My question is intended primarily for those who are still together with their spouse. I hope this question does not cause triggers for anyone especially those who have seperated.
Has anyone ever thought about the OM or OW as just one of your spouse's ex boyfriends or ex girlfriends? Other than the relationship happening while you were married to your spouse, what is the difference? I've been wondering about this lately and would like to hear opinions.
XGF were there before me...it was H's choice to marry me..he chose to pledge faithfulness...OW was there during marriage...
I cannot look at at OW the same way as XGF... but I use the term that OW is in the past same as XGF's...just because she is OW doesn't mean H is going to run back to her...OW and XGF are in the past...both are memories for H some good some bad...hopefully bad thinking about OW..
You can also look at he fact That FWS chose to stay with me...didn't choose OW didn't choose the XGF...choose ME...
and yes I have thought about this...
I am a 'sandwich' wife so to speak in that - my H has a child from his first marriage, and had a child with OW.
OW for me and when I think about her such as now is "the mother of his child". As you know she has refused visitation of their child to our house and without realising is doing me a 'favor'... So... I am not really sure how to answer your question. Their path crossed for a little while, and they went their separate ways...She has married, had another child so OC has a father (my H) and a Dad (her H)...
As thinking about her???? except for sharing when appropriate, I really don't think about her... she is a non-entity at this time. I have spent enuff time dealing with the aftermath ... no more...
As for H thinking about her??? I am sure he does ... but his affair is very rarely a topic of converstion for us.
I agree with Pat....it is about commitment and vows.
I did not marry my XBF, I married my H. Married men are not supposed to have girlfriends. I look at OW as his former mistress or whore, but not his XGF. His XGF's came before we were married. And even if we got divorced OW woulds still be his former mistress. But any women after the divorce I would consider girlfriends. These are "titles" if you will, to describe where this person fits in your life.
DEFINITIONS (from dictionary.com):
Mistress~ A woman who has a continuing sexual relationship with a usually married man who is not her husband and from whom she generally receives material support.
Whore~ A prostitute.
A person considered sexually promiscuous.
A person considered as having compromised principles for personal gain.
Girlfriend/Lady-friend ~A favored female companion or sweetheart. A girl or young woman with whom a man is romantically involved.
(NOTICE: how it does not state "married" man as it does with mistress...that is the difference)
Dancin-gal said, "OW and XGF are in the past...both are memories for H some good some bad...hopefully bad thinking about OW.."
This brings up another thing that I've been wondering about that is connected to my first question on this thread. Doesn’t it make you wonder what FWSs "REALLY" think about their affair partner, whether they think fondly of them or despise them or something in between? I'm not talking about while still in the fog in the beginning. I'm talking about years after d-day and for the rest of their lives. Sure they chose to stay with you and work on the marriage (like choosing you over an XBF or an XGF) but don't you ever wonder how much of their heart they gave away to someone else?
I can fondly remember intimate moments with XGFs from 36 to 40 years ago (Good Lord, am I that old?) as Dancin-Gal said, good times bad times. But that was in my past. Those XGFs were part of the process in getting to the point of me choosing a life partner.
I've tried to talk to my wife about these things but I get "Please don't make me remember things about him. I want to forget everything about him and what we did. If you (meaning me) would stop reminding me about him, I probably wouldn't think about him at all." I indeed do understand what she is saying and I don't really consider this evasive behavior by her at 3 1/2 years out. I believe she is sincere in her plea not to think about him but still I wonder since OM came after her commitment to me. Doesn't it make you wonder if they deep down see OP as their true love but for circumstanses beyond their control they stay away from them like a forbidden love? I say again, doesn't it make you wonder how much of their heart they gave away to someone else? This is something that I still struggle with.
"I can fondly remember intimate moments with XGFs from 36 to 40 years ago"
Well I'm not sure if that is the difference between men and women but for me, I can't recall any fond moments with any male past the one I'm with now. And that is the truth although I was never very promiscuous with very many males. Even with my ex, I just sort of get grossed out thinking about an intimate relationship with him. I guess that was because our relationship was filled with so many lies and such. Perhaps that is how a FWS could feel about an OW/OM, that there were just lies and deceit involved and once they realize all that, it just becomes an ugly memory. I can't speak for anyone else but myself, but that is likely how I would feel.
charlie wrote >>I just sort of get grossed out thinking about an intimate relationship with him<<
Yeah. Me too. Isn't it strange how much that can change? For me, it was like a large switch had been thrown. I would never have guessed how much things could change. There came a point when I could no longer tolerate the thought of going back there. It was too grody.
