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The Deity (Godship) of Jesus Christ According To The Scriptures

March 17 2008 at 9:06 PM

 

 
The Deity of Jesus Christ
According To The Scriptures


One of the most common traits of the cults is their denial of the Deity (Godship) of Jesus Christ. In an effort to prove that He is not God, the cults often point to scripture that they have taken OUT OF CONTEXT. These are most often scriptures that refer to His human nature, while they ignore all the scriptures that explictly teach His Deity. In this little outline, we will present the Deity of Jesus Christ according to the Scriptures.

1) Explicit "Doctrinal" Statements

A. Matthew 1:23 - "God with us"
B. John 1:1,18 - "The Word was God"
C. Romans 9:5 - "God blessed forever"
D. 1 Timothy 3:16 - "God in the flesh"
E. Titus 2:13 - "God and Savior"
F. Colossians 2:9 - "Fullness of the Godhead" (Greek: theotetos - the state of being God; not theiotes - divine, divine quality)
G. James 2:1 - "Lord of Glory"
H. 1 John 5:20 - "The true God"
I. Isaiah 9:6 - "Mighty God"
J. 2 Peter 1:1 - "God and Savior"
K. Revelation 1:8;21:6; 22:12-20; 1:17-18 - "First and Last"

2) Called The "Image" Or "First-Born" (Not First-Created)

A. Colossians 1:15
B. 2 Corinthians 4:4
C. Hebrews 1:3-6
D. Psalm 89:27

3) Jesus' Own Claims

A. John 5:17-18 - Called God His own Father
B. John 10:30 - "I and the Father are One"
C. Matthew 19:17 - "only One is good"
D. John 16:15 - "all things the Father has are mine"
E. John 8:24,58; 18:5-6 - "I AM"

4) Jesus Separates Himself From Humanity

A. Luke 11:13 - "You being evil" (not "we")
B. John 2:24-25 - did not trust Himself to man
C. John 3:7 - "You must be born again" (not "we")

5) What Contemporaries Thought of Jesus

A. His Friends:
1. Thomas - John 20:28 - "My Lord and My God"
2. Paul - Acts 20:28 - "God spent His own blood"
3. Paul and Ananias - Acts 9:5,10; 15:17 with Acts 22:12-22 - Saul chosen by Him/God

B. His Father - Hebrews 1:8 - "Your throne, O God"

C. His Enemies:
The Jews understood Jesus claimed Deity by attempting to execute Him many times - John 5:18; 10:35; Mark 14:63

6) Eternal ("Pre") Existence

A. Micah 5:2 - "From the days of eternity"
B. Isaiah 9:5 - "Father of eternity"
C. John 1:1-2 - "In the beginning" (origin)
D. John 1:15 - "He was before me"
E. John 8:58 - "before Abraham"
F. John 17:5 - "before the world"
G. Revelation 1:8 - "Who is, was, is to come"

7) Old Testament Passage Referring to Yahweh Applied Specifically To Jesus By New Testament Writers

A. Matthew 1:23/Isaiah 7:14 - "God with us"
B. Matthew 3:3; Mark 1:2-3; Luke 3:4; John 1:23/Isaiah 40:3 - "Straighten the way of the Lord"
C. Matthew 11:10/Malachi 3:1 - messenger to clear way
D. Romans 10:13/Joel 2:32 - believe on Him
E. Philippians 2:10/Isaiah 45:23 - knees bow to Him
F. Hebrews 1:6/Psalm 97:5,7 - worship Him
G. Hebrews 1:8/Psalm 45:6 - "Thy throne O God"
H. Hebrews 1:10-12/Psalm 102:24-27 - made the heavens
I. Revelation 1:7/Zechariah 12:10 - the pierced One
J. Revelation 15:3-4/Deuteronomy 32:3-4 - song of Moses/the Lamb

8) Old Testament Titles Referring To Yahweh Applied Specifically To Jesus By New Testament Writers

A. Revelation 2:8; 22:13,16/Isaiah 41:4; 44:6 - First and Last
B. John 8:24,58/Exodus 3:14; Isaiah 43:10 - "I AM"
C. 2 Timothy 4:1; John 5:22/Genesis 18:25 - Judge
D. John 1:9; 8:12/Psalm 27:1; Isaiah 60:19 - Light
E. Titus 3:4,6/Isaiah 43:11; 45:21; 35:4 - Savior
F. 1 Corinthians 10:4/Isaiah 28:16; Psalm 78:35 - Rock
G. John 10:11,16/Pslam 23:1 - Shepherd
H. Colossians 1:16; John 1:2/Isaiah 44:24 - Creator
I. Matthew 2:2; Acts 17:7/Pslam 5:2; 24:10 - King
J. Mark 2:19; John 3:29/Hosea 2:16; Isaiah 62:5 - Bridegroom
K. Acts 9:34/Psalm 103:3 - Healer

9) Placed On Par With The Father and The Holy Ghost

A. Trinitarian Events/Formulas:
1. Luke 1:35 - Incarnation
2. Matthew 3:16 - Baptism of Jesus
3. Matthew 28:19 - Baptism of Believers
4. 2 Corinthians 13:14 - a blessing
5. 1 Corinthians 12:4-6 - Gifts, service, working

B. The Three Working Together
1. Ephesians 2:18,22 - Access to the Father/built into dwelling
2. Ephesians 3:14-17 - we are strengthened
3. Hebrews 2:3,4 - Word announced, testified to
4. Acts 3:26; John 2:19; 1 Peter 3:18 - Resurrection of Jesus
5. John 14:26; 15:26 - Jesus send Holy Ghost from the Father

C. Parallels Between The Father and The Son:
1. John 5:23 - Honor the Son as the Father
2. John 8:19,24 - Know the Son/Know the Father
3. John 14:1 - Trust in God, in Jesus
4. Matthew 11:27 - Only the Son knows the Father
5. 1 Corinthians 8:6 - for whom we exist, through whom we exist

10) Jesus In The Old Testament (Barely a Sampling)

A. Isaiah 9:6 - Counselor, God, Father
B. Isaiah 49:7 - Lord and His Holy One
C. Psalm 110:1 - Lord said unto my Lord
D. Zechariah 13:7 - My Shepherd and Associate

11) Divine Attributes

A. Divine Actions:
1. Acts 5:31; Mark 2:5-10; Luke 5:20-24 - Forgives sins
2. Matthew 14:33; Hebrews 1:6 - Receives worship (see Luke 4:8)
3. Acts 7:59; John 14:14; 2 Peter 3:18 - Receives prayer
4. John 1:4; 11:25; 14:6 - Gives life, light
5. John 3:13; 6:51 - From heaven
6. 1 Thessalonians 3:13; Zechariah 14:4-5 - Will come on the clouds
7. John 5:27-29 - Will raise all men
8. John 17:2 - Gives eternal life
9. John 14:27; 16:33; Romans 15:33 - Gives Peace
10. Colossians 1:17; Hebrews 1:3 - Upholds all things

B. Divine Attributes:
1. John 2:19; 10:17-18; 5:26 - Self-existence
2. 1 John 1:2; John 17:5,24 - Eternal
3. Matthew 18:20; 28:20; John 3:13; Ephesians 1:21 - Omnipresence
4. Matthew 9:4; 12:25; Mark 2:8; Luke 6:8; 9:47 - Omniscience
5. Matthew 28:18; Luke 21:15; John 1:3; 10:18 - Omnipotence
6. Hebrews 1:11-12; 13:8 - Unchangeable
7. John 6;69; 8:46; Matthew 27:3-4; Luke 23:22,41 - Holiness
8. John 1:4; 11:25; 14:6 - Life

As can clearly be seen from the above, the scriptures explicitly declare the Godship of Jesus Christ. Thus to deny His Deity is to deny the inspired, written Word of God.

Something To Remember

Jesus was not only God, but God-Man. The following verses help to explain some Arian proof-text used to deny His Deity:

1. Colossians 2:9 - Deity in bodily form (Gk: somatikos)
2. Hebrews 2:14-18 - Shared Humanity
3. Philippians 2:6-8 - Emptied Himself, took the form of a man (Note: The Isaiah 45:23 passage immediately follows.)


1. Colossians 2:9 - Deity in bodily form (Gk: somatikos)
2. Hebrews 2:14-18 - Shared Humanity
3. Philippians 2:6-8 - Emptied Himself, took the form of a man (Note: The Isaiah 45:23 passage immediately follows.)




Rev. Jack Howell
"For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God to salvation to every one that believes; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek." (Romans 1:16)

john1_1





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AuthorReply
VER

WHO TOLD YOU THAT JESUS IS GOD?..YOUR POPE AND PRIEST?

