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Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

October 20 2004 at 3:31 PM
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  (Login raghfarm)

 
28/09/2004

Tehran - The head of Iran’s Aeronautics industry Organisation announced that
Iran is amongst the 5 countries producing advanced Jet and Mini Jet engines.
According to reports from the central news agency, Naderi added that Iran in the
Production of supersonic engines, Tolu 4 and 5, which are of the highly advanced mini jet variety in the world, has reached mass production level.
He went on to say that this type of engine is also used in a variety of missiles.
The head of Iran’s Aeronautics industry Organisation also gave news of the complete
Production of the Azarakhsh war plane, and went on to say that this aircraft has fighter, recognisance and bomber capabilities.
He recalled that different other types of planes are also in the process of production for the armed forces which will accommodate the needs for such planes.
Naderi commented on the capable Iranian scientist and experts which have been absorbed by the Organisation of aeronautics industries and asserted that the aeronautics industries of Easter and Western countries have been observed,
And currently, our warplanes are equipped with advanced instruments and have
Special capabilities, which the enemy cannot imagine.

Translated by Hadi Ragh




THE WORLD IS A BRIDGE, CROSS IT, BUT BUILD NO HOUSE UPON IT!

“IS THERE LIFE AFTER DEATH? ... TRESSPASS HERE AND FIND OUT”






CIA agent Geoffrey Kemp talking about Saddam Hussein:

“WE KNEW HE WAS A SON OF A BITCH, BUT HE WAS OUR SON OF A BITCH”

"when I think about Jews, I get really horney, casue when I think Jew, I think pussy"

 
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(Login raghfarm)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 20 2004, 3:32 PM 

The other countries producing Jet engines are:

USA
UK
Russia
China




THE WORLD IS A BRIDGE, CROSS IT, BUT BUILD NO HOUSE UPON IT!

“IS THERE LIFE AFTER DEATH? ... TRESSPASS HERE AND FIND OUT”






CIA agent Geoffrey Kemp talking about Saddam Hussein:

“WE KNEW HE WAS A SON OF A BITCH, BUT HE WAS OUR SON OF A BITCH”

"when I think about Jews, I get really horney, casue when I think Jew, I think pussy"

 
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(Login HBN2025)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 20 2004, 4:28 PM 

Hadi can you post some pictures of the engines and Iran produced jets?



 
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Diunei Lingyen
(Login Diunei)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 20 2004, 5:17 PM 

You also forgot to mention France; SNECMA has produced jet engines for all Mirage series aircraft.  You also forgot Germany, which invented the jet engine!

And speaking of Eurofighter countries, since Italy and Spain are also building Eurofighters in their respective territories, I think it is safe to assume they also have the technology to produce jet engines, if they didn't already.  And then there is Canada; Pratt&Whitney Canada in Longueuil (near Montréal) is actually producing components for the F-35's engine.  And Canada has been building jet engines for quite a while as well.


 
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(Login Geneva9)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 20 2004, 6:09 PM 

England invented the Jet Engine.

 
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(Login Sylent88)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 20 2004, 6:46 PM 

Germany did invent the jet engine....

 
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Anonymous
(Login BrotherAbdullah)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 20 2004, 7:03 PM 

This thread is a joke to anyone who knows anything.


The Italians and Swiss had working jet engines before the Germans and the UK

The Iranian assertion that only 5 countries produce jet engines is ridiculous

USA
UK
Russia
China

Lets see where is France?

Where is India (jet producer within 3 years of indepedance)

Yugoslavia In colaboration with Romania

Romania (ditto yugoslavia)



Sweden (1940s and then Domestic designed jets 1960-1970)

Brazil

Italy (1930s and several domestic designs)

Spain (Hispano souiza 1950s)

Switzerland (1930s)

Argentina (several cruise missile designs and even ICBM prototypes)

Japan (ww2 to the present day)

South Africa (Project cava/carver and icbm, cruise missiles 1980s)
I forgot canada aswell

 
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Anonymous
(Login Hayq)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 20 2004, 7:07 PM 

Sweden, Ukraine has many left over factories from the USSR...South Korea also has a working jet fighter.

 
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(Login Western_Commander)

Western_Commander

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October 21 2004, 3:09 PM 

Jet Engine technology is european.

England and Germany were the two to start jet engine flights/tests/etc.

Then followed all the others. Canada was the first to produce a jet commercial jet. Kinda failed but created more tech to produce bigger and better.

 
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(Login raghfarm)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 21 2004, 7:42 PM 

The country that invented the jet engine was Britain and not Germany, and also the first commercial jet aircraft was the Comet, also made by Britain, but it was a disaster due to the fact that it was rushed into production to beat the U.S Boeing 747, but after several crashes, it was taken out of service.

