Let me begin by saying that I have read Goodbye Natalie Goodbye Splendour. And here's my read lol. He didnt help her or look for her because he was afraid of Wagner. Huh a 30 year old guy was terrified of a not too shapely Wagner, what did he think Wagner was going to do to him, throw him overboard? And if he had, then Davern could have swam to the Coast Guard cutter which was 100 feet away. If Davern heard the terrible altercation in the cabin and that much I do believe then what a stand up guy to let it go down and then not insist on talking to Natalie. Granted a job is a terrible thing to lose, a life is a worse thing.

He didnt tell the police the truth because...well golly she was already dead and why ruin Wagners life right? Its an excellent point, I think we should never prosecute anyone who has killed their spouses if there are children involved because that would orphan the children. He didnt hear her from the water? Still laughing about that one.

******

The poster ****** (surprise) has also posted this message. The thread it is in is distorted so I will address her post here, and others should follow as the other post is unreadeable. (wide)
Here''s the post:

No you are so right there is so little Davern could have done that night. He says after all he was in fear for his life, a 30 year old guy with a physical job, he must have been TERRIFIED of Wagner a 51 year old man, gosh maybe he thought Wagner would get into an altercation with him and he might fall into the water, that would be terrifying! It was 100 feet to the Coast Guard Cutter, he would have had to swim there in that cold water and then-oh horrors maybe had to report why he ended up there. Natalie lived for hours so jeepers that would have been awkward. But then later rather than tell the police he chose to cover Wagner. Thats really all that matters, he chose to tell his story in a book not to the authorities. If you would like to talk about this I will be happy to explain the holes in his story.

Thanks

*******, you are just another RJ fan who can't accept truth. I'm not going to go through it all with you here. You are just another nasty, empty troll who twists everything to fit your own agenda: save the prince of Hollywood. He is beyond saving. Davern wasn't going to swim anywhere. Davern did everything he could do to stop the fighting. If you read the book you would understand why Davern couldn't hear Nataile's cries and why Marilyn Wayne could. Go write your own book. Anything to get you away from here. Go have luch with Fran. You two belong together.

LMAO...look at what I found when I searched ******'s name on FACEBOOK!!!!! And Rulli politely answered her! Again, just goes to show the decent character of Rulli and the evilness of others. So tell us, ****... are you in awe of Rulli's work or is your review your true feelings. You liar.

I answered her as well in a private message telling her I was sorry I had offended her but that yes it disgusts me that he did nothing. There were hours to do something, I read the book and decided he was a terrible self serving coward. If anyone should have responded to me it was Davern as I do not think Ms. Rulli is a coward, nor do I think she lied to the police. I responded to her privatley but if you want I can post my facebook reply. Do you approve of what Mr. Davern did, or more to the point did not do that night?

An R.J. fan? I think he killed her! I get sick to my stomach when I see his stupid AARP commercials and I do not like murderers. I beleive that justice delayed is justice denied. But while I dont think Davern laid a finger on her, its disgusting that he didnt lift a finger to save her either. Why does anyone have to like EITHER of them?

I am asking this in all politness what is it you like about either of them? I am genuinely curious?

So you trash Rulli because you don't like Davern? I saw that facebook thing too. Rulli had it posted: then she took it down.

Like I said I responded politley to her post. If I "trashed" her as you said, it was because sometimes you dont like the people that other people stand for. I guess a good example of this would be in politics, if you dislike the candidate then you dislike their apologists. And yes I see the book as an apologia for Dennis Davern in the same way that Gavin Lamberts book was an apologia for Robert Wagner. I do not dislike Ms. Rulli, I think she beleived her friend, well we all want to do that, but the bottom line is, however Natalie ended up in the water, if someone-anyone had just called the Coast Guard she would have been rescued. Passive evil some think is as great as active evil. I'm not sure I agree with that but our justice system seems to sentence that way so there might be something to it. I'm sorry if I offended you as well.

Just as it says in the book, Davern was an adventurer...a cavalier guy who was working for the weekend. He sees a fight: he has NO IDEA Natalie will end up dead: he never saw that side of his employer Wagner. He's drunk, he's in shock, he can't comprehend that she is in the water but he can't comprehend that she isn't. He believes RJ. He lets RJ pour him a drink: if RJ says she's ok, she probably is. He tried twice to interfere: he tried to protect them from other's hearing them... he was told to "beat it." He obeyed. He repents at his huge mistake. He is an innocent bystander of a murder. It is NOT passive evil. It is confusion to the high heavens. Rulli's hard work substantiates everything he says in character and in fact. If you don't appreciate the true work in this published product, you won't go far in the same field, trust me. You can disagree, but disagree with facts and constructive responses. You trashed a work of genuine compassion and detailed fact, in my opinion.

