Manny Castillo s father has blamed hockey as a factor in the death of his son. The perpertrater plays OHL hockey and received a one year probation.
This tragedy occurred when after the final whistle of a school rugby game
Manny was picked up and pile driven into the ground killing him.
If the kid was killed with a pile driver, why blame hockey? When is the last time a hockey player piledrove another into the ice?
You can't even really blame Vince McMahon and the WWE, where a move like that would be learned, because they run disclaimers every fifteen minutes on all programming, saying not to do the moves seen on their shows.
The only person to blame here is the kid who drove another kid's head viciously into the ground, and perhaps the coaches, referees, etc. who did not gain control of the situation better. Although we don't know the details...if more than just those two kids were fighting, then perhaps it was beyond the control of those in charge.
Teen in rugby death case stays out of custody
Mon Jul. 06 2009
An 18-year-old rugby player dodged a custodial sentence after being found guilty of manslaughter in the death of one of his opponents, a crime the judge attributed to "highly competitive instincts."
"He did not set out to commit a crime," Justice Bruce Duncan said Monday during Monday's hearing in a Brampton, Ont. court.
"The tragic consequences went far beyond what could have been expected."
The teen, who cannot be publicly identified because he was a minor at the time of the incident, was sentenced to one year of probation and 100 hours of community service.
He has also been ordered to undergo anger management counselling.
"I want to send my condolences to the family," said the young man while looking at victim Manny Castillo's parents. "I never had the chance to do that before. I'm just sorry it happened."
Castillo, a 15-year-old Lorne Park Secondary School student, died in 2007 from a head injury sustained during a high school rugby game.
Court heard that the accused lifted Castillo into the air upside down then drove him head first into the ground. Castillo died a few days later in hospital.
The defence had argued that the accused was simply defending himself because Castillo had put him in a headlock.
Duncan agreed with the Crown that the move was not self-defence but rather happened in the "heat of the moment."
"In some cases, accountability is largely achieved by guilt and this is one of those cases," he added. "I held him accountable when I found him guilty of manslaughter. It recognizes the harm done."
However, Duncan said he had concerns about the youth's "impulsivity and anger."
Earlier Monday, the court heard a victim impact statement from Castillo's father who called his son's death "every parent's worst nightmare."
"The pain and grief has been overwhelming," he said. "Time does not heal all wounds. ... There is no relief in the loneliness we feel. "
Manuel Castillo placed blame on organized hockey and hockey coaches because in that game, players are not reprimanded when they continue to fight after the whistle has blown. He said the rules are different in football and rugby. The accused played both sports.
The father did not comment on the sentence meted out to the young man who killed his son.
"The sentence was a fair one," defence lawyer Calvin Barry told reporters. "At onset, the victim's family didn't want him charged."
Castillo(the victim) also played football, rugby and football not two of the softer sports.
After reading other stories about this incident I see it as an accident.
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The fathers thinks that the psyche of hockey players are created by the
violence in the game and the overall acceptance of it.
Anyone remember Bobby Clarke intentionally injuring Kharlomov.
Martim McSorley attempt to remove Brashears head and Brashear getting hit
in the throat by a deliberately aimed stick. Bertuzzis attemt to drive Moores head through the ice and career ending injury,
A game where you can hammer a player into the end boards on an icing
where players arent required to wear full face protection.Where
running the goalie is a widely accepted practice.
"The fathers thinks that the psyche of hockey players are created by the
violence in the game and the overall acceptance of it."
Give me a break. The father is not from North America which means that soccer is the number one sport where he is from. Have you ever heard the term "Soccer Riot" ?
In Italy they made a team play in an empty stadium because the fans could not behave.
Other countries banned England's fans because of hooliganism.
A player was murdered for accidentally deflecting the ball into his own net.
"Anyone remember Bobby Clarke intentionally injuring Kharlomov."
I certainly remember Clarke tracking down Kharlomov. That, to me, was a very different situation.
"Martim McSorley attempt to remove Brashears head and Brashear getting hit
in the throat by a deliberately aimed stick."
Contacted the throat ? Not the way I remember it, but anyway McSorley was tossed from hockey.
"Bertuzzis attemt to drive Moores head through the ice and career ending injury."
Career ending ? That is a matter of opinion. Moore was a marginal player and may not have lasted in the NHL. He may have seen this as a pay day. This is not just my opinion, it is held my many other people.
