The Bixography Discussion Group

A vehicle for Bixophiles and other interested individuals to ask questions, make comments and exchange information about Bix Beiderbecke and related subjects.

Any views expressed in the Bixography Forum represent solely the opinions of those expressing them and are not necessarily endorsed or opposed by Albert Haim unless he has signed the message.

I started archiving some of the threads that have been inactive for some time. The archived threads can be found at http://ms.cc.sunysb.edu/~alhaim/archivesforum.htm

Albert Haim, Forum Owner

Irving Kaufman

by Patrick Humbert, brussels, Belgium

I'm a big fan of Kaufman recordings... I think he had a true voice, well balanced, and sometimes swing and never get any bad taste... I think he was a really great singer;

I'm currently working on his discography, the most prolific singer in the 1914-1930...

have a look :

patjazz.eu/A.internet/IK.html

Patrick Humbert, brussels, Belgium

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 6:54 PM

Posted on Jul 4, 2008, 5:10 PM

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will be giving additions/corrections to your work

As I work on the Nichols book, I will be sending you additons/corrections regarding the joint recordings of Irving Kaufman that involve Red Nichols. Also while filing and working on non-Nichols records in the collection, I will check those too.

Best and keep up the good work.

Stephen Hester

Posted on Jul 4, 2008, 9:30 PM

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Bix and Kaufman

That is quite a discography!

Irving Kaufman recorded four sides with Bix, two days in a row in 1927, and two more in 1928. From Sudhalter and Evans.

Sep 29, 1927 BROADWAY BELL-HOPS

144809-2 There Ain't No Land Like Dixieland to Me Har 504-H, Vel 1504-V, Diva 2504-V
144810-2 There' A Cradle in Caroline Har 504-H, Vel 1504-V, Diva 2504-V

Sep 30, 1927 FRANK TRUMBAUER AND HIS ORCHESTRA

W81499-A Just an Hour of Love OK 40912, OdFr A-189070, ParE R3463, ParG A-4912
W81500-A I'm Wondering Who OK 40912, OdFr A-189070, ParE R3463, ParG A-4912

Apr 3, 1928 FRANK TRUMBAUER AND HIS ORCHESTRA (Irving Kaufman as Noel Taylor)

W 400188-A Our Bungalow of Dreams OK41019, ParE R-142, ParG A-4543
W 400189-B Lila OK41019, ParE R-141, ParG A-4543

It is interesting that the credits on the label of ParE R3463 read "FRANKIE TRUMBAUER’S AUGMENTED ORCHESTRA with Bix, Lang, Rollini and Venuti with Special Vocal Chorus." ParE R-142 gives FRANKIE TRUMBAUER’S AUGMENTED ORCHESTRA. ParE R141 gives FRANKIE TRUMBAUER and his ORCHESTRA.

Here are images of some labels.

Note that OK 40912 was issued under the name "Benny Meroff and His Orchestra" and the vocalist was not identified.

Har 504-H does not identify the vocalist.

Neither does OK 41019

ParE R-142 does not even mention a vocalist.

I have a photo of the Kaufman brothers in the Bixography. See

http://bixography.com/images2/photogallery.htm#PhotographIrving%20KaufmanVitaphone

The image was courtesy of Ryan Barna who has a couple of pages of relevnt interest.

http://www.phonostalgia.com/kaufman/ind.html

http://www.phonostalgia.com/kaufman/final.html

Albert

Posted on Jul 5, 2008, 4:14 AM

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No Rollini, no Venuti on ParE R3463

The credits on the label of ParE R3463 read "FRANKIE TRUMBAUER’S AUGMENTED ORCHESTRA with Bix, Lang, Rollini and Venuti with Special Vocal Chorus." Rollini was in England when this recording was waxed. The bass saxist was Min Leibrook. The violinist was Matty Malneck.

Indeed, the orchestra was "augmented" as compared to earlier recordings. In the April 3, 1928 session, the band consisted of 11 musicians (without counting vocalist). Compare with the Feb 4, 1927 session where there were 7 musicians.

Albert

Posted on Jul 5, 2008, 5:53 AM

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Artilces about Vince Giordano and Dick Hyman in newspapers.

Dick and Vince cetainly know each other. Among things they did together, I highlight the CD "If Bix Played Gershwin." See my review in
http://ms.cc.sunysb.edu/%7Ealhaim/recordingstributes.htm#IfBixPlayedGerswhin

The QC Times announces a concert by Dick Hyman in Davenport during the Bix Festival.

From http://pagesperso-orange.fr/jcarl.simonetti/score.htm

From http://qconline.com/archives/qco/display.php?id=393976

"Music legend Dick Hyman to Perform at Figge
July 3, 2008, 12:53 p.m.

World renowned pianist Dick Hyman will perform at the Figge Art Museum from 1:00-3:00 p.m. on Sunday, July 27.

Hyman is one of the most versatile jazz pianists, equally at home in ragtime, stride, swing and bop. He has an extensive knowledge of jazz compositions, including those written and played by Bix Beiderbecke. The $10 admission stands alone regardless of memberships or ticket packages from sponsoring organizations.

Tickets are on sale now at the Figge but will be available at the door (seating is limited)."

The New York Sun publishes a review of Big Bands currently playing in the Big Apple, one Andy Farber's and the other Vince Giordano's.

From http://www.myspace.com/VinceGiordanotheNighthawks

From http://www.nysun.com/arts/tis-the-season-for-big-bands/81186/

This is an excerpt from the article.

"'Tis the Season for Big Bands
Jazz
By WILL FRIEDWALD
July 3, 2008
Recently, two veteran bandleaders launched regular runs. The arranger-composer-saxophonist Andy Farber joined the roster at Birdland on Sunday evenings, and the bass virtuoso and virtual one-man-band Vince Giordano has taken up residence at Sofia's. Both players are historically oriented, rather than "contemporary" (in the sense of Maria Schneider or William Parker), but each takes a distinct approach to bringing classic jazz to life.

During the past five years, Vince Giordano has enjoyed long runs in at least five different Manhattan clubs, the latest (and, with any luck, longest-running) of which is Sofia's, under the Hotel Edison, which itself was a dancing spot for big bands in the 1930s and '40s. Mr. Giordano's general approach is twofold: to play the classic "hot" big-band charts of the 1920s and '30s as authentically as possible, by means of exhuming the original orchestrations whenever possible, and to play them with as much energy and pure speed as his highly trained musicians can manage.

In the past, Mr. Giordano has tried to outrace the beboppers for sheer hell-for-leather velocity. But the current edition appears to be playing with more of a relaxed bounce than usual: The leader looks to be enjoying the horn men (especially saxophonists Dan Levinson, Dan Block, and Mark Lopeman, the latter two of whom are also in Mr. Farber's reed section) more, and inspiring the band to swing out more organically. I can't imagine that Mr. Giordano has mellowed in middle age; more likely he is approaching his career-long goal of nailing the idiomatic rhythmic feel of the Jazz Age in a way that meets his demanding standards.

On Monday at Sofia's, the centerpiece was the Fletcher Henderson classic "St. Louis Shuffle," a fast and furious arrangement by Don Redman that is not only a model of call-and-response (the saxophones answering the trumpets), but a showpiece in which the instrumental texture seems to change completely every four bars or so. As played by Mr. Giordano's band, the Nighthawks, it's always been a highly pyrotechnic display, yet jazzy and bluesy at the same time. Now it has more of a danceable groove, which has to be due at least in part to the presence at Sofia's of a dance floor. The Nighthawks are the undisputed masters of syncopated sounds from the pre-swing era, a period when even the much-disparaged "sweet bands" were incredibly innovative.

In three sets on Monday evening, the band also played everything from milestones ("I'm Comin' Virginia" by Bix Beiderbecke, spotlighting Randy Sandke) to curios ("Treat Me Like a Baby," from Sunny Clapp and His Band O' Sunshine), and everything between (including Ellington's early "Tiger Rag" variant "The Creeper" and King Oliver's more derogatory "Mule Face Blues").

In their own very different ways, Messrs. Giordano and Farber are exemplary representatives of the contemporary big-band scene, offering a kind of history that you can dance to — even if, like me, you can't dance.'

If you can, visit Dick Hyman in Davenport and Vince Giordano in New York City. By the way, Davenport and New York City are the two cities where Bix spent most of his life.

Albert

Posted on Jul 4, 2008, 9:23 AM

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Thou Swell

by Ken Bristow

Has there been any further information forthcoming as to where the test pressing of 4006117-A spent almost 40 years hidden away in a trunk? This story is indeed a miracle! According to the LP sleeve notes the disc first turned up in a New Jersey junk shop in 1938. Who took it in the shop and where did they aquire it? Did that person have any idea who Bix was? Clearly written on the plain label is written "Bix Beiderbecke & His Gang". Above that reads "2nd choice" etc. Then the record was bought by a serviceman (presumably) and travelled round the world in a military trunk miraculously surviving breakage. It was then located by Tom Pletcher in February 1977 in Denver when he brought it to London to be transferred. How a brittle shellac disc survived intact with undamaged grooves in those conditions for all those years is truly astounding.

Ken Bristow, London.

Posted on Jul 4, 2008, 3:59 AM

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Now, dear Bixonites ...

by TheHelpfulChazzer

... when we're talking about "Thou Swell", please give a listen to this wonderful version of Thou Swell (1928), with James P. Johnson (p), Fats Waller (org), Garvin Bushell (as) and another cornet genius, Jabbo Smith, an outstanding trumpeter, almost forgotten today.

Major Koslova: "The good guys don't hide." (Sometimes it's nevertheless necessary.)

Posted on Jul 4, 2008, 5:29 AM

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and...

by Klaus H.

Thanks, HelpfulChazzer. While we're looking at versions (and this song probably has dozens) here is Ben Selvin and Franklyn Baur from 1928;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgH6VCVbPlI

Posted on Jul 4, 2008, 5:55 AM

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My favorite section of the recording is ....

... Garvin Bushell around 1:13. Jabbo muted cornet sounds very muffled, poorly recorded perhaps, and makes a few booboos.

Bushell wrote an autobiography, "Jazz From The Beginning." No mention of Bix.

Albert

Posted on Jul 4, 2008, 8:11 AM

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Re: Thou Swell

by Klaus H.

These are the kind of stories that keep collectors - professional and amateur - rooting around in dusty places. Maybe Buddy Bolden's recording(s) are out there waiting for someone this summer.