The countries that I know which do NOT make jet engines are:
. Germany
. Italy
. Switzerland
. India
. Romania
. Yugoslavia
. Brazil
. Spain
. Argentina
. Japan
. South Africa
And I’m very doubtful about Canada

Its one thing to be a joint partner in the production of jet aircraft, but it is totally another to produce the jet ENGINE.
Ukraine used to have the ability to produce, or assemble get engines, but like many other things in Ukraine, this industry was destroyed after the collapse of the Soviet Union. I believe that France produces certain types of Jet engines, namely mini jet engines used in missiles such as the Excoset, but I think they use Rolls Royse engines for their aircraft.
But one thing that is certain is that only a handful of countries have the ability to indigenously produce jet engines.




THE WORLD IS A BRIDGE, CROSS IT, BUT BUILD NO HOUSE UPON IT!

“IS THERE LIFE AFTER DEATH? ... TRESSPASS HERE AND FIND OUT”






CIA agent Geoffrey Kemp talking about Saddam Hussein:

“WE KNEW HE WAS A SON OF A BITCH, BUT HE WAS OUR SON OF A BITCH”

"when I think about Jews, I get really horney, casue when I think Jew, I think pussy"

 
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(Login saturn_656)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 21 2004, 8:23 PM 

"the first commercial jet aircraft was the Comet, also made by Britain"

The first jet airliner was the Avro Canada Jetliner, do a google search, it flew before the British Comet, but like most of what Avro Canada did it was put on the chopping block unfortunatly.

Also Canada has been producing jet engines for over half a century, starting with Avro Canada and its engine division, Orenda (which outlived its parent company and still exists today as a division of Magellan Aerospace), and the aforementioned Pratt and Whitney Canada.

The club of jet engine producing countries is not as exclusive as some seem to think.

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(Login raghfarm)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 21 2004, 8:59 PM 

http://www.avroland.ca/al-c102.shtml

Check out the above site, just as I suspected, the Canadians were using
Rolls Royce engines, even on their Avor-CX-102. As far as I can see, Canada does not produce jet engines, and never has.
The countries that have the technology to produce Jet engines are indeed very limited!



THE WORLD IS A BRIDGE, CROSS IT, BUT BUILD NO HOUSE UPON IT!

“IS THERE LIFE AFTER DEATH? ... TRESSPASS HERE AND FIND OUT”






CIA agent Geoffrey Kemp talking about Saddam Hussein:

“WE KNEW HE WAS A SON OF A BITCH, BUT HE WAS OUR SON OF A BITCH”

"when I think about Jews, I get really horney, casue when I think Jew, I think pussy"

 
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(Login Hayq)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 21 2004, 9:52 PM 

these must be some ****ty arse engines...


 
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Diunei Lingyen
(Login Diunei)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 21 2004, 9:52 PM 

I suppose Britain and Germany can both claim to have invented the jet engine at the same time.

http://inventors.about.com/library/inventors/bljetengine.htm

As for claim that Canada does not producing jet engines:

http://www.slv2000.qc.ca/bibliotheque/centre_docum/protection/017_a.pdf

This is a brief history about Pratt and Whitney's Longueuil plant

http://www.quebecnews.com/en/show_brief.asp?lang=AN&no=8398&dt=10/13/04&homepage=TRUE

This is about the Longueuil plant participating in producing the engine for the F-35.


 
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(Login Diunei)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 21 2004, 10:09 PM 

BTW, Eurojet makes the engines for the Eurofighter and it is based in Taufkirchen, Germany.

http://www.eurofighter.com/Organisation/Eurojet/


 
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(Login raghfarm)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 21 2004, 10:15 PM 

Pratt and Whitney is American, and the Euro fighter is powered by Rolls Royce engines!




THE WORLD IS A BRIDGE, CROSS IT, BUT BUILD NO HOUSE UPON IT!

“IS THERE LIFE AFTER DEATH? ... TRESSPASS HERE AND FIND OUT”






CIA agent Geoffrey Kemp talking about Saddam Hussein:

“WE KNEW HE WAS A SON OF A BITCH, BUT HE WAS OUR SON OF A BITCH”

"when I think about Jews, I get really horney, casue when I think Jew, I think pussy"

 
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(Login Diunei)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 21 2004, 10:21 PM 

If you read Eurofighter's website, Rolls-Royce and Germany's MTU both have 33% shares in Eurojet, with the final 33% split between Spain and Italy.  Furthermore, the site says that ALL partner countries are assembling and producing the Eurofighter engines.  Conclusion: those four countries produce jet engines.

As for Pratt & Whitney Canada, so what if P&W Canada's parent company is based in Connecticut, USA.  The Longueuil plant hires Canadian engineers and scientists, and these Canadian engineers and scientists are actively involved in the design and production process.  Conclusion: Canada produces jet engines.


