4-4 after 2, Mizzou will start the 3rd with a man advantage due to a 5' major (they've already scored 2 goals on the major)

They're playing Ferris State, not Mizzou! and MSU is losing 6-4 in the 3rd

Ferris State wins over MSU 6-5 - the 5' major against MSU was the killer

The player that took the major (actually a 7 minute penalty) led the Bears in pim's with 96 minutes in 20 games. He had 3 goals in the regular season to go with those 96 minutes in penalties.

I've not seen the Bear' play much this year so I don't know what this kid brings to the team and don't mean to pick on him but I hope some lessons are learned along the way.

Yeah, I'm not sure why you take a penalty like that in a game you're leading 4-2, with the other team showing signs of giving up. Then you do something stupid like that to get the other team fired up, while your own team tries to kill a 7' penalty. That's the difference between the really good teams and the rest of the teams. Lack of discipline on taking dumb penalties is MSU's downfall this season. But, they still have a shot this coming weekend. (think they'll play that guy?)

As much as the Bear's like to play undisciplined hockey from time to time and give playing time to players that don't appear to contribute much but add PIM's to the scoring sheet. They don't have anything on Mizzou. A quick check of Mizzou shows that they average about 45 minutes in penalties a game! That's almost twice what the Bear's average.

I'd think the easy way to beat Mizzou would be to watch them go to the penalty box and capitilize on the power play. Two problems with that theory though, one the Bear's will likely play the same game as their opponent meaning their penalty minutes will be way above normal coupled with the fact that they don't usually capitilize on the power play!

To validate my thoughts I went back and looked at the first game between MU and MSU in November. The Bear's took 44 minutes in penalties and lost.

Anon: The first part of your opening sentence is correct... undisciplined hockey has been a problem....but the second part is not entirely correct. The coaching staff would not keep a player on the roster if he was only good for padding the penalty minutes.

You really can't go back to the November games and use that as validation because that was the time when USA Hockey mandated tighter enforcement of the rules.

Though Missouri State lost 3-4 and 2-1, in the first game the Ice Bears out shot Mizzou 50-25 but were only 2 for 15 on the power play. The Tigers were 1 for 13.

Game two of the series was not indicative of the outcome as the Ice Bears out shot (39-31) the Tigers in the game, had a 20-7 shot advantage (and still trailed 1-0) but ended up losing again 2-1.

Bottom line in these games: Mizzou's goaltenders.

Anon: One thing you didn't mention is that Missouri State has 16 shorthanded goals this season....so perhaps it's better they are shorthanded...I'm kidding. Good comments though.

One point regarding giving playing time to players that don't appear to contribute much outside of adding PIM's. There was a time when intimidation was a big part of ice hockey. That is no longer the case. So I'm really not sure why a coaching staff tolerates kids that take penalties way outside of the average.

The Bear's have two players that combined for 164 minutes in penalties (almost 20% of the Bear's total penalty minutes.) These players don't contribute a lot to the score sheet. I don't have access to plus/minus stats (flawed statistic anyway) but I think it's appropriate to question why they log so much ice time.

Regarding the penalty numbers from the first MSU - MU game. Go back and look at the penalties, 24 minutes in unsportsmanlike and checking to the head penalties. Those don't have much to do with "rules enforcement".

All that said, Mizzou is very beatable, just requires a more disciplined approach from the Bears. And yes you have to give kudo's to Mizzou's goaltending in that series. Who gets the start for the Bear's?

Your answer is that 4 "D" and 9 "FWD" cant play the entire game at this level. So you play what you got. And since when do you have to be on the score sheet just to be a contributor ?? Bad penalty....Yes. What was the "5" for?

Your logic implies that their aren't other options, we're not talking about a program that doesn't have kids, there are several kids that don't dress every game. Dress kids that won't hurt you.

5 Minute Major for Head Contact

Discipline is a problem, with some players. As far as head contact, a LOT more COULD and SHOULD be called. A bad penalty at a bad time....YES. However, it's very easy to 2nd guess the coaching staff after the fact. Dress someone else? Maybe, if they have the speed and skill. It's hard to keep your #9 scorer among fwds on the bench when you occasionally need 4 lines. However, in the future.....

MSU may have outshot Mizzou, they pretty much out shoot everybody, and i take nothing away from Mizzou goaltending, but lets be honest, MSU out shoots their opponents because they shoot from EVERYWHERE. Occasionally those shots go in, and that's great, but teams have to create scoring opportunitys to win, and Mizzou does that more often than MSU, that's why they win.

Listening to the game on WSR and the kid who was guilty of taking the 7 minutes that turned the game last weekend is trying his best to turn this one around as well. He's been to box twice already in the first period.

Absolutely right about shots...taking a lot of shots from the blue line means just that...a lot of shots..it's the quality shots that help score goals. MSU has 3 qualified goaltenders - a bigger defensive presence in front of the net might help the goalies see the shots better.