Moore has to share in the blame also. He went after a smaller skilled player. Moore acted the part, but did not want to play the part.
"A game where you can hammer a player into the end boards on an icing"
Have ever actually watched rugby or football ?
"where players arent required to wear full face protection."
Rugby has zero protection.
"Where running the goalie is a widely accepted practice."
Is certainly is NOT ! Do not get ' not called ' with acceptence.
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A The conduct of fans isnt what the father was talking about.
Its respect or lack of it as seen in hockey by the players and
how that attitude played a part in his sons death.
Clarke is quite proud of his intended injury of Kharlamov.
McSorley willfully assaulted Brashear from behind.
A New York Ranger was suspended for a unprovoked stick to the throat.
Ruutu biting Andrew Peters,
Never heard the expression you gotta get the goalies attention .
Its done all the time.The analyst point it out often
Ovechin/Lindquest
Holmgren /Fluery
The Young Russian in the caps net was,Cam Ward against Boston was.
You dont see the goalies complainig to the refs? The object is to
have his eye on a potienial hit as opposed to keeping his eye on the puck.
Rugby and football both have their ways to get even within the rules
if you have watched any rugby in the last 25 yrs the players in the scrums are wearing soft helmets.
What happens on the rugby pitch is not a reflection of what happens in the hockey arena, it is a reflection of the lack of respect in society. I have seen rugby over the last few years, still don't fully comprehend the rules, but I enjoy watching it. To say their is no dirty play in rugby is being naive. I heard on the side lines how players scorch the top of the opponents head with their metal spikes while in a ruck. Is that going to be attributed to kicking in hockey.
What happened to this young athlete is tragic, and maybe the rugby association will address the issue, but to say another sport is to blame is burying your head in the sand. Rugby like any contact sport has it's dangers, of kids playing at such an intense level they don't realize the inherent danger, to themselves or others.
If you are talking about respect, that is not any one particular sports problem, that is one that begins at home, and carrying on in everyday society.
To the family who lost their child, my sincere sympathies, the pain you have gone through would more than my worst nightmare. Don't make your sons death less by trying to find blame, honour him by working to make sure it doesn't happened to another young athlete.
"The father is not from North America which means that soccer is the number one sport where he is from."
Is there any significance to where the dad is from? Do we know how long he has been in Canada or are you simply taking the last name and trying to make some vague point here.
His son was killed, on the playing field (rugby probably isn't even a recognized sport wherever dad comes from)after the played had ended. It was an overt act of aggression outside of the rules of the sport. Was the intention to kill? Only the perpetrator knows for sure.
Does hockey condone that? The answer is "yes". There are some "slap on the wrist" penalties for fighting after a play is concluded. In most other sports, automatic ejection (basketball, football, baseball and, yes, even soccer).
The incidents sighted around soccer are crowd reactions, not playing field reactions. I would wager that of any sport I know, short of Ultimate fighting, there is more violence during and after plays than any other. Football might come close but hockey is at a much greater speed.
No, where the parents are from has nothing to do with it. It must be noted that in minor and Junior hockey there is an automatic ejection for fighting. Are you saying in football there are no head shots or crack hits that destroy the knees? In soccer, one of the best players in the game head butted his opponent during a premier tournament. And anyone who remembers Pele, knows he was a marked target to maime. In rugby, especially at the high school level there is trash talking, and that is rule now not the exception, not only in sports, but everyday life.
This was an incident that might have been avoided, whether through tighter calls by ref (and understand I was not there), coaches discplining their players for dirty play, we will never really know in this case. I have seen alot of high hits, poor tackling, dirty play in scrums, head butts, etc., but the common factor is, everybody says it's the other team, or just let them play.
With this reasoning, if a baseball player who plays hockey swings his bat and hits an opponent, then it is hockey to blame.
If you are going to put blame on hockey, put blame on all competitive contact sports.
This was not something that occured during play, though. This was turning a human being upside down and dropping him on his head.
That is an intentional act of aggression, an assault. If not a deliberate intent to kill, then a deliberate intent to injure for sure. It was vicious and violent, and probation and community service were not enough.
Hockey is not to blame. Neither is Rugby, Football, or any other aggressive sport. The person to hold responsible and accountable is the person who took it upon himself to drop another human being on his head. NOBODY ELSE.
