Aaron:

I'm sure you are aware that the fractal process usually takes a very simple math formula to produce. It fantastic ramifications arise from using the output of the last cycle of the operation of the formula for the input of the next cycle of the formula. It is a feedback system.

A little thought will reveal that; that is how reality works. Everything that happens anywhere is a result of everything that just happened an instant before. This is where MAX is screwed up. He thinks the past is something that can be revisited in the present.

Sure, pictures of it are available, that is what a picture is. No picture of the future can be had, because the future is not worked out yet. The present is the result of what just happened, the next present is the result of what happened right now. Everywhere.

Due to the finite speed of light, by looking into the distance we simultaneously look into the past. Does the past influence the present? Duh! reread the first paragraph, Max.

Yes Curt,

We will find that if we use fractal equations in our ###dynamics(hydro, thermal, density...) equations, we will find equations that accurately model the possible outcomes of the next position.

But even though the fractal solutions seem simple, its the interactions between ###dynamics that cause serious complexity. This is where our equation will be Medusa Ugly.

a

Yes Curt,

We will find that if we use fractal equations in our ###dynamics(hydro, thermal, density...) equations, we will find equations that accurately model the possible outcomes of the next position.

But even though the fractal solutions seem simple, its the interactions between ###dynamics that cause serious complexity. This is where our equation will be Medusa Ugly.

a

I didn't say I could go visit the past, way to misunderstand my statement.


If you're in a boat floating downstream in a river, you can change your position in the river by sticking paddles in and doing so.

The more you try to change that position, the faster you have to paddle, because you have to displace exponentially more water to gain every little bit of speed as you get near the speed of light.

It's just an aspect of being bound into space by having REST MASS.



I said the past is there.


When you're floating upstream in a river, does the river behind you disappear?


Of course not, that's absurd.


Yet you tell people the past is still there, and they propose all sorts of outlandish ideas to explain that it isn't.


I can give you a simple way to interact with the past and future, quantum mechanics.


Course, that's just from my observation about the nature of time giving an understandable explanation for quantum effects.


You could also just say that light lets you interact with the past, and if you don't understand why, you should re-think your position on Relativity, because you don't understand what it implies.

Max, the past is there for someone really far away, with a really powerful telescope. But you will never see it unless it was recorded by big brother watching over you to prevent terrorism.

Of course you can have a boat with a powerful motor and exceed the speed of the river flow, But you yourself believe that Einstein's speed limit is chiseled in stone. We see the past all the time. The activity on the Sun happened eight minutes ago. There is no way earthlings can participate it the past activity there.

You should read more about what Relativity actually says, and see why the "speed limit" is there.

It isn't an arbitrary "you can't go faster than this" type of thing.

Just to add, there IS a certain type of situations predicted by Relativity which would allow you to move back into the past.

Look up the Godel Universe solutions, and perhaps you'll understand better why I say Now is just an artifact of your perception, and actually corresponds to your motion through time.

I am trying to understand reality. I was born at night, but not last night.

Ok, help me understand your perception of Reality, and why it doesn't coincide with Relativity.


Why is your perception of a Now any more valid than the way SR describes time?

I realize that the only thing left of the past is the ever expanding wave fronts depicting it. Outside of a video of the past events, you would have to travel superluminally to some viewing venue, and look back with a very powerful telescope to see yourself in action. That being the case, you would no longer be where the original action took place. so much for travel into the past.

Max said: "Look up the Godel Universe solutions, and perhaps you'll understand better why I say Now is just an artifact of your perception, and actually corresponds to your motion through time."

Curt says: Max, here is one of your problems: Just because you imagine some "universe," doesn't make it reality, except in your own mind. Godel's universes do not make logical sense unless the meta assumptions are considered. His "Universes are merely mathematical constructs, just like the inertial frame. They are imaginary. You do not have the ability to discriminate between imagination and reality.

You haven't even figured out the ambiguities in the "at rest frame," and you go off muttering about moving through time and space like you know all there is to know about that subject. I can see that you don't. You don't even understand what an inertial frame is, logically.

We observe in the rest frame, (where distance is not changing between objects,) at any instant, events that have already transpired at various times in the past. The further away they were, the further into the past they were. Yet, we do not make the distinction that they happened at different times in the past.

Curt: We observe in the rest frame, (where distance is not changing between objects,) at any instant, events that have already transpired at various times in the past. The further away they were, the further into the past they were. Yet, we do not make the distinction that they happened at different times in the past.

cinci: Are you saying two events can't happen at the same time if there is any distance between them?
****************

Cincirob asks: "Are you saying two events can't happen at the same time if there is any distance between them?"

Curt scratches his head and wonders where Cincirob gets his take on things. Cincirob, there is an ongoing universal instant during which everything all across the Universe "happens" at the same time. Everyone thinks they get to see these happenings all at once. Nobody does, because the "happenings" are all at different distances. When you look out across the landscape, the close happenings are younger than the far happenings. You apparently cannot differentiate between the actual happening and the viewing of it.

We have already been over this ground, and I can't believe you think I would think anything like your above supposition .