March 18 2008, 6:03 AM 

ARE YOU ANY BETTER THAN THE INSPIRED HEBREW WRITER?
THEY ARE ALL UNISON IN IMPLYING JESUS IS A MN...NOT GOD!

Heb 3:3 For this man was counted worthy of more glory than Moses, inasmuch as he who hath builded the house hath more honour than the house.

Heb 7:4 Now consider how great this man was, unto whom even the patriarch Abraham gave the tenth of the spoils.

Heb 7:24 But this man, because he continueth ever, hath an unchangeable priesthood.

Heb 10:12 But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;

JESUS IS A FABRICATED GOD- WE HAVE BEEN EXPOSING THIS FACTS LONG AGO..

SOURCE:
http://www.nexusmagazine.com/articles/NewTestament.html
--------------------------------------------------

Constantine's intention at Nicaea was to create an entirely new god for
his empire who would unite all religious factions under one deity.
Presbyters were asked to debate and decide who their new god would be.
Delegates argued among themselves, expressing personal motives for
inclusion of particular writings that promoted the finer traits of
their own special deity. Throughout the meeting, howling factions
were immersed in heated debates, and the names of 53 gods were tabled
for discussion. "As yet, no God had been selected by the council,
and so they balloted in order to determine that matter... For one
year and five months the balloting lasted..." (God's Book of Eskra,
Prof. S. L. MacGuire's translation, Salisbury, 1922, chapter xlviii,
paragraphs 36, 41).
At the end of that time, Constantine returned to the gathering to
discover that the presbyters had not agreed on a new deity but had
balloted down to a shortlist of five prospects: Caesar, Krishna, Mithra,
Horus and Zeus (Historia Ecclesiastica, Eusebius, c. 325). Constantine
was the ruling spirit at Nicaea and he ultimately decided upon a new
god for them. To involve British factions, he ruled that the name of
the great Druid god, Hesus, be joined with the Eastern Saviour-god,
Krishna (Krishna is Sanskrit for Christ), and thus Hesus Krishna would
be the official name of the new Roman god. A vote was taken and it was
with a majority show of hands (161 votes to 157) that both divinities
became one God. Following longstanding heathen custom, Constantine used
the official gathering and the Roman apotheosis decree to legally deify
two deities as one, and did so by democratic consent. A new god was
proclaimed and "officially" ratified by Constantine (Acta Concilii Nicaeni, 1618).
That purely political act of deification effectively and legally placed Hesus
and Krishna among the Roman gods as one individual composite. That abstraction
lent Earthly existence to amalgamated doctrines for the Empire's new religion;
and because there was no letter "J" in alphabets until around the ninth century,
the name subsequently evolved into "Jesus Christ".

 
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Albert

Ver, can you tell this forum the real issue

July 25 2009, 8:31 PM 

why Jesus was crucified by the Jews?

 
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ver

Re: Ver, can you tell this forum the real issue

September 12 2009, 8:44 AM 

jesaus was mis-understood by the jews..
he never claimed he is god but the one sent by god.

john 8:40 But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham.

--------------------------------------------------
Friendly Advice:
Obey Gods Law and Submit yourself to it:

John 17:17 ¶ Sanctify them by Your truth; Your word is truth.

 
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Albert

Jesus never corrected them.

April 2 2010, 1:19 AM 

He did not say to them that He was not God. Can you cite a verse that categorically say that Jesus was not God? Don't ever mention verses that says He's just a man because that will become moot and academic as we believe He is both God and man.

 
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ver

stop destorting jesus true teaching about God

May 30 2010, 2:57 AM 

How dare you opposed jesus teaching that his father is the only god..
if you still insist your absurdity then accept that jesus brothers were also gods....

John 17:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

see?...where in the world can you find that a god has a brethren?
only in your wildest nightmare..lol

 
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Albert

Remember Jesus also prayed to his Father God?

April 7 2012, 5:30 PM 

On earth when He had assumed human form, He was then also become subject to God's laws and man's laws as well as humans diseases and suffering. He was likewise capable of committing sins which He didn't. But when He take His place in the Throne of heaven everything will be back on its former course. The important thing is that He experienced how it is to be like humans and by His not sinning as a man and for being obedient to God's laws while He lives among us He had earned the right to be our Ultimate Judge. Even the angels and cherubims have not experienced how to become human that's why Jesus is exalted above them. Jesus can say, 'I have been there.'

 
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Albert

Jesus was not misunderstood by the jews.....

April 22 2011, 1:29 AM 

they crucified Him because they cannot accept his revelation that He was God.

 
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VER

IS CHRIST CO-CREATOR?

March 18 2008, 6:18 AM 

V> "HO THEOS" = IN GREEK IS USED TO PINPOINT THE SINGULARITY OF GOD

N> I'm not disagreeing at all that there is only ONE TRUE GOD. I never have. The problem I see YOU'RE HAVING is that YOU are viewing God as an "ABSOLUTE" singularity where as the Bible even from the beginning DOESN'T TEACH that. The Bible teaches God as a "COMPOSITE UNITY", meaning while there is ONE TRUE GOD the exists THREE DISTINCT PERSONS, that possess the ONE TRUE GOD nature.


Gen 1:26-27
26 Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground."
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them. (NIV)

VER
Christ is neither the Creator in John 1:3 nor the Co-Creator in Gen. 1:26

The proponents of the Christ-is-God doctrine allege that Christ created all things. They cite John 1:3 which states:


All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. (NKJV)


The verse does not say that Christ created all things. What is written is All things were made through Him. However, this doesnt imply that He is the Almighty Creator since this would contradict what is written in Isaiah 44:24 that the Father alone is the Creator. Apostle Paul explains why all things were made through Christ:


For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. (Col. 1:16, Ibid.)

All things were created by God for Christ. As to why all things were created for Him, Apostle Paul explains:


God did what he had purposed, and made known to us the secret plan he had already decided to compete by means of Christ. This plan, which God will complete when the time is right, is to bring al creation together, everything in heaven and on earth, with Christ as head. (Eph. 1:9-10, TEV)


God, who will bring all creation together, is different from Christ to whom all things will be brought together. Christ cannot be the Creator for He is also one of those whom God createdHe is the first-born Son, superior to al created things. (Col. 1:15, Ibid.) Thus, the term created through Him only means that all creation, especially man, would necessitate a Mediator and Saviorthe Lord Christ (I Tim. 2:5; Acts 5:31). So, when God aid the plan for salvation, He created the Lord Jesus Christ for, without Him as a Savior, God wouldnt have made anything that was made. Thus, the true Creator is God:


For through him God created everything in heaven and on earth, the seen and the unseen things, including spiritual powers, lords, rulers, and authorities. God created the whole universe through him and for him. (Col. 1:16, TEV)

Hence, those who say that Christ is the Creator of a things have misunderstood the verse of the Bible.

Ref. Gods Message Magazine, July 2000, p. 13


FURTHER STUDY:

IS CHRIST CO-CREATOR?


Deity believer asks:

"If God is the Creator, who was God referring to in the pronouns us, our, ourselves in the verse, Let us make people in our image, to be like ourselves? (Gen. 1:26)

Answer:


Genesis 1:26 states:

Then God said, Let Us make a man in Our image, according to Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth. (NKJV)

It is admitted that Gen 1:26 implies plurality. But plurality simply means more than one. Proponents of Trinity doctrine limit the number to three beings in this verse and they presumably involve the Son and the Holy Spirit.

We should notice that nowhere in the verse does it state that the pronouns us and our refer to the Word or the Holy Ghost. Indeed, the Bible clearly stated that God alone created all things (Gen. 1:27; Is. 44:24; 37:16).
Then, whom was the Lord referring to with the pronouns us and our? The Father was referring to those who were already in existence thenthe Cherubs or the angels (Job 38:4-7; Gen. 3:22, 24).


 
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Albert

All things were created through Him and for Him. (Col. 1:16,)

July 25 2009, 8:38 PM 

Everything was created through Jesus Christ, the Son and for the Glory of God the Father.

 
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ver

Re: All things were created through Him and for Him. (Col. 1:16,)

September 12 2009, 8:55 AM 

Christ is neither the Creator in John 1:3 nor the Co-Creator in Gen. 1:26

The proponents of the Christ-is-God doctrine allege that Christ created all things. They cite John 1:3 which states:


All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. (NKJV)


The verse does not say that Christ created all things. What is written is All things were made through Him. However, this doesnt imply that He is the Almighty Creator since this would contradict what is written in Isaiah 44:24 that the Father alone is the Creator. Apostle Paul explains why all things were made through Christ:


For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. (Col. 1:16, Ibid.)

