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bad light - a thing of the past?

August 30 2017 at 7:58 AM
peter  (Login Blackpooltyke)

 
Many congratulations to the west indies yesterday.

I am all for allowing a game to continue in poor light, but can,t help thinking that if yesterday had been day 2 of the test they would have abandoned play with an hour to go.

If conditions were suitable for play yesterday then the same conditions on other occasions should also been deemed fit for play no matter what the match situation is at that time.

So has a precedent now been set that bad light is never an issue when the lights are on no matter what coloured ball is being used?

 
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Egham Tyke
(Login Davetyke)

Re: bad light - a thing of the past?

August 30 2017, 8:07 AM 

The guys on TMS were saying the same thing while hoping upon hope that the umpires were brave and keep the players on the pitch. Don't think the batsmen would have come off without being dragged off though happy.gif

 
 
sid
(Login sid-don)
Assistant Moderator

Re: bad light - a thing of the past?

August 30 2017, 8:15 AM 

Fair point and one which shows the inconsistency around. If that had been Yorks v anyone in the CC with no TV and only the 'faithful' in the ground we'd have been off soon after tea.

Well played to all concerned but the bar has been set.....

 
 
Steve C
(Login stevecowton)
Assistant Moderator

Re: bad light - a thing of the past?

August 30 2017, 8:26 AM 

It was also suggested that they should have switched to a pink ball....

 
 
Fraisse10
(Login Fraisse10)

Re: bad light - a thing of the past?

August 30 2017, 8:45 AM 

As no precedent had been set by any earlier bad light in the game, the umpires had total discretion and used it, I think, wisely.

 
 

Guest
(Login matthefish2002)

Re: bad light - a thing of the past?

August 30 2017, 8:47 AM 

The umpires might have been within the laws of the game taking the players off last night for bad light but would have been terrible advert for test match cricket and some may even have speculated something fishy was going off
Only the most ardent England fan would have wanted a draw in those circumstances.

Now really looking forward to following the 3rd Test at Lords now.


 
 
Steve C
(Login stevecowton)
Assistant Moderator

Re: bad light - a thing of the past?

August 30 2017, 8:56 AM 

And i thought the blatant English time wasting was a little unfortunate..
Well done the Umpires.

 
 
peter
(Login Blackpooltyke)

Re: bad light - a thing of the past?

August 30 2017, 8:59 AM 

Fraisse, discretion should not come into it at all

Either conditions are suitable for play in which case they play....
Or they are unfit in which case the umpires have to take them off.

When dealing with bad light the argument is a safety issue. If bad light makes play dangerous they should go off no matter what the match situation is...otherwise they play.

What would have happened had someone been seriously injured or worse? It would be no defence to say well they only wanted 20 to win.

A cricket ball can and does kill has as been tragically demonstrated in the past.

If the umpires deemed conditions were safe then similar conditions in future matches should be equally so deemed.

 
 
Dwight_Schrute
(Login Dwight_Schrute)

Re: bad light - a thing of the past?

August 30 2017, 9:41 AM 

Agreed. They took England off against the Aussies in 2013 in no worse light than yesterday. When England only required about 20 to win. Series was already won so it wasn't such a brave decision i guess, but as you say the state of the game should be irrelevant.


 
 
Geoff B
(Login Coastalview)

You need discretion in the final session

August 30 2017, 10:00 AM 

Quite a difficult problem with no easy or satisfactory answers.

The Umpires are, especially in Test match cricket, totally neutral but I'm sure the ICC Umpires are briefed on trying to do their best for the paying customers.

If we'd been in danger of losing to most other international sides, Australia for instance, the crowd and pundits would have been on the umpires backs to take the players off.

Gut feeling it was right for the good of cricket yesterday to keep going, but I'm as fickle as the next man.

 
 
Martin
(Login Martinh00)

Re: bad light - a thing of the past?

