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Margaret Golder
(no login)
203.40.196.127

Reunion @ Foulsham & Sgt Sanday

October 30 2004, 8:00 AM 

Dear Arthur,
Unfortunately my Aunt, Unlce Viv's sister died in 1964. So it would not of been possible for you to have met her at Foulsham in 1989. However, it would be interesting to know who the lady was that you were speaking with on that day.
Uncle Viv along with F/S Hetherington & F/O Millhouse were never found & theres not a night that goes by that my father does not think about his younger brother & wonders if, somewhere, he may be in an unmarked grave. I guess that we will never find this out.
In regards to Sgt Sanday, his full name is - George Arthur Edgar SANDAY.
My father Leonard Edward Ely (Len) & of course myself would like to thank you Arthur & your associates for all this valuble information regarding his brother F/O Vivian Clive Ely. I know how extremely time consuming this research work is.
Without, Rescue 57, Ian & this forum, you would not of known about us & vice versa. Our heartfelt thanks to you all.
Regards, Margaret, Queensland Australia.

 
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Ian F
(Login NA337)
Owner
82.41.159.208

Spare Bod

October 28 2004, 10:45 PM 

Hello Arthur,
Questions questions, I know... Sorry!
Can I enquire about the "Spare Bod" on the crews... Did their trip count towards their total tour of ops?
Some of my Canadian friends from 6 Group have told me about the 1/2 and 1/4 of an op if you went on what was regarded as "easy" trips! I was wondering if dropping 'window' or 'nickels' might have been regarded as one of those 1/2 or 1/4 ops?
Again, might I give my thanks to you for doing your bit, even if you DID enjoy it
All the best
Ian
57 RESCUE

 
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Arthur Newstead
(no login)
195.92.168.177

462 operations

October 29 2004, 9:59 PM 

HI IAN-GOT YOUR NAME RIGHT!
WILL REPLY TO LAST E-MAIL LATER. WANT TO FORWARN YOU THAT I AM GOING TO ATTEMPT TO PASTE IN 3PAGES OF DEATHLESS PROSE. MAY ARRIVE IN THREE PARTS OR TEN ARTHUR
AM HAVING TROUBLE LOGGING IN, YES I KNOW MY PASSWORD.

 
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Arthur Newstead
(no login)
195.92.168.173

462 operations

October 29 2004, 10:10 PM 


Dear Margaret and Ian.F.

Sgt G.A.E Sanday. Flight Engineer. 462 RAAF ( Bomber Support)

Squadron. 100 Group.
I am sorry but I am unable to recall Sanday's first name, we often just used surnames.
Sgt Sanday was crewed with F/O Astill and on 14th Jan.'45 they took off at 17.05 on a spoof raid to Mannheim. Shortly after T/O an engine caught fire and the plane crashed near Shiphdam which is about 12 miles S. of Foulsham. Sanday and rear a/g. F/Sgt Reed baled out but sustained minor injuries. The other six crewmen were killed.
Two or three weeks afterwards Sanday told me about the crash. He and spare bod, Sgt. Smith ( not his real name), were at the rear of the kite and having been ordered to bale out Sanday opened the rear door/ escape hatch which is situated on the port side at the junction of the side and bottom of the kite, more or less on the ' corner' of the fuselage. When the aircraft is parked or flying straight and level it is easy to enter or leave by this hatch.
But, Sanday told me, the kite was rolling to starboard which meant that the door opening was getting higher and the floor was tilting. Sgt Smith had slipped as the kite rolled but Sanday was holding on to something with one hand and desperately trying to haul Smith to the escape hatch with the other. You will appreciate that all this only took seconds. At some point Sanday realised that if they did not scramble out of the escape hatch then, it would roll too high and be out of reach and neither of them would make it.
As he struggled, Sanday lost his grip on Smith but managed to grab the bottom edge of the fast rising hatch with both hands, hauled himself up and out, he was a tall man, murmured a prayer and pulled the ripcord of his 'chute. He must have done it with nano seconds to spare. The aircraft must have been very low by now and he was lucky to escape with only minor injuries.
Although this conversation took place almost sixty years ago I can still recall his distress as he recounted his story.

It is fairly certain that if Sanday had asked to be taken off flying or 'rested ' for a while, at this late stage of the war, it would have been granted but he was made of sterner stuff and within five weeks he was flying again, albeit without a crew.

22 Feb '45 Flew as spare bod with Ridgewell ( note the name) on an op to the Ruhr.
23 Feb '45 Flew as spare bod with Byrom to Neuss.
24 Feb '45 Flew as spare bod with ELY and lost his life with the other seven crew members
He lost his crew in January and his life in February.

.Operations on the night of 24th February 1945.
Ten a/c were required for spoof and bombing operations against Neuss for the second consecutive night. 100 Group operated alone this night. Take off at 1700 hrs, return at 21.50. There were no non starters or early returns. Bomb load: three- 750 lbs incendiary clusters + I – 500 lbs GP bomb.