All things were created by God for Christ. As to why all things were created for Him, Apostle Paul explains:


God did what he had purposed, and made known to us the secret plan he had already decided to compete by means of Christ. This plan, which God will complete when the time is right, is to bring al creation together, everything in heaven and on earth, with Christ as head. (Eph. 1:9-10, TEV)


God, who will bring all creation together, is different from Christ to whom all things will be brought together. Christ cannot be the Creator for He is also one of those whom God createdHe is the first-born Son, superior to al created things. (Col. 1:15, Ibid.) Thus, the term created through Him only means that all creation, especially man, would necessitate a Mediator and Saviorthe Lord Christ (I Tim. 2:5; Acts 5:31). So, when God aid the plan for salvation, He created the Lord Jesus Christ for, without Him as a Savior, God wouldnt have made anything that was made. Thus, the true Creator is God:


For through him God created everything in heaven and on earth, the seen and the unseen things, including spiritual powers, lords, rulers, and authorities. God created the whole universe through him and for him. (Col. 1:16, TEV)

Hence, those who say that Christ is the Creator of a things have misunderstood the verse of the Bible.

Ref. Gods Message Magazine, July 2000, p. 13


FURTHER STUDY:

IS CHRIST CO-CREATOR?


Deity believer asks:

"If God is the Creator, who was God referring to in the pronouns us, our, ourselves in the verse, Let us make people in our image, to be like ourselves? (Gen. 1:26)

Answer:


Genesis 1:26 states:

Then God said, Let Us make a man in Our image, according to Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth. (NKJV)

It is admitted that Gen 1:26 implies plurality. But plurality simply means more than one. Proponents of Trinity doctrine limit the number to three beings in this verse and they presumably involve the Son and the Holy Spirit.

We should notice that nowhere in the verse does it state that the pronouns us and our refer to the Word or the Holy Ghost. Indeed, the Bible clearly stated that God alone created all things (Gen. 1:27; Is. 44:24; 37:16).
Then, whom was the Lord referring to with the pronouns us and our? The Father was referring to those who were already in existence thenthe Cherubs or the angels (Job 38:4-7; Gen. 3:22, 24).



--------------------------------------------------
Friendly Advice:
Obey Gods Law and Submit yourself to it:

John 17:17 ¶ Sanctify them by Your truth; Your word is truth.

 
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Albert

Were angels and Cherubims already around...

April 22 2011, 1:36 AM 

when God created the universe?

 
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VER

IS JESUS ADRESS AS "HO THEOS"?

March 18 2008, 6:20 AM 

IN THE ORIGINAL TRANSLATION WHICH IS GREEK JESUS WAS NOT ADRESS AS "HO THEOS" MEANING HE ONLY HAVE THE ATTRIBUTES OF GOD..AND NOT A LITERAL GOD.

"HO THEOS" = IN GREEK IS USED TO PINPOINT THE SINGULARITY OF GOD

"THEOS" = IS USED TO DESCRIVED A GODLY ATTRIBUTES OF GODSWORD OR GODS SERVANT JUST LIKE JESUS AND ANGELS.

PUT THIS IN YOUR MIND..PHIL 2:6,JOHN 1:1-3 JUST USED THE NAME "THEOS" TO DESCRIBED THE GODLY ATTRIBUTES JESUS HAVE..MEANING HE IS NOT A LITERAL GOD..


NUCC
There was God with the Word that was God in the beginning John shows the the TWO are distinct from each other and both EXISTED IN THE BEGINNING. Jn 1:1,2.

>> YOU ASSUME TO MUCH YET A FALLACY...DOES GOD ALLOW YOUR ASSUMPTION THAT THERE WAS ANOTHER GOD BESIDE HIMSELF?..READ!

ISA 44:Isa 44:6 Thus saith Jehovah, the King of Israel, and his Redeemer, Jehovah of hosts: I am the first, and I am the last; and besides me there is no God.

NUCC
Now we go the Jn 1:14 and John states that the "WORD" that was God became flesh which obviously means that God the Word BECAME FLESH. God in man.

>. ANOTHER FALLACY SIGHTED..DOES GOD ALLOW HIMSELF TO BECOM MAN?..NO!

NUM 23:19 God is not a man,Neither the son of man, that he should repent: Hath he said, and will he not do it? Or hath he spoken, and will he not make it good?

HOS 11:9 .... for I am God, and not man; the Holy One in the midst of thee; and I will not come in wrath

NUCC
Then in vs18 the NIV makes it even clearer in describing this person at His Father's side AS GOD "SHOWN" to man (Jesus Christ).

>>YOU NEVER STOP SHOWING YOUR FALLACY...CAN YOU STILL REFUTE GOD HIMSELF WHO TESTIFY THAT JESUS IS A MAN STANDING BESIDES HIM IN HEAVEN?..READ!

ZECH 13:7 Awake, O sword, against my shepherd,
against the man who stands next to me,
declares the LORD of hosts.

SEE? TRINITY IS NOTHING BUT A MYTH,INNVENTED BY RCC AND CARRIED BY APOSTATES OFFSRING THE PROTESTANTS.THIS IS THE REASON INC RE-EMERGED TO PREACH THE TRUTH ABOUT THE ONE TRUE GOD..THE FATHER IN HEAVEN.


 
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Albert

You see,

July 25 2009, 8:41 PM 

the stupid Jews crucified Jesus Christ because the accept the revelation that Jesus was also God.

 
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ver

Re: You see,

September 12 2009, 8:46 AM 

the stupid jews are just like you..they insist jesus claimed he is god..yet it was the other way..

john 8:40 But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham.

--------------------------------------------------
Friendly Advice:
Obey Gods Law and Submit yourself to it:

John 17:17 ¶ Sanctify them by Your truth; Your word is truth.

 
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Pope Reverend I, BV

The Pharisees were Roman Collaborators...

July 1 2010, 1:29 PM 


They wanted to maintain the status quo.

The Sadducees were a false Priesthood...
-- Although they were Levites of Aaronite descent...
-- They were NOT of the Zadokite bloodline.

On his Father's Side...
-- (Joseph)...
Jesus was Heir to the Throne of David.
And...
On his Mother's Side...
-- (Mary)...
Jesus was the Legitimate, Zadokite, High Priest.

The combination of these Two Bloodlines...
-- The Davidian Royal Lineage with...
-- That of the Priestly, Zadokite Lineage...
Brought about, in the birth of Jesus..
The Manifestation of...
The Messianic Priest/King...
Eagerly anticipated by the Essenes...
-- Who were, the Third Largest Sect of Judaism at that time...
-- And. in their own writings, referred to themselves...
-- By the same terms used by the NT authors...
-- In reference to the followers of Jesus.

So, the Pharisees and the Saduccees both had their reasons...
For wanting Jesus to be taken out of the picture.

To the Pharisees...
The Royal Bloodline of Jesus...
Represented a source of Political Unrest.

To the Saduccees...
The Zadokite Bloodline of Jesus...
Represented a Personal Threat...
To the Power of their Priestly Positions...
-- In the Temple at Jerusalem.

So, the answer to your question of WHY...
The Pharisees and Saduccees wanted Jesus Crucified...
Is two-fold...
-- Power and Security.
And...
It has nothing to do with the Erroneous Concept of...
-- The "deity" of Jesus.

-PRev1-

 
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Albert

It was the general population that condemned

April 22 2011, 1:59 AM 

Jesus not the Pharisees and the Sadducees. The general population was unaware of their personal motives. Their role was only to instigate. When the general population condemned Jesus it was in their correct understanding that Jesus claimed to be God which they cannot accept in the light of Isaiah 44;24 and other texts.

 
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VER

DOES THE TERM "IMAGE OF GOD" BE TAKEN AS LITERAL GOD?

March 18 2008, 6:21 AM 

NUCC
Phil 2:6 again CLEARLY states.....Jesus was by VERY NATURE GOD.

Phil 2:6
6 Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped, (NIV)

The Bible is quite clear Ver. Jesus is God by nature, the second person of the Triune Being called God.

VER
Isnt There is only one God the Father? ISNT JESUS THE SON?
Jesus is only in the FORM of God and not a LITERAL GOD...

WHY DID JESUS BECAME A "FORM OR IMAGE OF GOD"? IS IT BECAUSE HE IS GOD PER SE? NO...

JESUS BECAME "FORM OR IMAGE OF GOD" BECAUSE OF ALL HUMAN HE ALONE NEVER COMMIT SIN[1PETER 2:22],..

HOLINESS IS THE QUALITY OF GOD THAT IS FOUND IN JESUS..

Le 11:44 For I am the LORD your God: ye shall therefore sanctify yourselves, and ye shall be holy; for I am holy

ADAM TOO WHEN HE NOT YET COMMIT SIN WAS ALSO IN THE "FORM OR IMAGE OF GOD" BUT WE KNOW HE FAILD BECAUSE DESOBEDINCE.

