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Dressed and ready for the Temecula Challenge !

May 7 2017 at 3:48 PM

AngliaUSA  (Login AngliaUSA)
YF12


I just got my RWS56TH back from Hector Medina and I am happy to report that I am absolutely thrilled with the result of the 12 ft lb conversion.

It is super easy to cock, and the accuracy is astonishing. It rivals my most accurate Whiscombes and for a fraction of the cost.

I am a die hard springer fan but shooting my Whiscombes took it’s toll on my shoulder and elbow which are both struggling to recover from a torn rotator cuff injury and torn ligaments in the elbow.

Suffice to say I need a single stroke and VERY easy to cock rifle … which this is …. or else it’s PCP only for me ….

Anyway here he is … all dressed and ready for the 12ft lb WFTF Temecula Challenge in a couple of weeks time.

[linked image]

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Groups were shot of a sand bag and the rifle was benched with no wind ….. each 5 shot group can be covered by a nickel !

[linked image]

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At least when I miss I’ll know it was either my fault, or the wind got the better of me or a combination of both .. LOL

https://youtu.be/fbRKd6xIsT4

Thank you Hector for working your magic on this rifle … you are now officially renamed

‘Señor Airgun Wizard’

If you are interested in seeing what Hector can do for your air rifle he can be contacted here …

http://www.ctcustomairguns.com/hectors-airgun-blog

Héctor J. Medina G.- Airgunsmith
Connecticut Custom Airguns LLC
51 Hoyt St.
New Canaan, CT, 06840

(203) 340 2535


 
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Scott Hull
(Login Scotchmo1957)
YF

Dressed? - Gimp suit?

May 7 2017, 8:31 PM 

Glad you'll be there. Don't overdue it even with that 12fpe cocking. I have to moderate my practice, even when cocking my 12fpe gun. It's the repetitive motion as much as the strain.

Besides the PCP competitors, there should be plenty of piston shooters. I heard that the following planned on being there:

You
me
Casey R!
Jeff C
Jim Poh
Mark from Chico
Son L
Vince P

anyone else?

I'm tasked with targets and WFTF compliant signage. Not as big or long as the World WFTF match, but close as we can come on a smaller scale. And I expect target function to be the best you have seen.

100_4648.JPG

100_4649.JPG

 
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Bill Day
(Login dayjd2)
YF12

Looks pretty Professional to me .............

May 7 2017, 9:13 PM 

Hope you guys get great weather and have a great time. See some of you in Arizona this fall.

 
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AngliaUSA
(Login AngliaUSA)
YF12

KUDOS Scott !

May 8 2017, 2:10 PM 

Those targets and signs and lane markers .. oh my !

They look great .. really professional .... just like a real WORLDS event !

See ya there / safe drive down.

JB


 
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Bob D.
(Login MB-BOB)
YF

Scott, a question about WFTF target signage, please...

May 8 2017, 3:14 PM 

Per the International WFTF website, the sign to be placed to the side of the target specifies that the height of the target number be 10cm (3.94"). Is this dimension an official REQUIREMENT for all (International) WFTF matches?

[linked image]

[linked image]
www.DallasFTclub.org


    
This message has been edited by MB-BOB on May 8, 2017 4:22 PM


 
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Scott Hull
(Login Scotchmo1957)
YF

Re: Scott, a question about WFTF target signage, please...

May 8 2017, 4:19 PM 

Official REQUIREMENT? Per the most recent WFTF core rules.

WFTF-sign-03.JPG

WFTF-sign-04.JPG

WFTF-sign-05.JPG

2.6.2 All targets shall be clearly numbered (per course from left to right) at the target and the firing line.
...
Note: A document template with the signage is available in WFTF website for download.
Downloads
http://www.world-field-target-federation.com/Rules/TemplateDownloads


The only dimension I saw in the rules was the letter size of 6cmx10cm. I used their official templates at 1:1 scale, and the numbers matched the 10cm (3.94") high spec. The printouts from the downloaded templates are 15cm (wide) x 24cm (high) signs with 10cm high numbers.

 
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dan_house
(Login dan_house)
YC

I hope we (US shooters) adapt that signage standard

May 8 2017, 6:21 PM 

for a lot of reasons......

 
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AngliaUSA
(Login AngliaUSA)
YF12

Except if the Hunter Shooters

May 8 2017, 9:46 PM 

are on the same course as those WFTF signs are on they will have 'exact dimensions' to bracket there shots from ....

and I blame Scott Hull for that .... entirely ....

LOL

wink.gif


 
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Scott Hull
(Login Scotchmo1957)
YF

That would be a good thing.

