What's the issue? The latest game starts at 8 on Friday and 6 on Saturday. The schedule is staggered enough to allow teams to rest before the next round. Sunday games at 10 and 1 I'm guessing so the teams can play and then travel back to campus that day for Monday classes. What would you have done different?
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You are more then welcome to come to the league meeting on March 29th and give a proposal to host the tournament at any rink of your choice. You plan it and run it. Until you do that, zip it. You criticized but that's it.
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Don't feel bad. Last year's MACHA Semi-finals and Championship games for Silver started at 9am. That's the problem with using only a single sheet of ice, although there are 3 sheets at the International Ice Center, but only one was available at the time.
Larry Thatcher really wanted the games this year and he is an excellent tournament chairperson, things will work well.
Now, the Ice Bear's Jordan Valley Ice Park does have 2 sheets of ice and could have been a better choice, but I wonder if it could be that Springfield is geographically undesirable compared to the travel distances other teams would incur.
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are you sure that second round is going that way, with first seed playing lowest remaining? that isn't how it was stated in the schedule released by larry.
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Kitch is correct. The original schedule that was sent out by me, some time ago, indicated different match-ups, on Saturday,than the schedule attached here. We found it only fair that the top team should have the advantage in all games they particpate in throughout the tournament. They worked hard for it.
All Clubs should check your respective e-mails. I have sent out the tournament format today to everyone. Please feel free to contact me if you have any questions. Larry Thatcher will give you an excellent response ( i just had to write that so the guy that had never seen those two words in a sentence before would get to see it... just once
Peace to all, and good luck this weekend!
LT
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LT suggest checking St. Peters Rec Plex. Brand new 1400 seat NHL style arena. Would be great site for tourney and would give great exposure...better than East Alton.
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You people are amazing on the comments about East Alton. It's an excellent hockey rink and Thatcher offered to take the tournament this year while the league worked to determine a possible permanent site. A centrally located dual sheet rink would be nice, though they didn't use the two sheets available at last years venue.
As far as East Alton making big bucks on this event how do you people think they are doing that? He had to clear a weekend of youth and high school events to make the rink available. He's not selling any extra ice he wouldn't have already had on contract. If the tournament was held in April or summer that would be a net gain on ice but not February when all his ice is sold.
I'm amazed by some of the stupid comments that are made by people supposedly involved in this sport that would know these things, but maybe they have no clue about the ice rink business.
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1st SIU-E is hosting the tourney so it should be at there rink no where else.
2nd NEVER EVER say that East Alton it an excellant Ice Arena because it SUCKS, the ice surface is horrible, the boards look like there are going to fall, the locker rooms are tiny, and youll be lucky to get an ice make after every period.
3rd it wasnt high school games they were planning around but a MEN's dropp in that has had them playing at 11pm on friday nights
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I think you are talking about Fairview Heights, because there is nothing bad about East Alton. It may not be NHL quality, but its as good as it gets in college hockey.
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East Altons boards are in very good shape, they have all new glass installed around the rink, the rink, rooms, stands and locker rooms are clean...more than I can say for most places. The ice surface is about as good as it gets and if you had a game with no zam you were probably being blown out by about ten goals and they were trying to get the game over.
Doesn't matter if it's mens leagues, open sessions, high school or youth association that the MACHA tournament is replacing, the issue is that East Alton doesn't pick up anything from this tourney. The ice was all sold. What do you not understand about that? Friday night mens league, their biggest open session of the week and high school practices in the afternoon were moved. Saturday and Sunday EA moved youth and high school slots, including very profitable high school games.
What you know about the ice business wouldn't chill a bottle of pop.
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no.... we didnt get a zam in between a period because of time....... a college hockey game having a time limit is a joke. PLEASE quit saying its one of the best rinks in the st. louis area (maybe across the river), just because you play there doesnt mean its the best. it means you are used to it.
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To the person that said the boards look like they are going to fall... They did. In the MSU vs. Iowa game the boards needed to be fixed in mid game. It took about 20 minutes...
Also, if anyone that was there noticed... you could see the concrete through the ice... good lord.
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The ice thing has already been addressed. Also, if you have played hockey for more than 2 years or played on more than 2 rinks ever then at some point you would have already seen it. It does happen at times. When it does, you don't shut down the rink and redo everything, you just correct it the next time. So many perfect people on this board.
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The Feb 27th poster is a genius. The boards didn't fall down, a piece of glass became loose after contact. This happens in NHL rinks as well in case you don't notice. It had nothing to do with the boards.
And you saw concrete eh? That's a miracle since there is no concrete under the East Alton ice. Its a sand based system.
I love the ice rink experts.
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Well, actually all rinks have concrete and sand. From top to bottom: Brinewater is pumped into pipes embedded in the ice-bearing concrete slab. The ice-bearing slab sits below the skating surface (about an inch of ice) and between the ice and a layer of insulation, which allows the ice to expand and shrink as temperatures and time demand. The brinewater helps keep the ice-bearing slab's temperature just below 32 F so that the water spread onto it can freeze.
Underneath the layer of insulation, a heated concrete layer keeps the ground below the ice from freezing, expanding and cracking the rink structure. The entire rink sits on a base layer of gravel and sand which has a groundwater drain at the bottom.
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WSR
You need to do more homework. Not all rinks have concrete and in fact, until the new NHL rinks, many of those rinks were sand based. There is no concrete on these sand based rinks. The sand is saturated and frozen. And the ice is kept at 18 to 22. At 32 you would probably be skating on ice. The only concrete near the ice surfact at East Alton is the concrete that the boards sit in.