Wexdog;
"The father is not from North America which means that soccer is the number one sport where he is from."
Shamrook;
"Is there any significance to where the dad is from? Do we know how long he has been in Canada or are you simply taking the last name and trying to make some vague point here."
I did not make the above statement lightly. I searched and found a video in which he spoke ... with an accent. The politically correct answer is 'no it does not matter where the parents are from'. I do not care about political correctness. I am sick of the constant attack on hockey and blaming everything on hockey. My point is the violent attitude is there(other sports) also. Someone mentioned Zidane the headbutter. I have seen soccer player fights and attacks on referees on the field on play.
Watch rugby. I heard of tearing and biting ears as a badge of honor, this is ON THE RUGBY FIELD OF PLAY BY RUGBY PLAYERS !
The comparison of fans of other sports is the atmosphere exists in those sports.
Mr Castillo is just saying what he hears everyone else say. I doubt he has ever been in a rink.
Have some backbone and defend hockey instead of just going with the flow.
HOCKEY IS NOT TO BLAME !
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just because it is hockey? Gloss over the bad, wrap ourselves in the flag, go to Tim Horton's with the good old boys and remember when missing teeth was a badge of honour and hockey was played with a toque rather than a helmet?
I think not. I'll leave that argument to Wex and the "guy with the accent" (apparently, an accent means you can't have an opinion on hockey, at least not one that is valued by such a stalwart of the game as Mr. Wexdog)
Fact is, hockey condones fighting and embraces it as part of the game. It tries to control the aggression but, by its nature, aggression does bubble over. Few sports have the "stuff after the whistle". I would hazard a guess that most fights start after a stoppage, not during the play. Junior hockey could get rid of it if it wanted to but it doesn't. But let's not pretend it is all about "competitive sport" so it is OK. Do you think if they didn't throw a batter out of the game for charging the mound that it wouldn't happen every time a pitch was "high and tight"?
I don't have to defend hockey - I'm as involved in the game as 99% of the people on the forum. Doesn't mean I have to turn a blind eye to things that don't make sense. I don't blame hockey for it but hockey makes itself a natural target by allowing things that other sports don't. When was the last time you saw a batter hit a pitcher in the head with a bat? Stick swinging happens all the time in hockey.
Bludna started this thread and I bet he did absolutely zero research.
Here is Manuel Castillo(the father) speaking outside of the courthouse and he actually says "It is not hockey or rugby issue", but he does, however, blame hockey coaching.
Manny Castillo(the victim) obviously played rugby, also play football. Do not try and tell me they do not teach aggression in those sports.
KEEP THE BLAME WHERE IT BELONGS ! Within the sport of RUGBY.
This was a violent act in a violent sport. It was a heat of the moment thing.
"I think not. I'll leave that argument to Wex and the "guy with the accent" (apparently, an accent means you can't have an opinion on hockey, at least not one that is valued by such a stalwart of the game as Mr. Wexdog)"
Stalwart ? Sure whatever.
So now that I showed that I knew what I was talking about(in that he is from another country) you change your attack. Which is fine.
Hockey, the sport, is not to blame ... even the victim's father agrees with me.
Shamrook, glad you agreed about the badge of honour things. You mentioned some old time hockey ones like tuque for helmets(not acceptable anywhere anymore), but biting and tearing of ears still happens in rugby.
P.S. I never was big fan of Tim Horton's and rarely go there, more so now as it is an American company and lost it's Canadiana. Only exceptions are when friends want to meet there.
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I don't know were you people get the idea that Fighting in hockey is condoned. In the minor leagues, junior and down, there is a penalty and a game misconduct. If you are considered the aggressor then additional games are added to the suspension. If it is the habit of the said agressor then more games are added to his suspension. HOW DO YOU CONSIDER THIS AS CONDONING FIGHTING?????????? In the pros there are other rules, but fighting is still penalized, Hockey is a fast, hard hitting game and sometimes tempers flare in the heat of the moment. Even a Gretsky or a Crosby can lose his cool. And when your paying these guys $300,000. a game you don't want him sitting out a game because of a fight in the 1st couple of minutes,
I don't know how you blame the coaching in hockey and let rugby off the hook more or less.Maybe coaching in hockey is not perfect but i just can't see the logic that something happens in one sport but you blame it on another sport that makes zero sense to me.The father has the right to be up set but be upset at the real issues and thats rugby its not hockey its not anything else.
