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Idle Man
(Login Idle_man)

Re: 5th Test | India v England at Chennai (Match Thread)

December 20 2016, 11:15 AM 

Agree with that P. A major factor for me too is just the unrelenting succession of international competitions/series. I quite often miss the fact that a one-dayer is happening altogether. Even with test cricket it's become harder to enjoy the old cycle of the build up and then five sensibly spaced matches, followed by a wait of some months for the next series.

Also quite pleased that the Indians are celebrating test cricket. We need that.

 
 
Stu
(Login StuartRA)
Assistant Moderator

Re: 5th Test | India v England at Chennai (Match Thread)

December 20 2016, 12:14 PM 

I have never had any passion for Team England for all the reasons stated. Not really fussed if they win, draw or lose.


    
This message has been edited by StuartRA on Dec 20, 2016 12:15 PM


 
 
Guest
(Login sooty-yorkie1)

Re: 5th Test | India v England at Chennai (Match Thread)

December 20 2016, 12:46 PM 

A disappointment to say the least. I think everyone knew it would be a difficult slog and although we have done well against India in the recent past, however this was always going to be a tough one. What was obvious to me was England never really knew what there best team was. All seemed a bit muddled. I think after this hammering, in which we were totally out bowled and batted, someone is going to get the chop.

 
 
Seadog73
(Login Seadog73)

Re: 5th Test | India v England at Chennai (Match Thread)

December 20 2016, 1:03 PM 

The best thing about this series was seeing Kohli's apparently ferocious commitment to test cricket, a refreshing contrast to the attitude of his predecessor. There is talk of test cricket dying but only the West Indies' star players seem genuinely uninterested to me.

 
 
Team England
(Login Justgrazing)

Re: 5th Test | India v England at Chennai (Match Thread)

December 20 2016, 1:47 PM 

I feel just the same and have changed from going to all five days at the Headingley test to not even considering going to a single day.

The reason is partly the cost of a ticket to a day's play. I know that in the grand scheme of sporting events the price stands comparison but I cannot bring myself to believe that the team representing our nation is the best available. This Team England thing has just created a self serving, self perpetuating club that I don't feel represents me. There are so many poor players whose faces fit (and I include Cook and Broad in that category) that I would back Yorkshire with Root & Bairstow to beat Team England quite comprehensively. Team England just aren't good enough or representative enough to interest me greatly.

We have not improved one iota from the days when a team was picked from match to match and if they didn't perform they were out. This cosseted bunch are wrapped in so much cotton wool they scarcely have need to engage their brains. Having just witnessed today's debacle, we have to wonder if they have any brains; they certainly don't have pride in the shirt.

 
 
Guest
(Login EastYorkshireTyke)

Re: 5th Test | India v England at Chennai (Match Thread)

December 20 2016, 1:56 PM 

Sorry but am I reading that correctly Justgrazing, Cook and Broad are poor players who are only picked because their faces fit?

 
 

Dave Morton
(Login DaveMorton)

Re: 5th Test | India v England at Chennai (Match Thread)

December 20 2016, 2:45 PM 

Seven years ago, I sat in the stands, enthralled, as England batted all day 5 to save the game, against the odds and against all predictions.

This was Cape Town, January 2010. Graeme Smith had batted England out of the game, and three wickets were down overnight. Not one of the pundits gave England a chance against Steyn and Morkel.

As it was, night-watchman Anderson hung on for an hour with Jonathan Trott. When they were out, Collingwood and Bell took over. Runs were unimportant and they realised this. Collingwood was made for this sort of innings, but Bell too put away his strokes and battled for his team - hour after hour, block after block.

Early afternoon they had to face the new ball. This made for some of the greatest cricket I have ever seen. They both came through. With the game almost safe, Collingwood got out, quickly followed by Prior. Broad survived for half an hour, then he and Bell got out. Swann and Onions had to survive the last 17 balls, which they did, somehow.

THE CONTRAST BETWEEN CAPE TOWN 2010 AND CHENNAI 2016 COULD NOT BE MORE STARK. ONE TEAM HAD PRIDE; THE OTHER DID NOT.

The point I am trying to make is not that 2010 had better players, but that those players had better attitudes, with the exception of Pietersen, who had thrown his wicket away late on day 4. This current lot remind me of the shower of losers captained by Nasser Hussain, the team which capitulated at Adelaide. Vaughan caught on the boundary, slog-sweeping Warne, when all they had to do was to block for just half a day.

It is high time that these well paid players were reminded of the sacrifices supporters make to travel to watch them. Getting a visa to travel to India is harder work than working, and having to contend with hostile ground officialdom there is just as bad.

 
 
PaulYorks
(Login paulyorks)

Re: 5th Test | India v England at Chennai (Match Thread)

December 20 2016, 4:10 PM 

>> Sorry but am I reading that correctly Justgrazing, Cook and Broad are poor players who are only picked because their faces fit?

They are good players and most of the time justify their places in the team. However, those places are guaranteed because their faces fit - and that should never be the case.

 
 
Guest
(Login EastYorkshireTyke)

Re: 5th Test | India v England at Chennai (Match Thread)

December 20 2016, 4:38 PM 

They are good players and most of the time justify their places in the team. However, those places are guaranteed because their faces fit - and that should never be the case.

How do you know their places are guaranteed because their faces fit rather than just on their records and performances alone?