JESUS ALONE PASSED THE TEST THATS WHY HE IS IN THE "FORM OR IMAGE OF GOD" ..YET IN POWER AND OTHER GODLY ATTRIBUTE HE IS NOT EQUAL WITH GOD AND THEREFORE NOT GOD.

ROM 5:15 But the free giving of God is not like the wrongdoing of man. For if, by the wrongdoing of one man death came to numbers of men, much more did the grace of God, and the free giving by the grace of one man, Jesus Christ, come to men.
19 For as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners, so through the obedience of the one man will the many be made righteous.

SEE?..CHRIST LIKE ADAM IS A MAN IN NATURE...CHRIST IS ALSO CALLED 2ND ADAM...BOTH ADAMS ARE GODS CREATION..A CREATURE AND NOT CREATOR.

 
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Albert

Excure me. The verse "All have sinned and

July 25 2009, 8:48 PM 

fall short of the glory Of God" clearly states that ALL MEN HAve SINNED with no exemptions. Only God does not sin.

 
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ver

Re: Excure me. The verse "All have sinned and

September 12 2009, 8:38 AM 

JESUS BECAME "FORM OR IMAGE OF GOD" BECAUSE OF ALL HUMAN HE ALONE NEVER COMMIT SIN

1PETER 2:22],..

22 Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth:
23 Who, when he was reviled, reviled not again; when he suffered, he threatened not; but committed himself to him that judgeth righteously:

christ is a man used by god...

Act 2:22 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:

--------------------------------------------------
Friendly Advice:
Obey Gods Law and Submit yourself to it:

John 17:17 ¶ Sanctify them by Your truth; Your word is truth.

 
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Albert

All have sinned ..... is a sweeping declaration....

April 22 2011, 2:02 AM 

with no exception. so if Jesus is totally a man, He is a sinner.

 
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VER

DOES THE TERM "SON OF GOD" IMPLY DEITY?

March 18 2008, 6:22 AM 

NUCC
Jesus clear claim that He was God's Son.

John 10:36b
36b Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, 'I am God's Son'?
(NIV)

VER
RCC & PROTESTANT LIKE YOU HASTILY PUT A SWEEPING YET FALSE CONCLUSION,..IF I TAKE YOUR ARGUMENTS AND APPLY TO THEFOLLOWING VERSE THEN YOU WILL BE FORCE TO ADMIT THAT THESE PEOPLE WERE ALSO GODS..READ!

Ga 4:6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.

Ro 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

Php 2:15 That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;

1Jo 3:2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

SEE?..YOUR SUPPORT CANNOT STAND DEEP BIBLICAL SCRUTINY,THEREFORE IT IS OBVIOUS THAT YOUR 3 IN 1 GOD DOGMA IS UNBIBLICAL AND MUST BE REJECTED..

ON THE OTHER HAND WHAT TEACHING CAN BROUGHT MAN TO SALVATION?..TO BELIEVED THAT THE FATHER ALONE IS GOD!

JN 17:1-3 FATHER..This is eternal life: to know you, the only true God,..



 
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Albert

John 10:36b

July 25 2009, 9:34 PM 

Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, 'I am God's Son'?
(NIV

Simply, because the Jews understood that Jesus meant that He was apart from other human beings, not created but begotten from the God the Father from all eternity. This is the reason the Jews accused Jesus of blasphemy. He indirectly claimed to be God.

 
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ver

jesus never claim he is god...

September 12 2009, 8:42 AM 

but rather he claimed he is a man who tell the truth..

john 8:40 But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham.

0one of the truth that jesus hear from god is that he is a
man...he hear this not from himself but from god.


--------------------------------------------------
Friendly Advice:
Obey Gods Law and Submit yourself to it:

John 17:17 ¶ Sanctify them by Your truth; Your word is truth.

 
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Albert

If He was not God, why do He accepts

April 2 2010, 1:23 AM 

worships? According to the scripture ONLY God is to be worshipped.

 
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ver

you should denounce your faith if you want to be save

July 1 2010, 9:18 AM 

CHRIST AS GOD WAS THE GREATEST ENVENTION BY ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH..YOU WERE DECIEVED!

DISCOURSES OF THE APOSTLES CREED
Rev. Clement H. Rock. Nihil obstat: Arthur J. Scanlan, S.T.D. Censor Librorum. Imprimatur: Patrick Cardinal Hayes, Archbishop of New York 10th Printing, January 1960 USA Copyright 1938 by Joserp F. Wagner, Inc. New York City.

P. 206
" thus for example, it was not until 325 A.D., at the council of Nicaea, that the church defined for us that it was an article of faith that Jesus is truly God."

p. 206
"in 381, at the Council of Constantinople, it was defined that it's an article of faith that the Holy Ghost is God."


SYSTEMATIC THEOLOGY. Augustus Hopkins String, D.D. Three Volumes in One, Philadelphia. The Judson Press Chicago. Kansas City, Los Angeles, Seattle. Copyright by Augustus Hopkins Strong. 1907

p. 305
The earliest time known at which Jesus was deified was after the New Testament writers. In The letters of Ignatius, at the beginning of the second century.

--------------------------------------------------
Friendly Advice:
Obey Gods Law and Submit yourself to it:

John 17:17 ¶ Sanctify them by Your truth; Your word is truth.

 
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Albert

The emperor and the chuch council.....

April 22 2011, 2:05 AM 

were only God's instruments for the betterment of the church.

 
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VER

WERE THE JEWS CORRECT IN THIER ACCUSATION AGAINST JESUS?

March 18 2008, 6:24 AM 

1. By what Christ said, did the Jews (who would know) claim that Jesus was claiming to be God?

>> DONT FORGET THAT THE JEWS WERE LOOKING FOR A WAY TO ACCUSE JESUS OF CRIME,FOR THEY ALREADY PLANNED TO CAPTURE HIM,NOW DID THOSE JEWS CORRECT IN THIER ACCUSATION ABOUT JESUS BEING GOD? NOPE...JESUS NEVER IMPLIED HE IS GOD,RATHER HE TESTIFY THAT HE IS MAN WHO HEARD GODS TRUTH...

JOHN 8:40 I am a man who has told you the truth that I heard from God. But now you want to kill me. Abraham wouldnt have done that.

DID JESUS EVER COMMIT LIES? OF COURSE NOT!
-------------------------------------
2. Did Jesus deny their claim?

>>OF COURSE HE DONT AGREE WITH THE JEWS,HE ALREADY SAID " I am a man who has told you the truth that I heard from God." .. HE IS FLESH WHILE GOD IS SPIRIT[JN 4:24],MUCH MORE THAT HE IS the son and NOT THE FATHER.
-------------------------------------------------
3. In verse 28 "WHO" does Jesus say gives the sheep eternal life?

>>JESUS POWER WAS ONLY INTRUSTEED UNTO HIM BY THE FATHER,IN THE END HE WILL GAVE BACK THIS POWER TO THE FATHER,SO THAT THE FATHER WILL RULE OVER ALL..

1COR15:27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

SEE?....HOW CAN YOU INSIST THAT JESUS IS GOD WHEN AT THE END ALL POWER WILL BE GIVEN BACK TO THE FATHER?
YOU HAVE OTHER OPTION BUT TO ACCEPT THAT THE FATHER ALONE IS GOD..THIS IS THE SECRET OF ETERNAL LIFE.

JOHN 17:3 FATHER.. This is eternal life: to know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you sent.

 
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Albert

The Jews never erred in their understanding on

April 22 2011, 2:07 AM 

what had Jesus had revealed. they cannot accept his revelations that's why they were angry.

 
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VER

Does the "I AM" Statement of Jesus prove that He is God?

March 18 2008, 6:25 AM 

Does the "I AM" Statement of Jesus in John 8:58 prove that He is God?

DEFENDERS OF CHRIST-IS-GOD theology cite John 8:58 as one of their biblical bases in proving their belief that Jesus Christ is God. Although there is no explicit statement from Christ in this verse that He is God, His statement is being understood by those who believe in His alleged deity as an indication and affirmation of His divinity.

Why did they come up with this line of reasoningthat Jesus is Godsimply because Christ uttered "I am?" Because God also made the same statement in Exodus 3:14:
"And God said to Moses, 'I AM WHO I AM' . And He said, 'Thus you shall say to the children of Israel, "I AM has sent me to you"'." (New King James Version)

God declared "I AM" when He introduced Himself to Moses. Using the concept of parallelism, Trinitarians conclude that Jesus is God simply because Christ spoke the same terms uttered by God. This type of reasoning was utilized by Josh McDowell and Bart Larson, two defenders of the alleged divinity of Christ, in their look Jesus: A Biblical Defense of His Deity, that Christ's use of the term is a claim to deity:

Serious theological implications would result if we accept the Trinitarian's view that Jesus was the YHWH or God who spoke to Abraham in Exodus 3:14.