Posted on Jul 4, 2008, 5:31 AM

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Tom Pletcher knows

by Malcolm Walton

When I was at Davenport a couple of years ago, Tom Pletcher told me the story of him finding this disc. Unfortunately, I cannot remember any specific details other than that he was alerted to its existance by a third party, made a long journey to meet its owner, and finally bought it. But I am almost sure that he knew why and how it had travelled round the world in a trunk; just can't remember the details. So if you really want to know; contact Tom.
Malcolm

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 6:53 PM

Posted on Jul 4, 2008, 7:54 AM

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Deep Harlem

by Nick Flynn

Not a profound posting in any sense, but a way of saying hi after some time. I know “Deep Harlem” has been discussed in the past, particularly with reference to whether Bix was playing “blues” or with “blues feeling” or whatever. But I wondered if any other forumites have been struck in particular by the different feel of Bix’s opening bars in the Irving Mills and the Hostsy gang version”. I only heard it recently, being exclusively vinyl and consequently lacking some tracks. But when I heard those notes, they just blew me away. My description of Bix’s playing would not be “bluesy” but rather "heartbreakingly beautiful!."

Nick

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 6:59 PM

Posted on Jul 3, 2008, 5:56 PM

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Agreed

by Klaus H.

I would agree that it is heartbreaking.

The version can be found here:

copy and paste www.jazz-on-line.com/a/mp3c/BRUE32949-A.mp3

Frankie Trumbauer's version is there also.

copy and paste www.jazz-on-line.com/a/mp3c/OKe404010-B.mp3

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 7:00 PM
This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 3, 2008 6:17 PM

Posted on Jul 3, 2008, 6:03 PM

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Three things in common

Tram's recording of "Deep Harlem" dates from May 10, 1930. That by the Hotsy Totsy Gang from June 6, 1930.

The three things in common.

1. Joe Venuti is in both recordings.

2. Min Leibrook is in both recordings.

3. Both recordings have very similar arrangements. For example, the part played by Bix in the Hotsy Totsy version is played by Tram in the Trumbauer version. Both go into double time on two occasions. Both bands must be using a standard arrangement, doctored to their own needs.

Both are excellent recordings. It is interesting to hear Bix and Tram in different recordings playing very similar notes, one on cornet the other on C-melody (or is it alto?).

The tune was composed by Signorelli and Malneck, both with direct connections to Bix.

Albert

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 4:56 PM

Posted on Jul 3, 2008, 6:45 PM

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Re Deep Harlem

by nick Flynn

Thank you Klaus and Albert, for your comments and information. Yes they are both great versions and I love Tram but what about the added tension that Bix weaves in? What a genius that boy was!

Nick.

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 6:54 PM
This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 3:09 AM

Posted on Jul 3, 2008, 7:24 PM

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answering machine

I had this solo on my answering machine many moons ago. People kept saying, it's beautiful, but too long. I couldn't bring myself to edit it down.
A fantastically beautiful tune you never hear. The New Wolverine's do a version of it. Hard to dance to unless you know the tune because of the tempo changes.

Posted on Jul 7, 2008, 8:17 PM

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What solo?

Bix's from "Deep Down South"? Not that long.

Albert

Posted on Jul 8, 2008, 6:41 AM

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I got it ... finally

When people rang you, they heard Bix's solo in your message. Yes, too long. I imagine, people who are not Bix fans would get annoyed at waiting so long to leave their message. In telephone dealingss as in writing, "conciseness is next to godliness."

Albert

Posted on Jul 8, 2008, 6:53 AM

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A New CD form Josh Duffee and His Orchestra

Josh Duffee kindly sent a copy of his latest CD, Josh Duffee and His Orchestra, 'In My Merry Oldsmobile,' Volume III." Here is a scan of the cover

And here are the tracks in the CD.

With his characteristic class, Josh dedicated the CD to Rich Johnson. The dedication reads,

"Josh would like to dedicate this project to his inspirational and best friend, Rich Johnson."

Rich Johnson certainly deserves the dedication: he provided strong encouragement and support when Josh was just beginning his musical career.

The liners for the CD are co-written by Josh and a good friend of and important contributor to the Bixography, Frank van Nus. The liners are written in a concise style that manages to convey significant information about the tunes and the arrangements. The band has an authentic sound and their repertoire is exapnding beyond the Goldkette book. Here is a 60 sec sample of "Roodles," a hit for the Coon-Sanders Nighthawks.

http://bixography.com/RoodlesDuffee.ram

Josh's My Space page is at http://profile.myspace.com/joshduffeegroups There is a link to instructions to order the CD. Here is the link

http://blog.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendID=57742383&blogID=410076636

Albert

Posted on Jul 3, 2008, 10:12 AM

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Dorsey Bros. and Goodman in Fleischer cartoons

by J.V.

Getting back for a second to any connection between Fleischer cartoons and Bix for a second: in an online interview yesterday Lou Fleischer's son (who was a boy at the time of the Fleischer cartoons) mentioned off hand that both the Dorsey Bros. and Benny Goodman played as uncredited studio musicians on some of the Fleischer soundtracks. He did not elaborate. This is the first time I've heard that jazz musicians were working in this capacity. The interview will play again today (I think) at 4:00 (PST) on Shokus internet radio. One other connection between Bix and cartoons was fellow Whiteman musician James Dietrich who remained in California after filming "The King of Jazz" to become music director on the "Oswald the Lucky Rabbit" series. Perhaps this is what inspired Bix's letter regarding synchronizing movies?

Posted on Jul 3, 2008, 9:03 AM

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Does anyon have this CD?

Boop-Oop-A-Dooin' - The Songs of Sammy Timberg from Betty Boop, Popeye, Superman and Other Musical Classics
Timberg, Sammy

Price: $17.95

Audio CD
ORIGINAL CAST

Product Description
After 14 years in vaudeville and composing for Broadway musicals in the late 20's, Sammy produced a steady supply of spirited songs written for the classic Fleischer cartoons of the 1930's and 1940's!

Although Sammy conducted a live, swinging band to accompany these timeless cartoons, much of the jazzy scores were lost behind the screen action, dialogue and sound effects.
Boop-Oop-A-Doop compiles and recreates that music, with the help of some of today's most talented musicians and singers, so it can be heard on its own, for the first time and for its own sake!

Songs performed by Shannon Cullem (the great-grand-daughter of Sammy Timberg), Richard Halpern and Mora's Modern Rhythmists.

Featuring 2 archival recordings, one of which has Sammy Timberg singing and playing piano!

18 Tracks total:
1. Don't Take My Boop-Oop-A-Doop Away
2. It's A Hap-Hap-Happy Day
3. Got A Language Of My Own
4. Sweet Betty
5. I Wanna Be A Life Guard
6. Be Human
7. Brotherly Love
8. Keep A Little Song Handy
9. Hamburger Mine
10. I Want A Clean Shaven Man
11. Anytime At All
12. You Gotta Have Pep
13. Dizzy Debs
14. An Elephant Nevers Forgets
15. Little Lambkin
16. The Boopin' Stride
Archival Tracks:
17. The Superman March
18. I'm Glad We're Through (sung by Sammy Timberg!)

Who are the musicians in the band that recreated the music?

There is a page for Samuel Timberg in http://www.timbergalley.com/old/bios/sammy/index.php

Albert

Posted on Jul 3, 2008, 2:58 PM

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I found this...

by David Logue

...on the "allmusic" website:

http://wc04.allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&sql=10:fjfuxqyaldse

"Boop-Oop-A-Doin', subtitled The Songs of Sammy Timberg From Betty Boop, Popeye, Superman, and Other Musical Classics is a long overdue record that does for the fondly remembered 1930s songwriter Sammy Timberg what the Beau Hunks' re-recordings of the Little Rascals/Laurel & Hardy music did for composer Leroy Shield, except there's singing here (and good singing, at that). Mora's Modern Rhythmists are the players, using Timberg's original arrangements, and Shannon Cullem and Richard Halpern providing the voices once furnished by Helen Kane, Mae Questel, and Jack Mercer. There's even a track with Timberg singing and playing his own "I'm Glad We're Through." This is a bright, breezy, funny, and highly illuminating CD. Even if one knows the songs, chances are that one doesn't really know the arrangements, which were often obscured by dialogue and sound effects — this is the best opportunity to hear the music fully exposed, and it holds up on its own, evoking the best elements of Dixieland, swing, ragtime, and the popular music of the 1920s and 1930s. The only track that doesn't really fit is the original "Superman March," from the 1940s cartoon opening, but that's here simply to present Timberg's range as a composer."

Posted on Jul 3, 2008, 3:26 PM

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Trumbauer's "Humpty Dumpty" "A Tone Poem In Jazz"?

by Brad Kay

Has anyone ever seen a Parlophone 78 of the Trumbauer "Humpty Dumpty"
whose label includes the subtitle, "A Tone-Poem in Jazz"? Could it have
appeared both with and without? I need to clear up this point in the
Fud Livingston notes.

-Brad Kay

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 6:55 PM

Posted on Jul 2, 2008, 12:11 PM

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Krazy Kat

From Norman's site http://www.normanfield.com/bixlabellings.htm>

The description of Humpty Dumpty is as follows

14 81488-A HUMPTY DUMPTY
R3464 (1927) Small purple.
FRANKIE TRUMBAUER’S ORCH. with Bix, Lang, Rollini and Venuti.

The tone poem is Krazy Kat

15 81489-B KRAZY KAT (Tone Poem in Slow Rhythm)
R105 (1928) Small purple. Also known on plum.
FRANKIE TRUMBAUER’S ORCH. with Bix, Lang, Rollini, Schutt and Joe Venuti

And here is an ad for Krazy Kat mentioning "tone poem in slow rhtyhm" and for "Three Blind Mice" "Rhythmic theme in advanced harmony."

And here is the Parlophone label for "Krazy Kat."

Norman describes "Three Blind Mice" as follows

81273-C THREE BLIND MICE (Rhythmic Theme in advanced Harmony)
R105 (1928) Small purple. Also known on plum. FRANKIE TRUMBAUER’S ORCH. with Bix, Lang, Rollini, Schutt and Joe Venuti.

This is an exact description of the writing on the label.

Albert

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 2, 2008 4:44 PM

Posted on Jul 2, 2008, 3:35 PM

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Not Arthur Schutt.

"Krazy Kat" and "Three Blind Mice" were recorded on Sep 28 and Aug 25, 1927, respectively.

The Goldkette band was still constituted on Aug 25, 1927. The musicians in the Trumbauer band were all from the Goldkette Victor recording orchestra: no Rollini, no Venuti and the pianist was Irving Riskin. Eddie Lang was added in most Trumbauer recordings.

On Sep 29, the Goldkette band had dissolved. The musicians were from the New Yorkers orchestra, Rollini, Venuti and Lang were some of the New Yorkers and the pianist was Frank Signorelli.

Brad, the answer to your question is that "Humpty Dumpty" was not a "Tone Poem." There was only one label as described in my previous posting. The "Tone Poem" was "Krazy Kat" and the label said so.

