Is the fact that if you have a label someone can be derogatory about it.
If you have not, but your belief system does not fit any recognised group, you can dodge the bullets a little.
"oh, YOU CHRISTIANS, are this or that" for example.
What can you say to someone who sort of believes in a God, wont call it god, has various snippets of a belief system, not based on any one known group?
It allows them to be anonymous as such, and allows them to be under the radar for attacks upon them.
Not saying thats wrong, but it just makes me smile.
Me knows what you mean...me just needed to make up a reason to post something for me has been in a 'mood' lately and don't quess I gonna get out of it if'n I do not go back to posting some 'stoopid poop' :-)
Is the fact that if you have a label someone can be derogatory about it.
If you have not, but your belief system does not fit any recognised group, you can dodge the bullets a little.
"oh, YOU CHRISTIANS, are this or that" for example.
What can you say to someone who sort of believes in a God, wont call it god, has various snippets of a belief system, not based on any one known group?
It allows them to be anonymous as such, and allows them to be under the radar for attacks upon them.
Not saying thats wrong, but it just makes me smile.
Ju
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billlife share'd > Bill(Login PlanoBill)
Sufi
Works for me...
February 8 2009, 6:59 AM
Well, sounds a bit like me anyway.
Me knows what you mean...me just needed to make up
a reason to post something
for me has been in a 'mood' lately
and don't quess I gonna get out of it
***************************************************************
if'n I do not go back to posting some 'stoopid poop'
Hello billlife!
One!life > Share'n this with U, Cause: (use'd the word, silly )
Good, please DO make that a good habit, to save me having to read your replies.
"And, every time I Do...?
-- You're whining about something else."
Then you cant be reading many of them, as you admit. I suggest you read more of them, to get the right impression. Not my fault you come to wrong conclusions, is it?.... oh, and I will whine about what I want to whine about, if it irritates you or not.
"This is just one of those rare occasions..."
They do seem to be on the increase though, dont they? Please, do feel free to go back to not doing so.
"I'm reading...
And responding...
Because...
Well... I'm bored...
And... You're an easy target."
Yes, I guessed you were bored. Maybe get out more?
As for me being an EASY target.... depends on what you THINK is being targeted. You got me wrong sucker, you dont get to me.... but it makes me smile watching you try being clever enough to do it. Keep trying, if your still bored. I have nothing better to do at the moment. Burks like you dont get to me, as I know what you are about, and it makes me smile.
"The "point" of it all...?
-- Entertainment."
Yes, you are mildly entertaining, mich like watching the chimps in the zoo (though they do seem a little more inteligent)....keep it up, I am indeed a little entertained.
"You see...
-- I've always been a big fan of Mr. Alda's work."
First you say I shouldn't read your posts...
Then you say I should read MORE of posts...
-- You are obviously a double-minded man.
Personally...
Over the time we've "known" each other...
I think I've read MORE than Enough of your posts.
And...
The conclusion I've reached...
-- Is perfectly valid.
-PRev1-
Congratulations
President Barrack Hussein Obama
-- God's Will Has Been Done --
If there is any dodging that is being done it is by you, Ju.
Some believe, and it is just a belief, not a fact, that they can dodge hell or be favoured by their idea of God by just declaring themselves Christian. Ah, if only it were that easy.
Again, there is no dodging, cos whether you like it or not, we are all humans before we are any other labels we choose to give ourselves.
As humans, we are all fully aware of the Poles of Dualism and the effect of living at the end of one half or the other end of the other half or the Middle Way.
We have evolved to know the difference.
So there is no dodging and those that think otherwise create negative energies.
Thing is, some want individual results. Don't like to think that all their goodness is for individual benefit after 'death'. Well, it is what we all ARE as a collective that makes the difference.
So in the belief that Christians (or whatever belief system) are Special Ones, you put yourself up as targets.
In the main, most will leave alone cos what you believe is nothing in the main to anyone outside your own little circles. But when you step into a multi-belief forum or place and try and get away with such stuff as Christian Love and Prayers then those that have seen 'you' (meaning whoever is preaching) or another being, in 'action', well, just human, then don't be surprised or upset when we treat you as you have desired, yet wished only the best of.
"What can you say to someone who sort of believes in a God, wont call it god, has various snippets of a belief system, not based on any one known group? "
Well, apart from saying, how understandable, cos there is no proof for the existence or non-existence of a God (), and saying how understandable it is NOT to imprison oneself in a cult that is full of holes, well, also, someone that is able to try and be the best person they can (and yes, sometimes fail) in their everyday life, well, one can say, they are a creditable work in progress.
Hope that helps.
For one, I am not anonymous. I am so open that anyone can see my contradictions. Cos as humans with very limited knowledge, no one is the 100 per center. Bits of the puzzle of who we are and where we come from and why are to be found everywhere. Not just in one place, and definitely, (yes, in my opinion ), not just on this earth.