May 8 2017, 11:30 PM 

A reliable dimension to use for bracketing.

Hunter Division shooters might see it as a worthwhile reason to learn and use bracketing. That's what mil-dots were made for. Better than dealing with the recurring lobbying for higher power scopes in Hunter Division. It would be a win-win. WFTF would be more realistic, and Hunter shooters would be able to range a little better without resorting to expensive equipment.

But for this match, there is no Hunter Division, so everyone can use high power scopes if they want to.

 
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Luis Nevett
(Login lnevett)
YF12

Be careful ranging on the sign...

May 10 2017, 10:47 AM 

In some completions in Europe where I have been lucky enough to attempt I have seen the sign (number) of the target position in such way that from the shooting position it appears to be just at the same distance as the target, but in reality they are way back or way forward, of the target, sometimes up to 10 yards or more…

So be careful and don’t get used to range on the sign… better keep doing at the target…

Best,
Luis

 
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Bob D.
(Login MB-BOB)
YF

ALL DIVISIONS can use these signs for range finding, including WFTF

May 9 2017, 9:57 AM 

There is no rule preventing a WFTF shooter from secondary -- or primary -- range finding using these signs. Any stadia line or "mildot" reticle can be used. And why anyone would buy a simple cross-hair reticle these days confounds me... Cross-hair reticles are not very flexible.

I bet a WFTF shooter with a scope set at 32x can "bracket" this known measurement number to within 1/2 yard on the far targets where it counts the most... who needs to focus range find?

Anyone who thinks these numbers will NOT be used for bracketing at this "WFTF Only" match is kidding themselves.
[linked image]
www.DallasFTclub.org


    
This message has been edited by MB-BOB on May 9, 2017 10:01 AM


 
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LD
(Login lhd)
AR&P

Well Bob

May 9 2017, 1:23 PM 

IF you attended this very first "WFTF rules" match in USA, you would soon realise TRUE WFTF rules matches will NOT be very "bracketing friendly", since that method normally takes lots MORE time to range than the traditional sidewheel ranging method. Each of the two WFTF targets per lane are often placed in a way that requires body repositioning and very fast target locating in order to stay within the time limit ... you have only three minutes to find the two targets, aim and shoot, then get out of the lane.

Typical American matches allow 5 mins per lane, but the SHOOTER gets to start the clock when he is finally ready to being aiming at the first target, whereas WE will have the scorer start timing when the shooter steps into the box. Though it would appear 5 mins for 4 shots is similar to three mins for two shots, its not, because the first shot at each target takes much longer since there is no ranging for the second shot on a target you just fired on.

 
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Bob D.
(Login MB-BOB)
YF

Well, LD, Thanks for enlightening me to facts I already know... n/t

May 9 2017, 4:03 PM 

[linked image]
www.DallasFTclub.org

 
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Scott Hull
(Login Scotchmo1957)
YF

At this match ALL DIVISIONS = WFTF only.

May 9 2017, 3:01 PM 

If they wanted to bracket the sign they could, just like at a worlds match:

WFTF-bracket-00.JPG

I'd like to know how many would bother bracketing the target when they have a high power AO scope at their disposal. I bet they stick with focusing because it's faster/easier.

This match is WFTF only, so the issue of Hunter Division being able to use the signs for bracketing is not really pertinent here. How about another thread where we discuss the merits of having target signage at AAFTA GP matches?

"And why anyone would buy a simple cross-hair reticle these days confounds me..."

It does not confound me. A high power scope can focus range find well, so stadia lines or mil-dots are not needed for ranging. If you click for elevation and/or windage, stadia line are not needed at all. There is something comforting about a simple cross-hair that "focuses" your concentration on one point. Many people do well with them.

 
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Bob D.
(Login MB-BOB)
YF

A stadia line/mildot can be used in all 3 Divisions, Cross-hair only 2...

May 9 2017, 3:48 PM 

I'm certain you've never bought a cross hair scope for one purpose, and then later decided (as you regularly do) to switch (to or from Hunter) and wished you could use it in that division. That's a rhetorical question.

I have not bought a (limited use) cross-hair scope in 30 years, nor is one conceivably in my future.
[linked image]
www.DallasFTclub.org


    
This message has been edited by MB-BOB on May 9, 2017 4:12 PM


 
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Scott Hull
(Login Scotchmo1957)
YF

I missed the rhetorical question.

May 9 2017, 4:53 PM 

What was it?



"I have not bought a (limited use) cross-hair scope in 30 years, nor is one conceivably in my future."

Well, maybe you can get them banned.


