I think it might help us to have a running list of the questionable items in the current American Memorabilia auction. As long as they’re not going to respond to us, we can at least warn each other.
Eric, if others come up or if you want to make changes go ahead and edit this list
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Lot 120 Randy Johnson Jersey- wrong size, no extra length, name is far too low
Lot 160 1994 Brett Favre Game-Worn Packers Throwback Jersey- does not match actual game wear, many game issued jerseys like this
Lot 414 Maddux Jersey- wrong size
Dan
(Schilling jersey removed from this list- eric)
This message has been edited by ecky3 on Mar 6, 2005 10:39 PM This message has been edited by ecky3 on Mar 6, 2005 7:09 AM This message has been edited by ecky3 on Mar 2, 2005 2:49 PM
That Russell label was not used during the 1973,1974 time frame.In 72 they wore Sand Knit, before then Wilson.You are right, we need to help each other out.
Re: List Of Questionable American Memorabilia Items
March 2 2005, 5:54 PM
Okay Guys,
I just talked with Lou Lampson about the Maddux jersey. He was very adamant about the size of the jersey being well within the range of 2002 gamers.
Also, we are still going to check the Kiick and Favre shirts.
I am looking for the Schilling photomatch in the Boston Globe right now.
Thanks again guys and way to keep us on our toes!
chris
American Memorabilia lot 483 is described as a "Cal Ripken Jr Game Used Ball Signed By 4 Umpires." The description of this item is that this ball was game used from Cal Ripken's "final" major league game on 10/06/01 with signatures of Ripken plus umpires Al Clark, Greg Kosc, Dan Morrison & Larry Barnett. In actuality this is one of the those infamous 2131 "supposed" game used balls that got umpire Al Clark in trouble (among other things). I can't tell you who was the umpiring crew during Cal's last game (should be easy to look up), but Al Clark was fired by Major League Baseball in June of 2001. How could a ball which was "supposedly" used in 1995 all of a sudden be a 2001 ball?
Always looking for unique items related to the careers of Cal Ripken Jr., Sr. & Billy.
Take a look at Mark Hayne's post this am on my original post.You can add the Kiick jersey to the list to stay!Kiick was long gone when that tagging was used.There have also been a lot of 79 csonka's going around lately......hmmm....
I heard back from my friend at AMI, and I'm convinced he is doing what he can on his end to work toward regaining our trust.
On the other hand, I was not impressed with Chris' response to my post which started off with the patronizing "Sir..." when I had clearly posted my full name.
Hey man, just deal with the problems - patronize me and you can forget about my business in a heartbeat. AMI may not realize it, but even if they were "spot-free", there are still several auction houses that would out-rate them...they have work to do.
http://www.americanmemorabilia.com/Auction_Item.asp?auction_id=15630&auccat=Basketball
Name change, number change. Font of "BIRD" is too fat, maybe a legit Celtics gamer "restored" to a Bird. Why would the Celtics issue Bird a re-cycled jersey?
What is "cheesecloth"? Durene? Rayon/viscose? The material used for THIS Celtics jersey is 100% nylon knit.
It is their longstanding policy not to respond to questions about their items. As long as they have a COA from someone they will go ahead and sell the item.
I and associates of mine have pointed out possibly questionable autograph items, and never even got a response.
Go to my forgery alert page to read more about American Memorabilia:
www.richardsimonsports.com/hofauto2.htm
Richard Simon
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.
Unknown author
--
We made a promise. We swore we'd always remember.
No retreat baby, no surrender.
The Boss
Read the description of the jersey which describes the uni numbers as "badly faded". So badly faded, in fact, that the blurb plays up the scarcity of the design.
Now look at the image, where the "26" on both front and back both look rich and dark.
Wonder if they'll mail me an image depicting the jersey's ACTUAL appearance...if I inquire politely, of course...
In the past, American Memorabilia has been e mailed about every questionable item I wrote about on my website. They did NOTHING and always ignore e mails questioning any item in their catalog.
As someone who formerly authenticated for them, I can tell you an exact quote from Victor Moreno when items were questioned by me that had COA's from others:
"I am an auction house, if I have a COA, I will run with the item." I am paraphrasing here, as this statement was spoken to me over a year ago, but you get the idea.
For example: a presidential document with a pre printed Franklin Roosevelt signature had a COA. When one of the other autograph authenticators working for American Memorabilia saw it, from across the room, and questioned it, Victor Moreno exploded in anger. He already had his COA and did not want anyone else looking at the item.
