<< Previous Topic | Next Topic >>Return to Start  

Not an oldie, but close

September 11 2017 at 11:59 AM

Mike  (Login 17hornet)
Group #188948

 
This is one I built a couple yrs ago, just now put on an old 10x Litschert scope...
30 caliber tap loader co2,gets around 16 shots at 575-620 on a good day...
Sorry for image size, don't know how to make 'em smaller
Mike

[linked image]

[linked image]


    
This message has been edited by 17hornet on Sep 11, 2017 1:22 PM


 
 Respond to this message   
AuthorReply
DT Fletcher
(Login DTFletcher)
Group #188948

Very nice!

September 11 2017, 4:12 PM 

Love it. Did you use any published design plans for the action?



 
 Respond to this message   

Mike
(Login 17hornet)
Group #188948

Nope,

September 11 2017, 4:32 PM 

It's my own...(for better or worse) I like outside lock guns and ball guns,so I combined the two...
it was originally a 40 cal, but downsizing it made for better performance
Mike

 
 Respond to this message   
DT Fletcher
(Login DTFletcher)
Group #188948

Re: Nope,

September 12 2017, 3:32 AM 

That's great.

It's very much part of the history of the air gun that the production of simple outside lock airgun was within the means of any good village mechanic. None of the regular gun-making skills are required.

If you ever want another challenge, you might want to take a look at the Bourgeoys’ Airgun design, which is widely credited as being the earliest of all known pneumatic designs. I think it is a brilliant design and, as far as I know, has never ever been reproduced. I started a thread about it some time back on this forum. One of the real nice thing is that, unlike just about every other early airgun designer, we have a picture of Bourgeoys. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marin_le_Bourgeoys

 
 Respond to this message   

Mike
(Login 17hornet)
Group #188948

From my perspective,

September 12 2017, 12:40 PM 

I was trying for something totally different, not duplicating any previous designs. I'm not aware of any antique rifles that combine an outside lock and ball reservoir...
I'm not sure that I even know what regular gunmaking skills are,so I probably don't have them..
but I did make 3 pistols in the same style because I really like the striking mechanism...
I'd never be able to afford most of the antiques out there, even if they were shootable,so I satisfy myself by making them..

 
 Respond to this message   
DT Fletcher
(Login DTFletcher)
Group #188948

Battery description

September 13 2017, 3:25 AM 

The history of the outside lock air gun has never been a subject of any serious study. From what I can determine, the outside lock is likely the oldest of all airgun battery designs, other than the Bourgeoys, as already mentioned. The Bourgeoys dates to 1608 and the first mention of an airgun used in battle is 1634, during the 30 Years war. My guess is that the airguns in 1634 were likely outside lock airguns.

I suspect that if we were able to assemble a complete inventory of all outside lock airguns produced over the centuries that a few ball reservoir types would be included. The reason being that the high pressure pneumatic sphere was a staple of scientific instrument makers and would have been readily available to almost anyone. Obviously, at some point the butt resevior design came into being and seems to have completely predominated outside lock air guns starting sometime in the 1700s.

To tell if your lock design is unique, we'd have to have look inside and compare your design to those seen in Wolff's Air Gun Batteries.

 
 Respond to this message   

Mike
(Login 17hornet)
Group #188948

I've examined it, and

September 14 2017, 9:52 PM 

I'm ok with it's uniqueness...same goes for my mule ear air pistols

 
 Respond to this message   
DT Fletcher
(Login DTFletcher)
Group #188948

Re: I've examined it, and

September 15 2017, 5:49 AM 

Well, can't really credit you with a unique design, if you're not willing to show us exactly what it is you have.

There have been any number of designs to release air from a bottom mounted tank as seen in the definitive Wolff's "Air Gun Batteries"

My first take on a design like yours would that it might include a bell crank to transfer the energy from the rear of the hammer directly to the exhaust valve of the tank. But, there are certainly other ways of accomplishing the same thing. Taking the energy off the front of the hammer, a double bar battery could be used.

Bottom line: the only way of declaring a new battery design is to examine it against those seen in Wolff's book on the subject. If for some reason you don't want to supply pictures of your design, then, get a copy of Air Gun Batteries and make a close study of it. From that, you can then prove the uniqueness of your design by drawing it using the same symbolic characters.

It would be simply lovely to be able to declare that a new, innovative air gun battery --unlike any seen before in history has been invented-- But......



 
 Respond to this message   

Mike
(Login 17hornet)
Group #188948

I wasn't really looking

September 16 2017, 9:11 AM 

For credit, I just wanted to share a rifle I built from my own idea...I haven't really studied the Wolff book closely or copied anything in it...
If anything the batteries in the book are more complicated than mine....my design isn't a secret, it's just that there aren't 5 people in the world that would be curious enough to look at it,let alone anyone declaring a unique new lock style..
I've made a lot of airguns, most are non traditional striking mechanisms
I don't follow a print, so I have no drawings to share,but I'll post pics of the innards soon, for you...doubtful it's of interest to many others.
Mike


    
This message has been edited by 17hornet on Sep 16, 2017 9:32 AM


 
 Respond to this message   
DT fletcher
(Login DTFletcher)
Group #188948

That would be great.