    
This message has been edited by Scotchmo1957 on May 9, 2017 5:04 PM


 
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LD
(Login lhd)
AR&P

that he HAS to be different?

May 9 2017, 8:55 PM 

I hazard the guess that over 95% of all the riflescopes in the world sold for civilian use have the ubiquitous crosshair reticle.

But Mr. Dye, in his profoundness, NEVER buys em.

I'd say I too like the mildot type reticles, but yet WELL over half the scopes I own ARE crosshair type. BUT, I started shooting with scopes well BEFORE the mildot reticle was designed for scopes and even once in use, mildot and other rangedfinding type reticles were NOT LEGAL for civilian use until perhaps the late 80's or so, which is to me at least, fairly recently.


    
This message has been edited by lhd on May 9, 2017 9:31 PM


 
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AngliaUSA
(Login AngliaUSA)
YF12

Geez guys lighten up ...

May 9 2017, 11:17 PM 

My comments about Scott , bracketing and Hunter class were meant in jest ....jest folks ,, a joke ... my attempt at humor ...

I USED to shoot HUNTER and Scott taught me to bracket ...

a couple of years ago there was much debate about how Hunter shooters were bracketing from known dimensions of target faces,
cinder blocks , bricks etc ....

basically akin to the hunter shooter being accused of legal cheating ...

cinder blocks were even being placed at weird angles and covered with brush to disguise there shape, and size to discourage bracketing ...

yes it's all died down now and some Hunter shooters still bracket without any fuss or commentary ...

but getting back to my original point IF these targets numbers are used at a match were ALL divisions are shooting the same course then it will be pretty easy for the BRACKETERS to use the known dimensions ...

that's the only point I wanted to make .... it's not good, it's not bad ... it is what it is ....

Nobody shooting in OPEN with a big scope will bother bracketing obviously .... but the point of Hunter is to use a x12 power scope max and we all know that accurately ranging between 40 and 55 yds with these scope is near impossible ...

hence bracketing makes a huge difference and creates an obvious advantage to those that know how to do it ..

Thats all ... I'll go have a little lie down now.

Please let's try to be nice to each other ... the world is scary enough right now wink.gif

continued safe shooting to all

James B

 
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Scott Hull
(Login Scotchmo1957)
YF

I think it's GOOD.

May 10 2017, 12:42 AM 

and worthy of a separate discussion.

AAFTA could require that all GP matches have standard sign/numbers at each target. Then more Hunter Division shooters would learn how to bracket.

And when someone in Hunter Division then complains about not being able to range the far targets, we tell them: "You need more practice - Learn to use mil-dots, and then practice bracketing".

It becomes a practice issue rather than an equipment allowance issue.

As it is now, I bracket when I want to. Compiling the info is not alway easy, but most all info is out there if you're willing to put the time in. Even AAFTA obliges us by providing scales and KZ sizes for their target inventory:

http://aafta.org/Assets/images/Targets/aafta_targets.html

Those targets are often included in the National match. Some of the commercial targets (Gamo for instance) are easy in comparison.

A standard sign at each target would save people a lot of work. They would still need to insure scope calibration and practice their bracketing.

For the Temecula WFTF only match, it's not really an issue.

Note:
I don't really mind when MDs attempt to thwart bracketing. It makes it fun/challenging. I then have to come up with alternatives. Weird angles? Hiding faceplates?, etc. Bring it on. Besides, I can focus range and/or guess the target distance as well/or better than most. If they make it easier to bracket, it will help others more than it will help me. I then might lose some of my "unfair" advantage.

Fun with math - angled block correction factor: (COS(ATAN((dots-Length/Length)*(dots-Width/Width))))
I did that early on when I started to see more angled blocks. So I put it in a chart:
angled-block-00.JPG

Angled blocks take two dot measurements instead of one, but even with a sloppier dot read, it can give a more accurate distance than when the block is straight on. I think that angling the blocks fell out of favor as I see more straight blocks these days. The straight blocks are faster/easier, but do not give a more precise distance.

 
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Bill Day
(Login dayjd2)
YF12

Scott, to correlate all that data for ........................

May 10 2017, 8:35 AM 

useful bracketing purposes I think that Affta should implement a new genius class of which I'm pretty sure the competition would be very minimal. In fact you may be shooting against yourself. I mean this only as a compliment because you amaze me sometimes with your competitive intuition. As I have noted before the hardest part for me is holding steady enough to get the same mildot read twice. Maybe remembering the mildot count and transferring it to a distance number would be second. I appreciate all the help you have given on bracketing for it can help especially on the longer distances. Then we still have to make the shot. Correction ..... That might be the hardest part! LOL!

 
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