I think Davern too advantage somewhat too, and Rulli doesn't paint him as a saint, but she knows he's who he is, as she says in the book. I got the impression, too, that Davern threw Rulli under the bus when he did the Vanity Fair article and didn't tell her about it. But, it says right in that article that Davern wasn't paid for it. He wanted the truth out. He was probably one of the most confused people on earth. Imagine what he had to consider:
1) Hurting young daughters.
2) Getting himself KILLED
3) Turning on a friend when he didn't actually SEE how Natalie got in the water
4) Losing his entire world
5) Justice for Natalie weighing on him
6) Up against celebrity: Frank Sinatra!
7) Sleepness nights because all he wanted to do was to tell the truth.

His friend, a true friend helped him. They didn't wait 30 years, the media and police did. There is only one person to blame for Natalie's death: HER HUSBAND!
You should edit your review, it certainly doesn't set wll with someone trying to come across as "sweet" as you did in your last post. Your are meanspirted, and you look as if you don't comprehend what you read.

Gavin Lambert's book was a msiion to lie for Wagner. Rulli's work was a mission to give Natalie a voice, and she did a damn good job: the best I've seen!

Gavin Lambert's book was a mission (sorry for the misspell above) to create a scenario Wagner would hide behind for his own book: a book of lies.

I am just being myself, you didnt write a book that annoyed me so why would I be mean or critical of you? I wish Gavin Lambert were still alive so I could review his horrible book. I certainly reviewed Mr. Wagner's touching epistle! "tail swishing" how dare he?

Well money I guess, my theory is that if he hadnt written about Natalie then the book would not have sold. I appreciate your criticism of my annoyance and its valid in true crime. I have no intentions of writing a true crime book. My research led me down some dark roads on this and everything I have I am turning over to someone who does write true crime and who takes cold cases. Not that I think it will make a bit of difference, but honestly she seemed so lovely that I have to try. I know about Frank Sinatra but no one in the coast guard got knocked off-sorry too many Richard Price novels I love that phrase, nor did Thomas Noguchi, job loss yes, bullet in the head no. I agree that Mr. Davern did not see her onboard the boat or see Wagner dump her off the swimstep but he knew she was gone, he knew Wagner looked like he'd been in a fight, he would have lost his job if he had jumped off the side and swam to the nearby Coast Guard boat, absolutley he would have I agree. It sucks to lose your job, though I think the economy was better then lol. But he didnt have to take the drink he didnt have to go along.

Again I am sorry if I upset you but I just dont see the difference between Lamberts book and Ms. Rulli's from the apologia standard. I think she is a nicer person by far than Lambert was, but I just cant see the fear for his life thing. I'm not into conspiracy theories I dont think Sinatra or Wagner would have put any horse heads in his bed lol. He made a call. People make calls, his was a bad one, she died, he could have saved her and I cannot see past that. You and I will have to just agree to disagree on this one, but on the bright side we both think Wagner should leave Aspen for one of those nice state run facilities lol

Sleep tight

Davern pleaded to look for Natalie. Wagner didn't want to hurt his image. Davern might not have seen how Natalie got into the water, but when she was found the next morning and Davern identified her, he sure knew who killed her. She wasn't in the dinghy as he had prayed would be the case throughout the night.

And see we are in TOTAL agreement on that! Poor little thing. Hey I found out the weirdest thing, not only does down float like you wouldnt belive but soaking wet it keeps you warm. I have no explanation for this, but I spent the whole night in the damn cold water, my legs were freezing, upper body was not, so then I tried to see if I could bring my legs up under the coat and I could partially and they warmed up. Hell maybe North Face should have my video cause I'm telling you this is the item to wear overboard. I thought about those guys who fish the North Sea, these damn things should be compulsory. Okay now I really am going to sleep. Night

This is because of the bootleg dvds. She posted this site on the groups so now they will all come screaming on here.
Great for the site. Business is booming. Bad for the groups and her especially.
She broke the law and now she gets her vultures to circle!
Real ckass act. NOT!

Hi A, okay I'm as lost as a grizzly in L.A. what bootleg dvd's what are they off and how is someone making money off them? Now if its like a dvd of paranormal activity I get it lol. Though fortunatley-sorry I know I'm off topic lol but that opened nationwide so I didnt have to break down and buy a bootleg dvd, but you've got me really curious, do you mind telling me the story of the dvds and who has them and who is selling them and best of all what are they of?
thx
K

Just send your DVD's back to Moose, ******. Then go jump off a bridge. Take the down jacket off first.