Albert

Posted on Jul 2, 2008, 7:35 PM

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An Image ot the "Three Blind Mice" Parlophone. No Schutt, no Venuti

Rhythmic Theme in Advance Harmony

This was recorded on Aug 25, 1927. The Goldkette band had not dissolved yet, so the musicians are from the Goldkettte band, Irving Riskin on piano, not Arthur "The Baron" Schutt. No Venuti. But Adrain Rollini? Yes, he was in the recording. It turns out that on Aug 23, 1927, Rollini called Sylvester "Hooley" Ahola and the next day they met and Rollini offered Hooley a job for the New Yorker Club. Evidently, Rollini must have been talking to Bix and Tram also, and it is reasonable that Rollini was invited to record with them.

Albert

Posted on Jul 3, 2008, 8:27 AM

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Elizalde, the Rollini brothers, and Pola Negri.

Brian Rust in "The Dance Bands,"Arlington House Publishers," 1972.

"The Rollini brothers returned to America at the end of 1929 after helping to make a film with Pola Negri, the Elizalde band supplying the music."

I looked up Pola Negri in the imdb and here is what I found.

The Way of Lost Souls (1929)
Released: Estonia 18 February 1930, Finland 16 March 1930

Also Known As (AKA)
Kadunud hingede tänav Estonia
Rue des âmes perdues Belgium (French title)
Son dernier tango France
Straße der verlorenen Seelen, Die Germany
The Woman He Scorned (undefined)
Ulica potepionych dusz Poland

Runtime: 94 min
Country: UK
Color: Black and White
Aspect Ratio: 1.33 : 1
Sound Mix: Mono (musical score and sound effects)
Filming Locations: Mevagissey, Cornwall, England, UK
Company: Charles Whittaker Productions
Original Music by Fred Elizalde
Music Department: Fred Elizalde, conductor

The site http://www.jabw.demon.co.uk/bdb21.htm provides the following
The Woman He Scorned 1929 Fred Elizalde's Band
Warwick Ward
Margaret Rawlings
Terry Brown reports:
It was an independently made British production known in America as The Way Of Lost Souls. It was produced by Charles Whittaker productions, an only film and now apparently lost. It would be fascinating to hear what Fred Elizalde's soundtrack was like. Pola Negri plays a loose woman and there are several nightclub scenes. Perhaps Elizalde also appears.

The Pola Negri website, http://www.polanegri.com/ provides the following
" The film’s synchronized soundtrack is one of the most unusual and certainly one of the most “modern” sounding of any surviving original silent film soundtrack. The soundtrack was written by Fred Elizalde, who led one of the most successful British jazz dance bands of the 1920’s and who went on to become a successful modern classical composer in the 1930’s. (Thanks to John A. B. Wright and colleagues in the UK for this information.) This soundtrack catches Elizalde in the transition between the two genres, and the music, whether popular or classical in nature, electrifies the already emotional film. There is an unusual amount of atonality in the soundtrack, which makes it sound especially “modern” and ahead of its time. There are no spoken lines (it’s not a “part-talkie” as was once believed), however the film makes frequent use of sound effects. In some instances, such as in the lengthy bar sequence where Pola meets her husband-to-be (which, by the way, is the sexiest sequence the author has seen in any Pola Negri movie), there was not a strong attempt to synchronize the sounds perfectly with the visuals, which gives the film a slightly abstract and, once again, “modern” feel.

The film is available from Grapevine video. I will order it and report when I get it.

Another photo of Pola Negri from the Big Band Database

Albert

Posted on Jul 2, 2008, 7:14 AM

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A Great Photo Of Paul Whiteman and His Orchestra

More generous contributions form Enrico, a photo of the Whiteman Orchestra. (no Bix).

The overall photo.

A close-up.

Another close-up.

Enrico writes,

"Looking at it closely, zooming in, in the second close-up I spotted:
back row- unidentified sousaphone player, Rank
middle: unidentified, unidentified, Hall, Tram, Fulton?
front row: unidentified, Dieterle, Venuti
below the right foot of Dieterle there's Eddie Lang
In the first close-up
unidentified bassoon player, PW, unidentified sax player, Friedman, I don't know the violinists, Goldfield, unidentified sax player
on top, unidentified trumpeter (with trumpet on lap) next to the sousaphone player (Trafficante?)
below this trumpeter there's another one but he doesn't look like Secrest
unidentified sax player
the guy talking to the sousaphone player (his back to the camera) could be Margulis
Note that Hazlett and other regulars are missing.

Could this be from "The King of Jazz"? Can anyone identify other musicians?

Albert

Posted on Jul 1, 2008, 1:16 PM

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As I was googling ....

.... trying to see if Enrico's photo of the Whiteman band had been published, I found this site

http://www.jamd.com/search?text=%22paul%20whiteman%22

with photos of Whiteman in the Whiteman Lodge. They are supposed to be from 1930. But the lodge was built in 1929 and I wonder if some photos of people in the lodge in the failed attempt to film "The King of Jazz" in 1929 (maybe with Bix?) were taken.

John, maybe you can help?

Albert

Posted on Jul 1, 2008, 2:45 PM

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Wonderful!

by Frank van Nus

Caught in rehearsal, obviously. It's the Melting Pot Of Music finale from King Of Jazz. This particular band setting was used in the final cut only for the final 45 seconds, following 10 minutes of musical nonsense involving hundreds of extras and no band, just soundtrack. The band sounds as if it was recorded live in this particular scene, whereas the music for most of the movie was pre-recorded.

Have a peek; copy & paste www.redhotjazz.com/movies/kj/kjending.mov (slow!)

Here's what I think:

First close-up:
back row: Rinker, Trafficante;
middle row: Crosby, PW (supposedly standing in front of Marsh), Barris, Friedman, Goldfield, unknown subbing for Daly, Secrest, Maier, Margulis;
front row: Bacon?, Bouman, Malneck;
head showing: Hayton.

Second close-up:
back row: Leibrook, Rank;
middle row: unknown subbing for Cullen, Strickfaden, Hall, Tram, Fulton;
front row: Landau?, Dieterle, Venuti;
head showing: Lang.

The Rhythm Boys were obviously drafted to fill the stage. Cullen, Daly and Russell had had a bad car accident and were absent for some of the filming. Hazlett fell ill, and Friedman subbed for him. I suspect Pingitore and Bargy are on ground level, hidden by the dancers.

Frank

Posted on Jul 1, 2008, 2:55 PM

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Excellent identification.

Frank, you have a sharp eye. Once you identify the guys, it is easy to recognize them.

Like a Bix solo, once your hear it, you realize that it was inevitable.

Albert

Posted on Jul 1, 2008, 3:59 PM

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Test

This is simply a test of the alternative registration procedure. Hope it works.

Posted on Jun 30, 2008, 7:09 PM

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It works, it works!

Great!

Albert

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jun 30, 2008 7:40 PM

Posted on Jun 30, 2008, 7:40 PM

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Tesch in Sam Lanin’s “Too Busy”?

Frank Teschmacher was a huge Bix admirer. According to Marty Grosz [booklet with Time-Life Giants of Jazz set on Tesch], “If Bix wore one blue sock and one yellow sock for three weeks, ‘Stacy recalled,’ Tesch would do the same.”

Frank Teschmacher was with Sam Lanin’s band in the summer of 1928. Here is a photo [posted previously in http://www.network54.com/Forum/27140/message/1183317949/Who+is+the+Bix+look-alike-]

Tesch is the third guy on the left. [The first guy, a Bix look-alike, is Tommy Dorsey.]

On June 25, 1928, Sam Lanin’s Famous Players and Singers recorded “Too Busy” for OKeh 41079. According to Rust, the musicians in the recording are,

Sam Lanin dir: probably Phil Napoleon, Harold Peppie, t/Tommy Dorsey, t, tb/?Frank Teschmacher and another cl, as/cl, ts/_Warner, p/Smith Ballew, g or bj, v/Jimmy Mullen, bb/d/The Three Star Singers, v.

Listen

http://bixography.com/TooBusyLanin.ram

Could that be Tesch on two breaks around 1 min?

I like the tune very much. Obviously Brad likes it too. Watch him playing and singing it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PC1jQqZBBog

By the way, Brad, if you want to lower your voice, you need to fill your lungs with one of the heavier inert/rare gases (Krypton or Xenon).

Albert

Posted on Jun 29, 2008, 9:10 AM

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Grosz on Tesch and more on Tesch

From the liners of the Time Life Giants of Jazz set on Tesch.

"Personally he was something of an enigma, as quiet people such as he was often are.

When Teschmacher died on March 1, 1932, he was 10 days short of his 26th birthday and had been playing jazz for only about a decade.

{Artie Shaw quoted in Grosz's essay.} There was an assurance about everything he did that made you see that he himself knew where he was going all the time.

To most of his contemporaries he seemed shy, introverted, so submerged in music that he gave little thought to anything else.

He enjoyed drinking with friends, but he held his liquor well.

Though he left home at an early age, Teschmacher apparently remained close to his mother."

Does Tesch's personality (as described by Grosz) remind you of anyone?

This is what Tesch looked like, from the red hot jazz site

Tesch was strongly influenced by Bix, but they never recorded together. Tesch has many connections with Bix: he recorded with McPartland, Freeman, Sullivan, Krupa, the Dorseys, Nichols, Mole, Natoli, Signorelli, Kress, Teagarden, King, Brunis, Schutt.

Sudhalter (Lost Chords) tells us that in the Chicago Rhythm Kings "I've Found A New Baby" (April 6, 1928, Spanier, Tesch, Mezzrow, Sullivan, Condon, Lannigan and Krupa), "Bix's concepts of correlated, (i.e., paired, structurally balanced phrases, question and answer, point and counterpoint and summing up governs every note of Tesch's chorus. See for example, the beginning of the second eight bars, built on sequential use of a four note motif." Listen

http://www.jazz-on-line.com/a/ramc/BRUC1886.ram

Albert

Posted on Jun 29, 2008, 12:10 PM

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Re: Tesch in Sam Lanin’s “Too Busy”?

Two more of my favorite Tesch with Lanin records are the Columbias of 29 June 1928 NAGASAKI/DOWN WHERE THE SUN GOES DOWN Col 1463-D and 04 October 1928 I CAN'T MAKE HER HAPPY/HEART BROKEN AND LONELY Col 1586-D both as Ipana Trobadours. I CAN'T MAKE HER HAPPY also has a Bixian type cornet.

When at Stan's today, did forget to pull the Okeh of TOO BUSY. I was planning on scanning the label.

Steve Hester

Posted on Jun 29, 2008, 7:40 PM

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Tesch with Lanin...Columbias

I just realized that I made the post on these Tesch/Lanin records on the 80th anniversay of the recording of DOWN WHERE THE SUN GOES DOWN and NAGASKI.