"On several occasions Jesus used the term ego eimi of Himself as it can be used only of God. The clearest example is when the Jews said to Jesus, 'You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?' Jesus said to them, 'Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, "I AM" [Greek: ego eimi]. Therefore they picked up stones to throw at Him' (John 8:57-59). The Jews sought to kill Him for the presumption of that claim to deity." (p. 22)

Josh McDowell and Bart Larson also proposed a concept that Jesus is the Almighty God. They claimed that:

"He took to himself the Old Testament names and titles for God and also allowed others to call Him by the same names and titles ... this Galilean teacher was claiming to be Almighty God." (Ibid., p. 21)

Moreover, they maintained that "Jesus claimed for Himself the name of God which was most revered by the Jews, a name considered so sacred that the Jews would not even utter it: YHWH" (Ibid., p. 22).

McDowell and Larson postulated a concept that Jesus is the Almighty God of the Old Testament. The same idea is shared by some Christian apologists who even went further in saying that Jesus was the Jehovah or the God who spoke to Moses in Exodus 3:14. Typical of these is Geisler's reasoning in his book Christian Apologetics, wherein he alleges that:

"Perhaps the strongest and most direct claim of Jesus to be Jehovah occurs in John 8:58 where he said to the Jews, 'Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I am'. The Jews' reaction left no doubt as to how they understood his claim. They knew he had claimed not only preexistence before Abraham but also equality with God ... Jesus had clearly claimed to be the 'I AM' of Exodus 3:14 that refers to Jehovah alone." (p. 331)

Is Jesus the God who said "I AM" in Exodus 3:14? The answer is NO! And when Jesus said "I AM" (Greek, ego eimi) in John 8:58, was He indicating His alleged divinity? Definitely not! What was He affirming in this verse? That He was before Abraham. How is He before Abraham when He was born later? It must be remembered that Abraham is His ancestor and therefore came into existence before He (Christ) was born. However, He is before Abraham because He was foreordained by God even before the foundation of the world (I Pt. 1:20). It is in this sense that He was before Abraham.

In the context of John 8 it should be noted that Jesus and the Jews were having an argument about Abraham and Jesus' authority. There is nothing we can glean from the chapter that Jesus was claiming to be God. Rather, He told the Jews that He is "a man" telling them the truth which He heard from God (Jn. 8:40). Jesus was not telling the Jews that His name is "I AM." Likewise, He never told them, "I am God." If Jesus were God, He would have plainly told them so. On the contrary, Jesus clarified to them that He came from and was sent by God (Jn. 8:42).

It is true that Christ uttered the statement ego eimi, and God also spoke the equivalent of those words in Hebrew in Exodus 3:14. But does it prove that He is the same God who spoke in the Old Testament? No. Christ was not the only one who uttered these words. The truth is, both in the Old Testament and in the New Testament there were others who used the same words. In fact, in Judges 13:11 of The Septuagint with Apocrypha: Greek and English by Sir Lancelot Brenton, it is stated:

"And Manoa arose and followed his wife, and came to the man, and said to him, Art thou the man that spoke to the woman? And the angel said, I am."

The angel said to Manoa, "I am." Now, would our Trinitarian friends accept that the angel is also God for the reason that he uttered the same statement? Aside from that angel, who else uttered the same terms? In John chapter 9 verse 9, the formerly blind man emphatically stated, ego eimil Does that make him or qualify him also as the God of the Old Testament because he uttered what God declared in Exodus 3:14? Let our Trinitarian friends answer that question.

One could not notice immediately that Jesus and the formerly blind man had uttered the same statement ego eimi because most English translations rendered John 9:9 differently. Below are a few of the English translations of the Greek term ego eimi, spoken by the formerly blind man:

 
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Albert

Re: Does the "I AM" Statement of Jesus prove that He is God?

July 25 2009, 10:19 PM 

... Jews said to Jesus, 'You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?' Jesus said to them, 'Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, "I AM" [Greek: ego eimi]. Therefore they picked up stones to throw at Him' (John 8:57-59). The Jews sought to kill Him for the presumption of that claim to deity."


The Jews were simply asking if Jesus had SEEN (personally) Abraham and Jesus answered in the affirmative (I AM) plainly confirming that He had seen Abraham in person. Saying Jesus was before Abraham simply because He (Jesus) was foreordained was not the right answer to the Jews query. A plain question needs a plain answer.


 
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ver

Re: Does the "I AM" Statement of Jesus prove that He is God?

September 12 2009, 8:49 AM 

NAPAKAHILIG MAGBIGAY NG PALSONG KUNKLUSYON ITONG MGA KAAWAY NI HESUS...SINABI BA NI HESUS "BAGO SI ABRAHAM AKO ANG DIOS"?

BAKIT SI ABRAHAM BA ANG UNANG TAO SI MUNDO? KUNG BASIHAN MO NANDOON SIYA SA PANAHON NI ABRAHAM E PAANO SI NOE,SI SETH,SI ADAN MAS MGA NAUUNNAG NABUHAY KAY ABRAHAM ANG MGA YON..DI LALABAS NA DIOS DIN ANG MGA ITO? KITAM ANG PALSONG KATWIRAN MO?

BAKIT SINABI NI HESUS "BAGO SI ABRAHAM AKO NGA?
SAPAGKAT SI HESUS ANG NAUNA SA PANUKALA NG DIOS BAGO SI ABRAHAM..
ITO PRUWEBA: SI HESUS ANG BINHI SA GEN 3:15-->>GAL 3:20, SAMANTALANG SI ABRAHAM AY SA GEN 12:1 PA LANG BINANGIT.

ANO NAMAN ANG IBIG SABIHIN NI HESUS "AT NAKITA NYA ANG ARAW KO"?

ABRAHAM ONLY SEE THE VISION OF CHRIST 2ND COMING, YET ABRAHAM IS NOT PRESENT FOR HE DIED WITHOUT RECIEVING THE PROMISE HEAVENLY CITY WHICH IS BEING PREPARED BY CHRIST..IN SHORT IT IS A FUTURE VISION OF WHATS GOING TO HAPPEN..READ!

2Pe 3:10 The day of the Lord will come like a thief. On that day heaven will pass away with a roaring sound. Everything that makes up the universe will burn and be destroyed. The earth and everything that people have done on it will be exposed.

SINO ANG LORD NA BINANGGIT SA ITAAS? E DI SI HESUS NA GINAWANG CRISTO AT "LORD" NG AMA..in short hindi likas sa kanya ang titulo dahil bigay lamang..BASA!

ACTS 2:36 Let all of you know that God has made Jesus "LORD & CHRIST.

KITAM?..SINO NGAYON ANG KAMPON NG MGA SUWAIL NA HUDYO? E DI LAHAT NG NAGPAPARATANG KAY HESUS NA DIOS,MAS GRABE PA ANG GINAWA NYONG MGA ANTICRISTO KAYO DAHIL ANG MGA HUDYO AY PARATANG LANG ANG GINAWA SAPAGKAT SADYANG HUMAHANAP SILA NG DAHILAN PARA PATAYIN SI HESUS,SAMANTALANG KAYO AY TINATAKAN NA MISMO SI HESUS...MGA KAMPON NI TANING.

"AKO AY TAO NA NAGSASABI SA INYO NG KATOTOHANAN NA AKING NARINIG SA DIOS,NI HINDI ITO GINAWA NI ABRAHAM" JN 8:40

NAPAKAHIRAP BANG UNAWAIN ANG SALITA NI HESUS?
KAYA SIGURADO SA PAGSATING NI HESUS AT PAG LALAPIT NA LAHAT NG MGA ANTIKRISTO AY ITO SAGOT NI HESUS "HINDI KO KAYO KILALA,MAGSILAYAS KAYO MGA SINUNGALING?..GET IT









--------------------------------------------------
Friendly Advice:
Obey Gods Law and Submit yourself to it:

John 17:17 ¶ Sanctify them by Your truth; Your word is truth.

 
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Albert

Ang haba ng sagot mo mali naman.

April 2 2010, 1:33 AM 

Ang tanong ng mga Hudyo kung nakita ni Kristo si Abraham (ng personal) samantalang wala pa syang 50 anyos, na sinagot naman ni Kristo na NOONG WALA PA SI ABRAHAM NANDITO NA SYA.

 
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HUH?

July 1 2010, 7:15 PM 

gee guys.....how can i learn if you speak in 'za native tounge'.....me engliza......me no espioniol.....(spelling fer sure a mess there haha)

 
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VER

Did Jesus "saw" Abraham face to face.?