According to Wex, apparently I have changed my attack - don't think so. I think Mr. Wexdog would have changed his tack if it were a guy name "Smith" or perhaps "Bertuzzi" or "Camalleri".
This issue wasn't about rugby or tiddlywinks. It was about hockey as a violent sports that condones aggressive acts that other sports do not. As a result, it is "fair ball", in a court of law, to introduce that influence as a possible explanation for aggressive behaviour. In some kids, these influences enter into how they react in other social and athletic endeavours. As someone who has worked in the school system for 30 years, I have seen it many, many times. Some kids can't differentiate between the aggressive nature of competitive sport and everyday interaction in the classroom or the school yard. The "boys will be boys" scenario is still used by parents to explain over-aggressive behaviour in real life as compared to what kids are being asked to do on the ice.
"KEEP THE BLAME WHERE IT BELONGS ! Within the sport of RUGBY."
WRONG.
The blame does not belong with any sport. It belongs with an obviously aggressive, angry, and vicious young man. This is not an incident where in the heat of the moment a player fell or was knocked down and hit his head. HE WAS PICKED UP, TURNED UPSIDE DOWN, AND DROPPED ON HIS HEAD. That is most certainly not a "heat of the moment" act, but a vicious and deliberate assault. Keep the blame where it belongs.
Shamrock, being in the education system, do you feel it would be fair for a parent of a straight A student getting shot by a school system dropout to blame the teachers because they just push kids through the system.
Wexdog
"I think not. I'll leave that argument to Wex and the "guy with the accent" (apparently, an accent means you can't have an opinion on hockey
Onechkin Malkin the current world and olympic champions have accents
an accent means you are you have seen a little more of the world.
It doesnt make you better or worse than anybody else
To say a person doesnt know what hes talking about because they
have an accent is bigotry .
It was 2 kids (leaders on each team) being overly aggresive with each other. At the time of the incident I heard following a play right near the end of the game they basically were fighting/wrestling. One kid picked up another & dropped him. If the other kid had the opportunity he probably would have done the same.
Initial reports were that the boy who dieds family did not want to see any legal action because they saw it as a freak accident following the 2 kids wrestling with each other. One won & one lost & there was a tragic outcome in this circumstance.
The word was that once the family heard the other boy was a high OHL draft pick the prior weekend & was a potential future NHLer their view changed.
I hesitated to join this discussion because it quickly deteriorated into a quasi ethnic rant (yes I am the offspring of immigrants to this country as we all essentially are). Manni's comments however disturb me.
" If the other kid had the opportunity he probably would have done the same. "
That is speculative at best and completely germane to the issue. Also clouding Manni's opinion is his suggestion that the accused (now convicted) status as an OHL player motivated the victim's family to speak out. What some have missed in the discussion about this incident is that the perpetrator was completely out of control and took it way too far.
Contact sports by there very nature encourages physicality but all these sports have rules and more importantly a sense of respect associated with the physicality. In hockey we call it "the code" and many of our sport's greatest physical players repeatedly reinforce "the code" both on the ice and with the media after incidents. Like any other aspect of the game there is a bit of a learning curve associated with it which starts in minor hockey. By the time a kid is playing in his draft year and into junior at whatever level, he should be playing with the kind of respect needed in the sport.
High school sports in this country are in some ways more advanced than the hockey system in that respect, fair play and courtesy to officials is tied to all aspects if school life. There are always exceptions but the standard that every one involved must live up to is very high. Rugby in this country is a very civil sport at the high school level compared to some other countries. There are dirty players for sure but generally what the referee doesn't see and penalize for is not that consequential. The specific incident that lead to this discussion however was completely outside of a small on field spat. Guys frequently push and shove after a play and sometimes it escalates into a larger confrontation. Almost always however, team mates, coaches or officials step in and diffuse the situation.
What this kid did was inexcusable. he was out of control, showed no respect for his opponent, his team, his school, the sport and himself. This is the real issue here. The kid needs some help in not only channeling his anger and rage but also in learning to respect every aspect of sport. Somewhere along the way to this incident this kid was not taught properly. Was it by a minor hockey system? Who knows. Was it by his high school coaches? Who knows. What is known is that he missed something somewhere and if he doesn't correct it his carreer in sport will be short lived.