September 17 2017, 9:30 PM 

I would love to see the innards of your airguns. Understood that there is not a lot of general interest in airgun battery design but my interest in the subject knows no bounds.

Wolff developed the idea of Airgun Batteries as a tool for understanding the history of the airgun. From a practical standpoint, it just isn't possible to have a look inside of every historical airgun; however, using a good understanding of Wolff's system, it is entirely possible to describe the type of airgun battery a historical airgun has, even without seeing inside of it. An invaluable tool, for anyone interested in airgun history and it's development.

As it stands, I rather doubt that there are many, if any, really new airgun battery designs left to be had. If you have one, I'd like to know about it.

 
 Respond to this message   

Mike
(Login 17hornet)
Group #188948

Here are photos Dean,

September 20 2017, 9:27 PM 

I used a different gun, a pistol in 45 caliber...I had to take it down to change to a .30 caliber tap loader, so it's a perfect time for pics of the inside

[linked image]

[linked image]

[linked image]

[linked image]

[linked image]

 
 Respond to this message   
DT Fletcher
(Login DTFletcher)
Group #188948

Great pics, thanks!

September 22 2017, 1:51 AM 

I really appreciate the tour of your work. Very nicely done.

This is not technically an outside lock airgun, or at lest it is not what an outside lock mechanism is as seen in Wolff. Instead, it is a modern direct-trip battery; the hammer never goes past the intermediate member,
so, it belongs in the category of a direct trip battery.

It is very similar in form to the late British ball reservoir direct-trip pneumatics. Some of the finish airguns ever made are of this type.


Examples:

British Pneumatic 1750-185084.jpg

British Pneumatic 1750-185085.jpg

British Pneumatic 1750-185086.jpg

British Pneumatic 1750-185087.jpg


Your implementation is unique in that it has an outside lever for the hammer to work against.

 
 Respond to this message   
LD
(Login lhd)
Group #188948

Don't worry about DT not "bestowing" you credit

September 21 2017, 12:08 PM 

Its a fine piece for sure, and his credit wouldn't add much to it's cache in today's airgun credit bank anyhow.

As you recall, I have an even MORE unusal airgun action (including your handmade steel hallmark ball flask) that DT has never seen and its been admired by myself and a hundred others over the last decade or so I've owned it.


    
This message has been edited by lhd on Sep 21, 2017 12:09 PM


 
 Respond to this message   

Mike
(Login 17hornet)
Group #188948

I do remember...

September 21 2017, 12:24 PM 

I'm wasn't really looking for credit, maybe someone will take my idea,and make it better...

 
 Respond to this message   
Ken Walker
(Login therealkennyboy)
Group #188948

You're mistaken!

September 23 2017, 11:06 AM 

>doubtful it's of interest to many others

Actually, it is extremely interesting to see the guts of such mechanisms; I'd bet there are lots of us who find this kind of stuff fascinating, we just don't tend to actually post.

Nice work, as usual, Mike!

Ken

 
 Respond to this message   

Mike
(Login 17hornet)
Group #188948

Thanks Ken,

September 23 2017, 9:21 PM 

I appreciate it...I have others I’ve made, mostly different styles, not all are visually appealing, except to me Haha...i. I’ll see about posting a few of them
Mike

 
 Respond to this message   
Brian Cook
(Login boonieguy)
Group #188948

Always

September 27 2017, 1:08 PM 

I'm always interested in what you are building and how it works .

 
 Respond to this message   

Mike
(Login 17hornet)
Group #188948

Hi Brian,

September 27 2017, 4:23 PM 

Good to hear from you....I’m always interested in your builds too....it’s been a few years since our golf ball cannons have been fired....that was a good day!

 
 Respond to this message   
MDriskill
(Login MDriskill)
Group #188948

That's awesome!

September 12 2017, 12:29 PM 

Mike, it's really great to see your creations here! Hope there are many more to come.

I'm certainly no computer expert, but there are different ways to downsize the image.

Some photo-hosting sites set up different sizes for different uses, or allow you to choose a size manually. For a forum something less than 1MB size is plenty.

If you need to size the image prior to hosting it, most PC's have the simple graphics program "Paint." If you open the picture in Paint, you can re-size it easily. It gives you some options, to me the simplest is to choose a percentage of the original image dimensions. It looks like 25% to 30% would be about right for yours.


    
This message has been edited by MDriskill on Sep 12, 2017 12:40 PM


 
 Respond to this message   

Mike
(Login 17hornet)
Group #188948

Thanks Mike

September 12 2017, 12:41 PM 

I'll try

[linked image]


    
This message has been edited by 17hornet on Sep 12, 2017 1:02 PM


 
 Respond to this message   
 
  << Previous Topic | Next Topic >>Return to Start  
Find more forums on Air GunsCreate your own forum at Network54
 Copyright © 1999-2017 Network54. All rights reserved.   Terms of Use   Privacy Statement  
This forum dedicated to all that enjoy collecting and restoring airguns. Have fun. Dave