March 18 2008, 6:26 AM 

"the "meeting" of Jesus and Abraham were not observed by others by the senses. they havent seen Jesus and Abraham meet. But Jesus insists that He "saw" Abraham - He met Abraham. How? before he dwelt amongst us, he was in eternity."

Ver
another lies from trinitarian fanatic..
how can CHRIST MET abraham when he is ONLY the seed of abraham..CAN A SEED PREDATES HIS SOURCE?...read!

Gal 3:16 Now the promises were made to Abraham and to his offspring. It does not say, And to offsprings, referring to many, but referring to one, And to your offspring, who is Christ.

THE TERMS "ABRAHAM REJOICE TO SEE MY DAY" REFER TO CHRIST SECOND COMING,NOT THE PHYSICAL MEETING OF THE TWO...READ!

2Pe 3:10 The day of the Lord will come like a thief. On that day heaven will pass away with a roaring sound. Everything that makes up the universe will burn and be destroyed. The earth and everything that people have done on it will be exposed.

CHRIST WAS JUST A VISION OF ABRAHAM, YET HE IS NOT PRESENT FOR HE DIED WITHOUT RECIEVING THE PROMISE HEAVENLY CITY WHICH IS BEING PREPARED BY CHRIST..IN SHORT IT IS A FUTURE VISION OF WHATS GOING TO HAPPEN..READ!

HEB 11:8 By faith Abraham obeyed when he was called to go out to a place that he was to receive as an inheritance. And he went out, not knowing where he was going.
13 These all died in faith, not having received the things promised, but having seen them and greeted them from afar, and having acknowledged that they were strangers and exiles on the earth.
39 And all these, though commended through their faith, did not receive what was promised,

 
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Albert

He existed before Abraham, so He had seen him.Nt

April 22 2011, 2:10 AM 

...

 
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VER

Is Christ God because He is the ALPHA and OMEGA?

March 18 2008, 6:27 AM 

Pat Musto of Irvine, California, asks:

If Christ were not God, then how would you explain Revelation 1:18 and Revelation 22:13? n Rev. 1:18, God Almighty stated, "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending." In Revalation 22:13, Christ stated, "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end." Christ being the "Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end," is therefore God.



Editor's reply:

Although the words "Alpha" and "Omega" are used to describe both God (in Rev. 1:8) and Christ (in Rev.22:13), this neither states nor means that God and Christ are the same--one God. And to conclude that Christ is also God based on these verses is contradicting the fundamental doctrine that there is one true God, the Father Almighty (Jn. 17:1, 3).

Alpha (first letter of the Greek alphabet) and Omega (last letter of the Greek alphabet) mean first and last, respectively. Althought it is stated that both God and Christ are "Alpha" and "Omega" they differ in their being "Alpha" and "Omega."

The Lord God is Alpha or first since He is the creator of all things and all things came from Him:

"Yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came..."(I Cor. 8:6, NIV)

God is Omega or last because He was the One who appointed the day of Judgement or the end of the world, and when all things have been placed under Christ's rule, Christ will subject Himself to God so that "God may be all in all" (Acts 17:31; I Cor. 15:28)

On the other hand, Christ is Alpha or first because He is the firstborn of all creation:

"He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation." (Col. 1:15,NIV)

Therefore, the use of Alpha as applied to Christ is significantly different from the use of Alpha as applied to God. Likewise, Omega as applied to Christ is also different from the Omega as applied to God. Christ is Omega because it is through Him that God will judge the world:

For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that each one may receive what is due him for the things done while in the body, whether good or bad." (II Cor. 5:10, Ibid.)

It is important to bear in mind that the use of "Alpha" and "Omega" for God is different in meaning and in sense from that for Christ. Hence, Revelation 1:8 and 22:13 do not prove that Christ is God.

 
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Albert

All God's title were likewise Jesus'. Nt

April 22 2011, 2:12 AM 

....

 
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VER

DOES JOHN 1:1-3 IMPLY THAT JESUS IS GOD?

March 18 2008, 6:29 AM 

JESUS CHRIST: GOD INCARNATE?


Proponents of the belief that Jesus Christ is God uphold a concept which they have termed the "Incarnation" of God. Wayne Grudem, a protestant Theology Professor, explained this concept in hi book Systematic Theology:



"Although the word does not explicitly occur in Scripture, the church has used the term incarnation to refer to the fact that Jesus was God in human flesh. the incarnation was the act of God the Son whereby he took to himself a human nature." (p. 543)



Admitting that the doctrine of the Incarnation is not "explicitly" taught in the Bible, proponents of this concept can only resort to erroneous interpretations of some biblical texts as their bases, two of which are JoHn 1:1 and 14. The verses read:



"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God. "And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth." (New American Standard New Testament)



How do Catholic theologians understand these verses? The say that Jesus Christ is the "Word", in John 1:1 and since the third clause of the verse says "the Word was God," they conclude that Christ is God. By substituting the term "Word" with the term "Christ," they suppose that they third clause could then be rendered as "[Christ] was God."



To augment their position that Christ is God who became a man, they then cite verse 14. The Jerome Biblical Commentary points out:



"14. the Word became flesh:... This is the tremendous mystery of the incarnation, by which the eternal Word took on our exact human nature, becoming one with us in everything except sin (Heb 4:15); in everything, that is, except what was incompossible with the divinity. ... That the Word became man in the fullest possible sense is of the very essence of the incarnation and of the redemption that is its result." (p. 423)



Are the proponents of this doctrine correct in their understanding of these two verses? Definitely not. Why? If Christ were the Word and He were God, then John 1:1 would be teaching not just one but two Gods. Remember that the second clause says, "and the Word was with God." If the Word were Christ Himself and that He were God and the verse says that the Word was with God, then the obvious conclusion would be that another God was with the one true God. The aforementioned idea goes directly against the teaching of the Bible that there is only one true God.


The biggest dilemma for the proponents of this doctrine is how to reconcile their view with the biblical truth that there is only one true God while maintaining a position that there is another God who was with the true God. How could another God be with this one God if He were that same God? The alleged plurality of persons in the godhead might be a tempting justification but this only creates another serious paradoxical situation for them. As the saying goes, "a mistake could not be corrected by another mistake." Trinitarians, when confronted with this obvious dilemma, would resort to the so-called "mystery" of the Trinity, hoping that they could extricate themselves from the theological quagmire they've got in. But beyond cavil, their teaching is untenable.


The meaning of the Word


It should be noted that the original Greek equivalent of the term "Word" in John 1:1 is λογος ~ logos. What is the meaning of the word logos? Greek lexicographer G. Abbott-Smith, in his book, A Manual Greek Lexicon of the New Testament, defines the term as:


"1. a word, not in the grammatical sense of a mere name ... but a word as embodying a conception or idea." (pp. 270-271)


Catholic authorities conform to this definition given by Abbott-Smith and other Greek scholars. In the footnote of John 1:1 of the Douay Version of the Bible, it says:


"1, 1: ... St. John employs the term Word. It is so used only by St. John ... and designates the Son as a kind of intellectual emanation from the Father."


Therefore, in view of the definition given above, what was with God in the beginning was His concept or plan or idea (logos) about the Christ who would be coming into the world. The term logos does not refer to someone who was co-existing with God in the beginning.


The Word or logos is not another God but refers to the idea about Christ, which was "with God" or in God's mind in the beginning.


Thus, the clause, the logos was with God, indicates that the logos is different or distinguished from God. This position does not contradict the biblical doctrine on the absolute oneness of God. On the other hand, if we were to accept the position of the Trinitarians that the logos is a being who, although is distinguished from God, is also God, we would face the prospect of accepting an unbiblical position that there are two Gods.


What does it mean that the logos was "with God?" About what was this concept or idea that intellectually emanated from Him? I Peter 1:20 tells us that:


"For He was foreknown before the foundation of the world, but has appeared in these last times for the sake of you." (NAS)


God has foreknown Christ before the foundation of the world. To foreknow means to know something before it happens: to have knowledge or awareness that something is going to happen. The Greek word used in this verse is προγινωσκω, proginōskō which is defined in Perschbacher's The New Analytical Creek Lexicon as "to determine on beforehand, to foreordain" (p. 345).


However, proponents of the incarnation doctrine also use this to point out that Christ allegedly existed before He was born on earth. If that were the case, then the true Christians would also have prior existence because Apostle Paul declared that "just as He (God) chose us in Him (Christ) before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him in love (Eph. 1:4, NAS). Will our Trinitarian friends admit that we also had prior existence because we were chosen by God before the foundation of the world? Of course, not!


