This event has a little different name and a new location, at the Flying Squirrel Studio, just 4 miles north of Backus, Minnesota. There is a powerful force of friendship, brotherhood and sacrifice that is poring into this event because of the respect for the two carvers who are continuing their quest to build the most respected and desired carving event in the world.
There are going to be so many well known and respected carvers supporting this event, that it brings a lump in my throat, just talking about it. The attitude of comradery and the knowledge of being part of a great and noble happening is driving each of us to do all we can to make this event the best it can be.
Good people come together in this carving community to help each other in a time of need. Look at the help given to Gary Keenan, in Des Moines, Iowa, by carvers from the Northeast, when he unfortunately broke his leg. And now people from across the United States and Japan are reaching out to support these two good men in Minnesota. You just have to love being a part of this.
But on the other side of the coin, you have to be sadden because they are doing this despite the attempt by one person, R.D. Coonrod, with the help of 6 carvers willing to live with the stigma of being part of an evil scheme to cut the throats of A. J. Lutter and Ross Olson. It is hard to imagine anyone allowing themselves to be a part of something so wrong. Maybe they can live and sleep with their choice that just smells so bad. It just points out that not everything is always sweet like roses.
Sometimes evil people can cause, otherwise, good people to support them in wrong doing. I dont know if they are told outright lies, spins or twist on the truth or if I.O.U.s are called in. It doesnt matter, but they will be walking around with their heads hung down when they meet those of us that have our heads high. It could just be about making money and morals and high ideals are not considerations that fit into their decision making.
Forgive me for seeing things so black and white. I just hope that no one that I know and admire is one of the Dirty Half Dozen.
Sorry to end on a negative note because so many of you dont like the drama, but not a single day goes by that the evil part of this weekend in Minnesota doesnt rent negative space in my head and my heart. I just hate that this is happening and not talking about it doesnt do anything stop it or prevent it from happening again and again.
It is not too late to clear your conscience and drop out of the Log Hogger event.
I am only a part time hobby carver,and my livelihood doesn't revolve around making a living chainsaw carving.I do it for the sheer enjoyment.I was advised by the people who taught me how to carve to stay out of this, but your consistent soap box self righteousness is drawing me into this bull**** like a moth to the flame.Obviously, through your rose colored glasses I'm going to get burned,but as you so eloquently wrote, there are to sides to every coin.I have never met Ross and only met A.J. once, and I bear them no anomosity whatsoever.
From working with Loghoggers here in Wisconsin I have nothing but admiration for the way they do business, and am thankful and appreciative for them allowing me to be a part of their events.I personally enjoy the hell out of the opportunity to work with R.D. and his family every year,and if I get off of work will gladly help them out in Hackensack. If I can't get off of work,I'll support them however I can.Let the cards fall where they will.
In a lot of your recent posts you half heartedly apologize for the drama,who are you trying to kid? You are a DRAMA QUEEN! -ken trapp
America and the free world is built on open competition. Only the strong and good stay around. I support both of the Events. I like to be an equal opportunity person. Sounds like the carving world is split into 2 main groups of people.
it was AJs and Ross's event and they got blindsided and had it basically hijacked and the hijackers got RD involved to keep runnin it and its sorta spinned into a mess of a conflict now that probably should never have happened. if folks (and i'm not just talkin carvers) had been completely open and honest and fair it probably wouldn't have. to be honest i'd be thinking ross and aj had done wrong if RD had set up an event from scratch with a town that was very important to the founding artist RD (in hacks case it was aj and ross) and then the town played games and bascially screwed RD and then aj and ross ran down there and took it over for the town. RD said he ain't got plans to keep hackensack under his thumb and was open to AJ runnin it again but it seems the divide is too great and that probably ain't gonna happen. hell i personally like RD more than ross lol but i just feel whats happened is wrong and even AJ actually likes RD and i think vise versa and they respect each other. what dave typed was negative in the last part and i'm pass that but i think brotherhood isn't bs and if folks would embrace that and follow the golden rule a bit more in general the world would be a better place. thats why i didn't diss the loghoggers in the above post and honestly if RD were asked about folks treating each other right and fair and the brotherhood of humanity that jesus spoke of you'd probably find that he believes in that and in general tries to live by it. i do hope that the carvers from sack get to the golden saw and make new friends, rekindle old friendships, and there is something positive that can't be respresented by mere coin that results by the end. good luck and safe carving to all the carvers!