Attempting to e mail or telephone them will be of no value at all.
--
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.
Unknown author
--
We made a promise. We swore we'd always remember.
No retreat baby, no surrender.
The Boss
The very few times I have brought things to AMI's attention in the past has brought nothing from them except silence. However, when I sent an email directly to Chris this past weekend regrding Item 531 (after striking out with my usual AMI "contacts"), he responded directly to me very quickly saying that he would bring it to Victor's attention.
Lo and behold! When I went to the website on Tuesday evening, the item description - originally misidentified as a Washington Federals USFL jersey - had been amended to the correct identity of a WFL Chicago Winds jersey. Nothing can be done with the catalogue at this late date, but at least they got it right on the website.
It sounds like Chris may be the man at AMI to get things done.
Getting a jersey listed correctly is certainly important but if you send them information on questionable items, which should be removed, expect the same thing I got, no response. 500 HR ball, Bruce Springsteen facsimile signed record, are two of the examples I mean. I did not personally write to them about the "cowboy" signed picture, though an associate of mine did.
--
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.
Unknown author
--
We made a promise. We swore we'd always remember.
No retreat baby, no surrender.
The Boss
It's nice to see that Mark had good luck w/AM on getting them to pull that jersey. I've had a few emails with Chris back and forth, and he seems to be a good guy. However, we have differing opinions on the Favre throwback jersey offered in the current auction. Here is their jersey:
Here are two photos of Favre (sorry, I know they're not the best quality) from that one and only game where they wore this particular throwback style. I maintain that the "stem" of the "4" on the back of the jersey is shorter than on AMI's jersey. In these photos the stem of the "4" has a slight indentation; even with that, I think if you flattened the jersey out you'd see that the "stem" is shorter. Compare the length of the stems to the inner triangular spaces on the "4":
If my eyesight is failing me at my relatively young age, could someone please let me know?
Thanks,
Guy
Hi guys,
Once again, if you have any questions or concerns I will respond no matter what. As for removing items from our auction... if we feel after discussing any item, that it should be removed because of misrepresentation, we will definitely have it removed. We have removed numerous items from our March auctin for that very reason.
We value everyone's input... We really do. Victor, Tony and I have daily meetings about the great input from all members on this board and from phone calls and emails.
As for the Favre jersey. My conclusion is our jersey is correct. The tags are correct and the stem on Guy's photo is folded because of Brett's padding. I truly believe our jersey is good. It has tons of use on the white elastic on the side of the jersey.
It would be pulled if we thought it was bad.
I am a little frustrated with all the talk about this shirt because, as a result the bidding on it has dramatically declined. Someone is going to get a real bargain on it.
If you guys have any more questions, email me at info@americanmemorabilia.com or call 800-430-0667
About the Bibby jersey...
I am not sure what the issue is with the way we wrote it up... Do you think that the identifiers don't look faded. That is probably just because it was a bad picture. I have the jersey in my hands right now and believe me... The numbers and lettering is BADLY faded, as described.
If I misinterpreted your issue with it, please let me know.
chris
Chris-
Allow me to echo Eric's sentiments and thank you for taking the time to respond.
I don't doubt your assertion that the numbers on the Bibby jersey are badly faded, but the photos seen by everyone on the auction site and in this thread display numbers which appear as rich and black as the "4" on the Favre throwback. (Especially when compared to the "PIRATES" logo, which genuinely DOES appear faded.)
This leads to my belief that the photo was digitally "enhanced" to make the numbers look more attractive, and I welcome the opportunity to see an unaltered pic. It may indeed be a "bad photo", so I hope you don't mind my request for a "good photo".
Ryan,
We have a professional photographer on staff at AMI... He is very good. However, at times it is tough to make items appear correctly no matter what we do. We shoot autographed baseballs outside at times (I guess for the best lighting).
I can assure you that we would never enhance a photo. That is unethical and very time consuming for the editor.
I have a flat screen monitor at work and the letters look pretty faded on my screen.
chris
Chris,
Like I stated in our previous one-to-one emails, I appreciate the work you do in addition to the fact that you've gotten involved and have answered some questions. I'm not trying to be a pain here; if I were running the auction I'd want to know if it included a bad shirt. I still disagree with you about what the photos show. But what do we make of this, then:
This is yet another Favre MNF throwback, from American Memorabilia's auction of March 6, 2003. This shirt has Favre's auto on the back, and comes with a letter from him. I should add that I'm willing to demonstrate that Favre wore only one jersey in this game.