Steve

Posted on Jun 30, 2008, 6:49 PM

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Teschmacher or Teschemacher?

I have been spelling Frank's last name as Teschmacher. In his American Dance Band Discography (1975 edition) and Jazz Records (1978 edition) Rust spells Frank's last name as Teschmacher. In his 2002 edition he spells it Teschemacher.

I had not noticed the variation in spelling until Steve H sent (thanks, Steve) this scan asking if the Teschemacher on the label was a relative of Frank.

The Teschemacher given credit in the label was British lyricist Edward Teschemacher, 1875-1940. Edward Teschemacher was a pseudonym for Edward Frederick Lockton. No relation to Frank.

I had looked up Frank Teschmacher in the US Cenuss. No hit. Now, in view of the spelling in the Caruso label, I looked up Teschemacher. Bingo! Frank appears in the 1910 and 1920 US censuses as Frank Teschemacher living with his father Charles (in Kansas City in 1910, in Chicago in 1920), mother Charlotte, brother Charles and sister Mildred.

Another connection of Tesch with Bix: they both played with Charley Straight. And another. Jess Stacy told Richard Sudhalter, "Tesch idolized Bix, worshipped the gound he walked on. He even tried to walk like Bix Beiderbecke, copy his movements, his little mannerisms. Complete hero worship. I saw them jam together at the Three Deuces. Bix would take a chorus and Tesch would just sit there in a trance, looking as if he were about to faint."

In the booklet with the Time-Life set on Tesch, Marty Grosz writes, "In the same way that he had listened enraptured to Leon Roppolo with the Rhythm Kings and later to Jimmie Noone, Tesch absorbed the straightforward approach of Dodds."

Was Tesch's style similar to any of the clarinetists that preceded him? I don't think so. He seems to me to be like Bix, a unique style that came from within himself. Sue, do you detect any similarities between Roppolo and Tesch? I once made the distinction between inspiration and influence. I am pretty certain that Tesch was inspired by Roppolo, Noone and Dodds. But, Tesch developed his own identity from a driving force that came from within himself. As Eddie Condon puts it, "Of all the people generally associated with me in early Chicago, he [Tesch] was the most musically talented, whith the exception of Bix, whom he idolized."

However, a caveat. Sudhalter points out that other clarinetists, Volly De Faut, Fud Livingston, Bud Jacobson, Maurie Bercov, Pee Wee Russell sound sometimes like Tesch. Was this a Chicago phenomenon or an influence of Tesch on the others? Specifically about Fud (for Brad), Sudhalter writes, "Similar tones and mannerisms turn up in the clarinet of Joseph "Fud" Livingston, who had played in Chicago with Ben Pollack. Livingston's solo on the Red Nichols recording of "Nobody's Sweetheart," made in New York at the end of February 1928, demonstrate palpably "Chicagoan" qualities. Where, and from whom, did he adopt them?" Sudhalter suggests that there was a "Chicago style" and that Tesch was one of the children of that style. From "Lost Chords," "Most assessments of Teschmacher have worked from the inference that he stood alone, unique and inexplicable, and that anyone who sounded like him did so through imitation. Yet there is evidence to suggest that elements of his clarinet and saxophone styles were to some degree Chicago conventions, firmly in place by the time he got into a recording studio."

Marty Grosz belongs to the group that believes Tesch was unique. In the Time-Life booklet, he writes, "He played what looked like a clarinet but sounded like something he had invented: What issued form it were spiky, scratchy, piercing, surrealistic notes that on ordinary clarinets did not seem to exist. His style was as distinctive as his sound, a headlong, hell-for-leather outpouring, full of fluffs, undeniably brilliasnt. He was one of the most exciting soloists jazz has ever produced. There is no way to explain, on the evidence, how a 21-year odl ex-violinist who had been listening ardently to New Orleans clarinetists' fluid sound could, on his first recording date, play in a style so raw and edgy and pyrotechnic that nobody then playing could match it." Finally, a quote for Brad, "Fud Livingston's staccato manner owes a strong debt to Teschemacher."

Opinions? A unique, self-generated style or a trend in the air among Chicago clarinetists?

Albert

Posted on Jun 30, 2008, 7:00 AM

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Violinesque - and off-key?

by Fredrik Tersmeden

I recall reading that someone among Teschemacher's fellow musicians (it might have been Milt Mezzrow in "Really The Blues") saying that his clarinet playing very much betrayed that he had begun by playing the violin, i.e. that there was something of a "violinesque" approach to his reed playing.

By the way, my collector friend Johan (with whom I otherwise share most of my musical views and tastes) has never been able to stand Teschemacher - he claims that "Tesch" is constantly playing off-key. What do the poeople with better pitch than me think about this statement?

Fredrik

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 6:59 PM

Posted on Jun 30, 2008, 7:39 AM

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Ah, yes! -- Tesch is playing ...

by TheHelpfulChazzer

... quite off-key. -- Just listen to these three examples, which by the way represent Gene Krupa's very first studio sessions and the first time at all where the sound of a bass drum had been waxed.

Tesch's clarinet is always a bit flat, especially when he's hitting high notes. The vibrato is not as controlled as for example young Benny Goodman's from around that time. -- This vibrato is also responsible for the off-pitch sound:

McKenzie & Condon's Chicagoans

Jimmy McPartland (cnt), Frank Teschemacher (cl), Bud Freeman (ts), Joe Sullivan (p), Eddie Condon (banjo), Jim Lannigan (b/tu), Gene Krupa (d) - Chicago December 9 & 16, 1927

Sugar

China Boy

Nobody's Sweetheart

Major Koslova: "The good guys don't hide." (Sometimes it's nevertheless necessary.)

Posted on Jun 30, 2008, 8:07 AM

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Marty Grossz and Richard Sudhalter Speak.

From the Time-Life booklet.

"Many criticized his technique.Occasionally he almost overblew his reed, and he has been faulted for inaccurate intonation and for losing control of his vibrato.
Teschemacher was sometimes accused of playing 'wrong' notes, which seemed foreign to the usual simple barbershop harmonies that underpinned most jazz performances of the day. And since his improvidations did not amble down the famniliar paths taken by most of his contemporaries, his critics often pronounced his work inept or awkward. But if his notes were not always those indicated by conventional harmonic practice, they were usually the notes he wnted, not mistakes. And if he tampered with intonation, he did so in the best tradition of the jazz and blues performers who came before him.
He did make mistakes, of course, like all gifted and daring improvisers. 'If you don't make a mistake,' clarinetist Artie Shaw once said, 'you're not trying very hard.
Pianist Richard Voynow ... once commented: 'Tesch was also a genius but had a calculated manner of playing. He was an intellectual compared to others. He knew the value of each note he hit, and he knew why he played them.
'Teschmacher's clarinet, wrote Hoagy Carmichael, was highly rhapsodic, played out of tune in dissonance and quarter notes. Tesch played free-for-all, trying to develop it into a modern music."

From Lost Chords,

"Coming out of the bridge in his solo [China Boy], Tesch bats out six concert G's that are flat enough to be quarter tones, falling right between G and Gb. They've given rise to a small piece of jazz mythology, the suggestion that Teschemacher had a chronic problem staying in tune. Generations of writers who would have trouble finidng middle C in a keyboard have discoursed with great authority about alleged deficiencies in Teshcemacher's technique and intonation.
The statute of limitations on such armchair analysis has run out. Though he takes some liberties with pitch and tone quality, Teschemacher is no more 'out of tune,' in any general sense, than such diverse and distinguished stylists as Johnny Dodds, Henry 'Red' Allen, cornetist Rex Stewart, or his own cognate spirit on clarinet, Pee Wee Russell. Why, then, single him out for criticism, particularly on the evidence of little more than a few passages."

I have no problem with how Tesch plays. I like his sound and style very very much.

Albert

Posted on Jun 30, 2008, 8:36 AM

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A more general statement on 'wrong' notes ...

by TheHelpfulChazzer

... by one of my great modern trumpet colleagues, Booker Little (from the liners to Prestige/New Jazz 8260 - Eric Dolphy At The Five Spot):

"I can't think in terms of wrong notes-in fact I don't hear any notes as being wrong. It's a matter of knowing how to integrate the notes and, if you must, how to resolve them. Because if you insist that this note or that note is wrong I think you're thinking completely conventionally-technically and forgetting about emotion. And I don't think anyone would deny that more emotion can be reached and expressed outside of the conventional way of playing which consists of whole steps and half steps. There's mre emotion that can be expressed by the notes that are played flat."

And besides all emotions and expressions, maybe that Tesch only played on a cheap horn? -- Clarinets can be tricky sometimes

Major Koslova: "The good guys don't hide." (Sometimes it's nevertheless necessary.)

Posted on Jun 30, 2008, 9:32 AM

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Tesch's Grave

Thanks to Steve's unlimited generosity, here is a photo of Tesch's head stone.

The photo is from Bert Wyatt's Muggsy Spanier THE LONESOME ROAD, Jazzology Press.

Albert

Posted on Jun 30, 2008, 11:14 AM

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Fud in Lanin's "Too Busy"

Vince writes,

"re: Too Busy...

I think the 2 hot sax solos around 1 minute are Fud Livingston...and I think
this might be his arrangement too!"

I read in the liners of the CD "Sam Lanin and His Many Bands, 1923-1931," VMP 0131, for the musicians present in the recording of "Too Busy,"

"According to Brian Rust, Frank Teschemacher and Fud Livingston were with Lanin's orchestra during this time, but it is uncertain if either recorded with the band."

Albert

Posted on Jul 2, 2008, 5:22 AM

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Fud on Too Busy - yes!

by John Leifert

Hello Vince!

I certainly agree with you that Fud is most likely responsible for the excellent arrangement of "Too Busy". That is the same arrangement the Nighthawks play!

I hear Fud playing tenor sax also on the following Columbia by the Ipana Troubadours: "Do You? That's All I Want to Know" (with Scrappy Lambert vocal):

Columbia 1638D IPANA TROUBADORS (S.LANIN)
DO YOU? THAT'S ALL I WANT TO KNOW (vSL)
mx W147143=2
NY 10/25/28

Of course the long clarinet solo on this is by Benny Goodman (long established), and the trombone sounds to me like Tommy Dorsey. But the tenor sax has never been established in print - I believe it's Fud, played in comparison to similar Fud solos from that time period. It is possibly his arrangement, too. This side is on the new Rivermont CD BSW-1143 "Sam Lanin: Turn On the Heat - Hot Dance Band Sides 1925-1931" - highly recommended BTW for the superb sound quality throughout... John L

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 6:58 PM

Posted on Jul 2, 2008, 9:21 AM

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Fud Livingston Arrangements

by Brad Kay

Good work boys. Fud Livingston's arranging is unique and magical, WAY ahead of the competition in '27 and '28. I bet there are LOTS of his charts on records, as yet unidentified. How about keeping your ears peeled for these, Vince & John??