Getting everyone to get along in the carving world is like trying to get everyone in the world to get along and think they are all getting a great deal and equal to all. Not reality.
The brotherhood of carvers. I hear threats of the president of uccg threatening law suits, is this brotherhood or bad leadership to start a brotherhood?
maybe the second maybe? i don't consider brotherhood of carvers an actual organization with any real powers ect and if thats what dave or others mean then we are at differences. what i mean is brotherhood in the sense that carvers should treat each other as they would like to be treated themselves ect. nothing more really.
It is not a tangible organization. It is a feeling for each other with a desire for each ones success without taking it from another in a back handed way.
By the way I have made no threats. I have only tried to point out the reality of judgements being formed by the actions you take or don't take in life.
I wish every log hogger success working with R.D. everyplace but in Hack, because it is being done for the wrong reason, to hurt other carvers
A judgement has been shared on his forum that I am a drama queen. I accept that what I am trying to do to help A.J. a Ross will earn me many judgements, and they won't all be flattering. I give Ken kudos for standing up for what he believes to be right. I wonder if the Wizard of Odd would let me borrow his dress, next year in Ridgway. LOL
what a crock of pot, someone is blowing smoke up the carving world's ars. Give it time, it will all come out in the wash, or it will be whitewashed. Who cares what Squirel or AJ think? Squirel and AJ! Golden Chainsaw or not! Life goes on! I think they are both A-holes, your noses are just to far up there to smell where you are at...LOL...kieffer
Its the flying squirrel and AJ show, with special guest captin dave!
July 27 2009, 9:04 AM
Sounds like a bad cartoon for children. Dont worry if them grand babies are listening to you grandpa, they are watching you and they learn much quicker that way. Quite a few of the golden shower club brotherhood have blatantly committed the offenses of slander, defamation of character, liable as well as offered terrorist threats, and now discrimination by the disability collecting chainsaw carver / self appointed guild president looking to be part of anything even if he has to force himself on others. They have blocked my computer from being able to go to the appropriately named yellow room. It would seem that they want to commit their offenses with out controversy. ( I live in nice hotels this time of the year, If I wanted to post there It would be no problem, as my network changes every week and I have access to multiple computers at each location.) Thanks for being so kind as to put these offenses into print on a public forum for me. They have been recorded and forwarded to the necessary parties. This has put them in the position to be a nice insurance policy for the City of Hackensack and myself. They can and more than likely will be held accountable for their actions as well as be held responsible for any loss or damage possibly created by their actions. Try relevance in your attempts to gain support. It works much better than terrorism. I would strongly suggest that the offenders seek good legal advice at this point.
I would like to thank those that spoke up on our behalf on these posts. We do all we can with what we have to promote and support professional chainsaw sculpting. We are very busy this time of year, which makes it difficult to keep up with this Internet stuff. (I think they know this) We are sorry that you all have to be subjected to this type of business practice. I would also like to thank those that called us and the other carvers to let us know what was taking place. We appreciate your support. Hackensack will be better than ever this year and will feature a few new additions. The competitors are all fired up and ready to put on the best show the town has ever seen!
Re: Its the flying squirrel and AJ show, with special guest captin dave!
July 28 2009, 7:09 AM
You are really "IT" R.D.. UH oh, does calling you IT constitute slander? As Bill Clinton once said, it depends on the the definition of "IT", right?
To some people your post might sound like "Confident Defiance", but I see it as "Desperate Panic". Are you losing carvers? Are you making up all those phone calls? You want people to see you as the victim. Now there is a cartoon, fairy tale alright. ROTFALMAO. When I think about you, I see Napoleon invading Russia.
You cry that others have threatened you, but then you throw out threats of Law Suits. And what is the, disability, cheap shot against Jerry Shaffer? I thought that you were attempting to show the high ground in this post. Guess what, you failed. Your lack of class comes out all the time. I love it when you post. You just can't hide the mean spirited side of your personality.
You speak out in parables, like relevance instead of terrorism. Are you saying that morality, integrity, and ethical respect for Ross and A.J. are not relevant? By the way where have you seen terrorism?