 
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(Login saturn_656)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 21 2004, 10:22 PM 

This is ridiculous, you must not have looked very hard.

http://www.shanaberger.com/engines/orenda_11.htm

The long Orenda line of turbojets saw decades of service in CF-100 and CF-86 fighters. Orenda also produced the well known Iroquois engine, most powerful of its day, though due to budget cuts it was scrapped. In addition they built J79 and J85 engines under contract to General Electric. Today Orenda doesn't produce jet engines I believe, it concentrates on the piston engined market, making the only liquid cooled V-8 aircraft engine in the world today.

http://www.shanaberger.com/engines/p&wc.htm

Pratt and Whitney Canada continues the tradition started by Orenda, and it designs and produces the following lines of jet engines.

PT6A - Turboprop model, over 34,000 engines produced
PT6T - Adaptation of the above engine for use in helicopters
JT15D - Turbofan engine
PW100 - Turboprop design for regional jets
PW300 - Turbofan engine

Try telling any Canadian that Canada doesn't produce jet engines, you'll get your ass laughed off, some people need to read more.





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(Login Diunei)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 21 2004, 10:28 PM 


 
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(Login Hayq)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 21 2004, 10:29 PM 

Iranian government officials have been idoctrinating hte people wayyy too much.

 
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(Login raghfarm)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 21 2004, 10:30 PM 

To produce a jet engine, you have to produce the WHOLE jet engine.
Canada does not produce the whole engine and in fact only assembles them from U.S kit, now I don’t really care if any Canadians laugh at what I say, but assembly is NOT production, and Canada does not have the ability to indigenously and with out outside help produce jet engines! The same is true for Italy and Spain!
There are only a handful of countries that can produce jet engines on their own!




THE WORLD IS A BRIDGE, CROSS IT, BUT BUILD NO HOUSE UPON IT!

“IS THERE LIFE AFTER DEATH? ... TRESSPASS HERE AND FIND OUT”






CIA agent Geoffrey Kemp talking about Saddam Hussein:

“WE KNEW HE WAS A SON OF A BITCH, BUT HE WAS OUR SON OF A BITCH”

"when I think about Jews, I get really horney, casue when I think Jew, I think pussy"

 
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(Login Diunei)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 21 2004, 10:38 PM 

Then how do you think Bombardier, a Canadian company, gets their engines for their regional jets?  They are produced by P&W Canada in Longueuil.  If you don't believe me here is a company history:

http://www.utc.com/press/highlights/2003-11-24_anniversary.htm

If you still don't believe me then you are free to contact them and ask if they build engines or not.


 
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(Login saturn_656)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 21 2004, 10:39 PM 

Ok its offical, Hadi is HOPELESS... the Longueuil facility is a PRODUCTION FACILITY.

http://www.pwc.ca/en/0_0/0_0_1/0_0_1_3_1.asp
Check out "Worldwide" presence map, PWC does a hell of alot more than just produce from US kit, they are actively involved in design, R&D, and actual production of jet engines.





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(Login raghfarm)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 21 2004, 10:50 PM 

Look, all the sites you gives me just go to show that Canada does not produce complete Jet engines, but merely produce parts, and assemble the rest from other imported parts.
Now I might be hopeless, but that is what you have shown here!
I still stand by my assertion that only very few countries have the ability to single-handedly produce jet engines, and I haven't seen any evidence that says Canada is amongst those very few countries!





THE WORLD IS A BRIDGE, CROSS IT, BUT BUILD NO HOUSE UPON IT!

“IS THERE LIFE AFTER DEATH? ... TRESSPASS HERE AND FIND OUT”






CIA agent Geoffrey Kemp talking about Saddam Hussein:

“WE KNEW HE WAS A SON OF A BITCH, BUT HE WAS OUR SON OF A BITCH”

"when I think about Jews, I get really horney, casue when I think Jew, I think pussy"

 
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(Login Diunei)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 21 2004, 10:58 PM 

Hadi, with all due respect, those sites CLEARLY show that Canada is actively involved in the R&D and production of jet engines.  Trust me, I know people that are aeronautical engineers at P&W Canada, and they produce the engine from scratch, i.e. the casing to the turbines; trivial things like wiring or tubing is tasked to local sub-contractors.  I also know physicists that do the R&D via computer assisted design (CAD.) 

So I am sorry to say but your assertion just doesn't hold water.

BTW, for those Eurojet partners, since they all co-developped EVERYTHING, it is safe to assume they ALL have the technology to fabricate all necessary components.  And since they all produce their respective shares in their own local factories, shouldn't it be logical to deduce that they produce the engines?