I don't get your point on education, Shoeless. The analogy doesn't fit.
As for hockey not condoning fighting, if you don't move to stop something, you condone it. While many minor leagues do have a game ejection for fighting, many don't. If they wished to get rid of it, go to the OFSSA rule where if you fight, your season is done. As for the OHL, they give you one fight and eject with the second. In the NHL, they punish it with a major but most teams hold a roster spot for a fighter.
Thank you. Finally a post with enough common sense to put the responsibility and accountability where it belongs...with the person committing this vicious act.
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Re: Is Hockey Blameless ?
July 8 2009, 10:00 AM
I've covered rugby for the past few years and I can honestly say there is some fueds that carry over from season to season. There is also a ton of stuff going on at the bottom of a ruck pile that intiates these fueds and usually winds up leading to fights that can take a whole season or two to settle.
Even a career. I can remember a guy clocking out another guy in a senior game that went undected by the ref and the game went on with the one player holding his jaw. Afterwards, I asked what the guy did to deserve the punch and what I got was "that's the @#$@er that kicked me in the nuts in junior." That was 3 seasons ago.
And the above is not a blanket statement for every scrum of every game, but there is some terrible stuff that happens that leads to something more if the wrong two people are involved in it.
In the picture the player is wearing a football uniform.
In the past when I coached rugger saw a lot of roughness in the game carried over from the players who also played football.
Wex;
"KEEP THE BLAME WHERE IT BELONGS ! Within the sport of RUGBY."
Sharpie;
"WRONG."
You are correct Sharps. I know what I typed, but I did not mean to blame rugby. I got ahead of myself, then did not catch it later in review.
Sharpie;
"The blame does not belong with any sport. It belongs with an obviously aggressive, angry, and vicious young man. This is not an incident where in the heat of the moment a player fell or was knocked down and hit his head. HE WAS PICKED UP, TURNED UPSIDE DOWN, AND DROPPED ON HIS HEAD. That is most certainly not a "heat of the moment" act, but a vicious and deliberate assault. Keep the blame where it belongs."
Now here I think you are wrong. You do not know the kid. The unnamed player claimed Castillo had him in a headlock and that he just wanted to get out of it and did what he had to to get free of Castillo's grip. True ? I do not know.
We will likely never know for sure what really happened, but we can speculate, boy can we speculate.
Based on what I read I do not blame the unnamed player. Maybe there is no one and/or nothing to blame.
I heard/read the words "Picked up and dropped on his head" and "Picked up over his head and piledrove into the ground" I have my doubts.
The unnamed player claims 'Castillo had him in a headlock', the Castillo camp maintains 'the unnamed player picked up Castillo and drove him onto the ground head first' I would guess it is somewhere in between.
Maybe the unnamed player is totally to blame, I do not know him so I can not outright blame him.
I read(above) what several others have wrote and kind of agree, a lack of respect in society in general, if anything, is likely to blame.
Hockey is certainly not to blame.
To just jump on the 'let us blame hockey' band wagon is ridiculous, but it is the Canadian way.
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Bludna;
"To say a person doesnt know what hes talking about because they
have an accent is bigotry."
>Before I looked up the word 'bigotry'.
I can see where you may jump to that conclusion.
Now I thought I knew what it meant.
>I looked up the word 'bigotry'.
It goes a little further then I thought.
I can see how one would jump to that conclusion about me based on what I said, but you would be wrong.
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Shamrock, all I am saying is making a blanket statement blaming someone or some other organization or sport is not dealing with the situation. If you read the first hand account at the time it happened, the overwhelming view was they were wrestling with each other and then fell awkwardly. It could have very easily gone the other way.
But I believe rugby has to address the same problem hockey has had, consistant officiating. There is a difference between tackling in rugby and football, and there are many times you see players making high tackles, around the head in rugby. And referees let it go, which in most cases cause chirping and then retaliation. Maybe rugby should adopt the two official system to stop the behind the play confrontations.
In this case, because it was near the end of game, we will never know if there was ongoing chirping that lead up to the eventual wrestling match and tragic conclusion.
Like I said before, these kids do not understand the dangers of playing intense contact sports at a high level, and it's potential consequences.