H2C - could that be the way that NM views the OM now? It might be one of the reasons that she does not want to talk about it.
H2C - sometimes I wonder if there is something floating around in the ether that has never been resolved in your own mind, something that keeps you pondering these kinds of questions.
“”””(grody) could that be the way that NM views the OM now? It might be one of the reasons that she does not want to talk about it.””””
Maybe, but it could be the other way too. (forbidden love too painful to talk about)
“”””sometimes I wonder if there is something floating around in the ether that has never been resolved in your own mind….””””
Yeah, no kidding. I keep wondering what it is that makes me keep coming back to this too. All I’m trying to do, I think, is find a peaceful way to live with all of this. My guess is this may have something to do with feeling inadequate compared to OM.
“Sex with the Ex….BLECH.”
Friends, I hear what you are saying but I don’t know what that feels like since there is no “Ex” situation for me. You have been forced or have chosen to be in a world of indifference with your Ex spouses. I’m reconciling or at least working at it.
“I can't recall any fond moments with any male past the one I'm with now.”
Am I the only one that can remember intimate things about EXs from a long time ago? Surely not. You guys can’t reach into your memory banks and pull out a prom date, a first love, a moonlit walk on the beach or something?
I should just shut up and re-visit this at 4 ½ years. It will be better then.
>>You guys can’t reach into your memory banks and pull out a prom date, a first love, a moonlit walk on the beach or something?<<
Sure, I can. And some day, I expect that I might be able to remember some "good times" with my X. They must have happened somewhere along the line. But right now, those happy memories are almost impossible for me to conjure.
I guess my point is that I can understand why you would wonder why your wife can't remember any "good times" from her affair. The answer could be that she can't remember them because she chose you. It seems to me that after choosing you, her pleasant memories of the OM could be swamped by feelings (and memories) of the yukkiness of the past.
Having been divorced for a long time from two different spouses I was trying to think about romantic times I had with my former H's. Ya know, I just can't even manage to think up one thing that is a warm fuzzy. I can think of a hundred events/celebrations/situations but I have totally blanked out my history as far as intimate, romantic times. My prevailing emotion is not warm fuzzy, it's more like a feeling you get if you go to a restuarant and it's freezing in there, you just don't want to go back there again. But, I do love my kids' dad as a dad, and as my best friend in high school, but that is a different story.
I really feel no bad feelings toward my former H either, just a detachment from anything personal. I think detachment is something I learned at an early age to block unpleasantness, and sometimes I think it has become a defense mechanism to protect my heart. I try to work on that but am not always successful.
Will I remember the intimate times with my XBF? Well, again, they seem clouded by the overriding unpleasant memories of unresolved conflict and alcoholism and my own nasty comments about those issues.
Ok, I think I get it. Using my own memories, I can think of a couple of XGFs where we seperated under circumstances beyond our control. I can remember them and some times together in a fond way.
Then in contrast, there was one XGF that cheated on me by her mother setting up a situation for her to meet someone else. There was lying through the teeth from both of them. This XGF and her mother found it humorous that I was hurt. Her mother, for some reason, was a man hater that lived her life through her daughter's. Years later after NM and I were married, we bumped into this girl/woman at a grocery store. We exchange the common niceities and ask what we had been doing etc. NM and I had a lot of stuff pass through our lives to talk about. This girl still lived with her mom and under her mom's control and her biggest story was about a car wreck that she had been in 3 years prior. I thought to myself how sad, she has no life. Any way because of the lies, deception and the cheating I can't remember anything good about that 6 month relationship other than thank my lucky stars that I'm out of it.
> The answer could be that she can't remember them
> because she chose you. It seems to me that after
> choosing you, her pleasant memories of the OM could
> be swamped by feelings (and memories) of the
> yukkiness of the past.
In a roundabout way, I sometimes wonder about this with my wife and the OM. She say's she had no interest in him and doesn't want to think about him. But, I always wonder if she really enjoyed their time together, however brief. Someone paying attention to her, a new experience, a little "wild" side playtime. It disgusts her now because of where we are in life, but that little feeling that she really enjoyed being with him is the one issue that still eats at me...
H2C,
> You guys can’t reach into your memory banks and
> pull out a prom date, a first love...
I never really stopped loving my "first love". I had it so bad for her, but because of her screwed up family life, we were never able to pursue our relationship. I have many fond memories of the short times we had together, and we had talked about getting married. However, due to life circumstances, she was ripped away from me. Like a person who has a spouse that dies, she'll always have a very special place in my heart.
