I noticed today on the Tracy Site that the Kata Requirements have been adjusted.  Some of the weapons (Butterfly Wings and Iron Butterfly) have been removed, and the katas have been spread out to go thru 7th black.

Is this recent?  I notice that on the technique charts, the kata requirements are still as they have been since I started.

Interesting situation for sure, some get better with age, others just age.

The ability and forms are for the younger set as a rule, reminds me of the arguement about being very overweight and still very tough and strong...

Sort of a no brainer once you are over 60 as to what is what.

The carrot and the stick comes to mind...Sad really.

Gary

Gary, not sure what you mean about the carrot and the stick.  No requirements have been added, and for those of us who learned the material through 5th Black, we currently now already have the kata requirements thru 7th plus a few extras.  With this restructure, I have a 4th black and a 3rd black who have already tested the katas that are now required for 5th.  It does not seem as if a carrot is being dangled, but rather that some of the material is being spread out.

Also, I spoke to Mr. Tracy a couple of years ago and he mentioned that at some point, he would be placing kata and techniques in the upper black belt ranks (6-9).  He was very quick to say that these would not be requirements, but rather a way of preserving some of the techniques and forms that are not currently part of the structured system.  In other words, those who choose to learn them/teach them would have them available.  There are many techniques that are a part of kenpo that are no longer part of any of the curriculums that few people know.  I think that Mr. Tracy's goal is to preserve those techniques by making them available, without actually increasing rank requirements.

Dave,
Thank you for the answer. I feel you have a good handle on it.

Many I have seen add an extra kata or two as a way to get more into a system that is basicly not really that full of kata. Many do the same thing with drills and time in grade.

Not many should be above 5th in my opinon and very few where Ted has gone, and if you look at the system it is obvious it is a solid outfit not a dozen or more breaking off and starting their own, and becoming 10s in a system that is just a make believe...

Bruce Juchnik broke off, but he calls himself "Hanshi" that is around 7th in some 8th in others, and not a GM at all.
He has been awarded higher in other systems but not in his own, student and last disciple he mentions. That is good imo...That part, of it anyway.

His teaching has reached about 20 katas LOL...Selling a product is what that is all about.

Regards,
Gary

I have been told that at one time techniques were taught and used in the group class setting that were not part of the general curriculum that were taught in the private lessons. This was the reason that more than a few techniques that were a part of the requirements for belt levels in Rod Martin’s Kenpo Karate were in fact the “group class” techniques. Years ago GM Al Tracy mentioned that to me as one of the differences of this offshoot of Tracy’s. As always, those other techniques were fairly sophisticated and functional. I have never really tried to find out the all as I do not have my notes anymore after all this was close to forty years ago. If I remember there were around two hundred of these techniques someone said at one time.

I am amazed at how many there are totally that can be part of the whole system. That is a lot of development in such a short time period in the beginning and as the years rolled on by more were added as the knowledge and exposure increased, whew!

BB,
Several of the folks that are more loyal to W. Chow have said: It was all about creativity and it still is as far as they are concerned. Give credit where credit is due, be honest to your students, and they will be honest towards you, as their teacher...Ideal Phase

Gary

This creativity ideology seems to be ingrained with the Kenpo lineage and even Mitose has been quoted that after a number of “tricks” practiced until skilled and automatic then this can go on with infinite combinations. That is however if one has the true “Skill” and knowledge. I have seen some pretty lame stuff when someone thought that they were skilled and knowledgeable enough to make up their own “expression”.

Recently my friend and fellow martial artist was analyzing the Choy Li Fut forms as far as the Dim Muk “nerve striking” sequences; foot patterns etc. as Choy Li Fut is fairly old and does use this eastern medical cosmology. Yes, it is in the forms including strikes in certain areas from a cat stance that would change the polarity of the hand that is striking to the area that would be the opposite charge thus neutralizing the area. It was pretty revealing and not by accident. I find that amazing that combat engineers would put this “theory” into their combat method. Undoubtedly, it had been “field tested” more than once over the generations to convince practitioners of its value and therefore was retained in the system.

There is a lot out there when you investigate movements and why it is done in such away. I just try to be practical as really you can get lost in this stuff. There have been some dangerous pretty smart cookies I have run across over the years.

At San Jose Kenpo I do use the new technique requirements, however we still keep the kata requirements as they were back in the 60’s. There are about 200 -250 techniques that never got put into the manuals that I still teach, but only as group drills. I do not require them to be performed on belt tests.

Ted

I think "adjusted" is the best way to describe it Dave. I went back and looked at an old list I have going back to 1991. It appears the list is the same but I see some minor changes in the order taught.

As for the techniques I can relate to what Dr. Ted is saying. I can also tell you that some time back on this site someone posted Ed Parker doing if memory serves me right bow of compulsion. While the video was kind of hard to view, you can see Mr. Parker demonstrating the move against a tuite attack, or a "wrist lock". That was a move I remember learning years ago.

There are many moves that I learned as group class moves. I remember one guy liked to call them comparison moves or something like that. Some moves were changed a little for demonstration, and might be called Demo moves. Some moves had throws and knee cap strikes in them and might be called removed due to insurance coverage liability techniques. Ha Ha. I made up that last one.

Adios,

M