybe there are other pages to go with it.


Mark
O--O

 
 
Mark Lyons
(no login)

Re: Lilly research

March 21 2018, 9:07 PM 

I tried to read the above letter and other than a few words that I could not understand, I came up with; Dresden, Germany August 2, 1900 Dear Friend Leroy, Opened here last night and made good. You ought to see the handcuffs and irons used in Germany, here cuffs are used and every station has different cuffs in fact, there are no two alike. I am going to bring some styles back with me and I will give you a few pair. Here is the way they work. Has two spring lock (s) and looks like the Lilly Iron. The leg irons look like this. Did you know I patented the handcuff act in Europe? The drawings won't be published in nine months. Robertson patented his Catching Gold Fish in the air and he stopped Hiam (?) from making the trick and (unreadable) .... me from doing it. The (unreadable) house hired a man from Berlin to expose(?) handcuffs and he was closed after his first show. I do see the HH signature in reverse on the back page faintly visible. If anyone can decipher the missing words or has seen any errors, please let me know. Mark O--O

 
 
Vince
(no login)

Re: Lilly research

March 22 2018, 2:43 AM 

"exposition" house???

 
 

Paul Davies
(Login PaulJDavies)

some edits

March 22 2018, 3:36 AM 

"fine pair"
"the way they look"
"this ring hold them together"
"Robinson"
"Maskelyne" (a magician)
"opposition" house

 
 
Mark Lyons
(no login)

Re: Lilly research

March 22 2018, 10:29 AM 



Paul,
I believe "Maskelyne" and "opposition" are correct.
"Robinson" is also right, I just screwed it up when jotting it down.
The side notes are right too.
I am positive that it is "Few" pair and not "fine".
Good job!
Hope to see the back page on the auction site.
Not sure which auction site it is right now.

mark
O--O

 
 

Paul Davies
(Login PaulJDavies)

Fine or few

March 22 2018, 6:00 PM 

I am positive it says fine not few.
look at the w's in show and know, not the same.
look the 'in' in Robinson and the e at the end of Maskerlyne are the same.

Regards Paul

 
 

Paul Davies
(Login PaulJDavies)

Re: Lilly research

March 22 2018, 6:06 PM 

And Hiam could read Hearn, his manager.
Paul

 
 

Paul Davies
(Login PaulJDavies)

a link to the site where its for sale

March 22 2018, 6:11 PM 


 
 
Mark Lyons
(no login)

Re: Lilly research

March 22 2018, 9:12 PM 

Paul,
Amazing job on finding the auction.
They did a good job deciphering the letter too. They stated that one of the words in question is "fine".
I still disagree with the usage of the word "fine" versus "few" pair, as inconsequential as it is.
Houdini dots his "i's to the right and his dots are very pronounced.
In the word "few" there is no dot anywhere near that word.

A nice letter to have regarding the origin of Lilly Irons but that $24K price is certainly not in my budget right now.

mark
O--O

 
 
 
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