-Brad K

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 6:58 PM

Posted on Jul 2, 2008, 12:17 PM

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Did Fud play the pump organ?

I saw Fud listed as reed player and pump organ player in Benny Goodman's discography. Any recording where Fud plays the pump organ?

Look at this beauty in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pump_organ

Albert

Posted on Jul 3, 2008, 5:07 PM

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More Images Associated with Tesch.

Thanks to Rob's generosity, a few interesting images.

From a concert in memory of several jazz giants, most Bix and three connected with Bix..

Notice the spelling "Teschmacher" I wonder who were the jazz musicans playing in the concert?

The Onyx Club (previously Helbocks) was located on W. 52nd St., "Swing Street, USA," the capital of the swing world according to Abel Green of Variety. (the same guy who commented on the Wolverines in 1924). John Kirby's Onyx Club Sextet (John Kirby on bass, Charlie Shavers on trumpet, Buster Bailey on clarinet, Russell Procope on alto saxophone, Billy Kyle on piano and O'Neill Spencer on drums; when vocals were needed, Maxine Sullivan, Kirby's wife, sang)

From www.lastchancejazz.com/BaltimoreJF.htm

played at the club for several years in the late 1930s. John Kirby was a bassist and tubist with Fletcher Henderson and played in the 1931 Henderson recordings honoring Bix, "Clarinet Marmalade" and "Singin' the Blues." The Onyx Club Sextet play ed jazz influenced by classical music. According to http://www.mail-archive.com/pen-l@galaxy.csuchico.edu/msg37360.html "After the first set I chatted with Wayne Roberts, the bass player who leads the Onyx Club Sextet and raised the possibility with him that Kirby's main influence was Bix Beiderbecke, the white cornetist who fronted Paul Whiteman's orchestra in the 1920s, making a facile connection between white classical composers, white jazz musicians and their possible influence on blacks. Roberts clued me in. He said that the main influence on Kirby was Fletcher Henderson, the African-American bandleader who employed him prior to starting his sextet."

From the Chicago Federation of Musicians.

Again "Teschmacher."

Posted on Jul 2, 2008, 9:37 AM

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The record label of Lanin's "Too Busy"

Steve kindly sends scans o the two sides of OKeh 40179

Note that "Too Busy" was issued as Benny Meroff and His Orchestra. The same record was issued on Parlophone R-217 as Roof Garden Orchestra.

Steve points out, "TD heard on tpt before Fud's sax passages. TD does take the trombone solo. Tarto heard throughout. Note the unison tpts like Fud arranged and was used by Red for his Five Pennies records."

More versions of "Too Busy."

Charley Straight http://redhotjazz.com/Songs/straight/toobusy1.ram (my favorite)

Lillie Delk Christian with Louis Armstrong's Jazz Four http://redhotjazz.com/Songs/straight/toobusy1.ram (a great obbligato on vocal by Louis; we discusssed this in the past)

The Clicquot Club Eskimos http://redhotjazz.com/Songs/reser/eskimos/toobusycce.ram intro is a quote of Berceuse de Jocelyn (I believe). And again a long quote after the vocal. Who does the vocal obbligato behind Tom Stacks? Except for the voice of Tom Stacks, I love this one too.

Coon-Sanders Nighthawks http://redhotjazz.com/songs/coon/toobusy.ram Sophisticated arrangement

Harry Reser http://redhotjazz.com/Songs/reser/toobusy.ram Tom Stacks again Same or identical arrangement as Eskimos

All above are from 1928. For a 1939 version try

Orrin Tucker and His Orchestra http://www.jazz-on-line.com/a/rama/COLLA1997.ram

Albert

PS The Spanish translation is "Muy Ocupada." Note the a,; this means a female is busy. Had it been a male, it would have been "Muy Ocupado." The lyrics, in fact, apply to both sexes.

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 3, 2008 3:40 PM
This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 3, 2008 2:25 PM

Posted on Jul 3, 2008, 2:20 PM

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Blues Festival (Davenport, IA) will move to 2nd Street

From the QCTimes.

By Kurt Allemeier | Wednesday, June 25, 2008 |

The IH Mississippi Valley Blues Festival, which will be held July 3 to 5, is moving into the streets of Davenport.

The Mississippi Valley Blues Society, organizers of the 24th annual festival, made the decision Wednesday evening to move the festival after floodwaters in its usual location of LeClaire Park made this year’s festival impossible to hold.

An official announcement on the blues festival’s temporary location is expected today, including an announcement that ticket prices will be lowered from $18 to $15.

The festival will be on 2nd Street in Davenport, between Iowa and Brady streets. The festival was also moved into a downtown location near the park in 2001 when floodwaters forced the festival into a temporary home.

The Adler Theatre will serve as the tent stage for the festival, IH Mississippi Valley Blues Festival spokeswoman Karen McFarland said. Festival-goers will have access from 3rd Street and River Drive. Traffic on those two thoroughfares won’t be affected.

“We are part of the Davenport family,” said Ric Burris, Mississippi Valley Blues Society president. “We are a can-do organization, so we are moving forward in Davenport.

“It is going to be a great street fest.”

Planners start today tackling access and logistics issues, but Burris said the Fargo Street Fest, held on 2nd Street at the same time as the Bix Beiderbecke Memorial Jazz Festival, will be a helpful guide to setting up the festival.

Though the Mississippi River and LeClaire Park won’t be part of the festival, the quality of the music will not change. “The quality of the music will still be excellent,” McFarland said. “Everything will be the same, except we will be two blocks up from the park.”

The blues society also considered the Mississippi Valley Fairgrounds, Davenport Municipal Airport and a location on the Ben Butterworth Parkway in Moline.

“In the end, we stayed by our home,” Burris said of downtown Davenport. “Next year is our 25th anniversary and we want to keep our string going.

We still have about four weeks before the Bix Festival. Let's see how things develop.

Albert

Posted on Jun 27, 2008, 7:34 AM

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Test

by Albert Haim

This is a test.

Albert Haim
Forum Owner

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jun 27, 2008 6:57 AM

Posted on Jun 27, 2008, 6:56 AM

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The System works beautifully.

I posted a message and it did not show up until I approved it. Also, I deleted my address, that is why the message was edited.

I think this will work, at least for a while.

Albert Haim
Forum Owner

Posted on Jun 27, 2008, 7:00 AM

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Congratulations!

by TheHelpfulChazzer

Well, Albert,

there will be a lot of extra work for you ahead, but I guess you are practiced enough for separating the wheat from the chaff.

Thanks a lot and regards,

TheHelpfulChazzer

Please give my alternate e-mail I had posted above only to Malcolm who seems to be a genuine fellow.

Posted on Jun 27, 2008, 8:21 AM

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OK I am waiting

by Malcolm Walton

Just to follow up The Helpful Chazzer's previous message. I have scanned Blue River and I will send it to The Helpful Chazzer as soon as I have his email address. This will save a lot of time in getting the definitive Blue River transcription fininshed and double checked.

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 6:56 PM

Posted on Jun 28, 2008, 2:12 AM

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Malcolm, I just sent you .....

.... the information you nedd.

Albert

Posted on Jun 28, 2008, 4:54 AM

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Although the system works well, ....

.... there are two problems.

1. There may be a long delay between the time the forumite sends his/her post and the time I approve it. [What happens when I go on vacation, for example?]

2. The burden in terms of time and effort on me is enormous.

So, I am going to test a hybrid system. Fortunately, the forum software is quite powerful, and there are many features I can implement.

Current system.. For those of you who do not wish to register, I will keep the current mode of monitoring posts before they are published.

Registered Users. The majority of forumites who post here are well known to me, and therefore there is no need to monitor their postings. Therefore, I am creating a list of people allowed to post without the need for prior approval.

Those of you who wish to register, please go to

http://www.network54.com/Group/163564

and click on "Apply to the group." Instructions will appear on the page that will open. I already applied myself, although as forum owner, I need not apply. But I want to make sure the system works.

This may not be the final procedure to be implemented permanently. It is an experiment. Let's see how things develop.

Apologies for making things a bit difficult to all the good people here. Unfortunately, the alternative of allowing everyone to post without registration or prior approval of the posting has not worked recently.

Albert Haim
Forum Owner

Posted on Jun 27, 2008, 1:04 PM

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Registering

by Ken Jobling

Albert

Tried to register but, following the link, I'm not clear what to do. Unless I'm already registered.

Ken

Posted on Jun 27, 2008, 3:43 PM

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No one has registered yet.

Ken, you are not registered. Let me do some tests this evening and I'll get back with specific instructions, I hope, tomorrow.

Albert

Posted on Jun 27, 2008, 4:14 PM

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In order to register for the Bixography forum it is necessary

to have a Network54 account. So, the procedure is a two-step procedure.

A. First step. You create a network54 account [free of charge]. The following is the procedure to create the account.
1. Go to http://www.network54.com/
2. Click on "login"
3. You have three choices. "login" "lost password" "register" Click on register and fill out the information in the page that opens. You must choose a login name (no spaces)
4. Once you complete the page and click "create account" a new page will open. At this point, there will be a message in the mailbox for the email address you provided. The message comes form “Network 54 Support” and the subject is “Network Account Verification.” Open the message and click on the link provided. If you get a message that says “Verification Failure” ignore and click on “done.“ Now in the page that opened when you clicked “Create Account” fill in your login name and your password. A new page will open “signup for your account.” Ignore.

First step completed. At this point you have created a network54 account (no charge) and you are logged in.

B. Second step. You register for the Bixography Forum.
1. Click on (or copy and paste) http://www.network54.com/Group/163564 A page will open with the link “Apply to this group.”
2. Click on the link “Apply to this group.” A page opens titled “Registered Users, Group application. Make sure the email address is the one you used to login to netwok54. Fill in briefly the box “Information about yourself” and click on “Apply to group.”
3. A new page will open titled “Application sent.”
4. Now check your mail. You will find a message from “N54 Group Membership Application Verification” subject “Network54 Group Validation Key.” Open the message and click on the link provided. A new page will open that reads “Your email address has been validated. You will be added to the Group once the Group Owner has reviewed and accepted your membership request. Thank you.”

You are done. I will receive a notification that you have applied to be added to the group of registered users and I’ll take it from here.

When approved, you will be able to post in the Bixography Forum without prior approval of your posting. Remember to login in network54 before opening the Bixography forum page.

This sounds more complicated than it really is. As you go through the steps, things move pretty rapidly. The procedure is used to ensure that invalid email addresses are not used.

If this is too much of a burden for you, just post as you have in the past. There mey be a delay as I have to approve the messe efore it is uploaded.

Thank you.