 
 
Guest
(Login Fozzie1973)

Re: 5th Test | India v England at Chennai (Match Thread)

December 20 2016, 4:38 PM 

what alternatives do you have to replace them, maybe Cook steps down as skipper but a few more years left in him as an opener, does over 10,000 runs & 350 wickets not count then are they just getting picked because their faces fit

 
 
PaulYorks
(Login paulyorks)

Re: 5th Test | India v England at Chennai (Match Thread)

December 20 2016, 4:57 PM 

>> How do you know their places are guaranteed because their faces fit rather than just on their records and performances alone?

When was either of them last dropped?

 
 
PaulYorks
(Login paulyorks)

Re: 5th Test | India v England at Chennai (Match Thread)

December 20 2016, 4:58 PM 

>> does over 10,000 runs & 350 wickets not count then are they just getting picked because their faces fit

They count, but not indefinitely.

 
 
Guest
(Login EastYorkshireTyke)

Re: 5th Test | India v England at Chennai (Match Thread)

December 20 2016, 5:02 PM 

Why would you drop either Cook or Broad given their records? Who would you suggest replace them?

Stuart Broad didn't play in the 2nd test against Bangladesh when he was fit.


    
This message has been edited by EastYorkshireTyke on Dec 20, 2016 5:02 PM


 
 
PaulYorks
(Login paulyorks)

Re: 5th Test | India v England at Chennai (Match Thread)

December 20 2016, 5:26 PM 

>> Why would you drop either Cook or Broad given their records? Who would you suggest replace them?

I'm not saying I would replace them with anyone at the moment, just that one can sometimes get the impression that their places are guaranteed because they are part of the clique. This, like all impressions, is based on a variety of more or less woolly factors, including the players' selection records, their performances, their demeanour and their public pronouncements (and those of others). Obviously I don't have the inside track on selection policy any more than you do.

I would certainly like to see Cook relieved of the captaincy asap, and replaced with Root. In my opinion Cook has never truly inspired as a captain, and has been at best a dogged and stabilising presence. England should aspire to better than this. Obviously I don't have the inside track on dressing room morale or politics any more than you do (in fact, please consider this a standard caveat on every opinion I offer on Team England henceforth).

>> Stuart Broad didn't play in the 2nd test against Bangladesh when he was fit.

Sure, but I asked when they were last dropped.

 
 
CB
(Login BoomerC)

Re: 5th Test | India v England at Chennai (Match Thread)

December 20 2016, 5:30 PM 

I see Sir Geoffrey is calling for Cook to stand down and give the new skipper elect a chance to get bedded in and prepare for next summer's test series.

Tend to agree, a change of leadership would hopefully abate the malaise currently effecting this test squad ?

'Roll on the new cricket season ' 🍺+ 🍦+ 🍓+ 🌞= 🏏


    
This message has been edited by BoomerC on Dec 20, 2016 5:31 PM


 
 
Geoff B
(Login Coastalview)

Re: 5th Test | India v England at Chennai (Match Thread)

December 20 2016, 9:25 PM 

I think today was the final straw for Cook.

As well as making some ropey decisions he doesn't seem able to get the best out of the team on the field.

I know there has been some selection problems but once the team is picked the captain has to get the players to play up to their potential.

 
 
WS55
(Login WibseySimon55)

India v England

December 20 2016, 10:11 PM 

Er, India were the better team. By a long way. The emphasis should be on their success, not English failure. India has a population of about 175 million men and boys between the ages of 15 and 30 from which to choose a talented team of 11 men. England has about 5 million men in the same age cohort. If the sport were equally popular in each country, India should have a 35 to 1 chance of finding a better team. But in India a wide public is keen on cricket; in England it attracts narrower support, and thinner participation among the young, in the streets and in the clubs.

It should amaze us that we can put up a fight at all, even without considerations of local conditions -- wickets and spin bowling technique/experience.

This is not a bad England team, not at all.

I think we are just seeing the beginning of 50 years of Indian domination of test cricket.


 
 
Guest
(Login ThirdUmpire)

Re: India v England

December 21 2016, 6:58 AM 

Only if they play at home.

India were as woeful as England just have been when they last toured here.

Looking back the scheduling of 8 back to back tests with no preparation, breaks or tour games for fringe players to keep their eye in was bonkers. Some of the squad selection was bonkers with England stumbling along finding new talent more by accident than design.

But the leadership was poor too, with odd decision making, poor bowling choices, lack of any plans and a sense of going through the motions waiting for a declaration. Cook has never been a great strategic or tactical leader but has got by due to a strong team. Here he has been found out and I'm not sure he has the appetite or brain to go on any longer.

I fear it's too early for Joe but not sure if any of the others are any better options.


 
 
Twelfth Man
(Login twelthman)

Re: India v England

December 21 2016, 7:36 AM 

I would rather see Bayliss leave than Cook. His obsession with "attacking cricket" is taking England backwards. Even Root and Bairstow have caught the reckless batting disease, and we all know that is not "just the way they play".

I also find the fact that he does not watch county cricket absolutely disgraceful for the coach of the national team.

 
 
Geoff B
(Login Coastalview)

Re: India v England

December 21 2016, 9:00 AM 

No problem admitting that India were the better team, by a mile and a 2-0 or even a 3-1 series win would have been fair enough. But England rolled over in two tests, especially this one.

If Bayliss came over all Rugby leaguey and claimed he was homesick and didn't want to come back I would be delighted.

Cook must not be prevailed upon to keep on as Captain against his better judgement.

Joe is a big boy now, despite his looks, and if being the England captain is a challenge he wants, this is his time.

 
 
 
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