 
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(Login raghfarm)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 21 2004, 11:10 PM 

Diuneil, the hardest thing to produce for the jet engines is actually
The production of the special alloys needed for the production, but if you say that Canada produces every thing, then fine.
Regarding the Eruofighter, Spain and Italy have nothing to do with Jet engine production, and they only own shares in the mentioned company!
Also, even if they were producing certain percentage of the jet engines, it would be very wrong to presume that they can produce all the engine parts.




THE WORLD IS A BRIDGE, CROSS IT, BUT BUILD NO HOUSE UPON IT!

“IS THERE LIFE AFTER DEATH? ... TRESSPASS HERE AND FIND OUT”






CIA agent Geoffrey Kemp talking about Saddam Hussein:

“WE KNEW HE WAS A SON OF A BITCH, BUT HE WAS OUR SON OF A BITCH”

"when I think about Jews, I get really horney, casue when I think Jew, I think pussy"

 
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(Login Diunei)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 21 2004, 11:16 PM 

If metal alloys is a concern then Canada also has a very advanced metallurgical industry; Alcan and Stelco are but a few examples.

As for Italy and Spain, the very reason the Eurofighter has become so expensive is because of quarrelling on workshare, for everything from engines to actual airframes.  If production was concentrated only in the UK and Germany then I believe the price would be lower.  However, the Italians and Spanish insisted on having full produciton capabilities for all components as well as full technology sharing, engines included.  So, even if the engine technology was originally developped in Germany and UK only, the fact of the matter is that Italy and Spain also have full access to ALL technologies involved in ALL components, engines included.


 
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(Login Western_Commander)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 22 2004, 12:27 AM 

You mean Dofasco/Stelco/Alcan...those are just to name a few

I agree with Cole Liedtke... You underestimate us. Our military is small yet very skilled. Our economy is huge...one of the richest countries in the world.

Hadi is right out of her.....

 
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(Login freenick)

Ok Hadi what about this

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October 22 2004, 11:23 AM 

You claim Italy does not have the ability to produce je engines just becauese now it is developing joint productins with foreign partners and "great Iran" has better technology??!!

So what bout this:


The Campini-Caproni CC-2 aircraft






One of the World's Earliest Jets
Not everybody really knows that Italy was the world's second country to launch a jet after Germany. That jet was the Campini-Caproni CC-2, of which the Milan Museum of Science houses the fuselage for static tests, and the engine. A complete aircraft of this type is preserved at the Aeronautical Museum of Vigna di Valle in the Rome area.


Ing. Campini
Soon after graduating from university in 1929, Bologna-born Ing. Secondo Campini set about studying jet propulsion, and published an article in the periodical, Rivista Aeronautica, on its prospective application to aeronautics. In 1931, Ing. Campini submitted a report on his propulsion system to the Italian Air Ministry. In the same year, he founded the V.E.N.A.R. (jet aircraft and watercraft) company, which was the world's first reaction engine manufacturer. Again in 1931, thanks to the support given by the Milan Riva company, he built the world's first motorboat propelled by water-jet drive. Water was collected and piped to a centrifugal pump featuring a double-throw spiral. The pump, which was driven by a 9 hp Isotta Fraschini engine, directed water through two adjustable needle nozzles, which could then be used as a helm. This motorboat attained the speed of over 28 knots in Venice, where it was tested in 1932.



The CC-2 aircraft undergoing a ground test




On 5 February, 1934, the Italian Air Ministry and Ing. Campini signed a contract to build two jets and one fuselage for static tests. As the company of Ing. Campini did not have the means to implement its designs, it affiliated with the Caproni company of Taliedo. But the former was solely responsible for the supervision of the work for the plan and construction of the aircraft. Tests led Ing. Campini to work on a United States patent in order to make another jet, which unfortunately was never built. The 31st/12/1936 deadline set for the submission of the prototypes was missed because of technical difficulties and rising costs. This led the Air deputy-minister, Mr. Valle, to grant an extension. So it was that a fuselage for static and engine tests - which is now housed at the Milan Museum of Science - was completed. This fuselage provided static thrust for 700 kg. Two prototypes nos. M.M.487 and M.M.488 of the Campini-Caproni CC-2 aircraft were then made. Ing. Campini's prototypes in progress included a two-jet aircraft flying in stratosphere, and an autogiro. They were named S.C.3 and S.C.5 respectively - their modified versions being named, S.C.4 and S.C.6 respectively -. The autogiro was a two-seater jet-propelled helicopter, whose all-up weight was 500 kg. By going round, its rotor blades generated high speed and dynamic pressure, thus actuating the ramjet engines which were fixed to their ends. A 120 hp engine produced the power required to activate the ramjet engines. These plans, however, were never to be implemented because of the war.


The CC-2 Aircraft Flies!

