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DESPERATE EINSTEINIANS

October 1 2008 at 2:52 AM
 

 
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.physics.relativity/msg/b6f4d9841c6684a0
Tom Roberts: "SR's LOGICAL foundations have NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with light at all. Today we know several other sets of postulates for SR that do not involve any assumptions about light. Indeed, as SR is much more general than electrodynamics, it would be rather silly to use a postulate about light."

In any deductive theory an original postulate can be formally replaced (then it becomes a corollary) but this by no means implies that the theory's "LOGICAL foundations have NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with" this postulate. This is so trivial that only extremely dishonest einsteinians, in a state of despair, would camouflage the falsehood of Einstein's 1905 light postulate in the way Tom Roberts does.

Pentcho Valev
pvalev@yahoo.com



 
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Re: DESPERATE EINSTEINIANS

October 1 2008, 3:13 AM 

Einsteinians are desperate because their miraculous science is obviously dying. But they have always been consistent in trying to prove that, even if the original postulate is false, their miraculous science is true and eternal:

http://groups.google.ca/group/sci.physics.relativity/msg/dc1ebdf49c012de2
Tom Roberts: "If it is ultimately discovered that the photon has a nonzero mass (i.e. light in vacuum does not travel at the invariant speed of the Lorentz transform), SR would be unaffected but both Maxwell's equations and QED would be refuted (or rather, their domains of applicability would be reduced)."

http://o.castera.free.fr/pdf/onemorederivation.pdf
Jean-Marc Levy-Leblond: "This is the point of view from wich I intend to criticize the overemphasized role of the speed of light in the foundations of the special relativity, and to propose an approach to these foundations that dispenses with the hypothesis of the invariance of c....We believe that special relativity at the present time stands as a universal theory discribing the structure of a common space-time arena in which all fundamental processes take place....The evidence of the nonzero mass of the photon would not, as such, shake in any way the validity of the special relativity. It would, however, nullify all its derivations which are based on the invariance of the photon velocity."

http://www.amazon.com/Einsteins-Relativity-Beyond-Approaches-Theoretical/dp/9810238886
Jong-Ping Hsu: "The fundamentally new ideas of the first purpose are developed on the basis of the term paper of a Harvard physics undergraduate. They lead to an unexpected affirmative answer to the long-standing question of whether it is possible to construct a relativity theory without postulating the constancy of the speed of light and retaining only the first postulate of special relativity. This question was discussed in the early years following the discovery of special relativity by many physicists, including Ritz, Tolman, Kunz, Comstock and Pauli, all of whom obtained negative answers."

http://o.castera.free.fr/pdf/chronogeometrie.pdf
Jean-Marc Levy-Leblond: "D'autre part, nous savons aujourd'hui que l'invariance de la vitesse de la lumiere est une consequence de la nullite de la masse du photon. Mais, empiriquement, cette masse, aussi faible soit son actuelle borne superieure experimentale, ne peut et ne pourra jamais etre consideree avec certitude comme rigoureusement nulle. Il se pourrait meme que de futures mesures mettent en evidence une masse infime, mais non-nulle, du photon ; la lumiere alors n'irait plus a la "vitesse de la lumiere", ou, plus precisement, la vitesse de la lumiere, desormais variable, ne s'identifierait plus a la vitesse limite invariante. Les procedures operationnelles mises en jeu par le "second postulat" deviendraient caduques ipso facto. La theorie elle-meme en serait-elle invalidee? Heureusement, il n'en est rien ; mais, pour s'en assurer, il convient de la refonder sur des bases plus solides, et d'ailleurs plus economiques. En verite, le "premier postulat" suffit, a la condition de l'exploiter a fond."

Few people know that, logically, Einstein's revolution is an exact copy of Clausius's revolution. Initially, the miracle called "second law of thermodynamics", just like the miracles called "time dilation", "length contraction", "Minkowski's spacetime" etc., had been deduced from a false original postulate. Then Clausius managed to "prove" that, although the original postulate is false, the miracle is true and eternal.

Pentcho Valev
pvalev@yahoo.com

 
 

Re: DESPERATE EINSTEINIANS

October 1 2008, 3:50 AM 

I've said in other places, and possibly here.

The only things that will hold true from Relativity are the relationship between Space, Time, Motion, and Mass.

It isn't about the speed of light, to claim it is only shows you don't know what the reference to the speed of light implies.


Without invoking the speed of light, I can give you a description of Relativity.


3 Spatial Dimensions and 1 Time Dimension.

An objects motion through the 1 Time Dimension is determined by it's mass.

Motion through the Spatial Dimensions can be described equivalently as increasing the mass of an object. This reduces motion through the Time Dimension.

The presence of an object with great mass distorts the 3 Spatial Dimensions in it's vicinity, this distortion makes the path of least action lead towards the source of the mass.

This motion towards an object with great mass, as above, reduces an objects motion through the Time Dimension.


...you get the idea, I can go further into observation, simultaneity, etc, if requested.

The speed of light is only used as an example, and postulated as a maximal velocity for bodies with rest mass.

 
 

So the mass increases?

October 2 2008, 1:08 AM 

So the mass increases? It's a good thing not too many things go that fast, their mass would soon take over the universe.

 
 

Re: DESPERATE EINSTEINIANS

October 2 2008, 2:27 AM 

Yes, relativistic mass increases.

You can tell this when something collides with something else at a high relative velocity.


Two marbles traveling at half the speed of light relative to each other will collide with a force which could be measured more easily in bus masses, than marble masses.

 
 

Max,

October 2 2008, 8:19 AM 

How many marbles have reached that speed?

 
 

Re: DESPERATE EINSTEINIANS

October 2 2008, 6:19 PM 

Look up "Particle Accelerators".

 
 
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