As usual in your post you avoid relevance. Explain to us again, why you are so willing to drag your friends into a messy takeover of Ross and A.J.'s event. Do you need the money so badly? Can't be that because I remember that you have said money is not an issue. Are you morally corrupt? Morality is a vague concept and is different with many people and from one society to another, so please explain your view. I have stated that you probably have a legal right to invade Hack, but question your moral right to do so.
Can't you see the big picture, beyond your over powering consumption for revenge. So many of us are appalled by your obsession.
Brian posed the question so well on the yellow forum. Why would you walk your dog a mile to s***t on your neighbors lawn?
Dave, I respect your loyalty to your friends,and in the first part of your initial post,I can understand your enthusiasm for the event in September and wish everyone on both sides of this situation success.
What pushes me over the edge is the part about how anyone up at the other
Minnesota event should hang their heads in shame when you or your "good" guys walk by, or that to clear their conscience they should just abandon their commitments to suit what you percieve as "evil".
And by the way, feel free to wear the dress if you want to, but the definition of drama queen according to the online merriam-webster dictionary is: "a person given to often excessively emotional performances or reactions".There is no inflection of gender whatsoever.I researched it and then expressed it as an opinion, not to insult your gender or sexuality.-ken
What can I say, that does sound like me alright. Enthusiasm does overwhelm me at times. Keep on being observant and speaking out.
I hope the other guy doesn't consider the comment about hanging your heads low, a terrorist threat.
It does sound like I have just been threatened with a law suit. What is good for the goose isn't good for the gander Eh?
Reading your definition of drama queen over, it seems like R.D. fits under that description pretty well also. Gosh darn he and I have something in common. Oops, was that remark slander?
and honestly the posts that i've seen would be a waste of money hiring a lawyer or calling a DA to pursue. maybe there have been some mean emails that are to that level but nothing i've personally seen posted.
oh well its just a woodcarvin event at some lil don't blink or you'll miss it town thats not particularly memorable. though kieffer is often slammin everything (and maybe he has his reasons) i think in a way i have to agree with him in his statement "don't carve for others, carve for yourself" though i'm probably paraphrasing more than quoting. i've seen enough comp squabling online to make me never want to compete even if it were next door, everyone attending had only made one carving in their life, the prize was 50k with free saws for everyone, and the swedish bikini team were passing out free beers. seems like a lotta big egos and bad attitudes always come outta the woodwork. heck even if 9 outta 10 brought something delicious for the potluck stew it just takes 1 outta 10 wizzin in it to make it garbage. right on people. right on right on.
I want to clarify an important point and that is my advice to the people involved that there will possibly be negative impressions of those who attend R.D.'s event in Hack. That is not a threat, it is information and I haven't solicited anyone to do so, but my judgement on the moral aspects of this event may lead some to express their negative opinions.
I am mostly concerned about any carver who has previously carved with Ross and A.J. and now turn against them. I say shame on them, and suggest no negative actions against them. They will just be removed from my Christmas card list.
There will be some carvers with R.D. that have no clue as to the negative aspects of this event and thrilled to be invited to what they expect to be a special event. I hope that they will not be judged harshly.
I only know of a few, unnamed people who have an expressed axe to grind with either Ross or A.J.
I can see where the things I have said have been twisted, misinterpreted and changed to imply untrue meanings. That is the result of communication and I fully expected negative judgement for my words and actions of support for Ross and A.J. May the rest of you expect the same.
You may not like what I say, but I will stand up for my friends who are the best of people.
And good for you Ken Trapp for standing up for your belief.
Dave why don't you shut your pie hole!
you just keep stirring the pot!
you strike me as a brown noser and a ass kisser
like an old lady minding everybody's buisness.
You nailed it! Brian! CC says kieffer slams everyone, lol I just tell it like it smells, and your starting to smell a lot like someone who has someone else's smell.. pull your nose out and wipe it off, CC. Be yourself! Carve for yourself. For crying out loud smell yourself...lol
Ross & Aj got what they deserved, is the way i see it! Just like super steve did!
