Well, I figure I might get deleted over there, so brought it over here. I admit it pisses me off to be lied about. But how can you argue with God's chosen, who are the only ones with discernment, are free to make false statements, and say "Oh I read it somewhere and am sure others did too." Bullshit.
I can't quote exact wording but they was talk about then two of them coming to their senses (Somewhere)I am sure I am not the only one who read it. After that I decided NOT to even bother reading anywhere else.
Error does not become Truth because it is widely accepted; Truth does not become error, even when it stands alone!"
Re: I don't believe I said that
May 2 2008 at 3:37 PM
Kristy (Login Kristy_)
Forum Owner
Response to I don't believe I said that
I am not sure who all said what, but that was the jist of it. I thought it was you and Vince. I also can not quote exact words nor do I remember exactly where I seen it. But whatever If I am wrong God will judge me for it.
Error does not become Truth because it is widely accepted; Truth does not become error, even when it stands alone!"
I read somewhere that Kristy and Matt hate non-Christians
May 2 2008, 2:02 PM
I am not sure who all said what, but that was the jist of it. I thought it was Kristy and Matt. I also can not quote exact words nor do I remember exactly where I seen it. But whatever If I am wrong God will judge me for it.
The above is satire. Sometimes it is the best way to make a point.
~Mondo
This message has been edited by Oscar50 on May 2, 2008 2:54 PM
I guess it doesn't get my goat quite as much as yours because I remember what it was like on BOF back about 2000 when I was intensely engaged in trying to defend the faith.
I would JUST (seemingly) have put a group of sarcastic "mockers" to flight and along came the next wave of new people. It just never stopped. To make matters worse, I was also continually undermined by Christians themselves. It was like trying to keep a sand-glass filled. I began to wonder if there was ANY point at all in working so hard to defend Christian belief.
So, yeah ...... I read a lot of "intent" into the postings of non-Christians at that time. I gave TS quite a hard time at times, making lots of ad-hominem remarks about him. (I even called him "Tooth-seeker" one time ....... to make fun of his age. Today, I'm the same age!~). Yes, I used intimidation whenever I felt like it because I wanted to SHUT THEM (T.F.) UP!
These people have convinced themselves that the traditional NT tales are 100%, literal truth.
Therefore, in dealing with them...
It is necessary to take into consideration their PSF...
-- "Personal Suggestibility Factor".
In the case of Cult members, such as "christians"...
The "GSF" ("Group Suggestibility Factor") must also be considered.
The GSF leads members of the Cult to the willing predisposition of believing another group member...
-- above and beyond anyone from outside of their collective mindset.
In this particular case, the GSF has come into play by reinforcing each Cult member's PSF...
In such a way as to cause each indiviual to Believe that the initial statement was correct.
The most suggestible of the group, having accepted the suggestion, under the influence of the GSF...
Has allowed him/herself to become fully immersed in the concept...
To the point where the suggested event has become so "real" to that member...
That, under the influence of the PSF, they have become convinced of their own participation in the suggested event.
When this person speaks of their "participation"...
This reinforces the GSF for other members of the group...
In turn, further reinforcing each individual member's own PSF...
Thus, causing them to believe that they too participated in an event that never took place.
At this point, to say that these people are "lying" would be cmopletely off base.
They have convinced themselves that what they are saying...
-- Not unlike the traditional Gospel Tales to which they cling...
Is entirely... True.
They are guilty only of possessing a very high degree of suggestible gullibility.
Oh, I would LOVE to see these people in the hands of a Trained Stage Hypnotist!
-- On the count of three...
-- You will... Cluck Like a Chicken!
-- When I clap my hands...
-- You will stop.
I was thinking that the other day myself; the HYPNOSIS factor plays the biggest part in their "revealed truth" from the "holy spirit".
Once they relay a hunch to "two or three" other "witnesses" and get unanimous agreement, the hunch becomes divine revelation without question. Thereafter, it assumes a large-as-life persona of its own.
Can any ONE stand on his own convictions? Ah ........... that's the real test I think. Then it truly is, just you and God.
Thanks PRev. It makes sense, like a group hallucination. So one of them says they vaguely remember something and suddenly all of them vaguely remember it. Although, a part of me believes if you asked the last subject what she remembers, she wouldn't actually repeat what the first subject says. It is just another form of Amening, me thinks.
They were just careless about letting perceptions dictate their judgment. It's a valuable lesson to learn: DON'T judge ............ until you KNOW what you're talking about.
Sometimes it looks like a lie, but there are many possible explanations, and we should give the benefit of the doubt, as we would wish to be given the benefit of the doubt.
Just thought I should encourage you a little Marge. Not that you need it, but I do see quite often where you still are getting raked for what some see as your "deconversion".