Before you feel too sorry for yourself, from your Christian Brethren on just a couple of forums, I have been called a whore, an adulteress, a bad mother, someone who has condemned my children to hell cos I won't scare them with hell stories that they HAVE to believe in Jesus as the only way to God. Oh yes, and someone who is a witch and should be burned at the stake.
And that is just off the tip of my head.
Nice.
You once told me that men should always be the head of the house. Why? Cos Adam was created first and cos God placed man at the head of the household? Wishful patriarchal thinking, well past it's seel past date.
Hey, that's kinda derogatory, yeah?
Oh yeah, and a little giggle at feminism. And that is not derogatory? Christian belief in the main is derogatory to woman.
What bullets indeed and fired by Christians!
No easy ways for any of us. It's plain hard work and the 'result' is a mass transformation, hopefully, for the better.
In my opinion.....
This message has been edited by BlueJudah on Feb 8, 2009 9:32 AM This message has been edited by BlueJudah on Feb 8, 2009 9:15 AM
Nope, smiling in that way one smiles when you reralise how people often treat those they dont understand, but THINK they do. If I was feeling 'sorry' for myself, I would say so. Nope, I am not feeling sorry for ME, but I do feel sorry for a few others.
"If there is any dodging that is being done it is by you, Ju."
What have I dodged exactly? Not my style, if anything I respond when maybe I should just walk away.
"Some believe, and it is just a belief, not a fact, that they can dodge hell or be favoured by their idea of God by just declaring themselves Christian. Ah, if only it were that easy."
Not me, so why is that applicable in this post? In fact, I dont know anyone who believes that, maybe its just in YOUR mind?
"Again, there is no dodging, cos whether you like it or not, we are all humans before we are any other labels we choose to give ourselves."
Um, yea, I noticed we are all human. That wasnt the point, was it?
"As humans, we are all fully aware of the Poles of Dualism and the effect of living at the end of one half or the other end of the other half or the Middle Way."
Its cold today, not as cold as yesterday....well, it doesnt FEEL as cold, but it might actually be colder. It will proabaly get even colder, but then again, it might not...... yes, this has nothig to do with the topic of discussion either.
"We have evolved to know the difference."
Whos this 'we'? You might have evolved to know the difference, I only see a change in some people, who have decided not to be certain about anything. Some 'evolution' eh?
"So there is no dodging and those that think otherwise create negative energies."
Do they? I hadnt noticed that.
"Thing is, some want individual results. Don't like to think that all their goodness is for individual benefit after 'death'. Well, it is what we all ARE as a collective that makes the difference."
Is it? I dont think it is at all. The 'collective' seems to be a mess, in my opinion. There are indevidual results, for those who believe it. Thats not YOUR belief it seems.
"So in the belief that Christians (or whatever belief system) are Special Ones, you put yourself up as targets."
Why? By believing in a set of values? Why should that make anyone a 'target'? Why should YOU not be a 'target'?
"In the main, most will leave alone cos what you believe is nothing in the main to anyone outside your own little circles."
Or maybe BIG circles? It IS important to others outside, or we would not be discussing it in the first place, so thats a load of rubbish, right?
"But when you step into a multi-belief forum or place and try and get away with such stuff as Christian Love and Prayers then those that have seen 'you' (meaning whoever is preaching) or another being, in 'action', well, just human, then don't be surprised or upset when we treat you as you have desired, yet wished only the best of."
Thats got NOTHING to do with what upset me. I have NO problem talking to those with different beliefs to mine, so thats also rubbish. This was all to do with one person using a topic for his own agenda and another, who I thought was a kindly person acting in a mean spirited way, nothing to do with religion at all actually.
Julian - "What can you say to someone who sort of believes in a God, wont call it god, has various snippets of a belief system, not based on any one known group? "
"Well, apart from saying, how understandable, cos there is no proof for the existence or non-existence of a God, and saying how understandable it is NOT to imprison oneself in a cult that is full of holes, well, also, someone that is able to try and be the best person they can (and yes, sometimes fail) in their everyday life, well, one can say, they are a creditable work in progress."
That wasnt the point, it was about how easy it is to not be targeted, just because a person has 'wishy washy' beliefs (that actually dont amount to a lot).
"Hope that helps. "
Oh, you are helping me with each post you make Jackie, you can be assured.
"For one, I am not anonymous."
Didnt say you were. The comment was about being anonymous as far as a tag is concerned.
"I am so open that anyone can see my contradictions."
Yep, thats very true, you are, and they are.
"Cos as humans with very limited knowledge, no one is the 100 per center."
Center of what?
"Bits of the puzzle of who we are and where we come from and why are to be found everywhere. Not just in one place, and definitely, (yes, in my opinion happy.gif), not just on this earth."
I only know people on earth well enough to comment. The rest is indeed open to discussion, as we cant prove much either way.
