(moved from Further board according to Forum policy)
One more thing June 11 2005, 10:43 AM
I forgot one thing
The revenge affair. I didn't have the revenge affair, I had a one nighter with an old friend. Which he doesn't know.
It was about 2 months after the discovery. I felt just like you. I wanted revenge. I also felt I deserved it. After all, look how much sx he was getting and I was the faithful woman at home.
I never felt guilty about this. And still don't. But, I had mixed feelings about it and I will be brutally honest here.
I felt some relief because sx with him had become painful. I couldn't stop of thinking about them every time. Is this how he held her? Did he kiss her? etc. It was a relief to do that without all the images.
But, at the same time, it made things even more confusing for me. I got scared. I got scared because I felt so cold about it. I started to understand a little bit how he could do that and come home to me. It bothered me. I started doubting my intergrity. My morals. Who I was.
I kept thinking, how could I do this and come home to him like nothing happened? Does this mean I'm just like him? What if something went wrong and got something? But, more....I couldn't get out of my head....does this mean I'm just like him? That is what tormented me for months. It still does. I don't want to be like him.
You will do what you feel you need to. But, I can only say, it didn't help me understand, it only made me more confused.
Avoid doing that if you can and just try to focus on you and her. Don't bring anything else into the scene.
<The revenge affair. I didn't have the revenge affair, I had a one nighter with an old friend. Which he doesn't know.>
I'm curious what you would call sex with an old friend. A one nighter is still an affair. Maybe not the long drawn out secret rendevous, but it is an affair none the less.
I am NOT throwing stones here. Many people who post here have spouses who just had "one-nighters". They have been just as devistated emotionally as people whose spouses had the long drawn out affair. Some spouses had dozens of one-nighters, and some of those one-nighters resulted in pregnancies, and STD's.
MM - Thank you. Even though my H had a short emotional and slightly physical (just kissing and a little hand holding) it still cuts like a knife. He still left me.
I thought of revenge, I thought of looking for someone to whoo over me and make a fuss. But the person that I really, honestly wanted to make a fuss over me has been beside me all along. If I had gone out and found someone, I would be worse than him, I would be doing it for all the wrong reasons. Not because we weren't communicating, not because of stress and a mental breakdown, not because of loneliness, just for revenge, hate, lack of my morals.
You did what you did to help yourself at the time. I guess that it's okay for you if you can figure out a way to be okay with it. I personally would never have been able to face myself in the mirror if I had and it would probably have put me over the edge. I'm already fighting with that edge, but I see that there are daily baby steps (very very small) but I'm making it. I see some help coming and that's giving me hope where I really don't have much. My H is more than supportive and is "in my face" to help me see that he's not going anywhere. In the moment of that desire for another, I talked to my H about my feelings (thanks to everyone here for their support), and we worked it out. He cried, he was upset, he was sad and depressed. He has been this way for a couple months when I'm down that tunnel. But as he said today, there are good days, we do laugh, and we do love. In the end, I realize that it wouldn't have helped, it would have broken us further.
Yes, I thought of how he kissed her, if he kissed her like he kisses me. Questions like "did he feel the same towards her when they were kissing and holding hands as he does towards me?" I ask him. I bug him until he answers me. He's much more understanding now that I tell him that I need to know all the little secrets so my mind doesn't wander. I never knew that it took them 5 minutes to get from their building into the car, then 5 minutes back into the building again. That leaves them with 20 min for lunch. Then, I found this out last night, they would get sodas, which took another 5-7 min, sometimes longer, that leaves them with about 15 min, and 5 of that was wasted driving to get sodas, that's 10 min to drive somewhere. And he told me that two of the three times he ended it early because he knew it wasn't right and didn't want to be with her anymore, so he drove back. All this I just found out. It doesn't excuse what he did, but it did help with my embellishments of what happened. He's realized this from our discussion last night and is much more open.
He agrees, no more secrets. He wants me to be able to walk into his work and if I see her, know that I know everything, and she knows nothing at all about us, or him.
If we feel like we are faltering, if I feel like I'm going to do something tragic, we talk about it. He knows me enough that if I'm not talking about it, but am sad, then I'm thinking it, and he talks to me. Tries to get me to open up. It makes him sad to hear me and see me cry, it bothers him so. It makes him resentful of her and himself. He sees where he disrespected me and our family, and he resents himself for that. He is very regretful. These are the branches that I cling to when I think that he's going to go back to her because I'm too damn depressed all the time. But he doesn't.