On 27 August, 1940, the first prototype was tested for 10 minutes over the Taliedo airfield by the great pilot, Mario De Bernardi. On 16 September that same year it was flown for another 5 minutes, thus undergoing the acceptance flight test in order that the second prototype was upgraded. The latter made its maiden flight on 11 April, 1941. On 30 November, 1941, at 2:47 pm, Mario De Bernardi and Ing. Giovanni Pedace flew the second prototype on an official flight from the airport of Milan Linate and that of Rome Guidonia. After flying over Pisa, they landed at 4:58 pm after covering 475.554 km at the average speed of 217.147 km/h. According to the pilot's wish, the afterburner was never actuated in order to save fuel.



The Caproni aircraft undergoing an acceptance flight test




The flight was a tremendous success, su much so that Mussolini personally complimented De Bernardi, and low-altitude flights were made over Rome, preceded by announcements repeatedly broacast by radio. The event took the world by storm, and no less than 33 countries congratulated the Italian government. These flights were recognized by the F.A.I. (Fédération Aéronautique Internationale) to be the first ever made by a jet. Truth to tell, the plan conceived by the German, Hans von Ohain, and the Heinkel group, whereby the extraordinary He.178 aircraft was flown precisely a year before, on 27th August, 1939, had been kept secret.


Wartime and Postwar Years

In 1942, Ing. Campini was commissioned by the Italian Royal Navy two single-seater water-jet-propelled mini-submarines (maximum power 1,000 hp; displacement 7 tons at the estimated speed of 30 knots; cruising radius 1,000 km). The prototypes completed, fitted with the reaction engines, which had already undergone the acceptance flight test, were destroyed in 1944 by air raids. Other brainchildren of Ing. Campini, like a two-jet bomber and a fighter driven by the Campini-devised propulsion system, were never implemented. De Bernardi and a panel of military engineers went on testing the CC.2 aircraft at the experimental centre at Guidonia until September, 1942. However, the results were disappointing because of the limited overall maximum power. So it was that the prototypes, having no further prospective developments, were stored in a hangar where they were damaged by German air raids on 24 October, 1943. In June, 1944, the Anglo-American commission salvaged the fuselage of the second prototype, and transferred it to the Royal Aircraft Establishment of Farnborough. After 1949, all trace was lost of the second prototype. The first prototype, on the other hand, is now housed in the Aeronautical Museum of Vigna di Valle, near Rome. The fuselage for static tests, and the reaction engine are on display at the Milan Museum of Science and Technology.



The prototype housed in the Aeronautical Museum of Vigna di Valle




In 1948, Ing. Campini moved to the USA, where he conceived of a four-seater helicopter with a 200 hp turbine. In 1949, he carried out a new plan for a big helicopter with a rotor actuated by two turbines, which were capable of lifting a 40-ton armoured car. He received a commission by the American government to design a 6,000 kg-thrust long-range turbojet, and considered replacing the 4 propeller-driven engines of the Northrop YB-35 bomber with turbojets, and constructing the strategic bomber, B-49. Ing. Secondo Campini passed away in Milan on 7 February, 1980.


The Engine of the CC-2 Aircraft

Like a gun, which 'reacts' with a quick backward movement (i.e. the recoil) when a projectile is shot forward at high speed, a jet engine derives its thrust by reaction to its high-speed ejection of combustion products, and by the expansion of heated air, which is pushed out at a higher speed than when the air is drawn in. (After all, ordinary propellers work in a similar way. They accelerate backwards the air mass that moves through their rotating blades.) These introductory remarks are meant to help our visitors gain an insight into the workings of Ing. Campini's thermojet. It is, in effect, to be considered more as a hybrid than as a jet engine proper. An internal combustion engine characterized by reciprocating motion of pistons in its cylinder - in our case, a 900 hp Isotta Fraschini L. 121/R.C. 40 engine - drove a compressor incorporating 2 ducted propellers and a propeller designed to direct the flow and minimize the breakdown of the smooth airflow. A ring of injectors (i.e. the burners) introduced kerosine, whose combustion increased the volume of the thermojet and the exhaust velocity.



Plan of the engine of the Campini-Caproni aircraft




It was an interesting application, albeit structurally different from German turbojets - like those fitted to the Messerschmitt Me 262 aircraft - which, in place of the reciprocating engine, featured a turbine-driven air compressor. The turbine was to be found past the blast chamber, and the air under pressure was heated not through the injectors, but through several blast chambers that heated the air by conduction. Which was a more effective solution. What's more, the higher the altitude and speed, the better the performance of turbojets. On the other hand, endothermic reciprocating engines - like the one used by Ing. Campini - attain top efficiency at sea level, while they call for an extra compressor to operate at high altitude where the air is rarefied.



