I wanted to thank you both for sticking around and sharing everything you've learned with all of us. You've both come a helluva long way.

Bob, you've been writing some great posts buddy.

Thanks again.

Regards,

Tex

Thanks Tex. That means a LOT coming from you. My wife and I both are so impressed with your wisdom and ability to so clearly define the real issue and perfectly express what needs to be said in a diplomatic, level headed, comforting manner. You can wield a pretty good 2x4 when necessary too (the back of my head is still stinging from one or two I received from you)...but it's always appropriate.

If I can give back even a fraction of the help everyone on this forum have given me, and even the slightest spark of hope for their future in a time that has to be one of the darkest a person can experinece, I'm happy to do it. It helped me so much in my time of need (which I daresay isn't over yet...it's just easing up quite a bit lately). I know it helps when my wife posts too. She doesn't like to write so much - not because she doesn't want to help, but because she doesn't think she can be as expressive as she wants to be in written form...but hopefully she will give it a shot on occassion.

I won't speak for her, and I don't mean to pressure her into writing more...I just mean to say that we both really appreciate the fact that this site is here to help people like us in such a friendly, safe and experienced manner, and we're happy to give back what we can.

Now that means alot coming from you bro. Thanks.

I was lucky enough to have R.W., Quinn, Cory, Kat, G.T., TLMM and Chris as my mentors although I doubt they knew it. We're all lucky to have them and I still learn alot.

As for the 2x4...LOL...Kat still whacks me with it ocassionally.

Note to Mrs. Bob: You write just fine. When you feel comfortable enough to post more we're here to listen.

Regards,

Tex

I can't thank you all enough for being here!! This place has saved my sanity! There have been times when i have felt that i can't go on and i have no where to turn but i come here and get sooooooooo much wisdom and comfort that i could never fine enough ways to thank you all. Talking to people that have been through what i have ,had the same feelings , the up the downs, "THE HORRIBLE ROLLERCOASTER",that we have all been on.I wish i could just give you all a big hug!!!
No matter what happens with me and my H, you all have been the best source of C that you find.
H wrote a wonderful note this morning. He is good with the notes but never follows through with what he says in his notes. Hopefully you all can help him with how to do that!He says he is going to make me fall in love with him again but yet he does nothing different. I do love him but i don't feel i am "in love" with right now!
I feel it will take the whole courtship thing all over again and then go from there. Am i wrong??
Again thanks so much for your wisdom, comfort, and the fact that you care for others going through this!!!!
Kathy

Kathy,

I can remember early in my discovery telling my wife that I loved her, but I have to stop hating her first. Imagine how much that must have hurt to hear. I then remember several weeks later coming to the realization that of course I'm still in love with her. Why else would I be SO upset about what had happened? Why else would I be sticking around after she did what she did. Why else would I care?

Then I remember several times when my wife said, "I love you...I just don't know if I'm IN love with you anymore." I think I countered with similar variations of that as well, because those words hurt me so deeply, and I wanted to give some of that pain back. I think we've all heard and/or said some variation of those words in our process. They hurt like someone pushing their fingers through your skin and pulling your heart out to show you its last few beats. It's a horrible thought and a horrible thing to say to anyone with who you've spent so much of your life, shared so many of your dreams.

I agree with O in Barb's recent thread in the Discovery Forum...I think those words are a cop out. They don't really mean what you're trying to say and - when said out loud - serve no purpose but hurting the recipient. Their genesis and the confusion behind them are certainly understandable, but it seems to me that they only serve the purpose of allowing the person thinking or speaking them to make an excuse for either not trying to figure out what they really want, or not wanting to take a deeper look at themselves...essentially, not wanting to move forward in some sort of positive manner.