I just couldn't go out and have a revenge affair. There's already three people in this marriage at this time being, I don't need a fourth. I realize this and am thankful, very thankful, I talked to him about it all and it's all past me now.
Please think before you do. Talk to someone first.
That's my best words of wisdom from someone who can barely make it through the day.
I know you're not throwing stones, TLMM. And I think you're right that a one-night stand can be just as hard to deal with as a 10-year affair.
Still, I'm glad that Melissa posted about her experience because (I'm guessing that) almost every betrayed spouse thinks about a revenge affair. It helps to hear from someone who has actually been there and done that and has the guts to write about it.
Thanks Melissa for being brave enough to admit what you did and write about it honestly. I figured I could never have a revenge A because I couldn't bear to hurt another woman the way I had been hurt, but I honestly never thought of some of the points you made about comparing yourself to WS. It is always good for us to hear another perspective.
First I'd like to say that you are a brave woman for sharing and I'll bet there are many people who have questions like I do.
Does your H know about the one nighter? How does his knowing or not knowing effect your relationship?
Was/is your friend that you had the one nighter with married or committed to some one else?
Like most here (assuming), I sorta thought about a revenge affair but I considered it for a weird reason. I want to stay with my wife, who is very remorseful, but also wanted to level the playing field. I thought that if I did a one nighter and told my wife that we would both have to go through all of the same dynamics of recovery. I would understand first hand how her guilt and embarrasment felt and she, I imagined, would have to deal with the anger that I felt for her betrayal.
However, thinking through this, I don't think it would achieve what I imagined. Firstly, it would not be a big surprise to my wife therefore it would not have the same shocking value as her affair did to me which in turn would not create the same feelings for her as it did me. Secondly, I wouldn't want a bunch of spin off hurt issues for my (imagined) OW's family as it affected my family. (Michael Douglas would be really really pissed at me. LOL) Thirdly, I think that it would create whole new dynamics that are no where near what I imagined or would want to achieve by having a revenge affair or one nighter as you did.
Years ago I had a secretary that was betrayed by her husband. Her husband's drinking also played a big part of their problems as he was abusive too. They divorced after a couple of years of trying to make it work. My secretary said that when she chose to have her RA that was when my secretary realized that her marriage was over. She never really explained this in detail to me other than for me not to do it.
Another woman that worked for me that is about my age admitted to having a RA to level the playing field with her husband's affair. They are still together and they are about 15 years past d-day. She also recommended that I not have an RA but did not go into detail about it. She only mentioned that she had to deal with a lot of guilt over her A.
I know in both cases above that those women found it very difficult to discuss their RAs face to face with me. Melissa, do you mind discussing this and answering my questions on the boards? I'll bet there are many who have questions about RAs.
Does anyone know of a guy who had a RA and is still with his wife?
Thank you in advance Melissa for anything that you are willing to contribute.
H2C
P.S. Before I get beat over the head by Jbean's swimming pool lectures and Emersom and especially NM, I'm just trying to get a dialogue going that might be helpful to all of us.
Hi there
and thank you to every one for the support in letting me be truthful about what I did in regards to having an RA.
My boyfriend for 2 years was seeing alot of other women. Whether actual physical relationships or verbal, to find one, then another and another was an awful lot for me to bear. I got seriously depressed.
At first, when I thought of having my own affair, it was much more complicated in my head. I wanted to have an entire relationship, but I knew that would never happen and I knew it was because I was so hurt.
But, then, when the sx was too painful, I didn't know what to do. I felt disgusting everytime. I couldn't get HER out of my head. I couldn't get the emails about what they did out of my head. I didn't want him anymore, but I still loved him. I was so confused.
A few months after the discovery, I was back in my hometown and arranged to see a "special" friend. He is single. No attachments. Someone I have known for about 20 years. Someone I have gone to before between boyfriends, etc. He knows of my relationship.
For the first time in months, I could have sx and not think of her. I felt elated and happy. Then I went home.