Plan of the Jumo reaction engine of the Messerschmitt Me-262 aircraft




The engine designed by Ing. Campini had many other drawbacks. That is, it was heavy and bulky, the type of engine used to drive the compressor was rather complex, the efficiency of the burner was low - although it came close to the best possible performance of the day -, and maximum power was considerably limited. This is why the German design - which came into use when World War II was drawing to an end, and was partly due to the British research work carried out in parallel - is the forerunner of the modern jet engines, while the Italian version has a purely historical value.


Technical Specifications

The Campini Caproni CC.2 aircraft is a single-propelled, tandem, two-seat, low-wing monoplane of all-duralumin construction.The wings are elliptical in plan. Other features include a pressurized cabin for altitude flight. The undercarriage is of the retractable type, the wheels rotating outwards during retraction into the wing thickness. The tail wheel retracts into dedicated fairing. The fuselage is of circular section structure. The rear section accommodates the exhaust pipe, complete with a cone for directing the flow of gases.

Other Data

Ducted fan with three rotors, of which two are rotating, and one is fixed; burners provide 700 kg thrust; engine of the compressor, 900 hp Isotta Fraschini L. 121/R.C. 40; length, 12.10 m; height, 4.70 m; span, 14.63 m; wing area, 36 sq m; weight empty, 3,640 kg; total weight, 4,217 kg; useful load, 577 kg; maximum speed at an altitude of 3,000 m without burner, 325 km/h; maximum speed at an altitude of 3,000 m with burner, 359.5 km/h; climb, 1,000 m in 9 min. (with burner); maximum altitude attained in the course of acceptance flight tests, 4,000 m.

Texts by Aldo Curti - Editing by Giuliano Gaia
We gratefully acknowledge the technical assistance of Ing. Mario Mantero.
For further, detailed


"Memento Audere Semper"

 
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(Login HBN2025)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 22 2004, 5:47 PM 

It is well true that very limited countries are able to produce meaningfull jet engines INdependently.

 
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(Login Hayq)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 22 2004, 11:02 PM 

Independently it is very difficult especially for natiosn who did not take part in the original designing of jet engines back in the 40s to get an industry and schools about the entire subject open.

However, I dont think the Iranian engines are indigenously built either, i supect they are reverse engineered American stuff.

 
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(Login Landos)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 24 2004, 5:48 PM 

The British Comet was the first practical jet transport. It was rushed into production to beat the Boeing 707 (not 747). Two Comets were lost in mysterious crashes before they discovered that pressurization/depressurization of the fuselage was leading to fatigue cracks at the corners of windows. This caused catastrophic failure of the fuselage-usually at altitude and high speed. The problem was corrected by redesigning the passenger windows, but the aircraft never overcame it's bad image. Besides, the 707 was a far superior aircraft and had been launched by then.

As for who can and can't build jet engines, I agree with Hadi on his comments about assembly versus manufacture. The hardest part to building a jet engine is casting, forming and machining the high temperature alloys in the compressor section. Very few foundries can cast or heat treat those type of alloys. We have several in Michigan where I live. I don't know if they have any in Canada.

Germany did a good job fielding a jet fighter in WW2-the ME-262-but they were behind England in the quality of their jet engines. German jet engines were efficient up to about 20,000 feet and then they became inefficient. Also, German engines required major overhauls after only 10 hours of service. The problem was they lacked access to and experience with the high temperature alloys that are needed for really high compression, high efficiency, durable jet engines. England was more advanced in this area. In fact, the Russians used a British Rolls Royce Viper engine as the basis for the engine they put in the Mig-15.

E Tan, E Epi Tas!

 
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(Login Diunei)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 24 2004, 6:03 PM 

I don't know if they have any in Canada.

You can find plenty of high tech foundaries in Ontario (Hamilton and Sudbury, for instance) and Québec (eastern Montréal.) 


 
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(Login Landos)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 24 2004, 9:46 PM 

"High Tech" foundries, maybe. But foundries capable of producing high temperature alloys, I don't know. It's a pretty specialized field. I worked in foundry engineering at GM for several years and I only know of a few foundries in North America that produce castings for jet engine grade turbine blades. Howmet in Michigan is one of them. They require special high temperature heat treatment as well, to grow the grain size. Top turbine blades consist of almost a single grain of metal. It improves the strength and hardness.

E Tan, E Epi Tas!

 
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(Login Diunei)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 24 2004, 9:55 PM 

By high-tech foundaries I implied the capacity to produce the necessary high temperatures to make high quality alloys.  And Canada definitely has this capacity; you forget that Alcan is the #2 aluminium company in the world behind Alcoa.  There is also Stelco, based in Hamilton, that is a major producer of steel for GM, Daimler-Chrysler and others.