When did Christ, who was a plan or word in the beginning, come into existence? When he was born of a woman. The Bible says:



"But when the fullness of the time had come. God sent forth His Son, born of a woman, born under the law." (Gal. 4:4, New King James Version)


Christ existed only when he was born. He had no prior existence. In the beginning, it was not Christ Himself who was with God; it was the concept or idea (logos) that was in the mind of God, for God had destined Christ to play an integral part in His master plan of salvation (Eph. 3:20-21, Living Bible).


The Third Clause:
'and the Word was God'


In the third clause of John 1:1, it says "and the logos was God." By equating the term logos with the name Christ, Trinitarians render the clause to read something like, "and Christ was God." This assertion stems from the wrong understanding that the term God in the third clause functions as a noun.


The word "God" (in Greek, (θεος~ theos) in the third clause of John 1:1 is not a noun but an adjective. And this is attested to by Greek grammarians, such as R. H. Strachan. In his book The Fourth Gospel: Its Significance and Environment, Strachan explains:


"The closing words of v. I should be translated, 'the Logos was divine'. Here the word theos has no article, thus giving it the significance of an adjective." (p. 99)


William Barclay, another Greek grammarian, agrees with Strachan in classifying the term theos in the third clause of John 1:1 as an adjective. In his book The Gospel of John he points out:


"Finally John says that the word was God. This is a difficult saying for us to understand, and it is difficult because Greek, in which John wrote, had a different way of saying things from the way in which English speaks. When Greek uses a noun it almost always uses the definite article with it. The Greek for God is theos and the definite article is ho. When Greek speaks about God it does not simply say theos; it says ho theos. Now when Greek does not use the definite article with a noun that noun becomes much more like an adjective. John did not say that the word was ho theos; that would have been to say that the word was identical with God. He said that the word was theos-without the definite article-which means that the word was, we might say, of the very same character and quality and essence and being as God." (p. 39)


The same understanding could be gleaned from the book The Person of Christ written by Vincent Taylor. He testified that the term God in John 1:1c should be translated as divine:


"The Word, he says, was 'in the beginning', distinguished from God ('with God') and divine (θεος, but not ό θεος) ..." (p. 109)


Even Bible translators agree that the term theos in the third clause of John 1:1 is an adjective. Below are some English translations that rendered the verse as:


"In the beginning the Word existed. The Word was with God, and the Word was divine (Goodspeed's Translation)."


"The Logos existed in the very beginning, the Logos was with God, the Logos was divine (Moffatt's Translation)."


What does it mean that the logos was divine? It means that the word of God is with power (Lk. 1:37, American Standard Version) for the true God who has spoken the word is powerful (Gen. 35:11). Since God is Almighty, He alone has the ability to plan something and the power to bring it to completion as He testified in Isaiah 46:11:


"Truly I have spoken; truly I will bring it to pass, I have planned it, surely I will do it." (NAS)


God's plan of bringing His Son into the world was fulfilled when Jesus was born of his mother Mary. His birth is the fulfillment of what John wrote that "the Word was made flesh" (Jn. 1:14, King James Version). Contrary to what some have postulated that Christ took a different form, i.e., from being God into being human, Christ never transformed Himself from being a pure spirit into an infant. He was conceived in Mary's womb through the agency of the Holy Spirit. Luke the Evangelist reports:


"And Mary said to the angel, 'How can this be, since I am a virgin?' And the angel answered and said to her, 'The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; and for that reason the holy offspring shall be called the Son of God." (Lk. 1:34-35, NAS)


Further, the concept of incarnation grossly violates the biblical teaching concerning the immutability of God. The Bible is clear in its teaching that God does not change (Mal. 3:6) even a shadow of turning (Js. 1:17, NKJV).
-------------------------------------------------



 
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Albert

The whole bible, OT &NT, was explicit that

April 22 2011, 2:29 AM 

only God is to be worshipped but Jesus was likewise worshipped. Besides, all the titles of God were also Jesus' titles.

 
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VER

DOES THOMAS NOTION "MY GOD" BE TAKEN AS TRUE DOCTRINE?

March 18 2008, 6:31 AM 

Kristy
Here, Thomas calls Jesus God. "Thomas was a devout Jew and never would have shouted "my God" for that would be blasphemy for a Jew.

John 20:28, Thomas agrees . After seeing the resurrected Lord, proclaims to Jesus," My Lord and My God."


VER
Can doubting thomas statement be taken as a true teaching?
can thomas override jesus stament?...just few verses earlier in the same book jesus teach his Father is the true God..did thomas learn this?..of he was not there when jesus implied his teaching..read!

John 20:17.. I ascend unto my Father and your Father, and my God and your God.

EVEN PETER WHO WAS STALWART FOLLOOWER OPPOSED THOMAS..READ!

MATH 16:15 He says to them, But who do you say that I am?
16 And Simon Peter made answer and said, You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.
17 And Jesus made answer and said to him, A blessing on you, Simon Bar-jonah: because this knowledge has not come to you from flesh and blood, but from my Father in heaven.

CHRIST IS THE SON OF THE LIVING GOD...NOT THE LIVING GOD...GOT IT?

EVEN PAUL OPPOSED THOMAS NOTION...READ AND LEARN!

1COR 8:6 yet to us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we unto him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and we through him.

SEE? HOW CAN ANYONE INSIST DOUBTING THOMAS NOTION IS A TRUTH WHEN IT WAS OPPOSED BY JESUS,PETER AND PAUL...
THIS ONLY PROVED THOMAS BELIEVER ARE DECIEVED PAGANS.



 
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Albert

Thomas did not err in his statement.....

April 7 2012, 6:25 PM 

As Jesus did not correct him on the spot. The statement should be taken at its face value.

 
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VER

IS JESUS GOD SIMPLY BECAUSE GOD DWELLS IN BODILY FORM?

March 18 2008, 6:33 AM 

nucc
What are "YOU" going to do wqith the verse that says the "ALL" the FULLNESS of DEITY lives in Christ?

Ver
your col 2:9 doesnt support your paganic dogma nucc.
it doesnt qualify jesus to become god simply because Gods spirit dwells in him.

Apostle Paul statement in col 2:9 only implied the prophecy in isaiah that was fullfilled in the man jesus...read!

ISA 42:1 Behold, my servant, whom I uphold; my chosen, in whom my soul delighteth: I have put my Spirit upon him; he will bring forth justice to the Gentiles.

WHO IS THIS CHOSEN SERVANT OF GOD? IT IS THE MAN JESUS.
CAN A SERVANT SUPERCEDE HIS MASTER? ONLY IN PAGANS MIND.

DID GODS SPIRIT REMAIN IN JESUS BODY ALL THE TIME? NOO!

Mr 15:34 And at the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani? which is, being interpreted, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?

DO YOU KNOW WHAT THE WORD "FORSAKEN" MEANS NUCC?
WHO WAS FORESAKEN BY GOD ACCORDING TO Mr 15:34?...
THEREFORE YOUR TRINITY NONSENSE IS NOW A MYTH.

ITS A GROSS FALLACY TO BELIEVED THAT JESUS IS GOD SIMPLY BECAUSE GOD DWELLS IN BODILY FORM.



 
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Albert

Out of context.

April 22 2011, 2:32 AM 

fullness of deity means Jesus has all the attributes and powers of God.

 
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Ver has been refuted for years now, but still cannot admit the truth

April 7 2008, 7:34 PM 

I have refuted the false understanding of Ver for over a year now, but he still cannot accept the Word of God. This is because God has hardened his heart and is not capable of accepting or understanding God or God's truth. There is no point conversing with Ver, he is a lost cause.

www.dk777.com/incinanutshell.pdf

www.dk777.com


Jason

 
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Jim

Jason is bragging in the other forum that he was never refuted!

April 8 2008, 5:37 AM 

But if he does, his excuse is "a lost cause"

Jason you are such a loser! Get a life as a liar.

 
 Respond to this message   
VER

huh..the antichrist jason is still alive?

April 8 2008, 11:39 AM 

YOU TRINITY SCHEME IS A HOPELESS CASE...
NOBODY BUYS THIS RCC INVENTION EXCEPT THE DECIEVED PAGANS..LOL

WHY DONT YOU REVIEW THE LINKS AND LEARN HOW YOU BEEN DECIEVED?