I am being told my comments are disturbing & speculative. But I am the one that had eye witness reports from some different players & parents.
The two kids were basically wrestling with each other & the victim had a hold of the defendant. The defendant basically lowered himself, thrust up & flipped him back. The victim landed in on awkward position wih his weight being absorbed by his head & neck.
My comment that the victim probably would have done the same if he had the opportunity was that to break away from him he probably would have used a similar move that happens hundreds upon hundreds of times in Rugby. The difference was that the victim fell awkwardly.
Of course I am sure different individuals saw it different ways, but the accounts I got were the day following the incident, even prior to the boy dieing, so accounts before the hysteria.
I think too many people here watch wrestling. It was not the classic WWF pile driver, it was not the flip a player over & drop him on his head. It was a reaction to an action.
The real speculation in the previous posts was your comment that
- the perpetrator was completely out of control and took it way too far.
Or Sharpies
- It belongs with an obviously aggressive, angry, and vicious young man. This is not an incident where in the heat of the moment a player fell or was knocked down and hit his head. HE WAS PICKED UP, TURNED UPSIDE DOWN, AND DROPPED ON HIS HEAD. That is most certainly not a \\\"heat of the moment\\\" act, but a vicious and deliberate assault.
You know sometimes bad things happen with no intent & just because it happens does not mean they were out of contol or were being vicious.
In minor hockey he had 1.1 PIM per game, in the OHL last year he was not even in the top 10 on his team for PIM & averaged approx .7 min per game.
The kid was given leadership positions in the OHL & in minor hockey. He is not a vicious kid, nor the type to lose control.
The ones speculating here are guys like K2 & Sharpie that know SFA about the kid or what really happened.
With respect to the OHL angle. Here are some quotes from the victims family
- We support the police investigation but we do not condone the fact that this kid is charged with assault or that he is in custody, the boys uncle, Hector Castillo, said last night.
- They were not playing volleyball. They were not playing checkers ... We truly believe it was a freak accident ... I know that (Manny) would not want anything to happen to this kid.
- The family is unanimous about not pressing charges, he (The father) said.
So what brought about the change of view? Can families sue in Canada for something like this? Maybe it was the police telling them it is not up to them & butt out. Maybe it was their own lawyers advice. But the OHL draft position & potential NHL future was talked about quite openly. O.K., maybe I am speculating now.
A freak accident? Yeah, right. A freak accident is when something beyond your control happens.
If there wasn't a fight there wouldn't have been an "accident".
If restraint was shown there wouldn't have been an "accident".
If, if, if.......
The fact of the matter is this kid was found guilty, culpable, responsible for the tragic death of another human being. He received a very lenient sentence that focuses on anger management. I sincerely hope he learns something from the whole situation and becomes a better person for it.
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Re: Is Hockey Blameless ?
July 9 2009, 9:44 AM
Just so I understand it, the kid was in a headlock that was being performed by Castillo, at which point the kid lifted him up, broke the head lock and dropped him awkwardly over his back. Is this the way it happened?
UGLY CONFRONTATIONS MAR END PANAMA-MEXICO GOLD CUP MATCH
HOUSTON - Mexico and Panama played to a 1-1 tie in a Gold Cup match on Thursday night that ended in chaos after a confrontation between Mexican coach Javier Aguirre and a Panamanian player triggered fights among fans in the stands.
Tempers flared throughout the match and boiled over in the 80th minute.
Panama's Ricardo Phillips dribbled out of bounds in front of the Mexico bench and, when the linesman stopped play, Phillips shoved Aguirre.
Players converged in the area and several got into shoving matches. Referee Joel Aguilar ejected Aguirre and whipped out a red card to give to Phillips as fans littered the field with cups of beer and other objects.
Phillips was escorted off the field by a swarm of police -- and pelted with beer as he ran into a tunnel and, after about 15 wild minutes, play resumed.
A fight then broke out between two fans in the front row across the field from the benches and Houston police moved in to separate them. Police handcuffed at least two fans in the area.
Miguel Sabah and Blas Perez scored the goals.
Perez was injured on the field in the 90th minute and medical staff brought out a stretcher. As Perez was carried off the field, Mexican fans unleashed another barrage of cups and beer bottles and Perez fell off the stretcher.
The game ended about five minutes later and the Panamanian team lingered on the field to let stadium officials drive off the fans.
