###There is a difference between respecting and tending the earth as God intended man to, and worshipping the earth. ###

I agree, but where do we draw the line? Now days I see people putting a lot of effort into "preserving the environment" over the welfare of the inhabitants of it.

Paris, as much as you might not like it, the earth was not made for man. We share the planet with a lot of other living things and have no more rights to it than they do.

The earth couldn't care less if we were here and would do just fine without us. It was here long before we were and if we don't stop ****ing with it, one day WE will be an endangered species.

To cause people to loose their means of making a livelihood for their families because some

people who do not live in the real world...decide to preserve the environment is just plain terrible!

I agree Sirus the world is for all living creatures...but at the expense of mankind's existance?

Oxy

>>I agree Sirus the world is for all living creatures...but at the expense of mankind's existance?< <br>

Are you talking long-term or short-term existence? While there may be short-term pain to adjust the behaviours and practises of human beings, to not do so, could, as Sirius pointed out, result in human beings being extinct in the medium and longer term.

Then again, since we'll likely be extinct at some point anyway, why not just continue to f*** up the earth as fast as we can and speed up the process of extinction?

I heard a comment this weekend that put things in a different perspective. Given that the universe is believed to be around 14,000,000,000 years old, and humans are relative newcomers to the universe, this is similar to a hypothetical situation where all of the universe's history is contained in a set of 30 books with each volume containing 500 pages. Humans don't appear on the scene until the second to last page of the 30th volume.

Sheeze Steven, ok, on January 1 2010, lets all follow Jim Jones and drink cool aid,
we'll give the earth back to the trees, insects and animals.


Dang, you people can get into the craziest, most senseless, meaningless horsesh** I've ever,ever
in my life, seen.

You gave me the best good laugh I have had on this site so far! Thanks

Oxy

"Are you talking long-term or short-term existence"?

I was speaking of now and the future. If we are not humane to mankind we will continue to

kill each other off as is so frequently happening today.


Oxy

First Nas says this:

>>Sheeze Steven, ok, on January 1 2010, lets all follow Jim Jones and drink cool aid, we'll give the earth back to the trees, insects and animals.< <br>

Then he responds to his own idea with this:

>>Dang, you people can get into the craziest, most senseless, meaningless horsesh** I've ever,ever in my life, seen.< <br>

Nas: Are you getting senile and starting to respond to your own posts?

You should at least put your response in a different post, rather than in the same one...

Look Steven, mine was a joke, you guys are dead serious. Now come on here,
we're sitting on a jillion barrels of oil in the good ole U.S.,,,, but,,
we can't drill because you Al Gore goon heads claim we aren't giving the
spootted owl enough room to fart.
Now really, lets get real, the deer and the antelope can still play, they
got oodles of room, we're not going to cut down the entire forest, the spine
headed lizard can still get naked with mrs. lizzy, just don't do it in the
middle of the oil route road. (Which used to be the yellow brick road!)
Can I get an AMEN here??? !!!

You got it, "AMEN"

The earth couldn't care less if we were here and would do just fine without us. It was here long before we were and if we don't stop ****ing with it, one day WE will be an endangered species.

Yep and if we let the political powers that be scare us into making stupid decisions about a little fish over the welfare of a family and their ability to work the land they have been working for decades then our rights become endangered too. Don't you feel more for those people in that video then you do for the fish that's "endangered"?

quote Steven
Then again, since we'll likely be extinct at some point anyway, why not just continue to f*** up the earth as fast as we can and speed up the process of extinction?

Amen, Amen, Amen!

Oxy

Oxy said

To cause people to loose their means of making a livelihood for their families because some

people who do not live in the real world...decide to preserve the environment is just plain terrible!



Paris said

Yep and if we let the political powers that be scare us into making stupid decisions about a little fish over the welfare of a family and their ability to work the land they have been working for decades then our rights become endangered too. Don't you feel more for those people in that video then you do for the fish that's "endangered"?

..."people who do not live in the real world"

I assuumed using the word "people" would be taken as Bureaucrats?

I do not quite understand the depiction of me sitting there like a big "un" and Paris
as a little 'un with hands curled inward as if in submission?


Am I simply naive and what am I missing...or is it that we, Paris and I, simply agree

that a little fish is NOT more important than human beings and their humane rights?

Paris I got yours! Annnnnnnnd Kevin it is...instead of Sirius?


Oxy

I wonder if a lot of this does not relate to plain old common sense. People need to pay attention to things like the direction of the lay of the land, where does the water flow to and from. whether or not what you are doing will restrict things like that and destroy the dynamics of the lay of the land. When I was young, we lived on a farm that had a lovely stream that branched into another stream and ran between 3 hills. Between 2 of the hills was the perfect place to put a dam and make a lake. It would have been probably 20 acres. So my dad decided to talk to the engineers about it and study it before he did it. Great Idea, they said, except for the fact that, that particular valley was the water shed for 500 acres and if we did that we would flood more like 50 acres including the road and the neighbors across the road. He compromised and built us an ice skating rink beside the creek that provided lots of fun for a couple yrs. That valley now has 5 different ponds on it, each at least 1-5 acres but they did not dam between the hills to do it and the water still flows thru the valley. We moved from that place to 185 acres of bare land and proceeded to build a brand new grade A dairy farm on it. more than 80 acres was woods and still is. they crop market the trees every 5-10 yrs. when we moved there, there was no wild life at all due to the extreme use of chemicals on the fields. after yrs of lime and manure those fields produce beautiful crops, there is wild life in abundance to the point that my brother has leased out the hunting on it. A very small plot produced 500 lb of potatoes. small trees from there have been sold all over 10 counties. no, they quit milking cows.
Down the road from us was just installed one of those factory chicken farms. Now I am not against farm enterprise, but when you can smell you 3 miles away, Hello!!!! I think there is a problem with your feed. then they placed it in the edge of a valley that is on one of those places where 500 acres shed and right beside a stream so we are waiting for that big rain we get about every 5 yrs of so and all that chicken stuff to start running into that creek that runs into the nearest river and kills all the fish in 50 miles and then they are gonna sit there and go OH No, what did we do? and blame the farmer that they talked into going into $600,000 worth of debt to work for them. and then fine him $250,000 for all the damages.

We used to have great water, till someone down the road decided to dynamite out their ditches and cracked a bad line into our good one. Now everyone in our little town has a water treatment system to get rid of the iron algea and the contamination.
One of my cousins lived in AZ. He used to talk about how they would go into these lovely valleys and put in allotments and then all of a sudden they would get one of those 10-20- or 30 yr rains and wonder why every thing washed away.

We definitely should have talked to the neighbors before we bought our house. the realtor told us this was a flood area but it never floods around here. That was small consolation the year we watched the water move across the slope of the yard at 12 in every 5 minutes until it finally stopped less than 10 ft from the house. or 4 yrs ago when we had to go 15 miles around to get to the town 6 miles away, down a dirt road when all the roads around were under 3 ft of water.


I still think common sense should rule and there are some things that should be looked at in view of livelihoods where the livelihood is causing an extreme side affect that will affect the lives of people for yrs to come.

Message to Sirius = please don't quit your day job.

Clever art!




OXY