Captain Dave is only making them look worse in my eyes. I wasn't taught to keep my mouth shut when i have nothing good to say about someone, i was taught to tell it like it is. kieffer
Brian and Kieffer, no last name guys. No one is twisting your arm to click on this post. Simply ignore it, don't read it any more, duh. After the initial post, I am just responding to attacks against me, by people like you.
Your name calling and insults simply strengthen my resolve and require me to defend myself, because that is what I learned when I was little. To defend myself from bullies.
I know several good Brians in this carving world, but I don't have a clue who you are.
Kieffer, I can't recall, ever, reading anything nice you have said about anyone. I feel sorry for you living with so much bitterness inside you. I personally like all three of the guys you scorn.
I get a kick out this misconception that I have to kiss anyone's arse, brown nose nor suck up to anyone. What am I supposed to gain? I have a successful business and don't need to get invited to any comps to make a living. I like the friends that I have there.
keep typing Dave, people will see the real you soon enough if they haven't already.
I am well liked among the people who matter to me, so don't feel sorry for someone who has everything they have ever wanted. I wonder how many of your friends will take the time to gather to honor you, by digging your grave. ???? Or will your family have to pay strangers to do it?
I'm more of a fighter than a lover, so yes I will argue with anyone. When i'm right, and your so wrong, that just makes it easy. If AJ and Ross were smart, this never would have went this far. And if they had the capability to learn from thier mistakes, they would tell you to shut up. But AJ has praise for you, go figure! Not a wise man at all. Your analogy of me sounds more like him!
You are doing them no favors. RD, AJ, and Ross are big boys, let them sort it out, or not if they choose. Dave you live for this kind of turmoil, i can tell.
Sorry you missed the one time I had something positive to say on one of these forums! People really don't want to know their carving sucks, or why. Sure a few can take it, but mostly they get mad at the person who gives them advice, percieve it as an attack! Let it go Dave, people will just end up hating you, resenting you, and calling you names. Like you are doing to me! Sticks and stones, man...words only hurt if the person cares about you,,,,,and i only care about a couple people on here! my circle is full of friends, and it is large. I never was here to make friends, only came on these forums to fight the bull-sht lies of a larger than real life carving comp promoter that was getting out of hand......dejavu is what i'm feeling now....no worries people will believe what and who they want, truth has nothing to do with it! Oh and by the way kieffer is my last name.
I see on Chainsawsculptors.com event listing there are these two events plus the Golden chainsaw one. Why is everyone on RD when he's 40 miles away from the other event and there is this other one same week no one says nothing about. also drawing carvers from the Golden chainsaw one. 40 miles is a long way off why worry about it Get a new town and go on. doesn't sound like the town is worth it so small anyway. maybe everyone just likes to rile everyone when it has RD and a rodent in it
INDIANA CHAINSAW CARVING EVENT
Knox County Chainsaw Carving Festival
September 25 - 27, 2009
Knox County fairgrounds
Hosted by Charles Neighbors
Neighbors Custom Chainsaw Carvings
208 E Holmes St. Bruceville In, 47516
1-812-324-2218 Home#
1-812-899-6453 cell #
tdneighbors@avenuebroadband.com e-mail
http://www.sawdustparadise.com
These carvers coming to the event:
Dick Tilley
Brian Willis
John Williams
Sherri McCloskey
Brian Christman
Elmer Hickey
Patrick Armstrong
Johnny Roysden
Jason Emmons
Randy Rinsch
Chaz Neighbors
Desiree Neighbors
Todd Elario
Ryan Anderson
Doug Ricks
and maybe Tone!
Willy Loper
Matt Loper
Bob Taylor
Mr. & Mrs. Tim Rohr
Jamie Doeren
Jon & Marie Mykkanen
Jeff & Peggy Dahr
Sheri Keiffner
Jerry France
Sept 25 - 27
5th Annual Hackensack National Chainsaw Sculpting
Hackensack MN.
LogHoggers will be hosting the 5th Annual Hackensack National Chainsaw Sculpting Invitational Competition September 25th - 27th in Hackensack, Minnesota. This year's event will feature 6 professional compeitive artists from across the country and a few guest artists as well. $12,000 in prize money plus a percentage. Competitor spots are all full. If you would like to be considered as a guest artist, please fill out the event application form at www.loghoggers.net
Contact LogHoggers.net with any other questions or comments.