The 1-1 draw means that both Canada and the U.S. have qualified for the quarter-finals.
Earlier, Guadeloupe beat Nicaragua 2-0 in the opener of the doubleheader at Reliant Stadium. The event drew an announced crowd of 47,713, nearly all of them donned in green and cheering for Mexico.
Giovani Dos Santos took a loose ball and outran a Panama defender to set up Mexico's first goal in the 10th minute. Dos Santos dribbled into the penalty area, then passed to Sabah, who easily beat goalkeeper Jaime Penedo with a right-footed shot.
Perez tied it in the 29th minute, taking a pass from Felipe Baloy, overpowering three Mexican defenders to beat goalkeeper Guillermo Ochoa with a sideways kick.
The tie was a disappointing outcome for Mexico, which has won four Gold Cups, the last in 2003.
El Tri is facing mounting pressure at home to return to international prominence after some embarrassing recent results. Mexico lost to the United States in the 2007 Gold Cup final and its under-23 team failed to qualify for the Beijing Olympics last summer.
Mexico has a key World Cup qualifier Aug. 12 against the U.S. in Mexico City.
I dont understand your references to Soccer unless it was
associated with the tragic death. Are you saying these boys are soccer players ?
Mr Castillo is an extremely compassionate man. He wanted no charges
brought against the othry boy. Citing one family has already already
been ruined why ruin another.
This man sat through a trial what information led him to this
opinion?
I have nothing but respect for the man .
In some of my previous posts I admit I played the devils advocate in
order to draw out opinions that were predictable.
Hockey means different things to different people.I can cite enough
examples on the negative side but in the end I respect most of
the boys and men who play it.
Ive played Rugby and committed some severe fouls often in retal
iation.
One tactic would be too hit the ball carrier by driving my shoulder just under the ball grab behind the thighs lift him off his feet and drive him on his back into the ground usually winding them in the process.
Yes it was rough but within the game as he had the ball and during play.
What this boy did went far beyond that
Mr Castillo feels thst fights after the whistle are not
dealt with severely enough to deter that behaviour and that had a
part in the aggressive behavour that killed his son.
He sat through the trial and heard opinions that may have created that impression I dont know that but neither do you.
If he didnt know much about hockey where did he gain that insight.?
When the father infered hockey was to blame in my opinion that was a stupid statement, but hey, I pray I never have to go through what he has. Who knows where his head is at.
Hockey is what it is, it's an aggressive game, and we all must love it at some level or else we wouldn't even know this forum exists.
What I think Wex is saying though is that "Hockey Fans" do not have a culture of blatant violence and hooliganism. Die hard soccer, (or football as they call it) fans from across the pond have a very bad, (and well earned) reputation for violence, not only amongst themselves, but also toward players on the field resulting in fencing often being put in place as a barrier. Obviously there are many more civil soccer fans than violent ones, but nobody can deny that things get out of hand at soccer matches a lot.
Because this man has an accent Wex is "assuming", and is probably correct, that this man is probably from overseas, or maybe only one generation removed, and he's "assuming" that the odds are in the world of sports he's probably a lot closer tied to the soccer culture than the hockey culture.
I agree with Wex, I think to blame hockey is crazy.
Is it an "accident"? No. Accidents can be prevented. If there was no Rugby game, and everybody stayed home that day, ate only healthy food etc. the death might have never occured.
There's not one of us on here who couldn't have had the same circumstances result from some playfight with sibblings, or wrestling match with schoolmates at some point in our lives.
You guys are going to love this
at 9.30 am today om 640mAM in Toronto the EMCEE asked.
Should the CFL have more Americans playing because the Canadians were
too penalty prone because of the ""HOCKEY CULTURE"
To my surprise the first call in said he agree100%
Our game sure could use a better PR job .
My thought was lets bring in the most violent peoples on earth to
cut down on penalties?
Most Canadian kids are graduates of Canadian universities where
Academia means something and therefore bright enough to play a game
realizing the impact of penalties.
aardvark123 (Login aardvark123) Registered Members
Re: Is Hockey Blameless ?
July 19 2009, 1:32 AM
Oh dear God, Canadian CFL players are too undisciplined because of the hockey culture?
Have you ever seen the rap sheets of the hundreds of US football players on the daily blotter?