Let me know (write directly to ahaim@bixography.com) if you run into difficulties.

Albert

Posted on Jun 28, 2008, 5:40 AM

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Update

Registrations are coming in. I modified the Introduction to the Forum page by including information about posting by registered members and by not registered members, as well as detailed instructions (I hope an improved version) as to how to register.

Let me know by mail to ahaim@bixography.com if you have difficulties.

Albert

Posted on Jun 28, 2008, 12:53 PM

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Don't be discouraged by the verbiage in the instructions to ....

.... register! Rob tells me that the instructions are longer than the process of registering itself.

Albert

Posted on Jun 28, 2008, 2:57 PM

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Verbiage Suggestion

by Brad Kay

The top third of all pages of the Forum is now a thicket of verbiage about registration. One must scroll down quite a way before the posts begin.In the interest of non-clutter, Feng Shui, or what-you-will, I suggest making a link to that info. Just a button that says, "Click to Register." Simplifies things. -BK

Posted on Jun 29, 2008, 8:48 PM

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Excellent Suggestion.

Implemented.

Albert

Forum Owner

Posted on Jun 30, 2008, 6:32 PM

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Alternate takes?

by Warren Kilbourne

I registered a couple of days ago; didn't it "take?"

Posted on Jun 29, 2008, 12:34 PM

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Warren, I am afraid I do not have any ....

.... record of your registration. Please try again. Take 2.

Albert

Posted on Jun 29, 2008, 12:51 PM

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Well, I guess I'm in

by Warren Kilbourne

An interesting thing I discovered while looking for Bix Chat Room on Yahoo. "guerradetubesBIX" All in Spanish--"War of......?"

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 6:57 PM

Posted on Jun 29, 2008, 5:28 PM

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GuerradetubesBix

The site specifies PSP. I found two PSPs

1. http://www.psp-tubes.com/
This has to do with making tubes for Paint Shop Pro.

2. http://www.gamespot.com/pages/unions/read_article.php?topic_id=22604023&union_id=891
This has to do Play Station Portable and "The Incredible Adventures of Nick and Bix: Planet of The Fi Foms."

Albert

Posted on Jun 29, 2008, 5:56 PM

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Re: Although the system works well, ....

by Sergio Calvé

"Registered Users. The majority of forumites who post here are well known to me, and therefore there is no need to monitor their postings. Therefore, I am creating a list of people allowed to post without the need for prior approval."

That's my vote.

Posted on Jun 28, 2008, 7:11 PM

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Mine too ...

by TheHelpfulChazzer

... ... although I can fully understand Albert Haim's new strategy. I will sign with Chazz from now on, it's shorter.

Chazz

Major Koslova: "The good guys don't hide." (Sometimes it's nevertheless necessary.)

Posted on Jun 29, 2008, 6:04 AM

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A clarification.

"I am creating a list of people allowed to post without the need for prior approval." Yes, but the individuals in the list are registered users.

Instructions for registering are given at the beginning of each forum page.

Albert

Posted on Jun 29, 2008, 7:39 AM

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Help with registration. Amended!

If you have problems with registration for the Bixography Forum, I think I can help you.

Again a two-step process.

1. Send an email to ahaim@bixography.com with the following. Copy and paste the text between the ******************

*****************************'

login name: ________________________________________ (no spaces; could be your name, AlbertHaim or ahaim; or a moniker, bixologist)

password you choose for me to sign you up with network54 ____________________________________________

email address: _____________________________________________________

*************************************

2. Check your mail (the one you specified above). When you get a message from “Network 54 Support” with subject “Network Account Verification,” open the message and click on the link provided. A new page will open. Click "done"
3. You are done. I will take it from here and will notify you when your registration is complete.

Albert

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jun 30, 2008 4:32 PM
This message has been edited by ahaim on Jun 30, 2008 4:32 PM
This message has been edited by ahaim on Jun 30, 2008 4:07 PM

Posted on Jun 30, 2008, 2:24 PM

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Temporarily, the Forum ....

.... is set up for reading only.

Albert Haim
Forum Owner

PS If you want to post, please send your piece to me at ahaim@bixography.com and I will post it for you.

Posted on Jun 26, 2008, 2:53 PM

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Approval Required Before A Post Will Appear in the Forum

I have changed the Forum Mode to the format "Post Moderated." This means, I believe, that

1. all forumites will be able to read messages
2. all forumites will be able to post messages, but the messages must be approved by me before they are posted.

Please test the system and let me know what you observe.

Thank You.

Albert Haim
Forum Owner

Posted on Jun 27, 2008, 6:45 AM

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Addendum

A valid email address is required in your posting. To protect the privacy of forumites, I will remove all email addresses before posting the messages.

Let's hope this works.

Albert Haim
Forum Owner

Posted on Jun 27, 2008, 6:48 AM

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Addendum 2.

Unless you state explicitly as a PS to your message (for example, keep my email address) I will routinely remove email addresses from all messages.

Albert Haim
Forum Owner

PS Please, any bona fide forumite, post a message as a test. AH

Posted on Jun 27, 2008, 7:08 AM

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WBIX # 152

Radio Program # 152. (loaded on 06/26/04) Bix's Fellow Musicians: Min Leibrook. Recordings of Min Leibrook without Bix. 1 hour 3 minutes

Real Audio
Streaming audio file. http://www.bixography.com/wbix152.ram
Download file. 15.2 MB http://www.bixography.com/wbix152.rm

mp3 files
Streaming mp3 file http://bixography.com/wbixmp3/wbix152.m3u
Download file Copy and Paste bixography.com/wbixmp3/wbix152.mp3 60.7 MB

List of Tunes.

When My Sugar Walks Down the Street. Wolverine Orchestra. 1924.
Prince of Wails. Wolverine Orchestra. 1924.
Mother Me, Tennessee. Wingy Manone and His Sue Strutters. 1925.
Promises. Joe Venuti and His New Yorkers. 1930.
Dancing With Tears In My Eyes. Joe Venuti and His New Yorkers. 1930.
Nobody's Sweetheart. Paul Whiteman and His Orchestra. 1929.
Without A Song. Paul Whiteman and His Orchestra. 1929.
(I'm A Dreamer) Aren't We All? Paul Whiteman and His Orchestra. 1929.
Living In the Sunlight, Loving In the Moonlight. Paul Whiteman and His Orchestra. 1930.
You Brought A New Kind of Love To Me. Paul Whiteman and His Orchestra. 1930.
If I Had A Talking Picture of You. Paul Whiteman and His Orchestra. 1929.
After You've Gone. Paul Whiteman and His Orchestra. 1929.

If anyone knows the piece of classic music interpolated before Tram's solo in "Nobody's Sweetheart," please let me know. Thanks. I think Chico Marx played the piece on piano in one of the Marx Brothers movies.

WBIX #153 will be uploaded on August 1, 2008. I'll be in Davenport

on the last Friday of July.

Enjoy.

Albert

Posted on Jun 26, 2008, 11:56 AM

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The Quote

by TheHelpfulChazzer

"If anyone knows the piece of classic music interpolated before Tram's solo in "Nobody's Sweetheart," please let me know. Thanks. I think Chico Marx played the piece on piano in one of the Marx Brothers movies."

Hi Albert,

the quote is from Igor Stravinsky's "Petrushka". -- I met a music professor from the Cologne Musikhochschule today and hummed the tune for him. He recognized it immediately.

Chazz

Major Koslova: "The good guys don't hide." (Sometimes it's nevertheless necessary.)

Posted on Jul 1, 2008, 12:41 PM

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Petrushka and Sylvia

Thanks.

It turns out that this was discussed a couple of years ago!

http://www.network54.com/Forum/27140/message/1150571192/No+one+answered+my+question+--%28

Albert

Posted on Jul 1, 2008, 1:29 PM

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I haven't ...

by TheHelpfulChazzer

... "existed" yet a couple of years ago

-- I mean, virtually. -- Anyway, when I had listened to it the very first time, skipped back and fourth, I immediately thought of Stravinsky and his neo-classical period. -- The quote is at the beginning of the 2nd movement and the composition stems from 1911. I have an LP with "Stravinsky conducts Stravinsky" where he conducted the Columbia Symphony Orchestra in the late 60's I guess. Side 1: Firebird Side 2: Petrushka -- Great compositions, very influential on composers like Gershwin, Copland or Grofè. -- And you can bet your bottom dollar that Bix had listened to the contemporary music of Stravinsky, Debussy or Ravel.

Major Koslova: "The good guys don't hide." (Sometimes it's nevertheless necessary.)

Posted on Jul 1, 2008, 2:55 PM

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Brad Kay ...

by TheHelpfulChazzer

... had nailed it in 2006 already!

Chazz

Major Koslova: "The good guys don't hide." (Sometimes it's nevertheless necessary.)

Posted on Jul 1, 2008, 3:44 PM

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The Lectures at the Bix Festival

The Society has listed the names of lecturers and the title of their seminars. This will be on Friday, July 28, 2008 at the Clarion Hotel.

Clarion Hotel, Davenport, IA

Here is the schedule of lectures.

FRIDAY SPECIAL EVENTS - SEMINARS TO BE HELD AT CLARION HOTEL
FRIDAY 11am-12 Scott Black - "Bix: As Told By Those Who Knew Him"
1 - 2 Albert Haim - "Bix: The Man, Not the Legend"
2 - 3 John McDonough - "Collecting Beyond Records"
3 - 4 Dick Hyman & Randy Sandke-Open Discussion about Bix's Music and His Influence on Jazz
4 - 5 Sue Fischer - "Bix & The New Orleans Rhythm Kings"

Albert

Posted on Jun 26, 2008, 11:12 AM

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Bix cornet

by Jim Baldwin

At our recent 78 club meeting in NH a member brought along his cornet as a show and tell item. He read from Evans + Sudhalter about the model of horn that Bix played in his early career.

When my friend went out to buy a cornet he just happened to buy the same model Bix owned. It was a lucky guess. It was years before he read the standard Bix bio.

Anyways, recently on the forum a photo of a Bix horn was displayed. I am unable to find that again. My friend is coming for a visit and I want to show him that nice photo. Could someone help?

Thanks.

Jim

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 7:02 PM

Posted on Jun 26, 2008, 6:57 AM

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The Bach Stradivarius

Here is the image from ms.cc.sunysb.edu/~alhaim/bixbach620.jpg

A model Bix used very often was a Conn Victor. I am guessing your friend has a Conn Victor.

Albert

Posted on Jun 26, 2008, 7:14 AM

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Funny, because ...

by TheHelpfulChazzer

... I'm playing the big brother of Bix' horn, an original Conn-Constellation from the late 60's I guess:

... and:

Posted on Jun 26, 2008, 7:58 AM

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Blue River transcription

by George Ferrick

Does any body have a transcription of Bix solo on this record---the Trumbauer version.