For the clarification on your name.
First I called you no names. Second, it seems perfectly natural for you to come to the forum to fight against the three men you mention, but you want to stop me from fighting for the people I believe in. You tell me to shut up but I don't tell you the same. Actually, knowing you are on the other side of this issue makes our side look sooooooo much better.
One thing you have right is that I don't mind a good fight when the choice is right in my mind. There are several times that I have entered into a good fight over important issues. But, I have been posting positive responses and sharing tools, techniques, knowledge and encouragement for 7 years on this forum. Many of my post have saved carvers time and made them lots of money. I am more of a giver than a fighter.
Another thing you are close to right in is that the truth is probably some place in the middle of both points of view and people will choose their respective sides of this issue for personal reasons.
I don't tell anyone to shut up and I don't call you any names. I just point out that if you don't like what is in this post, no one is making you click on it and read it.
I came on to inform. That is done. I don't want to argue or change peopple's mind. No more of this for me on either forum.
If you want to write to me, my e-mail is davidlavoie@bellsouth.net
Thanks for the support. Let's see how it turns out.
That last post was just a test and reminder as these posts get more personal and slanderous,that you might want to log in. Anyone can type in anything in your name.It gives you some protection and credibility. -ken trapp
these forums are so full of lies, what's it matter. techies know who writes what anyway.
BUt thanks for you concern, Ken! I'll take my chances, NO NAMERS ARE LIKE THIS lol kieffer
Perhaps this is adding fuel to the fire and honestly I would not normal share the behind the scence information, but I believe it is necessary. To ensure the full truth is there for everyone to see.
After months of working with Jerry Schieffer via email and phone calls to try to build a bridge back with Ross & AJ, I was informed by Jerry he could not help me and Ross nor AJ wanted anything to do with the event taking place in Hackensack. ( I have all these emails and recorded phone conversations, should anyone want them).
Through research of my own (as a few of you know who sent my the very colorful emails to my personal email address) I found RD as a carver through website surfing.
As you are all aware there is a timeline involved with hold events of this size.
With no response coming back from other carvers, Ross or AJ, RD told me the only way he would put together a bid would be if I had one last conversation with AJ to try to make things work.
I did this, I spoke with AJ regarding the event. I told him the town was willing to work with AJ alone this year and perhaps next year they would be open to working with Ross/Brian. But, this year it would be he alone. We spoke on the phone for about 35 minutes going round and round and it came down to he would not do the event without Ross & Brian. His choice completely (have recording of conversation if anyone would like this). Which brings it full circle to the email I received from Ross in March that said the same thing.
I called RD after my conversation with AJ and he said he would share a propsal the next week.
That is the story in a nut shell on how the town came to work with RD.
Trail of information...
As the key contact for the groups, I reached out to Ross in March of this year and offered the "olive branch" to work together. I shared I did not know the carving communities ins and outs and would the first person to admit I was not an expert, nor would I pretend to be. In addition to the emails(below) I have one conversation (recorded if anyone wants a copy)of Ross yelling at me on the phone and then hanging up on me (short communication for wanting to work with the town representative for this event).
Please follow the trail for the facts of the decline in writing by Ross. Note when I did speak to Ross of a short period of time, he did state on the phone call and in writing he spoke for AJ as well (partners).
My first email to Ross:
3/11/09
Hi Ross,
I would like to offer the oil branch...
This is an invitation for a discussion around the Chainsaw event in Hackensack. This is an internationally known event which everyone has come to love.
To prepare for our conversation, I have done some homework about you industry regarding bench marks and best practices. In addition, I continue to gather more information about the art it 'self as I am not an expert in this field as you are.
My intent is to have open communication, I am not out to point fingers or assign blame to one side or the other.
Once I hear back, I will forward the conference call number and password to access the call once all the logistics of times/dates etc are nailed down.
Best regards,
Shelly Meyers
Ms. Meyer,
I speak for AJ and Myself when I say we have no interest in working with you in any manner. I am disturbed by your connections to this event, with your mother being the most problematic personality involved last year. I have no interest in catching you up with the history of the event. Suffice it to say it was my idea, which we cultivated, and which the town benefitted.