Hi Anonomous, I dont know if there is only one of you or not so I'm answering three different posts here or just one. I promise I wont repost after this as I joined the site to see what people thought in general about all 5 books. First off I dont know who moose is, I dont have any idea what dvd's you are talking about. I dont write true crime and have no intention of trying to write it. Whatever I've learned goes to someone much better than me and goes to them for free just because its wrong that nothing ever happened. Though I dont think if Susanne Finstads book bothered the authorites anything is going to. As to the down experiment, what was interesting about it is that I got totally different results and I had a doctor there and a videographer. I am sorry if that annoys you. I dont know why it would or why you would care that the results were differnt. Thats why forensic testing is always interesting.

I also dont understand why anyone has to root for Wagner or for Davern, neither of these guys is exactly in the hero category. Sure I think Wagner killed her, have ever since I read Natasha in 2002, it made sense and its like that old saying if you hear horse hooves dont think zebras. But there are some small but strange discrepancies in Daverns story. Dont worry I wont go into them as I can tell you like the guy. I dont, I dont like Wagner and I dont like him and I have sort of clued in by now (better late than never lol) that you need to be rooting for one or the other of them to be welcome here.

Good. Turn your work over. That's what Rulli claims she wants: for people to get involved. I happen to agree with you that Davern is no saint. He's wishy-washy at best. But this book delivers the goods. MUCH moe than Finstad's and the police keep looking the other way. Can't yuo talk to Rulli. Maybe she would appreciate any help she can get. I would approach a little softer than you approach here though. You don't have a very good bedside manner.

Hi and thank you that was informative, nah you are right my bedside manner sucks, I had written questions for several days to her site and she didnt answer so really that was sort of a chum in the water kind of deal. She's a nice woman she's got a bestseller controversy sells books. Just ask Sarah Palin! I went after Mr. Wagner a lot harder, but good luck trying to raise the slightest response out of him. I think he long ago decided he was not going to be bothered by a damn thing anyone says and maybe living the good life in Aspen its all too understandable. How do you annoy a celebrity? Civil suits lol, but only relatives can initiate those and his daughters I'm sure wont and poor Lana, you get the idea she just wants to put it behind her. Besides you need a lot of money to get that sort of attorney. As to offering all these horrible things up to Ms. Rulli, that boat-pardon the pun has left the harbor.

The thing this case needs is someone so damn famous with skin as thick as an alligators to write a true crime book so explosive that it will almost force Wagner to respond. There's like four of those people on the planet, or on our side of it. In her book Ms. Rulli says she wished she could have contacted Dominick Dunne and he would have owned it and maybe who knows...but there is Mark Furhman, Vincent Bugliosi, Ann Rule and Joe McGinnis. Other than that who could really do it? Oh and my dive master buddy thinks my stupid experiment in the pool is ridiculous he says and I think he's right that without adding panic into the mix you just wont ever know how that rolled out. To get panic would mean uhm shark infested waters, so that probably narrows down my list of four to a list of two, Furhman and McGinnis, they're both cold case guys too.

You believe Wagner killed Natalie but you are attacking Davern and Rulli. That does not make sense. Kill the messenger?

*****. Again. Rulli already tried the down jacket experiment and it's written about in her book, the one you apparently didn't read. Or, if you did, you would know that everything you just told us about down jackets is in GNGS. If you recreated Rulli's test, thanks for telling us the same results Rulli came up with. Maybe you should go "take the drink" - you are annoying.

You forgot to mention that Rulli has talked with the lead detectives on the case. Kath suggested that the book was written instead of going to the police (idiot) in another thread. She says the authors pimp themselves out, then she comes here and acts like the one who can do better. I'm ignoring the idiot. She's an RJ fan from start to finish. Natalie is obviously her last concern.

This is the trouble we have and we are all speaking about. Personal attacks on Rulli and Davern and private people who support GNGS. Now Rulli and Davern are called pimps but as soon as someone responds back with a riposte against RJ Wagner or one of his supporters hell breaks loose and it starts all over again.

That's your opinion ******* an opinion of a loser.

I think the site owner is on to her games because as soon as the posts turn up the names are edited.
When will she learn? Poor dear has major issues and everyone is onto the game.
Natpack Hart to Hart Stefanie Powers group Natchat RJ group all came together on this one and the jury has spoken. Guilty as charged.

you mean its bad to call him a filthy murderer who didnt only kill her but has lived off her money all these years? Dang my bad. Not that he cares, the air is rare in Aspen

Instead of calling him those names on here where you can hide behind a computer, why don't you send him your thoughts personally and see how gar you get with calling him a filthy murderer.
I am not an RJ Wagner fan but come on now. Make that statement in public and you sure will have a lot of explaining to do.