By 21.50 four crews had failed to return:
F/O. V. Ely. Skipper and seven crew members all killed.
Fl/Lt A Rate. Skipper and six crew members killed, A/B Reg Gould* baled out and made POW.
Fl/Lt Ridgewell. Skipper and three crew killed. 3 became POW's and the fate of the third is unknown.**
Fl/Lt Tootal. Skipper and seven crew members all killed.
In all 26 aircrew were killed, exactly half the squadron total between January and end of March 1945.

The following six crews returned;

F/O J. E. Byrom ( RAAF)
F/O W.J. Frazer '' ( our rear a/g, Fred, flew as spare bod.)
P/O G.M.Langworthy ''
F/O P.S . Sherron ''
F/O D.M. Taylor ''
W/O P.F. Whatling ( R.A.F).

What really happened that night?
I am sorry to say that I don't really know. 462 Operations Record Book simply records that unfortunately four of our aircraft failed to return.
Byrom reports ..´sticky trip….held in searchlights´.
I cannot find any comments by any of the other surviving crews other than that they dispensed their Window, dropped their bombs and returned to base. Reg Gould ( survivor from Allan Rate's crew)said that they were in the area of Kreffeld in the Ruhr when they were hit by flak in the port wing which caught fire.
The Ruhr was well defended and perhaps the fact that this was the second night in succession that Neuss had been attacked may have a bearing on it. They were flying alongside OTU and HCU ( trainee ) crews but I do not think that in its self was significant. We have some inconclusive evidence that in fact the OTU and HCU contingent did not cross into Europe but 'spoofed' towards Norway. Bomber Command was on daylights that day so did not operate that night which meant that there would be few Allied aircraft over enemy territory. Not sure whether that meant it was safer or more dangerous over Germany that night.
I am sorry to say that I do not think we will ever hear the full story.

Finally. I have tried to tell this story to honour the memory of gallant men, some who died and some who endured. Never forget that they died to give us all a better tomorrow.

* Reg Gould dislocated his shoulder as he baled out. He was captured and met up with the three survivors of Ridgewell's crew, two of whom were injured but he was later separated from them. Interned in Stalag 111 near Berlin he and 10.000 others were forced marched in groups to Stamlager 7a near Munich, a distance of 300 miles. He survived the war as, I think, did all 462 POW'S. Reg seems to have born all his tribulations with great fortitude and good humour. He died peacefully about three years ago.

**F/O Watson, Air Bomber, flew with Ridgewell but is not listed on 462's Roll of Honour or in the list of POW'S. It is possible that he was an evadee. If any one knows what happened to him I would be very pleased to hear from you.

Acknowledgement.
Bill Johnson ( Co. Durham). If Bill had not spent many hours in the Records Office and even more hours collecting and recording stories and reminiscences of 462 aircrew this story could not have been written. Thanks pal.


 
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oliver bradley
(Login oliverb95)
90.217.131.48

regards to reg gould.

March 31 2011, 1:57 AM 

Hello there im related to reg Gould and im always excited to hear about his time during the war he told me many of his memories.Sadly reg died earlier this year (correction from 3 years ago) at the age of 86.Reg was my great grandfather. thanks oliver happy.gif

 
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Anonymous
(no login)
101.176.179.67

Re: regards to reg gould.

September 5 2016, 7:44 AM 


 
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HAROLD DUMMER
(no login)
195.92.168.178

SQUADRON 462 RAAF 1944 1945

October 26 2004, 10:30 PM 

garet have you by any chance any info re 436070 Flt/Sgt M J COLEMAN He flew mith 426 Squadron from July 1944 to 1945 He was the only surviour of the crash of Halifax LV825G in which my brother lost his life He was then with 10 squadron the crash happened 17 6 44 after this he transfered to 426 squadron Many Thanks HAROLD DUMMER

 
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Margaret
(no login)
203.40.195.14

Flt/Sgt M J Coleman

October 28 2004, 8:11 AM 

Sorry Harold, no information to give you. Margaret

 
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Arthur Newstead
(no login)
195.92.168.173

F/S COLEMAN

October 29 2004, 10:37 PM 

Have a little on him.m/u gunner. Was crewed with F/L Peter H FINLEY DFC RAAF. Know of 2 ops out of Driffield (4 Group)
11/09/44 Le Havre
Daylight Op. Halli 3 MZ341 'P'
Landed at Carnaby ( PROBLEMS?)

15/10/44 Duisberg
T/o 00.44 hrs. Hali 3 MZ429 'F'

23/10/44 Essen
Non starter.

Jan 1945
F/L Finlay and W/O Gee ( rear gunner) posted out of 462 squadron- destination unknown. Have attempted to trace Coleman after this but so far no joy.
PS 1994 EDITION OF 466/462 MAG REPORTED DEATH OF SIR PETER FINLEY DFC. Arthur N


 
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HAROLD DUMMER
(no login)
195.92.168.167

F/S M J COLEMAN

November 1 2004, 4:53 PM 

Hi Arthur A Million thanks for info re M J COLEMAN Harold Dummer

 
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Linzee
(Login Linzee_)
57 Rescue Moderators
195.92.168.168

Re: F/S M J COLEMAN

November 25 2004, 10:01 AM 

Margaret,

Are you aware that the Service Record for F/O Vivian ELY is currently available for viewing online via the National Archives of Australia website.  There are 33 pages which also include photographs of the airman.  Visit this link http://www.naa.gov.au/the_collection/recordsearch.html and click on the 'Search now - as a guest' link.  In the box 'Keywords or name' type only 'Ely 426221' this should bring up two results one of which is digitised - click on the appropriate link to view the digitised copy of the record.  It may be possible to request that the other item is digitised.
 