"Before you feel too sorry for yourself,"
As I said, I dont.
"from your Christian Brethren on just a couple of forums, I have been called a whore, an adulteress, a bad mother, someone who has condemned my children to hell cos I won't scare them with hell stories that they HAVE to believe in Jesus as the only way to God."
Yes, I know, and those who said that to you are in error. If your remember I said it at the time.
"You once told me that men should always be the head of the house. Why? Cos Adam was created first."
Because that what God designated. Being the head doesnt have to be what you might make it out to be though. Thats another topic for discussion though.
"Hey, that's kinda derogatory, yeah?"
To who?
"No easy ways for any of us. It's plain hard work and the 'result' is a mass transformation, hopefully, for the better."
When two mind sets are so different, then SO BE It....
As far as dualism is concerend, the pole business, I have no idea why you turned it into a weather report. It is that as humans we know the deal of good and bad without the necessity of a label like religion to be 'judged' from. So Christians, to me, are in no more a vulnerable place than being a human is.
Luv
Jackie
We are all of 1 Spirit
and
1 Spirit is The All That Is!
If you have not, but your belief system does not fit any recognised group, you can dodge the bullets a little.
Apparently you haven't seen the posts about "unbelievers", and "apostates", and "heretics", and those children of Satan ..
No, there is no escape really. Much as their are folks that speak sweeping and disparagingly of "Christians", there are folks that do so about "unbelievers", or, even worse "liberals" -- be it political, societal or religious.
There is some truth in what you say regarding the taking of a position, period. Those that never say much, or never discuss their own beliefs, can never be targets. But put it out there, whatever "it" is, be it atheism, Christianity, New Age, or Taoism or ... whatever -- put it out there, and you have painted a bulls-eye on your back for someone.
Just my thoughts, based on my experiences and observations.
By the way Julian, I do appreciate your contributions here. I like diversity of opinion .. it is nice to get your views on these subjects. I do believe that by discussing as we are here, we can see things differently.
I find myself a bit in the middle on these things. I am not considered a "believer", but I'm not an atheist either. I was pondering today though that one of the most accepting sites I ever visited was an atheist site -- and yes, I posted there about Intelligent Design, and while I wasn't a Christian they did all consider me a theist. And yet, I was never marginalized for not being one of them.
This message has been edited by Oscar50 on Feb 8, 2009 1:59 PM
If each of us are firm and sure in what we believe....why all the concern over what others 'say'?
Name calling is one the first defensive responses we learn as children when we cannot or are not equipped to give a measured response to someone challenging us either personally or otherwise.....
some continue it into adulthood for the same reasons.....why then all the fuss about those who do it?
It has nothing to do with Atheism or christianity.....just maturity or maybe just habit....?
This will never change i will add.
I will add too all those labels....apostate, etc.....used equally WITHIN the christian ranks.....so it is not something exclusively used against say atheists......
it imv, is something that gets way too much attention based on its real importance and seriousness.....in fact it is just childishness....
so why so much worry if someone calls another an apostate etc.?
big deal really imv.....lol actually it should be amusing not irritating imv....
so?.....for example...'gerry you dam apostate, liberal male chavanist pig you!'
ouch?.....lol.....find the humor in it.....i wish i understood here the intolerance for 'the intolerant'......i mean i have read comments like this one for maybe 10 years:
'...how to use scripture IN CONTEXT, but since you reject the whole counsel of God's Word...'
YET...it upsets people still when it is said to them?
why?
I have been called an apostate and not a real christian more times than I could ever count....
and?
Also....while that site you went to/mentioned Mondo...as being a good one and being an atheist site as you said....well....again i say that there are JUST as many intolerant atheists as there are Jews, muslums, christians, Kalahari Bushman....whatever.....
I probably shouldn't say anything here.....however....i just did anyhow..
Does it matter when people paint Christians with a certain brush? I think that's part of where this started. Although, I'm not sure. Grin. These discussions get a life of their own, and to be honest, I had a hard time keeping the thread on this one. Maybe because it's more of a tangle of threads.
I was pondering this in the afternoon, walking the dogs. There's a spirit of divisiveness in some of us, and it doesn't come down to our beliefs. I will contend though that the fundamentalist/dogmatic type, be it Christian, Muslim, Atheist or what have you -- is by their very nature going to be more intolerant. Because when you have the One and Only Truth -- that follows, it seems.
I still hold out hope that thing will change, that we all will change. I've seen many of us, in stops and starts, growing in maturity. It isn't linear, and it isn't on all topics.
So perhaps it doesn't matter, but it does seem that is a big part of this whole discussion.
But, it is ironic, that part of what started all of "this", is one fellow who above all others feels he has the truth, and has the right interpretation of what it means to love, and points to Jesus using a whip in the temple as an example of his own righteous anger ...