Quality or quantity - it doesnt matter for shots as long as you have at least one. Even better if you have both. The more shots you take, the more chances you will have at scoreing. Remember, if you don't shoot you can't score. Also, don't forget, if it isnt on net (or gets blocked) - it doesnt count as a shot on goal. MSU hasn't been outshooting opponents like crazy all season, from what I can remember. Granted, game against some weaker teams will be lopsided, but we've also been on the recieving end of that as well. Shooting from all over is NOT a bad game plan. In fact its actually a pretty damn good one. More shots = more rebounds, which turn into goals. You dont have to snipe every shot you take. It makes the goalies and the defense work harder.
If you need clarification on this, watch a game and see how many goals are really scored from great shots. Its the rebounds, screens, and defletions that get the goals. Not perfectly calculated shots.

As for playing players with lots of penalty minutes, from a score sheet perspective, one of the players (becasue I know of one you all are talking about, but am not who the other one is) you have valid arguments. BUT, the game is a lot more than just stats on a paper. He is a playmaker, and may not have lots of assists, but when a physical presence is needed, or a grinder for the corners, he is the top guy to get the job done, he isnt afraid to hit (illegal at times, yes), and is 110% all the time. He hits and causes turnovers so his linemates can score. Thats his role. His job isnt to score, but to give his linemates a better chance to score. His intensity is also contagious on the bench and is a good model for the younger (and some of the older) players to remember what it takes.

Reko - I believe two of the most negative things that can occur in a hockey game are 1.) the goalie gives up a bad goal and 2.) a player or players take bad penalties.

I think you can appreciate this comparison. If a goalie lets in a terrible goal (hey it happens!) one of two things are likely to occur. Either the team will rally behind the goalie and turn it into a positive or the team will quit. I've seen both occur more times then I can count.

On the same page, players that repeatedly take bad or excessive penalities can suck the life right out of a team. I've also seen that happen more times than I can remember.

I think the bottomline to this is that your penalty leaders better be making MAJOR contributions in other ways. In my opinion seldon is that the case, which is why the players that take inordinate numbers of penalty minutes in hockey are a vanishing breed.

I (and Reko) have an idea of who "the player in question" is and all I can say is that he played one of the most incredible games of his hockey career. Granted he had one point and one 2-min penalty, but he was instrumental in bringing the MACHA Gold Championship home to Springfield, Missouri.

This player went into the corner and dug the puck out and his pass resulted in the Ice Bears first goal breaking the 3-0 SIUE lead. Everywhere the puck was, he was there too. He He motivates. He gives spirit to the team bench, and he gained a new found respect from me.

Steve

I really didn't ever want this to be about a kid or two. It's really a higher level issue for me. I doubt that most coaches in club sports understand how to measure the performance and contributions of individual players and how those performances affect their teams.

I'm amazed that many of the teams don't even video tape their games. Their is absolutely no way a coach can effectively evaluate player/team performance without that aid. Period, no way. There is just too much going on and your at a terrible vantage point on the bench to see everything. But lot's of coaches don't take the time or make the effort to tape and review the games.

Analytics is finally being embraced by the sport of hockey. Hockey is probably a decade 9or two) behind other sports but some coaches are finally getting it.

One of the first things Andy Murray said when he took over the Blues was, we're leading the league in penalty minutes, does anyone think that might have something to do with us having one of the worst records in hockey. Duh!

There is a great study done by a guy named Alan Ryder that looks at player performance from a statistical analysis perspective. Andy computes positive and negative player performances. A major component in determining whether a player is a postive or a negative contriubtor is yep you guessed it, his ability to avoid penalties.

I agree completely, bad penatlies are detrimental to both the team and the player as are goalies giving up bad goals. But will you bench a goalie for letting up a bad goal or two when his play otherwise would have you start him? Bad goals happen, as do stupid penalties, especially in the heat of competition. The bad penalty vs. Ferris State was after he got tackled from behind and thown to the ice.

I think we are just talking about two different things (the difference being me talking about one specific player and you talking in general or overall). Yes, bad penalties are horrible for team but he doesnt take all bad penalties as some on this forum seem to think. He has certainly taken some, yes, but I still would play him becasue of his other contributions. If we had other large penalty takers (as in equivalent to him) or if his play on the ice was worse, then this would be very different.

There are smart penalties (taking someone out of the play on a breakaway or sure goal scoring opportunity) and dumb penalties - like retaliating. My only point is that good teams with good players know when to skate away. Refs never see the first penalty; they only see the retaliation and you end up having to play short.

MSU has had a number of games where dumb penalties are taken; and I'm sure a lot of other teams do the same. HOWEVER, I'm not talking about other teams. I'd like to see MSU pick it up a notch and take the high road, forcing other teams to play shorthanded. That will help separate them from the rest of the pack and join the other elite, fine-tuned, well-oiled, impressive teams that play with discipline and keep coming at you.

Great ending to this year's season - Go BEARS!