PART 1-1 WITH JAZON
http://www.network54.com/Forum/412992/message/1134010384/THIS+IS+1-1+DEBATE+WITH+JASON...
http://www.network54.com/Forum/412992/message/1136362445/cant+you+destinguished+a+literal+and+not+literal+verses-
http://www.network54.com/Forum/412992/message/1136370569/CMON+AMUSE+ME+JASON..HAHAHA
http://www.network54.com/Forum/412992/message/1136371883/ANOTHER+PRE-CONCIEVED+IDEAS+SIGHTED.
http://www.network54.com/Forum/412992/message/1136372733/GOD+CAN+BE+SEEN+THRU+HIS+WORKS
http://www.network54.com/Forum/412992/message/1136377897/WAS+God+talking+to+the+2+person+OF+THE+TRINITY-
http://www.network54.com/Forum/412992/message/1134064772/point+by+point+rebuttal+on+I+claim+to+be
http://www.network54.com/Forum/412992/message/1134064842/point+by+point+rebuttal+on+claim+to+be+God


PART 2-1 WITH JASON
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150087293/1-1+W-+JASON...BLOW+BY+BLOW..JESUS+DIRECT+STATEMENTS


* REFUTED-is CHRIST God for having the name "Immanuel"
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150644413/REFUTED-++is+CHRIST+God+for+having+the+name+%26quot%3BImmanuel%26quot%3B

* REFUTED-God is plural, not singluar or only the father - VER on Jun 12, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150104861/REFUTED-God+is+plural%2C+not+singluar+or+only+the+father

IMAGE OF GOD EXPLAINED...
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1164146810/IMAGE+OF+GOD+EXPLAINED...

REFUTED- Gen 1:26 - VER on Jun 18, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150654491/REFUTED-++Gen+1-26


* REFUTED-who did John physically touch - VER on Jun 12, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150105148/REFUTED-who+did+John+physically+touch

# REFUTED- ISA 9:6 - VER on Jun 16, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150479348/REFUTED-+ISA+9-6

# REFUTED- John 1:1 - VER on Jun 16, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150479503/REFUTED-+John+1-1

REFUTED-Who was pierced on the cross? - VER on Jun 12, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150107260/REFUTED-Who+was+pierced+on+the+cross-

* REFUTED: I and my Father are one - VER on Jun 14,
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150307891/REFUTED-+I+and+my+Father+are+one


* REFUTED: Let us make Man in our Image - VER on Jun 14, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150308284/REFUTED-+Let+us+make+Man+in+our+Image

* REFUTED- Mighty God - VER on Jun 16, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150480093/REFUTED-+Mighty+God

# REFUTED- Jesus was God in human flesh - VER on Jun 16, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150480457/REFUTED-+Jesus+was+God+in+human+flesh


* REFUTED- Christ and the Father are one - VER on Jun 16, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150480732/REFUTED-+Christ+and+the+Father+are+one
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1202931612/THE+JEWS+TESTIMONY+ARE+FABRICATED+LIES%21

* REFUTED- Trinity and plurality of God - VER on Jun 16, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150481887/REFUTED-+Trinity+and+plurality+of+God

# REFUTED- Your throne, 0 God - VER on Jun 16, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150484438/REFUTED-+Your+throne%2C+0+God

# REFUTED- before abraham I AM - VER on Jun 16, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150484645/REFUTED-+before+abraham+I+AM
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1151779405/another+false+ascertion+by++trinitarian+fanatic
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1170181844/BAKIT+SINABI+NI+HESUS++%26quot%3BBAGO+SI+ABRAHAM+AKO+NGA-

# REFUTED- Romans 9:5 - VER on Jun 16, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150484796/REFUTED-+Romans+9-5

* REFUTED- Christ created all things - VER on Jun 16, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150485112/REFUTED-+Christ+created+all+things

# REFUTED- is CHRIST God for having the name "Immanuel" - VER on Jun 18, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150644413/REFUTED-++is+CHRIST+God+for+having+the+name+%26quot%3BImmanuel%26quot%3B


* REFUTED- Is Christ the 'great God'? IN TITUS? - VER on Jun 18, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150644969/REFUTED-++Is+Christ+the+%27great+God%27-+IN+TITUS-

# REFUTED- Is Christ God in I JOHN 5:20...? - VER on Jun 18, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150645811/REFUTED-++Is+Christ+God+in+I+JOHN+5-20...-


* REFUTED- Is Christ God because He is the ALPHA and OMEGA? - VER on Jun 18, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150647658/REFUTED-++Is+Christ+God+because+He+is+the+ALPHA+and+OMEGA-

# REFUTED- Let us make man... - VER on Jun 18, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1150654609/REFUTED-++Let+us+make+man...

* TRINITY IS A PAGAN CONCEPT - VER on Jun 30, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1151727193/TRINITY+IS+A+PAGAN+CONCEPT

FIRSTBORN FROM THE DEAD February 17 2008
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1203222438/CHRIST+BEING+FIRSTBORN+ALL+THE+MORE+PROVED+HE+IS+A+CREATURE.

Thomas' MY LORD MY GOD...
http://www.network54.com/Forum/message?forumid=84590&messageid=1085289448
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1204173966/Re-+MY+LORD+AND+MY++GOD++...

+ THIS WILL CLOSE YOUR COFFIN FOR GOOD JASON..HAHA - VER on Jul 4, 2006
http://www.network54.com/Forum/70213/message/1152072953/THIS+WILL+CLOSE+YOUR+COFFIN+FOR+GOOD+JASON..HAHA

 
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VER

Does Thomas exclamation "my Lord and my God" be taken as true doctrine?

April 8 2008, 8:55 PM 

Believers in Christ's alleged deity cite what Apostle Thomas said in proving their point. They quote John 20:28 where Apostle Thomas called Jesus Christ his Lord and his God:


"And Thomas answered and said to Him, 'My Lord and my God!'"(NKJV)


There are several probing questions that need to be answered in order to determine whether it is correct or not to conclude from John 20:28 that "Christ is God":


What does the verse say regarding what Apostle Thomas believed? What was it that Apostle Thomas doubted at first? Were Christ and Apostle Thomas speaking about the former's alleged deity?


First, let us find out what Apostle Thomas doubted. John 20:24-25 says:


"But Thomas, called Didymus, one of the twelve, was not with them when Jesus came."The other disciples therefore said to him, 'We have seen the Lord'. But he said to them, 'Unless I see in His hands the print of the nails, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and put my hand into His side, I will not believe'." (Ibid.)


As can be deduced from the verses quoted, the topic of discussion was about Christ's resurrection. Apostle Thomas was not present when Christ first appeared to His disciples after His resurrection. Apostle Thomas could not believe that Christ had been resurrected:


"Unless I see in His hands the print of the nails, and put my hand into His side, I will not believe."


Hence, Apostle Thomas' doubts were not concerning the nature of Christ, but on the latter's resurrection.


Eight days after His first appearance, Jesus appeared again to His disciples. This time, Apostle Thomas was present. What did the Lord say to Apostle Thomas?


"And after eight days His disciples were again inside, and Thomas with them. Jesus came, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, 'Peace to you!'"Then He said to Thomas, 'Reach your finger here, and look at My hands; and reach your hand here, and put it into My side. Do not be unbelieving, but believing." (Jn. 20:26-27, Ibid.)



What Christ said to Apostle Thomas was aimed at dispelling the latter's doubt regarding His resurrection. Out of surprise, Apostle Thomas mistook Christ to be God when he said, "My Lord and My God" (Jn 20:28, Ibid.) The fact is, it was not only Apostle Thomas who misttok Christ for God when the risen Christ appeared to His disciples. Even the other disciples thought that Christ was a spirit:



"Now as they said these things, Jesus Himself stood in the midst of them, and said to them, 'Peace to you'.


"But they were terrifed and frightened, and supposed they had seen a spirit."And He said to them, 'Why are you troubed? And why do doubts arise in your hearts?


"'Behod My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself. Handle Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see I have'." (Lk. 24:33-39, Ibid.)



Christ did not condone but instead corrected the wrong belief of Apostle Thomas and the other disciples. He explained that a spirit has no flesh and bones, which Christ said "you see I have." God, who is spirit in nature (Jn. 4:24), has no flesh and bones. On the other hand, man is "indeed flesh" (Gen. 6:3, Ibid.)


Here, it is made clear that the teaching that Christ has a dual nature is against the doctrine of the Bible.

 
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Albert

Thomas exclamation meant it literally...

April 22 2011, 2:37 AM 

because he believed Jesus is God hence, the utterance.

 
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how is Jesus God? Only ONE WAY

February 23 2011, 10:08 AM 

God created everything with "LET THERE BE",


except Man

about man he said, "LET US" make man (not create, but MAKE) Man in OUR image and likeness

who is the OUR?

the creation he created

NATURE



he said to nature, LET US MAKE MAN IN OUR IMAGE AND LIKENESS


JESUS is that MAN who is IN GODS IMAGE and NATURES IMAGE

and IN natures likeness and GODS LIKENESS

till we are baptized into that NAME we are NOT able to come in that NAME without deceiving others


if we come in that name others will hate you the way they hated Jesus because HE IS ALWAYS THE SAME, yesterday, today and forever


JESUS is the MAN that MANIFESTS GOD perfectly, like him, his EXPRESS IMAGE


if you don't understand that,

ask, and God will explain it to you

 
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