I guess what I'm saying is, if he feels like - or worse yet, hears - you're not in love with him anymore, he's not going to want to put the effort forward because he may figure it's not going to really do him any good, other than to continue to be hit over the head with his mistake. That seems to be about the time that the WS starts getting the "Just get over it!" thoughts in their minds, because it has turned itself into resentment for getting beaten so much for a mistake that they don't have the capacity to understand themselves right now. The beatings are coming from all sides....from their Betrayed Spouse, their family and/or friends who they've disappointed, and especially from themselves. I don't know...just guessing...but my logical sense tells me that must be incredibly frustrating. What would you do if you became that frustrated? Would you fight it? Lash out? Bury it and continue to take it? My emotional state at the time this was going on with me sure didn't let my logical side have a say. I just wanted to give back the pain I was receiving.

My wife and I went back and forth with this game for way too long....each of us becoming more and more resentful as we spiraled into that vicious cycle, resentful because of that statement (and of course, the "deeper" issues), which meant to us that the other wasn't even going to try. It gives the feeling of pure hopelesness. It's essentially anti-communication. Only destructive...not allowing any positive aspects of our relationship to surface. Neither of us wanted to comprehend what the other was going through, which was the thing we both needed the most at the time.

It's a perfectly understandable sentiment, "I love you but I'm not IN love with you". After all, the BS must be thinking the WS wasn't in love with me if they could have an affair. The WS must be thinking their BS must not be in love with me because I had an affair. What do you do from there, act on that and continue the game, or tell each other how you really feel and what you really need to move forward WITH each other? There's nowhere else to go if you stop at that conclusion and continue the game. Until you are both willing to hear each other without judging what the other has to say - that cycle will continue to spiral in the opposite direction that you both really want it to, and you'll both be flushed down the big ole toilet bowl...the one that this whole situation stinks like. Guess where it leads.

Bob

"I love you but I'm not IN love with you". After all, the BS must be thinking the WS wasn't in love with me if they could have an affair. The WS must be thinking their BS must not be in love with me because I had an affair."

What an incredibly insightful response from you Bob. I'm glad you and your W are pulling it together.

Charlie

I don't think i have said the words i love you bit i'm not in love to him. It is just the way i am feeling right now. I understand what you are saying ,if the WS thinks the BS doesn't love him anymore why try? But yes i do feel ,as all other BS that if he loved me he wouldn't have had an A. The only reason he can come up with right now is "he guesses he didn't love me enough". I look at that like, now you do love me enough!!!I know some one will say that you don't realize what you have until you loose it. But that is a dangerous game.The not loving enough goes back to him saying our marriage was in a rut , hum drum etc. and that is what made him think he didn't love me enough. But why didn't he come to me with what he was feeling not someone else? I was in that same rut of a marriage that he was in.
He still swears that it was just for sex , no emotions involved at all.He actually says how much he hates the OW now, hey it took 2 people, but he does say he hates himself too.
This is just so hard!!I know that there are times i really go off on him and call him names that have to hurt him but its like it can't hurt you as much as you hurt me.I know this is going to take alot of work on both are parts. That is why we come here for advice and a reality check now ad then!! Thanks so much for that!!!
Kathy

Barb here! I don't really think it's a cop out to say that I love my H but don't think I'm in love with him anymore. I love him because of our history & the fact that I care about his well being but I am confused & do not feel like I am in love with him anymore. He killed what we had, especially by lying to my face each & every day - 4 or 5 times a day. He watched me cry like crazy everyday & didn't care enough to come clean & admit what he was doing. Only protecting himself & having his little A mattered. There is no romance & we don't even see each other for more than 5 or 10 minutes a day.Some days we don't see each other at all. Because of his selfish actions my kids & my lives are forever changed. So, I am not going to feel guilty that I don't love him right now. He caused my feeling to go away. Now he has to figure out how to fix the mess he created.I'm tired of crying & being upset. It's better not to care so much at this point. He still isn't doing what I need. He needs to take the time to focus on me & us & he can't right now.I need attention & understanding & don't believe I am getting it. I want to be appreciated. He needs to treat me like we're dating & not just like a wife. I don't feel like a wife anymore because of his A.He needs to win me back & make me think I'm worth whatever effort he needs to make to put the marriage back together.