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Value of a Kolpak

September 11 2017 at 12:12 PM
sid  (Login sid-don)
Assistant Moderator

 
We've had some discussion about the merits of a 'Kolpak' v an 'overseas' player. I've just had a look at the stats for Abbott at Hampshire - impressive.

County championship: He's played every game and bowled more overs than any other first division seamer.

Bowling: 339 overs producing 45 wickets at 20.09

Batting: I didn't realise he's almost an all rounder with 378 runs at 37.8

I also think he's played every one day game, in the process making a reasonable contribution to a team making finals day.

Chanderpaul at Lancashire. Played 10 out of 11 with 725 runs at 65.91. Again value for money.

Hard to get away from the conclusion that a good Kolpak in the current climate beats a more traditional overseas player, especially for Yorkshire where several 'England' players come and go already disrupting the team. They bring stability and, with the right one, quality. I don't know the figures but I'd guess Abbott has cost Hampshire a similar amount to our combination of short term signings.

I'd now back a decent Kolpak rather than the current overseas recruitment policy.

EDIT: My edit is to stress 'rather than' and most definitely not 'as well as'.


    
This message has been edited by sid-don on Sep 11, 2017 1:34 PM


 
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Idle man
(Login Idle_man)

Re: Value of a Kolpak

September 11 2017, 12:31 PM 

Can't disagree with that. This isn't about going out and about buying people in, which is clearly what some posters would like. It's about finding the best way to delver a single 'hired gun'. We need to get someone successfully bedded into the dressing room, rather than constantly flying people in for a couple of matches.

The selection is not easy however. We've all enthused about signings who've gone on to make fairly limited contributions.

 
 
Guest
(Login ThirdUmpire)

Re: Value of a Kolpak

September 11 2017, 12:33 PM 

Agree entirely Sid. The world of kolpaks has changed but so has the world of having a single overseas player for the season.

To me a good kolpak available all summer gives stability and consistency of selection etc. As an example Hodd has not had a look in when handscomb was our overseas or sarfraz but then is back in favour when we have marsh. But this has a knock on effect on the rest of the team selected too.


 
 

Dave Morton
(Login DaveMorton)

Re: Value of a Kolpak

September 11 2017, 12:33 PM 

Harmer at Essex has played in all 11 matches, taking 55 wickets at under 22 each, with four 5-fors.

Vilas at Lancs and van Zyl (wherever he is) may be less impressive, though I can't be bothered to check. You've got to get a good 'un, and that's the judgement call your management team stand or fall by.

Ingram at Glamorgan - what's his status?

There's another route, too, via education. Jordan and now Archer, at Sussex, offered a top education, and they finish up England qualified in their early 20s. Everyone benefits, except Windies of course, and S Africa in the case of those other Kolpaks.

 
 
Stu
(Login StuartRA)
Assistant Moderator

Re: Value of a Kolpak

September 15 2017, 1:41 PM 

Can we persuade Vernon Philander to do an "Abbott" and come to us next season!! Three year deal, every match every format.

Instead of an overseas, not as well as.

We seem to have sorted the batting problems out now after 3 good batting performances in a row (even though it may be a tad hasty to state that yet), so a bowling all rounder is now what we need with Siddy retiring, and Brooks, Bresnan & Patto past their "sell by" date.


    
This message has been edited by StuartRA on Sep 15, 2017 1:48 PM


 
 
Guest
(Login EastYorkshireTyke)

Re: Value of a Kolpak

September 15 2017, 2:13 PM 

You are aware of Philander's injury record when suggesting this, aren't you?

Also, as a player of colour, he's less likely to go down the Kolpak route.


    
This message has been edited by EastYorkshireTyke on Sep 15, 2017 2:18 PM


 
 
Stu
(Login StuartRA)
Assistant Moderator

Re: Value of a Kolpak

September 15 2017, 2:25 PM 

Not aware of his injury record, and is a good point you make re his colour.