August 30 2017, 1:30 PM 

As I understand it the overriding issue is one of safety. If the umpires consider the conditions to be unsafe then the come off (and take a reading at that point), if they think it is OK they stay on.

Where floodlights are being used, there seems to be this secondary question - are the floodlights taking over from the natural light. If the answer is yes then the advice seems to be that they come off - regardless of whether there is an overriding safety issue.

My understanding is that that playing conditions were not unsafe but that this odd rule about floodlights could have been invoked but thankfully was not.

Seems sensible to me.

 
 
peter
(Login Blackpooltyke)

Re: bad light - a thing of the past?

August 30 2017, 3:49 PM 

In that case the umpires were wrong to stay on.

The umpires do not make the rules and cannot change them during the game.

Icc make the rules and had the umpires done their job correctly they would have taken the teams off. It would not have been their fault, that lies squarely with the icc who make these rules.

Rules are rules and the umpires are there to enforce them consistently - it is not their job to pick and choose which games to enforce the rules in and which not to.

We need umpires to be consistent.

Like I said earlier, no problem with them staying on and England losing, just so long they do the same in all future games.

 
 
swfctyke
(Login swfctyke)

Re: bad light - a thing of the past?

August 30 2017, 6:08 PM 

I think in the county championship earlier this season derbyshire needed about 20 runs to beat notts, a highly unlikely result.
They came off for bad light and when they came back on it rained and was a draw.
Do you have flexibility on bad light in those circumstances, or carry on? After all, bad light is bad light whatever the game situation.

 
 
Martin
(Login Martinh00)

Re: bad light - a thing of the past?

August 30 2017, 8:31 PM 

Okay. I've googled ICC playing conditions for test matches and it would seem that lights can be used to allow a days play to be completed. The only consideration is the safety of players. I can find no mention anywhere of this issue of the lights taking over from natural light. Also it says very specifically that shadows caused by static objects shall be disregarded. So unless I've missed a relevant clause and if we accept that safety was not an issue I think the umpires interpreted the rules correctly.

 
 
WS55
(Login WibseySimon55)

Re: bad light - a thing of the past?

August 31 2017, 11:50 AM 

Surely the "lights taking over from the natural light" 'rule' is just a clever workaround to try to keep the playing field level between counties (grounds) with floodlights and those without -- in the County Championship?

In Tests, always played on grounds with floodlights, then let the floodlights do their job. Can be no excuse for taking the players off. I can see the case for the umpires being allowed to change the colour of the ball though, if it really makes a difference. Does it really make a difference?

 
 
Justgrazing
(Login Justgrazing)

Re: bad light - a thing of the past?

August 31 2017, 3:25 PM 

It hardly seems fair that counties without lights get some consideration in games between counties with lights when they haven't been driven to the brink of bankruptcy by unrealistic demands from the ECB.

 
 
peter
(Login Blackpooltyke)

Re: bad light - a thing of the past?

August 31 2017, 5:58 PM 

So what about grounds with high tech drainage systems? Should these not be taken advantage of?

Besides lights may cause the home team to lose what would otherwise have been a draw

 
 

Dpreseed
(Login dpressed)

Re: bad light - a thing of the past?

August 31 2017, 6:05 PM 

I don't mind this, but if they come off for bad light on a text when England are doing well I expect major ruptions

 
 
Geoff B
(Login Coastalview)

In the umpires view.

August 31 2017, 6:55 PM 

It's not only bad light but rain where it's not always possible for the umpires to measure things accurately and follow hard and fast rules.

They have to weigh up player safety primarily yes, but the match situation and a big unknown called 'the good of the game' have to be taken into account.

Allowing the umpires some discretion is like democracy, the worst possible way to govern a country, until you consider all the alternatives.

 
 
peter
(Login Blackpooltyke)

Re: bad light - a thing of the past?

September 1 2017, 9:57 AM 

I wonder what would have happened had the crossbow bolt had landed at old Trafford instead? With the lancys needing 20 or so to win?

Would the match have still been abandoned as a draw?

 
 
 
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