In your ignorance, you are doing irreparable harm to the chances of an event happening in Hackensack city ever again. You have already destroyed the credibility of the town to hold a professional event by posting on a Guild forum to which we are members of the Guild. Do you think our peers are sympathetic to your cause against us? Continued contact of our carving collegues, like Liz Boni, will result in more carvers becoming aware of your self serving intentions, further limiting your options. We have secured the participation of our returning champions and will continue to lobby for a boycott of any event that is done "for the community by the community" which looks to exploit the carvers for it's own rewards.
Ross Olsen
P.S. If Dan Meyer wants to be involved with our event he is welcome, as are the Lions. We can speak directly with Dan without an uniformed interloper.
On Mar 12, 2009, at 2:54 PM, academy693@aol.com wrote:
Ross,
It truly would be sad if there was a boycott
A boycott would would only come about if negative energy is put into the wood community by a member of the community.
Again, I am reaching out with a hand of friendship. My intent is to conduct myself and the event in a professional manner and have everyone continue to work together. The Hackensack community recognizes both you and AJ as founders of this event and give you full credit for it, this has never been in question.
I volunteer over 2000 hours a year for numerous organizations in addition to serving on a Board for Missionary . This proudly give credit to my mother for teaching the value of giving back and from it you gain richness in life that money can never fill. With that said, I believe you should not be disturbed. If you still have concerns, I am more than willing to supply my 1000 hours or donated time for GE Money alone from last year not to mention my church etc.
I am merely trying to work with what little knowledge. Which, I did not believe could be fairly viewed if I did not know the true facts from each side.
My approach to this event is to run it like a business. With any business you want to have a clear understanding of what has brought this event forward, what worked, what did not work and the key players (which everyone agrees are you and AJ).
Which included the logistics:
* who the vendors were
* what they supplied
* were the fairly bid
* how were they paid & who paid them
* bounced/stop payment checks
* and the list goes on
You are correct, as I have shared numerous time I am not aware of the carving industry, membership, which is why I reach out to experts in your field.
I am more than willing to share what I have gather in information on best practice, bench mark, etc with the wood community. Yes, I reached out to Liz Boni as I will continue to reach out to others in wood community.
I am not hiding I have reached out, nor am I ashamed of it. I shared this with you in my first email.
Again, I reach out to work together for one event for the community. I can be reached at GE Money directly at 651-286-5624.
Have a blessed day.
Shelly
The response back from Ross:
Ms. Meyers,
Let me be crystal clear. Your intervention is NOT WELCOME. I do not care about your church life. We do not need a business plan from you. I have NO INFORMATION I WANT TO GIVE YOU. I do not need you to recognize my participation in this event. I don't care what your approach is. As far as I am concerned, you are irrelevant. I am not interested in further dialogue with you.
As I have stated, If the Chamber or the Lions wants to work with us on our event we welcome their contact, not yours. I have presented opportunities to both organizations and they are aware of the terms. I HAVE NO INTEREST in cooperating with you in any manner. You are not even a community member, so don't pose as one. There is only 1 win/win situation in this and that is for the chamber to join us in the new chainsaw event and then hold their own fall festival in city park. In this way we can benefit mutually from both events. A multifaceted area gathering. A head to head chainsaw event showdown will look foolish and you now realize some of the challenges you face. Believe me, we have not even tried to turn up the heat yet.
Questions on this, please feel free to reponse.
Shelly Meyers
And the rest of the story,lol
I just have one question Shelly, What was the amount paid to the Advisors (AJ and Ross)each year? I think that may shed a little light as to how close the carvers Brotherhood is,lol I couldn't help myself, Sorry!
Thank you for your question,(a fair one). When I started my research to determine a fair market dollar fee associated with a consultant from your community I could not find one.
While I reviewed every dollar earned/paid for this event of the past 4 years, it would be unprofessional to share this information.
I can share my contracted consultant fee with the 4 organizations I represent $ZERO.
Best regards,
Shelly
Foot note:
Might I suggest... starting an advisory board on how to become a consultant, perhaps Ross & AJ could lead the group and share how much they earned over the last four years to determine amongst your peers if this is a fair wage or not.
Based off the results of your advisory board, perhaps you could start a list of consultants for future reference... should other towns have a desire to have carvers come to their town.