Posted on Jun 24, 2008, 7:08 PM

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I looked up in ....

.... the following sources:

Bix Beiderbecke, Observing A Genius At Work - Randy Sandke
The Further Adventures of Bix Beiderbecke - Peter Ecklund
Bix Beiderbecke Trumpet Transcriptions - Jay Arnold
Great Cornet Solos of Bix Beiderbecke - Peter Ecklund

Total failure.

All that Bix does in "Blue River" -including the obbligato behind Ellis's vocal- is a thing of beauty!

Albert

Posted on Jun 25, 2008, 4:39 AM

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Found at least something!

by TheHelpfulChazzer

http://pubcs.free.fr/jg/jazz_trumpet_transcriptions_jacques_gilbert_english.html

Posted on Jun 25, 2008, 5:06 AM

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Send an email to ....

.... ahaim@bixography.com and identify yourself.

Albert Haim
Forum Owner

Posted on Jun 25, 2008, 5:10 AM

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Done. -- Please have ...

by TheHelpfulChazzer

... a look in your mail-box, Albert.

Posted on Jun 25, 2008, 5:27 AM

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Thank you for ....

.... identifying yourself.

Albert Haim
Forum Owner

Posted on Jun 25, 2008, 5:43 AM

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Thanks

by George Ferrick

Alas, no Blue River. The obligato behind the vocal is very hard to pick out at times. I thought somebody might have attempted it. How about it Brad?

Posted on Jun 25, 2008, 10:36 AM

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Blue River

by TheHelpfulChazzer

Hi George,

I will sit down and transcribe that solo and probably Bix' obbligato. Just give me some time please until Monday next week. I've just watched the German soccer team winning the half-final against Turkey and won't have too much time for jazz until then.

Thanks and regards,

TheHelpfulChazzer

Posted on Jun 25, 2008, 1:45 PM

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Blue River`

by George Ferrick

HelpfulChazzer, Many thanks! Enjoy the soccer!

Posted on Jun 25, 2008, 2:12 PM

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Thanks For Being Helpful, Chazzer

by Brad Kay

The "Blue River" obbligato is a fabulous "submerged" Bix creation that deserves close attention, just like all his work in this period. Thank you for sparing me the task of transcribing it - a job I had planned to do someday! I will double check your notes and report any audible discrepancies. -Brad K

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 6:58 PM

Posted on Jun 25, 2008, 2:25 PM

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Never mind, guys, but ...

by TheHelpfulChazzer

... please be patient because the Germans won the match tonight and are now on the road to winning the cup. -- And if not, there'll be a big blue river of tears running down our cheeks,

Posted on Jun 25, 2008, 3:14 PM

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I have a transcription of Blue River

by Malcolm Walton

I did this twenty years ago and have not e-checked it, but I am happy to share it if I can find the best way to scan and post it.
I am a luddite you see !
Malcolm

Posted on Jun 27, 2008, 4:57 AM

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So it's probably ...

by TheHelpfulChazzer

... redundant transcribing that obbligato, Malcolm? -- Anyway, I will give it a shot after Sunday and we could compare our works, okay? -- I hope you'll find a way to scan it. The best host to load it up is this site: >http://www.uploadedit.com/_to-upload-edit-send.php -- It's safer than imageshack, in my opinion. -- Or you send it to my e-mail and I would upload it to my AOL-XLite Destop Drive account.

Thanks and bon chance,

TheHelpfulChazzer

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jun 27, 2008 10:40 AM

Posted on Jun 27, 2008, 8:06 AM

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I have scanned it

by Malcolm Walton

I have scanned Blue River and I think that the best solution is to send it to your email address when I know what it is. I would be most grateful if you could check what I have done as I am sure there will be a couple of mistakes. Then we can jointly put it out on the forum.
Malcolm

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 6:55 PM

Posted on Jun 28, 2008, 2:15 AM

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And I have ...

by TheHelpfulChazzer

... sent you an e-mail, Malcolm. -- As you know, will I have time next week for working on my own transcription. Until then I will look at yours only superficially. -- Looking forward to hear from you.

TheHelpfulChazzer

Major Koslova: "The good guys don't hide." (Sometimes it's nevertheless necessary.)

Posted on Jun 28, 2008, 7:10 AM

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River, Ramblers and Copying Bix

by Rob Rothberg

When you folks focus on Bix's Blue River obligato, you will find that it has a one-bar descending phrase (at 2:07 of the redhotjazz version) that is replicated in the trumpet solo on the California Ramblers' record of that tune (at 1:43 of the redhotjazz version).

Posted on Jun 28, 2008, 8:17 AM

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Re: River, Ramblers and Copying Bix

by George Ferrick

A big thank you to everyone for this project. I'm sure others on this site will also appreciate the transcription. Just months before he died, I was priveledged to play Blue River for Bobby Short at a brithday party for a mutual friend. He asked the friend, also an officianato, what that song was. I was delighted that I had caught them both on a song. Now they are both gone, but I still get requests from others at that party to play that song that Bobby didn't know.

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 6:55 PM

Posted on Jun 28, 2008, 12:57 PM

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Re: River, Ramblers and Copying Bix

by George Ferrick

Many thanks to everyone.

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 6:56 PM

Posted on Jun 28, 2008, 1:00 PM

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Copying Bix?

Great finding, Rob.

Here are the two fragments, juxtaposed. First Bix in the Aug 25, 1927 Frank Trumbauer recording, and then Chelsea Quealey {agreed? there were two trumpeteers in the recording, Chelsea Quealey and Frank Cush; I think Chelsea is the soloist) in the Sep 19, 1927 California Ramblers.

http://bixography.com/BlueRiverBixChelsea.ram

A record was not issued for several weeks after it was recorded. I doubt that Bix and Tram "Blue River" was out by Sep 19, a little over three weeks after it had been recorded. How could Chelsea play what Bix had played? Coincidence? Was Chelsea present when Bix and Tram recorded the tune for OKeh? Did Bix play that obbligato live with the Goldkette band when Chelsea was present. All speculation.

A very interesting finding. Thanks, Rob!

Albert

Posted on Jun 28, 2008, 2:00 PM

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Not the same ...

by TheHelpfulChazzer

... but quite similar choices what notes to play here, isn't it? -- Bix' way to play had a strong impact on all cornet players who heard him. And so I think that this solo by Chelsea was clearly inspired by Bix, if he heard him playing that tune or that solo before or not. I listened to it several times in a row. The big difference is of course the vocal. Bix played his little fills without bothering the vocalist, whereas Chelsea had a clear solo spot here. The notes are different but the Bixian spirit is audible.

Posted on Jun 28, 2008, 3:14 PM

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Malcolm's Transcription Uploaded

by TheHelpfulChazzer

Blue River -- Page 1:

Blue River -- Page 2:

Major Koslova: "The good guys don't hide." (Sometimes it's nevertheless necessary.)

Posted on Jun 30, 2008, 3:41 AM

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P.S.

by TheHelpfulChazzer

For zooming, please click on the pictures.

Major Koslova: "The good guys don't hide." (Sometimes it's nevertheless necessary.)

Posted on Jun 30, 2008, 3:43 AM

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Frank van Nus's trascription of Blue River Obbligato.

Thanks to Malcolm, the Chazzer, and Frank v for their great help. As I said before, forumites are very generous and I am grateful for all they do to enhance the value of the Bixography Forum.

Here is Frank's transcription.

Frnk writes, "I transcribed Blue River too, but only the obbligato behind the vocal. It might be interesting to compare it with Malcolm's version. I didn't check mine with his, so there are bound to be discrepancies between the two transcriptions, especially since Bix's part is hard to make out much of the time. I put a hook over the areas where I was especially in doubt.
Please feel free to post it - should be fun!"

Indeed, lots of fun.

Albert

Posted on Jun 30, 2008, 9:06 AM

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Thank You

by George Ferrick

Wow! My dreams came true. Thank you every one.-George

Posted on Jun 30, 2008, 10:03 AM

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Ditto

by Brad Kay

I'll be studying these!! -Brad K

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 7:01 PM

Posted on Jun 30, 2008, 10:44 AM

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It'd be also interesting...

by Sergio Calvé

...to have the transcription of the 3-sax chorus. Does anyone have it (Cm - asx and bar)?
Sergio

Posted on Jul 6, 2008, 1:29 PM

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Locations of Blues Festival, Bix jazz festival uncertain ....

.... is the title of an article in today's QCTimes at

http://www.qctimes.com/articles/2008/06/23/news/local/doc48604428e5944201910278.txt

Heer is the relevant section.

"The locations of the I H Mississippi Valley Blues Festival, set for July 3-5, and the Bix Beiderbecke Memorial Jazz Festival, scheduled for July 24-27, remained uncertain as Davenport city officials surveyed Leclaire Park on the riverfront. It is expected to remain underwater through Friday, said Dan Sherman, the city parks and recreation director.
Once the water recedes, he expects to find that all of the grass in the park is dead, Sherman said. To replace it will require sodding, and that will require people to stay off it for about 40 days."

If the LeClaire Park venue is unavailable, what will happen to the festival? I believe the Park is the most popular of the venues, particularly on Saturday.

Albert

Posted on Jun 24, 2008, 5:04 AM

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Re: Locations of Blues Festival, Bix jazz festival uncertain ....

by Gerri Bowers

Ray Voss is working very hard with the park board to make sure we will still be at the park. We are all hoping and praying we get no more rain. We still have a month till The Bix Fest. Lets all hope they are able to get it back in shape. All Ray has to do is make a few calls and we will all volunteer to do what every is needed to make this happen.

Posted on Jun 26, 2008, 10:07 AM

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Sonia Meroff

by Ken Jobling

Does anyone have any info on Sonia Meroff who had one issued side on Okeh 40899 - There Ain't No Land Like Dixieland To Me (a tune associated with Bix of course). It's good to hear the full version and this is a pleasant 20's style vocal but she does lose it a bit at the end of the side.

Assuming this is her real name, is she related to Benny Meroff? And did she record for any other company?

Posted on Jun 24, 2008, 3:36 AM

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Identify Yourself ....

.... by sending an email message to ahaim@bixography.com

Albert Haim
Forum Owner

Posted on Jun 24, 2008, 4:23 AM

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I thank Ken ....

.... for identifying himself.

Albert

Posted on Jun 24, 2008, 10:05 AM

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The Dodge Brothers Victory Six Radio Hour.

Steve H kindly sent this ad for the radio program.

See also Evans and Evans pp. 314-316 and http://bixography.com/images2/photogallery.htm#Victory_Hour

As Evans and Evans tell us, this broadcast was a technological breakthrough. It a was a coast to coast broadcast: one would imagine that someone in the US recorded the program. But I have not seen any reference to a possible recording.