 
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(Login raghfarm)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 25 2004, 6:16 AM 

One things that people have to ask themselves is whether a particular
Country would be able to single-handedly, and without any outside help
Or assistance be able to produce the jet engines!
Now, in Britain, Rolls Royce uses many imported American parts in their jet engines, and Britain is sure more advanced than Canada.
Would Canada be able to single-handedly and with out any outside help or assistance be able to produce jet engines? If yes, then the question that begs being asked is; why are the Canadian Jet engines produces by a U.S owned company?!





THE WORLD IS A BRIDGE, CROSS IT, BUT BUILD NO HOUSE UPON IT!

“IS THERE LIFE AFTER DEATH? ... TRESSPASS HERE AND FIND OUT”






CIA agent Geoffrey Kemp talking about Saddam Hussein:

“WE KNEW HE WAS A SON OF A BITCH, BUT HE WAS OUR SON OF A BITCH”

 
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(Login Diunei)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 25 2004, 11:38 AM 

Would Canada be able to single-handedly and with out any outside help or assistance be able to produce jet engines? If yes, then the question that begs being asked is; why are the Canadian Jet engines produces by a U.S owned company?!

And the answer again is yes.  Canada has been doing it since the late 1940s, and Canada is a leading R&D centre.  As for the ownership contention, it is the same reason Rolls-Royce uses American imported parts: competitive economics.  In Canada's case, Pratt & Whitney's Canadian division was just one example; don't you think that if those Canadian scientists and engineers decided to leave P&W Canada and start their own company, they could still produce the same product, patent rights notwithstanding?


 
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(Login Vijak)
Soldiers

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 25 2004, 12:24 PM 

test

--------------------------------------------

Mankind is a single body & each nation is a part of that body. We must never say "what does it matter to me if some part of the world is ailing?" If there is such an illness, we must concern ourselves with it as though we are having that illness. My thoughts have never left my country, they remain there.
(Saadi Shirazi and later Mustafa Kemal Attaturk)

 
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(Login Vijak)
Soldiers

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 25 2004, 12:31 PM 

"One things that people have to ask themselves is whether a particular
Country would be able to single-handedly, and without any outside help
Or assistance be able to produce the jet engines! "

IMO these countries do possess the industrial capabilities to do exactly that,
to "single-handedly, and without any outside help or assistence be able to
produce (the) jet engines":

usa
russia
uk
china
germany
italy
spain
france
sweden
canada
south korea
india
japan
iran
brazil
turkey
south africa
taiwan
... (and some others)

basically any country with a sophisticated industry

why shouldnt they? whats so extremely hard about producing "a jet engine" when
jet engines have been mass produced in the 1940's allready?


--------------------------------------------

Mankind is a single body & each nation is a part of that body. We must never say "what does it matter to me if some part of the world is ailing?" If there is such an illness, we must concern ourselves with it as though we are having that illness. My thoughts have never left my country, they remain there.
(Saadi Shirazi and later Mustafa Kemal Attaturk)

 
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(Login meemperor)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 26 2004, 9:34 PM 

http://exn.ca/FlightDeck/Arrow/words.cfm?ID=19990628-64

http://www.avroland.ca/al-c102.shtml - Just look around there.

http://www.avroarrow.org/history.html


Not to Mention P&W Canada, which is NOT a wholly owned Subsidary.

Also saying that Canada doesn't have the ability to produce the Special Alloy's (I assume you mean for intake fans and electronics for the 30,000+ volts of electricity), is just insane. Considering Canada has the ability to make any kind of Alloy know to man, and even if we couldn't, our economy could conjure it up in no time.

Another thing is, why do you think the Avro Arrow was so important, because we built our own engines for it, even though it never offically flew with them in. O btw the way, before the program was cancelled France was going to buy 350 Iroquois engines.

And if your too lazy too research yourself and can't read well.


Avro Jetliner


CF-100


AT the Avro Machineshop


OMG LOOK, Orenda enginers working on a JET ENGINE






---------------------------------------------


"deeds, not words"


 
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(Login meemperor)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 26 2004, 9:41 PM 


 
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(Login raghfarm)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 26 2004, 9:49 PM 

Avro Arrow were using Rolls Royse engines!!!!!!!



THE WORLD IS A BRIDGE, CROSS IT, BUT BUILD NO HOUSE UPON IT!

“IS THERE LIFE AFTER DEATH? ... TRESSPASS HERE AND FIND OUT”






CIA agent Geoffrey Kemp talking about Saddam Hussein:

“WE KNEW HE WAS A SON OF A BITCH, BUT HE WAS OUR SON OF A BITCH”

 
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(Login meemperor)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 26 2004, 9:53 PM 

Acutally the Avro Arrow's to fly were using P&W's. And the Iroquios was actually in the last one that never flew. Did you look at any of the links ?


idiot....