Guy
Chris - did Amer Mem refund the money to the buyer of the Springsteen Gold Record with the FACSIMILE SIGNATURE?
I sent Kieta as much proof of the signature being a facsimile as was possible. A letter from Columbia Records stating the record was not authentically signed was the most important.
Am Mem also received an e mail from a highly qualified Springsteen authority, and I found the EXACT same item on a website, stating it was a facsimile, and selling it for much less than Am Mem got in the auction.
--
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.
Unknown author
--
We made a promise. We swore we'd always remember.
No retreat baby, no surrender.
The Boss
Hey folks - I've just stepped up to confirm that Chris keeps his word. His photographer e-mailed me a higher-res image, and (with the aid of a friend's flat-screen monitor) I was able to more clearly see the fading.
Thank you both again for addressing my concern and clearing up any confusion. True, the item isn't the biggest big-ticket item up for grabs, but it's good to see that AM stands behind all its items, big and small. r4f
Guy,
We are investigating the Favre jersey some more and will make a decision before auction close tomorrow... You have made some very good points here.
chris
for actually stepping up to the plate and addressing sepcific issues the board has with some of their items. It definitely shows that these guys are making an effort and are willing to review things further when brought to their attention...
I'll give Chris credit as well for his involvement, however they have still not changed their description of lot 483 (Ripken GU ball). This ball was NOT used on 10/06/01 during Cal's last game; this ball is one of those infamous Al Clark "2131" balls that a lot of collectors were burned on. As I stated previously, Clark was fired during the 2001 season and was not part of the umpiring crew during Cal's last game. I listed my original post on 03/05, there was plenty of time for them to research it, change their copy, etc. Let's hope they do the right thing.
Always looking for unique items related to the careers of Cal Ripken Jr., Sr. & Billy.
The Randy Johnson Diamondbacks jersey in AMI's most current auction still hasn't really been addressed. I've handled 6 Randy Johnson jerseys (direct from the D-Backs) since 2000, and this one isn't even close. Here are the obvious problems with this jersey:
1) Size 50 - RJ wears a size 52.
2) No extra length - RJ wears at least 5" extra length.
3) Name placement is much too low when compared to 2001 WS photos.
Remember...RJ is 6'10" - a size 50 jersey with no extra length wouldn't even come close to fitting him. I'm 6'1", and the last RJ jersey I had came down to my shins.
Your thoughts?
Rob Steinmetz
Authentic Gamers, Inc.
www.authenticgamers.com
authenticgamers@aol.com
I'd like to take the opportunity to thank Chris for taking the time to visit with me this evening regarding our concerns over the John Elway jersey that is running in their current auction.
He allowed me to voice my issues and seemed to have an honest understading of my concerns. While every point was not resolved to my satisfaction, sometimes you have to agree to disagree and move on. I appreciated his honesty and candor.
Chris: Thanks for you kind responses. Please check the inside tags on the Favre to see if there is any writing on them in green ink. It would be something like NGU for not game used which Grey Flannel put in some of the team issues they sold.
Favre withdrawn=Chris just saved someone a few grand
March 24 2005, 10:06 AM
No doubt about it, Chris deserves credit for his work as AM's envoy. If more auction houses had someone like Chris, someone willing to step up and address collector concerns like this, the hobby would be an even better place.
Guy
Thank you to Chris for listening to the concerns regarding the Favre jersey in your auction. I think most people here will agree that American Memorabilia has stepped up in a way that other auction houses have yet to do. I feel more confident that now and in the future if there are questions we will work with you to get those resolved.
We just all have to be responsible about how we couch these things. It's better to question an item and hear how they went about authenticating it than to come out and say it's a fake.
There are enough smart people here with expertise in different areas, that a calm approach can go a long way. We proved that with the Favre. Thanks to the people on this board and thank you Chris
Someone is still going to pay at least $1500 for a Randy Johnson jersey that isn't even close to something the Big Unit would have worn. I don't want to beat a dead horse, but the 2001 home Randy Johnson jersey is the most blantant error in the entire auction. Is there something I'm missing?
Rob Steinmetz
Authentic Gamers, Inc.
www.authenticgamers.com
authenticgamers@aol.com