At first, I thought like you, maybe it would even the playing field. Maybe he would know what it feels like. Then, I realized, it would only be seen as what it is. an RA. I didn't tell him. I probably never will. I know he would forgive me, but I know I had to do it. I knew I would do it. I was too hurt.
Guilt? No. Look at myself in mirror. Absolutely. What he did was horrible beyond anything I could imagine. One woman, two? No...physical sx with at least 5 or 6 during the two years.
If anything, it helped me be less angry with him. But, it did confuse me an awful lot. I could almost understand how he could come home to me. It terrified me that I could almost understand that. I didn't want to understand that. I currently have absolutely no desire to that again. I am very much into the relationship with him now. It did not affect my relationship, but then again, I feel no guilt. Only a deeper understanding of myself and him.
I still don't recommend it. I honestly feel it didn't help me recover from the disappointment and the loss I felt. I still think about what I did 6 months ago. I still wonder how I could do it. I still deal with my own personal morality about it.
I hope that helps. I certainly don't mind talking about. I am thankful to have a place to talk about everything and read what other people say about their own lives. This website helps me keep the relationship I have in perspective and helps me keep my sanity.
i missed this thread somewhere, so just catching up now.
congrats on being honest, that takes some guts, i guess the reason that for some people the revenge event doesnt work because in hindsight it is done for the wrong reasons. we try to punish the other person and then end up feeling crap ourselves.
but in some ways we can also feel a bit liberated even if just for a time.
i say this with some trepidation, because i dont want to hurt anyone, but i think there is some honesty in that statement.
i didnt have a revenge A but i did find myself in a situation where a man 'cracked onto me', some time after my hubby was going to leave, but hadnt. i felt very flattered etc etc and a little stunned, who was this odd man who was chasing around after this little, tubby 44 year old woman haha, he must be drunk, who cares.
i enjoyed the attention, i also enjoyed (ducking here) telling my H about it, and the stunned look on his face. but it was at a time when he was tooing and frowing about what he was going to do. so i just put it to him that another man found me attractive. albiet he might have been drunk and it was at a blondie concert haha.
but i also know that now, if that happened again, i would very graciously say, "thanks but no thanks", still be flattered but know there is no need to go there.
for you at that time there was a need to go there, and you went to a safe person. you are lucky that you had that person there for you, sounds like it brought a bit of equilibrium back to you.
One thing that stands out about this thread is the very conscious choices and reasons for having revenge affairs as opposed to the less conscious (just my opinion) choices of WSs having affairs. If it feels good, do it versus I want to show him/her what it feels like to be betrayed. I think the differences in those types of choices for the most part prevents the actual follow through.
So Melissa, if he continues to fool around on you would you consider having another meeting with your old friend at some point? How would you handle it?
Thanks Kath for supporting me on my honesty. You are right that I had a safe person to turn to and yes, it did liberate me for just a bit - so nicely put!
And to answer and comment to H2C
You are right - there is a different intention in this thread..that is interesting. I can honestly say I would have never done IT if he hadn't. I was completely faithful. An RA is different, very different. I didn't want it to continue, I just needed some sanity back in my sx life. He, on the other hand, well, I'm still not sure exactly why he did it. Just turned 40? Low self-esteem? I don't know.
But, if he did it again, I would leave him. The only reason I stayed is because I found out after he had stopped the affairs, supposedly. It took almost a year to fully discover the extent of his deceptions. By that time, he had been trying to be "good". Yes, I do know - I check his email, his mail, his phone records, go through his briefcase, make him call constantyly when he travels, call his hotel late at night to make sure he is there, etc. The more I see he hasn't been doing anything naughty, the less I feel the need to look.
I wouldn't do another RA. I don't want that kind of relationship and if he does what he did again after the counseling, the talking, the "committment" we are making to each other and buying a house, I would just leave him. Or rather, make him leave.
I never want to go through this again, ever. It nearly destroyed me.
But, as a side note, again, I am ever thankful for this website. Everyone makes this such a safe place to just talk about our feelings. For such a long time, I felt so alone, now I know all those feelings I went through were real. Perhaps, if I had been able to talk about wanting to do an RA, I might not have. I just didn't have anyone to talk to at all about this.
< Perhaps, if I had been able to talk about wanting to do an RA, I might not have. I just didn't have anyone to talk to at all about this.>
Wow, that is an eye-opener. You rock Melissa, and we're here now.