---------------------------------------------


"deeds, not words"


 
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(Login Western_Commander)

Western_Commander

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October 26 2004, 10:08 PM 

lol ignorance

 
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(Login meemperor)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 26 2004, 10:12 PM 

7 links. 7 ..... and that was 5 mins of research.

---------------------------------------------


"deeds, not words"


 
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Diunei Lingyen
(Login Diunei)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 28 2004, 10:55 AM 

I am sorry to say Hadi, but getting proved wrong by Fool is pretty foolish IMHO...lol!

Anyhow, I hope your previous misconceptions have been thoroughly answered.  Seriously though, I don't know how you could have initially excluded France as a jet engine producing country.


 
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Anonymous
(Login Mehran.)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 28 2004, 11:40 AM 





LOL wow this thread hit a number I never thought it would.
@ Hayq Shut up lol


@ Diunei

Is Longueil plant located in quebec? (I remember shooting one of my college film projects in a place called Longueil in montreal just outside the city across a bridge..



.?.?.?.?Mehran.?.?

And all I was in ashes...


<< Р? ? ? ܠR ߟ__r ʠŠ[_ Ӡ? >>

 
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Diunei Lingyen
(Login Diunei)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 28 2004, 2:20 PM 

Is Longueil plant located in quebec? (I remember shooting one of my college film projects in a place called Longueil in montreal just outside the city across a bridge..

Longueuil is a suburb of Montréal, on the south shore of Montréal island.

Longueuil, Québec, Canada
Click to spin globe northwest Click to spin globe north Click to spin globe northeast
Click to spin globe west Map - Click to zoom


 
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(Login raghfarm)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 28 2004, 5:33 PM 

Well, actually, I have already provided a link that says the engines on Avro were made by Rolls Royse, Just because I don't respond, don't think I have changed my mind! And I know what you mean, if some one who has sh!t for brains beats me in a argument (fool), then I really am a no hoper!
Link:
http://www.avroland.ca/al-c102.shtml



THE WORLD IS A BRIDGE, CROSS IT, BUT BUILD NO HOUSE UPON IT!

“IS THERE LIFE AFTER DEATH? ... TRESSPASS HERE AND FIND OUT”






CIA agent Geoffrey Kemp talking about Saddam Hussein:

“WE KNEW HE WAS A SON OF A BITCH, BUT HE WAS OUR SON OF A BITCH”

 
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(Login saturn_656)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 28 2004, 5:47 PM 

Are you telling me Hadi that you don't know the difference between the Avro Arrow, a supersonic interceptor, and the Avro Jetliner, a passenger aircraft???

---------------------------------------------------------------------


 
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(Login raghfarm)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 28 2004, 6:53 PM 

Well, I was actually talking about the jetliner, but isn't it rather
funny that we are basing our information on whether Canada can make
Jet engines independently, on two jet aircraft that were never produced!




THE WORLD IS A BRIDGE, CROSS IT, BUT BUILD NO HOUSE UPON IT!

“IS THERE LIFE AFTER DEATH? ... TRESSPASS HERE AND FIND OUT”






CIA agent Geoffrey Kemp talking about Saddam Hussein:

“WE KNEW HE WAS A SON OF A BITCH, BUT HE WAS OUR SON OF A BITCH”

 
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Anonymous
(Login Mehran.)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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October 28 2004, 7:32 PM 



Thanks Diunei so it is exactly the Longeuil I know.
I miss montreal....st,catherine Street downtown, paramount cinema thought the older sinema (forgot its name) was so cool, a ticket was 2.50 CA$ ...

.?.?.?.?Mehran.?.?

And all I was in ashes...


<< Р? ? ? ܠR ߟ__r ʠŠ[_ Ӡ? >>

 
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(no login)

Re: Iran amongst 5 countries producing Jet engines

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May 20 2011, 12:01 PM 

many people here are mistaking a licenced production of a foreign jet engine, o even a foreign factory installed in certain country with the CAPABILITY to create an indigenous jet engine.
You can have a production facility for a licenced engine in, say for example, Egypt. But the MATRIX (the machine that makes the machine) is foreign, and Egypt is not capable of developing one of their one. They will build that specific engine until the machine stops working or gets replaced.
Same goes for a foreign company producing engines abroad. If General Electric is producing jet engines in Colombia, that doesn't mean that Colombia has the capability to produce that kind of engines AT ALL.

Brazil trhough EMBRAER is the 3rd largest producer of commercial planes in the world. But there isn't a single brazillian jet engine, the ones powering their planes are all american or british. Same goes for Canada (Bombardier)

That's why the only countries capable of REALLY produce jet engines are France, USA, UK, Russia, and China (China is still behind the others in jet technology). India is working on it, but they didn't quite made it yet. Germany and Japan could do it easily if they wanted to, but they aren't.

As for Iran, i really don't know if their claim is true.

 
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