15. The Avoidance In regard to the avoidance, we do believe according to the Holy Scriptures that all expelled sinners should be avoided in all spiritual, doctrinal fellowship, as in the Lord's Supper, greeting of peace, etc. Nowhere in the gospel is the Greek word Sunanamignusthai used to convey spiritual fellowship. In 1 Corinthians 5:9 and 11, Paul uses this word to command the avoidance in temporal matters and the use of this word in 2 Thessalonians 3: 14 is sufficient to establish the avoidance in temporal matters. (The Martyrs Mirror, Menno Simons' writings, and Mirror of Truth clearly convey this concerning the avoidance.) We are united with the confession of the martyrs; namely that the separation in 2 Thessalonians 3:6 is to be understood in temporal matters, and in like manner with 2 Thessalonians 3:14; Romans 16:17. See Martyrs Mirror, p. 405, Art. 29. We do not believe in a withdrawal which is limited to only withdraw from the Lord's Supper, feet washing, kiss of peace, and brotherly council. We believe that the holy kiss should not be withdrawn before the excommunication. Matt. 18:17; Rom. 16:17; 1 Cor. 5:9-11; 2 Thess. 3:6, 14; Titus 3:10. (Refer to Art. 7,1909 Conference.)

The Avoidance- In regard to the avoidance, we do believe according to the Holy Scriptures that all expelled sinners should be avoided

Now we see how to "deal with people" after expelling the "miscreant" for any particular misdeed, whether it be arising out of biblical misconduct such as gross heinous sin, as the son fornicating his mother.

Whether a personal proving of a wolf like action coming from a lazy preacher as spoken of in Thessalonians, or whether by properly holding a charge against a trespasser for cause in Matthew 18 granting the individual the right to allow his trespassing brother to be like an infidel or a publican.

Or, as is by far the most common church discipline in the h, a presumptive miscarriage of justice that arises out of allowing the conference to be authority over the bible, and the preacher over the laymen, and marking a man for said presumptive "breach" that simply has no way to be argued, rebutted as unscriptural, or The rights of the individual reserved, thus publicly stated they never agreed to the "rule".


The expulsion by the H, has turned common sense, the bible, the proving of the individual conscience,upside down and all good men in there are put in the quandary of deciding to obey the bible or the conference, thus institutionalizing dishonesty. And build a "one size fits all" either you are "in" or you are "out" and there is little area between the two and no individual wiggle room to disagree.


Now they the proverbial "we" have to deal with So here they come again, and when they say "we believe" look for a lie to come afterworlds, for though it looks innocent, hell is breaking forth with lies brought out of demonic hell-bound spirits that are sent by the demons of the dark world to build a stronghold to oppress souls with and destroy faith.

we do believe according to the Holy Scriptures

Eph 4:28* Let him that stole, steal, no more let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, (verse deliberately twisted to make a point)

With very little moving of words, you can make the bible say the exact opposite the thing it means!

And this is how they expel, and you simply are not allowed to argue with the foundational presumption!

and if you are about to lie thorough your demonic inspired lips, it is way better to do in the name of the Lord so people can blame Him, instead of the devil or the followers of the devil.

So you say "we believe" which is a sacred thing to say and how dare you "touch" a belief, and also "according to the scripture" which makes it even hard to touch, for the gy has to argue with God to touch it.

Only problem is, the belief is wrong, and thus not true, and God never authorized the legalization of it (at least in his name)!

all expelled sinners

Now the holdies are thieves, no matter how good they are otherwise, for they take away that which they have no right to possess. Simply because the possession they steal is not of a temporal nature but tends to the ethereal, that does not make it nevertheless not valuable.




30 Men do not despise a thief, if he steal to satisfy his soul when he is hungry;
31 But if he be found, he shall restore sevenfold; he shall give all the substance of his house.

Being an investor of rental property, I am keenly aware of the value of the ethereal.

I am considering the purchase of a trailer park that has 30 spaces but only 17 units on it, which means there is 13 empty spaces.

The park will not cash flow right now, but it is almost new, being built about 8 years ago, so it has potential to be nice cash flow if it was contracted up.

But the value is not there for the contracts are not there, you can't buy a property that will cost you 7500 per month if it only produces 5100, unless you have money to make up the loss.

But if the property was full, there would be nothing more that belonged to the park, except the ethereal, or unseen thing, which is a "right" a contract right, that right holds the trailer to the land no matter who owns the trailer and whether there is even a written contract, and as long as the trailer is sitting there it has value!

If a tornado came through and blew trailers off the land, the land is basically unharmed for it will still hold trailers and the road and sewer drops still work, but the trailers are gone, so the income is gone!

Well the holdies think nothing of 'taking" that which can't bee seen from him that has a right to posses it.

It would seem to me that if I went around taking other peoples property, I would want to be careful to use 'due process" and if I were the highest pinnacle of grace, the pillar outside of which is no salvation after coming to it, how much more so?


But them thieves in the H despise honesty, and love fraud and theft, so they "steal" the rights of men without biblical mandate. They simply make a conference rule,and by that rule they can fornicate the truth and turn it into something not lovely, but perfectly demonic.

Now notice the term " expelled sinners ? that is an interesting expression! For once they expel you, you become an "expelled sinner" and a lower caste citizen in their families. unworthy to "sit" at the upper-caste table, but relegated to the hallway and the position of scorn.

Now I agree the bible teaches this in the case of willful heinous sin, but I don't agree it teaches it for attitudes, spirits, or intentions.

Jesus clearly knew Judas was harboring a demonic spirit, but he never "Cut him off"

Why do the people whose alleged favorite verses are found in the sermon on the mount, not also take his example as their way of discipline?

Nowhere in the gospel is the Greek word Sunanamignusthai used to convey spiritual fellowship. In 1 Corinthians 5:9 and 11, Paul uses this word to command the avoidance in temporal matters and the use of this word in 2 Thessalonians 3: 14 is sufficient to establish the avoidance in temporal matters.



Here we see a "truth" shrouded in a lie, for the word spoken is "strictly true" yet is is a complete error, for the word in Corinthians is obviously spoken to deal with a notorious and wretched, yet obviously gross willful sinner.

In this case the local church is told to "deliver one to Satan'

In the second case is the church advised to avoid those workers behind the pulpit, that refuse to work for their keep, but instead charge the church for their bread.

Nowhere is the idea of a temporal avoidance even hinted at in the areas that the H usually exercises it.

Your thoughts are quite clear Fred but how can a group who makes and re-makes their own standards and laws, get to a place where they do not think in legal terms concerning their standards on both attitudes and beliefs.

Pride is created where there was no pride by creating a standard that blue is kosher but red is unlawful and prideful.

An attitude is created where there was no attitude by provoking the children to wrath. Let's provoke our people by all these things we call sinful, and see if there might be an attitude of pride or anger or rebellion in there somewhere. My my!

What can be done once a group spirals downward to such levels of sin-management? Contrite repentance possibly? The efforts are high and moral it seems, because the church must be perfect, which indeed can never happen by such tactics.
It's impossible to repent of something that we've determined to be a good thing.

Whatever level of perfection we actually reach as believers is reached by regeneration of the Spirit and the washing of water by the Word of God! Eph. ch. five.