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I thought the tournament was run as well as a tournament can be run. Everything started on time, they employed experienced personnel in the box to work the clock, keep score and announce the scoring and penalties. (From what I heard on the WSR broadcast from Chicago I don't think the same thing could be said.)
The ice at East Alton has been good since the day the facility opened with rare exceptions. I certainly didn't see anything that would leave one to believe it was different during the tournament.
I am curious as to why the lighting was so much better down at the end where the zamboni comes on and goes off. Extra fixtures had been added at that end but not at the other.
Running a tournament is work, Larry Thatcher and his crew did a great job and no I'm not from "that" side of the river.
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3:36 poster...I didn't build the rink. But I was there when it was build, ground up and have been involved with that rink since day one. I have seen the rink without ice and there is no concrete below, believe me.
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"In any climate, an arena ice surface can be installed in a properly built space. This consists of a bed of sand, or occasionally a slab of concrete, through (or on top of) which pipes run. The pipes carry a chilled fluid (usually either a salt brine or water with antifreeze) which can lower the temperature of the slab so that water placed atop it will freeze. Such rinks were developed in the late nineteenth century, the first being the Glaciarium in London."
Let's start a new post for "Ice Rink 101 - Theory and Concepts". I'm sure the first enrollee would be WSR since they seem to believe they know everything.
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Let's start a new post for "Ice Rink 101 - Theory and Concepts". I'm sure the first enrollee would be WSR since they seem to believe they know everything.
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Guess I should jump on and dispel some myths. I don't know who the poster is that was here from the time the rink was built, but I appreciate your input, and the kind words of all those who appreciate the job that we did. I think my staff did an excellent job and my hats off to them. Their work allowed all of us to enjoy the tournament without worry.
Ice rinks - East Alton is in fact, a sand based rink, as are many around the area. There's no need to have a concrete floor for your ice unless you are a multi purpose facilty, and many rinks opt out of the cost of concrete for that reason. WSR was right in some respects, wrong in others, but not bad anyalsis (if we kept our ice surface at 32 degrees it would be slush). East Alton is a "direct system", meaning there is not a brine solution (indirect system) running through the floor. The water is frozen directly, by R-22, much like the freezer in your refrigerator, and travels to the floor in 1/4" stainless steel tubing, spaced 4" apart, under the entire surface. We keep it around 18 - 20 degrees. There is no concrete under the sand. The sand is saturated with water, and then frozen. There is a 3" foam barrier below the sand, covered in plastic insulation, and 18" below that is a series of poly tubes about 18" apart, that a glycol solution runs through to prevent perma frost from forming, and making the ice surface heave.
There was no concrete showing through the ice, however, the ice paint that was put down last June was faulty, and degraded throughout the year. It's not a situation you can remedy without taking the ice out, which will happen this June. The ice paint doesn't affect the ice surface, and the ice surface was in very good shape for the tournament. We keep the ice at about 3/4" thick to maintain optimal hardness that good hockey players appreciate, and reduce heat transfer so as to maintain utility costs the best that we can.
We are experimenting with new lighting. The 3 extra fixtures at the west end of the rink were given to us by a lighting manufacturer as demos to see if we liked them. They are temporary, but we figured since they were in place, we would use them.
The rink is now 14 years old, and is definitley showing some wear, however, for the most part it is well maintained and an excellent place to view a hockey game. Our Zamboni is 3 years old and does a great job of maintaining the ice surface. I wish the locker rooms were larger, but their adequate, especially when compared to some other facilities, and the players benches are second to none (yeah, i do believe that).
Lastly, if you had a bad time, it's probably because of other issues. The teams that won played on the same ice as the teams that lost. Don't take away from the thrilling victories of McKendree and MSU because you missed a tape to tape pass and had to blame it on the ice.
Great games, great weekend, good times had by all(most).
Peace to All!
LT
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Regarding blaming things on the ice. I read this some time ago but was able to find it to share. This is from the guy who is responsible for making aure all of the NHL rinks have good ice.
"Dehumidification, temperature, air conditioning, pyrotechnical smoke, pucks, Zambonis and water. Craig battles them all to keep the ice temperature between 15 and 23 degrees.
At one point during last year's playoffs, Craig checked his pager. The message: "You should have been in Buffalo tonight. The ice was terrible."
Craig had a terse but insightful response.
"You know," he says, "the ice in that building isn't that bad. The biggest problem they have there is the (guy) in the penalty box who takes care of the pucks. He keeps them lined up on the dasher boards.
"You'd think they'd want to keep the pucks in the refrigerator and cold, wouldn't you? But there they are out of the refrigerator, lined up in a neat little row and losing their effectiveness."
Craig says the ideal temperature for pucks is 14 degrees. Anything wanner increases the chance they will bounce and roll."
My point (in case it escapes you) is that even the personnel associated with the NHL are likely to blame the ice for events that aren't really related.
On a completely unrelated note, I just read that the Olympic's will be played on an NHL size sheet of ice for the first time in 2010. This decision saves Vancouver a lot of money but couldn't have been an easy decision.
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This forum has been created with the purpose to constructively discuss college club hockey. We encourage you to freely discuss any topic you wish, with the caveat that you keep the discourse within the bounds of good taste. While good natured trash-talking is fun, thought provoking and acceptable, any replies that turn personal, disrespectful and/or disruptive of the intent of this forum will be deleted by the moderators of this forum.
Our intent is to build up and promote college club hockey and its teams. We need to work together and support each other to make this happen. We already have enough critics of club hockey. Let's do our best to keep things amiable on this forum, as not to give them any ammunition.
Best of luck to ALL teams!
Regards,
Jpower79