 
 
LUTyke
(Login Y4EV)

Re: Value of a Kolpak

September 15 2017, 2:28 PM 

I think we need 2 players minimum to make a decent fist of things next season. An opening batsman allowing Lees and TKC to battle out for 3 (both would play when Ballance is away with England) and a new opening bowler (who preferably can bat in the lower order).

 
 
Guest
(Login ThirdUmpire)

Re: Value of a Kolpak

September 15 2017, 2:33 PM 

Steyn or Morkel??

 
 
wibseysa
(Login wibseysa)

Re: Value of a Kolpak

September 16 2017, 9:53 AM 

I see this morning another south African as said he is retiring from test cricket

JP Duminy .

 
 
Stu
(Login StuartRA)
Assistant Moderator

Re: Value of a Kolpak

September 16 2017, 10:02 AM 

After our last three batting performances we may have cracked the deficiencies in that area. Lees at 3, Hodd at 6 and Tim at 7 seems to be a better combination. Do we really need another batsman now if KC opens with Lyth.

Duminy will be snapped up be someone (probably Hampshire or Notts), but a bowler would serve our cause better (preferrably one who has a decent batting average to come in at 7 or 8 for us).


    
This message has been edited by StuartRA on Sep 16, 2017 10:04 AM


 
 
Dwight_Schrute
(Login Dwight_Schrute)

Re: Value of a Kolpak

September 16 2017, 10:14 AM 

I wouldn't be too hasty to think the batting is suddenly sorted off the back of runs scored at the Oval.

Anyway i'm assuming Brathwaite is the plan for next season if he impresses/fancies it.

So if any Kolpak bowlers of a decent standard are available then it would be a good move imo.

 
 
Guest
(Login BrickyardBoy)

Re: Value of a Kolpak

September 16 2017, 11:04 AM 

All very good in the short term, but the exodus of talented cricketers from Test cricket, seen through the other end of the telescope, is a further step towards the demise of "real cricket".

We have witnessed the devaluation of County Cricket and only the deaf could fail to hear the siren voices which call for a similar development at Test level. If the most gifted and talented players only want to play for easier, but financially, more highly rewarded types of the game (and distantly related spin-offs such as T20 Slog Ball) then the future for red ball cricket takes yet another hammer blow. Even some on TMS call repeatedly for the reduction of Test Matches to 4 days.

To me this is another reason to eschew the Kingdom of Kolpakia.

Purely mercenary, non-representative sport has a long history of destruction. It transforms all that infects into a vehicle for media hyperbole and celebrity worship which, so evident in other sports, and particularly, soccer and athletics, is at variance with the traditional metier of cricket. It places winning in the position of being the only outcome of worth and this in turn opens up the potential for those devoid of moral compass to engage in match fixing, illegal performance enhancement and other essentially self-seeking motives which bring the game into disrepute.

Even YCCC's celebrated foray into Kolpakia, though not in anyway illegal, was clearly in breach of an established gentleman's agreement.

 
 
JG
(Login _JG_)

Re: Value of a Kolpak

September 16 2017, 11:27 AM 

Duminy is a poor Test player anyway, he wasn't getting in the SA side as it was. Please note he's also retired from Test and First Class cricket: he'll be pursuing an itinerant career in the T20 leagues alongside continuing to play white ball cricket for SA.

I still think we need another top order batsman- even if we have performed better in the last three innings, quite a large contribution to that has been Marsh who would need to be replaced- and I would argue a further seamer too. Sidebottom will be retired, Plunkett is rarely available, Bresnan is getting less potent with the ball each year (and is also becoming increasingly expensive) while Patto and Brooks have each fallen a long way from their usual standards this season- not to mention that all of these bowlers are of a similar age. People will mention Fisher but he's still only 19 so I'm not sure we can expect too much so soon- it took Coad until he was 23 to break through.

 
 
 
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