The other Australian onboard was HERING JOHN HUBERT : Service Number - 419001 : Date of birth - 21 Aug 1919 : Place of birth - GEELONG VIC : Place of enlistment - MELBOURNE : Next of Kin - HERING EDWARD his service record has not been digitised yet.  You could request this (request to have it digitised is free) using the National Archives of Australia website.  Using the information above you could also try writing to the local newspapers in Geelong, Vic to see if any of his relations are still in the area.
 
Regards
Linzee

 
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Margaret Golder
(no login)
203.40.201.26

Hi Linzee

November 26 2004, 8:04 AM 

Linzee,
Thanks for the info. I had requested the digitised copy about 2 months ago, but hadn't realised that it had happened already. They told me it could take up to 3 months & to keep checking as they don't advise when it happens.
As an aside, I like to pop into the forum & read all the happenings. It is becoming quite a hobby for me. I was interested to read how you became "hooked" (for want of a better word) on all of this, & how you have obviously quite a lot of knowledge about these things. I wouldn't of got as far as I have with my research, if wasn't for the kind input from people such as yourself. I have to say, I had posted my info on other forums/notice boards, with no success at all, so keep up the good work & friendly atmosphere that I have encountered with this forum.
Regards,
Margaret.

 
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Arthur Newstead
(no login)
195.92.168.179

VIV ELY'S LOG BOOK

December 4 2004, 8:35 PM 

Hi Margaret, Very pleased to learn that you have found Viv's log. Coincidently I have just found details of two ops he did from Foulsham but you will have full details of these now. However if I can be of any further help don't hesitate to contact me. Best wishes
.......Arthur N.

 
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Glyn Jenkins
(no login)
120.144.61.151

F/O. John H Hering

June 30 2012, 11:57 AM 

Margaret
If you are still in touch I note your family interest in PO Ely RAAF.
John Hering was my wife Marie's brother and you already have the details of his enlistment and service number.
His father and mother died some years ago as did his sister Norma.
We have little detail as to the operations in which he was concerned and the web site has been of real interest.
He was the only son and his death was a great tragedy to his mother and father and family. He was to attend the marriage of another crew member the day after their death as best man.
A small street in a new sub-division in East Geelong was named in his honor.
I am no 85 years of age and my wife Marie is aged 83.
Regards
Glyn Jenkins

 
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Lynn and Yvonne
(no login)
195.93.18.33

462 SQUADRON

February 2 2005, 8:43 PM 

Hello Margaret

My sister and I recently posted a request on the internet for any information on our uncle who was a rear gunner on the Lancasters.
I had a response from Harold Drummer who suggested that we look at your messages, I are so glad I did, it appears that our uncle was on the same flight as your uncle when they were shot down on Feb 24th 1945.
His name was Sgt Matthew Ogilvie.I am writing this e-mail in the absence of my sister, as yet she has no idea about this, I can't wait to tell her. She has been trying to find out as much as possible about that flight and the circumstances surrounding it so I know she will be eager to get in touch with you. If you don't mind I would like to e-mail you again when my sister is with me.
Lynn Eyre

 
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Ron L
(Login roncl)
142.161.110.92

Re: 462 SQUADRON

April 2 2006, 1:46 PM 

Fascinating reading and research. Great information, Arther.

Arther, I have a question related to a thread I posted on this site. Do you recall if you used a ladder when climbing in and out of the port access door on the Halifax? I am trying to get some idea concerning how frequently a ladder was used by Halifax aircrew.

Thanks.

Ron

 
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Anonymous
(Login roncl)
142.161.110.92

Re: 462 SQUADRON

April 2 2006, 1:54 PM 

Hi Arthur,

Sorry about the wrong spelling of your name in my previous post. Too early in the morning for me.

My apologies. Hope to hear from you.

Ron


 
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Hans Ploes
(no login)
62.225.37.72

Info on Halifax MZ461

November 12 2008, 10:25 AM 

Hello Lynn,

if you are still out there and looking for info on your uncle please contact me under:
hans.ploes@t-online.de

Hans Ploes
Aviation Historian
GERMANY

 
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Hans Ploes
(no login)
62.225.37.72

Info on Halifax MZ461

November 12 2008, 10:25 AM 

Hello Margaret,

if you are still out there and looking for info on your uncle please contact me under:
hans.ploes@t-online.de

Hans Ploes
Aviation Historian
GERMANY

 
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james long
(no login)
212.183.128.82

reference lost aircraft

June 3 2012, 9:40 PM 

Hi i have only just found this web site my great uncle ( peter millhouse ) was killed along with him on that day his body was never found either i have only the infomation my nan gave me about him so anything else anyone could tell me about him would be great , thanks james long

 
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