Albert

Posted on Jun 23, 2008, 9:23 AM

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What an accomplisment!

If you think in contemporary terms. This was an early effort at something that later became a standard practice in network radio..."breaking the network."

Until 1985 the radio networks were carried on a telephone line that went in a loop across the country. When a broadcast took place other than in NY or LA, the entire loop would be "opened" at the point nearest the venue...and only for the duration of that broadcast. Then at the close it would be put back "or closed" for the next broadcast. That's why almost all radio remotes end with a standard outcue that came from the venue ("...This is the Columbia Broadcasting System...").

It required a lot of people at both the Phone Company and the radio network to all be on the same page. And as likely as it was to fail due to someone making a dumb mistake, it rarely did.

Nowadays there is technology...easier to set up but the co-ordination issues are just as complex.

SS

Posted on Jun 24, 2008, 7:25 AM

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"Mountain Greenery" by Roger Wolfe Kahn

Yesterday, in his weekly Sunday program (WFUV and streaming), Rich Conaty played the tune "Mountain Greenery" by Roger Wolfe Kahn and His Orchestra. It is available in the red hot jazz archive at

http://www.redhotjazz.com/Songs/kahn/MountainGreenery20071-A.ram

The recording is from May 27, 1926, a tune by Rogers and Hart from "The Garrick Gaieies 1926." According to the Eddie Lang Discography by Ray Mitchell, the personnel is Tommy Gott, Leo McConville, Miff Mole, Alfie Evans, Harold Sturr, Joe Venuti, ?Joe Raymond, Arthur Schutt, Eddie Lang, Arthur Campbell and Vic Berton (diud you get a load of all the connections to Bix?) Rust omits Venuti and adds Arnold Brilhart.

It is a great recording and a first class arrangement, in the tradition (to my ears) we find in Whiteman recordings. Incidentally, I think Kahn must have been influenced by Whiteman's approach to dance band/jazz/symphonic jazz. I remind you of

http://www.network54.com/Forum/27140/message/1208370998/Roger+Wolfe%92s+Symphony+Jazz+Orchestra

where I discussed "Roger Wolfe’s Symphony Jazz Orchestra."

My question. The arrangement is terrific. Who wrote the arrangement? And do you agree or disagree with my view that the arrangement is influenced by Grofe's arrangements for Whiteman? I am not that good at recognizing arrangers, so feel free to blast me if I am way off base.

Albert

Posted on Jun 23, 2008, 5:30 AM

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Re: "Mountain Greenery" by Roger Wolfe Kahn

by sirscratchy

Yes that is a great RWK side. Most likely that arrangement is probably the combined efforts of someone at Victor (Edward King, Nat Shilkret, Etc and their underlings) and Roger Wolfe Kahn, and is a re-tooled version of the Stock.

A hearing of a Banner or Perfect record of the Mountain Greenery would prove that.

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 6:56 PM

Posted on Jun 23, 2008, 9:01 AM

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For all guys who haven't heard ...

by TheHelpfulChazzer

... that sweet early version of the Rodgers & Hart song yet: Mountain Greenery -- Roger Wolfe Kahn (1926) -- Besides: it was a very big hit for Mel Tormé later on and Bing Crosby delivered a great rendition of the song on one of his best LP's, Bing Sings Whilst Bregman Swings, 1956.

Posted on Jun 26, 2008, 7:11 AM

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Sorry for the ...

by TheHelpfulChazzer

... double-posting of the track! -- Anyway, one can download the mp3 I have posted and the sound is a bit better than a ram-file.

Posted on Jun 26, 2008, 7:24 AM

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Re: "Mountain Greenery" by Roger Wolfe Kahn

by jazzlover

A beautiful song ruined by an awful arrangment with stilted and unryhmical phrasing.

Posted on Jun 26, 2008, 9:04 AM

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Please identify yourself by ....

.... sending an email message to ahaim@bixography.com

Thank you.

Albert Haim
Forum Owner

Posted on Jun 26, 2008, 9:18 AM

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Do forumites agree with the very negative .....

.... assessment of Roger Wolfe Kahn's "Mountain Greenery"? I am favorably impressed by the interesting arrangement, not at all "unrhythmical" as "jazz lover" asserts. On the contrary, the beat is steady and strong. The rhythm section consists of none other than Eddie Lang, Arthur Schutt, Vic Berton and Arthur Cambpell: a group of terrific musicians, you can hardly get better. As I said in my previous post, the arrangement strikes me as Whitemanesque and rather inventive. Opinions?

Albert

Posted on Jun 26, 2008, 2:06 PM

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The arrangement is ...

by TheHelpfulChazzer

... certainly not what a true and pure jazz lover would prefer to listen to: no improvisations, not even the kind of phrasing one would find in the charts of a Fletcher Henderson or a Don Redman. It's an all written down arrangement, but a pretty good one. Especially the use of the unison clarinets towards the end plus the straight tuba passages reminds me of some of Gil Evans' writing for the Claude Thornhill orchestra. -- Far fetched? -- No! -- Gil was quite aware of his roots and he must have listened to that kind of jazz influenced early dance music.

The jazz content of it is very small, that's true; but one should always remember: it was 1926! -- The time of swing phrasing was yet to come. A few attempts in this direction had been made by Louis Armstrong or Earl Hines already. The mainstream then was another one: danceable rhythms, the Charleston ruled. In my opinion is that arrangement a typical piece of its time, nothing really outstanding but not bad at all. -- I think the arranger's intention was not to write a jazzy arrangement in the first place.

Posted on Jun 26, 2008, 6:29 PM

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"Sophisticated Lady" and the Interlude of "In A Mist"

In http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2DqNvVeewg Duke Ellington plays a piece of his 1932 composition "Sophisticated Lady." I detect some similarity between a passage in "Sophisticated Lady" and the interlude in Bix's 1927 recording of "In A Mist." Listen (I slowed down the tempo of "In A Mist" to facilitate the comparison).

http://bixography.com/sophisticatedinamist.ram

Or am I hearing things? Agree? Disagree? Comments?

Albert

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jun 22, 2008 8:32 AM

Posted on Jun 22, 2008, 8:29 AM

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Mmmm......

by Klaus H.

Me too. I wonder if a musician member might, in simple terms, explain what the similarity is?

Posted on Jun 22, 2008, 9:12 AM

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Only superficially

by Malcolm Walton

Two litle run downs with similar notes on the top of each chord. However, the extract from "Sophisticted Lady" contains staightforward descending chromatic chords. The extract from "In a Mist" follows an entirely different chordal progression and, furthermore, all the chords are "more advanced" in harmonic terms than the Ellington example.
Malcolm

Posted on Jun 25, 2008, 6:54 AM

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Message to all forumites

A deranged individual has beeen bombarding some of you with messages to your email boxes. I apologize for this nuisance.

Effective immediately, please do not include your email addresses in your postings.

Sincerely,

Albert Haim
Forum Owner

Posted on Jun 22, 2008, 6:45 AM

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e-mails from a seriously disturbed mind

by Ken Bristow

These messages are also turning up here in London but a swift visit to the delete key . . . problem solved.

Posted on Jun 22, 2008, 7:08 AM

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an awful lot of his [Bix's] solos just ask to be analysed in classical terms.

From http://groups.google.com/group/rec.music.makers.bowed-strings/browse_thread/thread/ae3627948a060202/f4458f3940e7426b?hl=en&

If you go back to classical analysis there are "essential notes" (those on
the harmony) and "unessential notes" (not "inessential"!) which are the
others.

Unessential notes against the harmony occur in assorted ways including:

Passing notes: you move in steps up or down. the unessential notes you go
through are passing notes.

Auxiliary notes: you step off an essential note and back on to it.

Appoggiature: you hit an unessential note on a strong beat and move by step
onto an essential note.

Turns: go round essential notes.

[In these last two I am not talking about the decorative symbols used in
classical music but the sequence of notes which they imply, and they don't
just have to be short notes.]

I'll gloss over the choice between chromatic and diatonic unessential notes,
but obviously there are both.

It may see odd or "uncool" at first but all of this is still relevant in
jazz and blues playing The upshot is that you can do almost anything
you like if you move in step and it can sound right - the unessential notes
fall into one category or another. But if you leap, and want to fit with
the harmonies, you should land on an essential note, or on a note one step
away and step off onto an essential note.

Jazz improvisation before the late 1940s very much followed these principles
but gradually increased the concept of essential notes where things like the
B in Cmaj7 started to become "essential" as opposed to what it would have
been in classical music.

A very good example is Bix Beiderbecke in the 20s: he was absolutely
brilliant but an awful lot of his solos just ask to be analysed in classical
terms. "Blue notes" were not "extra notes" but a way of bending certain
notes (especially vocally) to give a certain feel. You should be able to
hear this in the older generation of Blues performers - for example as I
mentioned Bessie Smith and Jelly Roll Morton. (The latter as you observed
was busily transforming blues into jazz but a lot of his early work was
essentially blues.) [The article continues; see url above] [The author, David Webber is probably British: note how he spells analyse.]

What do the music experts thing of this, in particular the statement about Bix's solos in need of analysis in classical terms? I have always maintained (just a gut feeling: I am no musicologist) that Louis's music has a blues sensibility whereas Bix's has a European sensibility. Does this go along with the need to analyze Bix's music in classical terms, if the latter is an accurate statement? Do the music experts view Randy Sandke's "Observing A Genius At Work" as an analysis of Bix's solos in classical terms or as jazz creations or both?

Albert

Posted on Jun 22, 2008, 6:01 AM

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Just an opinion

by Sergio Calvé

What’s the use of “analyze Bix's music in classical (or any other) terms”?. If music experts find it somehow interesting, fine, but they are missing something. Bix’s music is pure “feeling”. The word should be “enjoy”, not “analyze”.

Posted on Jun 22, 2008, 11:28 AM

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It's Highly Analyzable, If You Feel Like Analyzing...

by Brad Kay

Bix's musical language on cornet is essentially Romantic. It compares with the piano revelations of Chopin. Bix's piano music compares more to the Impressionist Debussy, in his piano preludes. My point is, that any technical analysis one could apply to those esteemed gents could be used for Bix as well. They all still abide by the European diatonic system. Bix's cornet playing, for all his half-valve and glissando moments, STILL conforms more to pianistic staff notation than other great jazz horn players. Bix was first and always a piano player, who thought in precise pianistic intervals when he played cornet. So, yeah, classical analysis, in matters of structure, harmony and melodic movement, definitely apply to Bix. There's a book of solo transcriptions, published in 1944, which includes beaucoup analyses of this sort.

Brad K

This message has been edited by ahaim on Jul 4, 2008 6:55 PM

Posted on Jun 22, 2008, 12:34 PM

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