Looking back, it was actually for the best that we did not end up together. She was dishonest, often hung around other guys then lied about it, and had different morals and life goals than I did. If we had ended up together, I suspect she would have had an affair and the marriage would have ended badly.
Of course, my heart sees things differently. When my "first love" found out I had a new girlfriend and that we were getting married, she suddenly came back to town. I was torn between my "first love" and my "new love". Intellectually, I chose my "new love" (my wife), but it literally took years to let go of the strong love I had for my first girlfriend.
Last I heard, my ex-girlfriend had three kids, had been married and divorced at least twice, and her life was still a mess. I've only seen her once or twice in the last 20 years, but she still pulls at my heart strings when I see her.
""""However, due to life circumstances, she was ripped away from me. she'll always have a very special place in my heart.""""
Thanks, Anthony, these are the words that I've been searching for to describe a forbidden love. It bothered me that this may be the way NM felt deep down about OM but because of life circumstances........ How would anyone ever know for sure other than NM. I don't want to harp on this. I just wanted to say thanks for the help in defining what I was struggling to say about how much of her heart NM may have given away to OM.
I tend to believe what Q and Judy say about their lack of fond memories about their Xs. It makes sense since I have felt the same about an XGF.
Yep, I also recollect a song that said "Grody, grody to the max" in it. Can't remember what song that was but everyone around me, including myself kept repeating that phrase.
I'm coming up on only 7 months out... so my input may be limited but when I ask my H about the ow... he looks sick. He also says what your W says about not thinking of her unless I bring it up. He says (and I can only take his word) that he was trying to break it off with her prior to me finding out and he was desperate for freedom from her. He has no fond memories because he says it was dirty. Now he may be blowing smoke up my ass but he's been pretty good to his word thus far. I may one day poot enough smoke to kill him with smoke inhalation. That'd be poetic justice, huh?
I've questioned him on favorite songs, gifts, places they met, pet names... anything to put a personal face to it and he admits that they had none of those... he never bought her a gift, or a card, not even a meal, not even a ride in his convertable... don't know her birthday, no pet names, no fav songs... What in the hell was she doing with him on and off for over 6 years??? What he liked about the whole thing was she was married and could really only give him so much of her time. He says what she gave to him was devotion, clung to his every word, spoke of his importance blah blah... but in the end her neediness drove him crazy. As her admiration grew, his feeling of doom grew. I think alot of the FWS may just feel that way. Its to hurtful for them to remember also. I try to put myself in his place and I think I would feel the same but thats me the faithful one thinking.
Glad I gave you a laugh Quinn.... but sorry 'bout your pc. I'll be here all week... Well no... I'll be here next Tue... I'm going on vacation with a girlfriend to tie one on for the next 4 days.... Just sunshine, warm sand, cold drinks and girl-talk... I can't wait. Laughing is so fun. O
Comparing infidelity of marriage partners with a dating partner to me is a big difference. With marriage you have a committment with a binding contract. It is supposed to be until death do we part. No more searching. Security. Unconditional love. May sound like a fairy tale but that is why a lot of people marry. That is why I married. I waited until I was SURE. I waited until I was 36 before I married. If you are not married it is so much easier to just leave. Not to mention the legal aspects,division of assets etc. I think there is a big difference. Now other people may disagree but you asked for our opinions.
<< If you are not married it is so much easier to just leave. Not to mention the legal aspects,division of assets etc. I think there is a big difference. Now other people may disagree but you asked for our opinions.
>>
I would agree tend to agree with this statement. If we had not been married for 15 years with 3 children I definately without-a-doubt would have left if someone cheated on me. But the vows, legal aspects, children, and half my life invested with this person, made me want to try to work it out. still loving them also contributed to me staying, but now I know LOVE is not enough...and now I no longer believe in fairytales
Well, the A partner took AWAY from me and my children, which the ex-girlfriends never did. My H also lied to me, kept me up calling a turned-off cell phone all night looking for him, etc to be with her...In other words I was traumatized over his relationship with her while it was going on before he got honest and ended it...Also, he was supposed to be mine at the time. He was supposed to be giving his all to me and our marriage, not some woman he barely knew...Maybe at some point in the future...but now I can not put her in the ex-girlfriend category...it took too much from our marriage....
I am lucky in that I know for sure that he does not have any positive feelings left for her. She was nothing special to him. He admits that he would not have even considered her as girlfriend material if he was looking for a full-time relationship. He feels that she used and manipulated him. Now that the fog has cleared, he does not like or respect her. His memories of her are also clouded by how embarassed and ashamed he is that he got involved with her....