First ... who is the mysterious Brian you mention in your post ... actually it was a Ross/Brian ... and there are a lot of Brians here. Do you have a last name?
And as we have been told that this entire debacle is due to the gate fee ... how much was being charged? ... and what happened to to the money? Sheeze ... it sounds like the tickets must have been 20 dollars a pop or something.
And why would the city expect the PARTNERSHIP of AJ and Ross/Brian to seperate just because the city says so ? That's not what being PARTNERS is all about ... is it??.
For all that has been written here I still stand by the fact that I only got involved online here because I objected to the carvers being intimidated and/or threatened for carving where ever ... and I find it interesting that for all the chest banging going on ... we ... the carvers ... still haven't really been told anything of substance except that everyone wants the gate fee. Do the carvers (the attraction) get a cut ?? Just a thought.
Are you going to charge a gate fee this year ?? Just curious ... you dont have to answer that ... but I would suggest you dont ... not with a show happening just up the roa on the same weekend LOL
Some clarification would be great ... THanks !!
Oh ... and BTW ... you have some awesomely talented carvers (and super nice people) coming to your gig in Sept. I'm without doubt that you wil grace them with the same fun and friendly hospitality you showed me when I was in Hackensack. Take care ...
The town had hopes you would be able to come back this year. But, with the circumstances the way they are... completely understandable.
As in the past,carvers coming this year will have free lodging & meals (donated by the various businesses in the community...they have done this for the all 5 years).
Those carvers who have come to Hackensack and those coming this year for the first time (a new opportunity for all carvers this year and years to come) will be treated with respect and admiration as they always have been and always will be.
We are very excited to have the chainsaw event this year and hope to draw record crowds once again.
For those of you who have not been to Hackensack, it is a very small community of about 300 plus. The tourist season (May-September) is what keeps the town alive.
While the tourists are gone over the winter months, life continues with the needs of the towns population and with that comes the need for supporting each other through community events and fund raising activities such as the chainsaw sculpting invitational.
Events of this nature are run by non-profit organizations with limited funds and must manage "reasonable" expenses, to be run as a business with the same goal... earning money for the entire community.
When fees/expenses become unrealistically excessive there comes a point when there needs to be a clear understanding of what you are paying for and what is considered "taking advantage" of your customers due to a monopoly.
In the past, carvers earned prize money and a percentage of their carvings.
This comes down to what the customer is willing to pay for the carving they want. Which, thankfully.... the customers coming to purchase (many of them living in the community themselves, purchased numerous carvers)... raising money every year.
I can tell you my parents have purchased numerous carvings and they are all proudly displayed throughout their home.
Brian's last name... will remain out. The reason the town does not want Brian involved, has to due with the need for registration legally on Brian's part.
Regarding Partnership. While I myself have two business partners, there are times when working with various business deals we do not involved the other partners due to the nature of the business.
Does this mean we are not partners? No, it means it is a sound business decision to ensure the client(s) request is made and we continue to grow our business strong while each supports the other and understands this will happen from time to time.
The facts are the facts. Make your customer happy and they will continue to be your customer. It is much easier to bend for a customer you have already than it is to try to find a new customer.
Thanks Shelly ... I think (we can all just take guesses as to who the mysterious Brian is instead ... LOL ... that could be a bit of fun).
And so you know ... the reason I am not carving anywhere in the States this coming September is because I have existing carving committments already back in Oz. As I live so far away I need to plan much of my year in advance ... and most professional gallery exhibitions are planned 18 months to 2 years in advance. I am a carver and an artist and I am involved with many different parties in relation to my art practice ... much more than is represented here on these forums or on the international chainsaw carving circuit. The only reason you never got a response from me was because my return emails I sent you kept bouncing back (I dont know why ... it happens) and thus I wrote to Squirrel ... not knowing at that time about the Hack-n-slash debacle ... thinking he would pass the message on as from my past observations you guys were pretty tight. I am saddened by all that is going on with this mess ... it is most unfortunate.
DAMN ... that must have been an impressive gate fee !!
So ... good luck with your event. I hope the heat doesn't get turned up too high ...
Both sides have expressed their views and informed decisions have been made. Each side will approach the event with their own enthusiasm and we will see where the chips have fallen after the fact. Stay tuned for an historic event.