It took a lot of faith and courage for you to truly seek truth and allow your beliefs to be question, shaken and ultimately destroyed.
That is indeed the narrow path, and there are few that find it.
peace Sister
Now, I really don't see how this is "bragging", nor why it would be offensive to anyone. I admire Marge's courage. There are probably lots of people that have crises of faith, and probably lots that in their hearts depart the false faith, but keep an outer appearance.
It takes courage to give a witness to truth. Whether that truth is finding truth in the Bible, or finding that truth is not in the Bible.
If those were the posts, it explains the perception Kristy got.
I didn't think I'd "rejoiced" over having helped Marge change her mind and leave the Christian faith ....... but ....... I sometimes DO say things flippantly and so I wasn't exactly sure.
My position is this:
I definitely DON'T want to encourage people to drop all faith and become atheists. While I don't hold atheists in contempt, it's not a philosophy I could ever envision myself to embrace.
At the time I left my own Christian faith behind, I had a dream (which I've posted before) ..... which I shared on BOF at that time. It had to do with my wife falling off a rapidly-moving go-cart and ripping out her pelvis and her being mad as hornets, standing there and pointing to her pelvis on the ground and giving me heck.
The "interpretation" of that dream was quite clear to me (if it wasn't to anyone else). My future mission would entail ripping out the ability of Christians to reproduce their religion as they always had been able to, traditionally.
The fact that my wife was STANDING (without a pelvis) signified to me that faith in God was self-sustaining and DIDN'T need propogation through reproduction (ie being "born" into it).
This would REALLY piss off Christians ........ but they wouldn't see that ............ they could stand (and WERE standing) WITHOUT their human propups.
I don't know if this means anything to anyone else but it was very significant to me at that time because it gave me a "sign" that I WASN'T fighting God in my quest and mission to show Christians the TRUTH. I wouldn't be destroying peoples' faith; rather, I would be helping people REFINE their faith.
So, while I don't have any grandiose vision of my mission accomplishing anything spectacular on this earth, nevertheless, the private message I got from God was that I was on the right track and he was ok with it.
If I was to be instrumental in creating atheists ...... I would become a little worried.
for me to speak up and sound my heart to people. Childhood conditioned me to STFU or suffer for speaking. So I generally do keep my feelings (ones that would be perceived as negative) close to the vest. I'm a little sorry already for what I said over at Jules but mostly because of the responses. Can't throw fists over the internet so that's a plus for speaking my mind. I don't generally like saying negative things about people 'cause I know how it feels to be criticized but sometimes I just gotta say it and get it done. Oh well. Some bandaids just gotta be ripped off and done with.
Being Christian...Ignorance is bliss...for the ignorant
May 3 2008, 8:19 AM
What Christians, due to their insistence upon a literal interpretation of their Bibles (who knows which version they've chosen) do not know is that the Christ they're expecting to ride in on a White Horse is not a physical Christ but a 'quality' of mind called 'Christ' in the Occident.
They don't know the difference between Jesus and the Christ and would be astounded (astonishment clothed in denial) to learn that the White Horse of Jesus is the White Horse of the Zodiacal sign Sagittarius.
This Christ quality Mind is also in process of doing precisely what their Bibles in Matthew 25:31-34 says (as usual, over-emotionally and a bit much) Christ mind will do...separate the sheep from the goats...New Age thinkers from Old Age thinkers; those who represent the "good ground" alluded to in Matthew 13:8 as opposed to those of Matthew 13:5,6, and 7.
As Matthew 25:33 symbolically points out, the Sheep on God;s right hand (always a symbol for the spiritual... the spiritually oriented who will continue their ascent up their Mountains of Transfiguration to where, at its summit they will "inherit the kingdom prepared for them", as Matthew 25:34 says, in contra-distinction from the goats who will be on God's left (always a symbol for materiality, greed, selfishness, stagnation).
As we know, whenever Christianity finds a scripture (God's inerrant word) which refutes, disagrees with, their interpretation they (never, as your post says, "being wrong") come up with a new, revised edition in which God agrees with them.
But originally, as you also know, in all the scriptures of all religious Expressions ante-dating by thousands of years what is today recognised as Christianity, scriptures from which the Bible was plagiarised we find, worded differently of course, what Luke 17:21 says; that the prepared kingdom spoken to in Matt. 25:34 is within everyone from the foundation of the world.
BW, the "from the foundation of the world" leads into more discussion.
It is almost like they believer that the brain and intellect were given to us by Satan. Thinking is evil and dangerous. It is no wonder that God didn't give us brains.
I then got the warning from Matthew that what I had said was not allowed. I got a little 'you're kidding me right? you couldn't possibly be that tight-ass' but indeed, that is the tightness of his ass, more probably. I guess he never farts. :-D
