Which putty for Tamiya zimmerit?August 22 2012 at 4:26 AM
|Christian Pålsson (Login ChristianPaalsson)|
from IP address 188.8.131.52
I'm thinking about taking the BIG step
of trying to create zimmerit on my next late Tiger I.
I have decided on the Tamiya raking method with their zimmerit coating applicator, but which putty is the best for this method (i.e. easiest to work with and most accurate)?
I have noticed that Tamiya recommends their Polyester Putty (Item 87097) in the new Elephant kit, so this is currently what I'm planning to use, but any advice would be highly appreciated!
|August 22 2012, 5:38 AM |
I've experimented with the Tamiya putty, Aves Apoxie, Milliput, and two other 1:1 brands(the containers aren't labeled) of putty for applying zimmerit. To be honest, I got better results from the other products than the Tamiya putty. I like the Aves the best with Milliput at the bottom. I think it's safe to suggest that putties for zimmerit are like airbrushes. It's a personal preference based on your experience with different products. It might be worth your time to get another brand and experiment with the two on plastic stock before trying it on an actual kit.
I've just used Milliput on an AFV Club Sturmtiger.
|August 22 2012, 7:13 AM |
I rolled out the Milliput as thin as I could then applied it to the hull sides. To get the pattern I used the Modelkasten Zimmerit roller set and it worked a treat.
MODERATORS ONLY - Axis WWII
Re: Which putty for Tamiya zimmerit?
|August 22 2012, 8:07 AM |
I would agree with John and Andy. Personally, I use Aves Apoxie Sculpt with Zimmerit dies to press in the pattern in small squares. Zimmerit rakes produce an unrealistic looking Zimmerit pattern. On June 30, 2009, I posted a step by step tutorial on using the Aves product for Zimmerit that will help you out.
|This message has been edited by atcockle from IP address 184.108.40.206 on Aug 22, 2012 8:14 AM|
(Login Gunnar J)
Tiger I zimmerit , how it was made and be duplicated...
|August 22 2012, 10:39 AM |
Your name suggest's me that you also are swedish?
I just want to give some info regarding zimmerit pattern on Tigers, to get the most realistic pattern I think one should duplicate how it was done in real.
For Tigers the pattern was made by rollers, zimmerit tools utilising rollers and stamps (in hard to reach areas)for 1/35th scale are made by Lion Roar and Model kasten for example, though most of the wheels and stamps doesn't have the correct "pitch" to get the pattern perfect in scale, it depends how exact you want it.
I and Roddy MacDougall (zimmerit pattern maker for Dragon kits after 2006) have been digging into size on different zimmerit pattern and how to best simulate this on models and get the most realistic look.
I have designed and have had made customized rollers and stamps for vehicles that had "rolled on" zimmerit (Tigers, MAN Panthers for example)in 1/35th scale, some of these has been used for making the pattern for Dragon "pre zimmerited" kits.
I can mention that the last tools designed, has been used on Dragons new Otto Carius Tiger I kit.
If anyone are interested I will post soemthing about the design of the tools, how they where made etc.
Best regards/ Gunnar
|August 22 2012, 11:22 AM |
I am interested how you made those tools, etc.
Best regards from Finland =)
|August 22 2012, 11:51 AM |
Why would you think we wouldn't be interested? Please post informatioon about tools and/or any other Zimm info you would like to post, be it about applying Zimm or Zimm in WWII.
I frankly was quite disappointed that I couldn't see Roddy's seminar at one of the contests half a world away from my home.
Improving my modeling one mistake at a time.
Yes, please do...
|August 22 2012, 12:19 PM |
|August 22 2012, 12:36 PM |
My name is indeed swedish because my family is. I am actually danish of birth though, but I have lived in Sweden for a number of years, so I consider myself partly swedish!
I really appreciate all the info on zimmerit!!! and I would VERY MUCH like to hear all about the tool design as I am also a complete perfectionist when it comes to modelling! Hell, If feasable I'd propably be mixing the paste myself using the original ingredients
Also thanks for the tip on the Otto Carius Tiger kit, though you kind of screwed up my initial plan of using a plain Tamiya Late Tiger kit. Damn it!!! I have built only Tamiya kits for 30 years and sworn to continue, but those damn DML kits keep coming out better and better trying to lure me to switch sides and join the DML modellers
The first DML Tiger I w. zimmerit didn't look quite right to me (the depressions seemed too deep and the pattern seemed too monotonous and uniformly applied), but judging from the box photos of the Otto Carius Tiger it looks SPOT ON!!!
Tiger I zimmerit and 1/35 roller history
|August 23 2012, 2:29 PM |
In real life the Tiger I zimmerit was done with mix of rollers and a trowel. You can often see the troweled ridge pattern on the driver's plate around and behind the Bosch headlight and sometimes on the entire rear plate or just around and between the exhausts.
We've come a long way in the last 10 years. When I pushed the roller technique in the late 90s and early 2000s, it was widely ignored or dismissed in favor of the less realistic "rake" technique. I did this MAN Panther G pattern in 2001 using a watch crown as a roller:
The first idea for the roller to replicate the pattern came from Sheperd Paine in "Modeling Tanks and Military Vehicles" published in 1982. It was by using his technique and looking at the particular quirks of the MAN Panther pattern that I saw that this was in fact how it was done at the factory. AFV Club followed with their 1/35 zimmerit roller ca 2005 and other manufacturers followed with thier versions later. Now Gunnar has taken the old roller to a higher level of accuracy so that Roddy could do such a nice job on the Dragon models.
|This message has been edited by mglgr from IP address 220.127.116.11 on Aug 23, 2012 2:30 PM|
Here's another link
|August 22 2012, 12:26 PM |
Thx. for all the great replies!!! ...
|August 22 2012, 12:54 PM |
Thx. a lot! I really appreciate the fact that you have taken time and energy to provide me with so much info
(Login Gunnar J)
Making zimmerit with specially engineered tools...
|August 22 2012, 4:17 PM |
I will prepare some pics showing the tools I have made and that was used for the pattern making of Dragons latest Tiger I kit.
I will do a briefly description how to use them with one component acrylic auto repair putty, It's nothingh new really, the method and similar tools are out there by different brands, but I have just tweaked the design to get as realistic and in scale zimmerit as possible.
I have just started to do zimmerit, Roddy is the "expert" his experiance and practise has made him a "master" in zimmerit making I would say.
as always practise makes perfect.
Maybe he can and are willing to share his thoughts and can give some hints and tips.
One important thing though is finding a sutiable putty with the right properties.
I will post in a new topic, here or under "tricks and tips", but I will notify when but keep your eyes open in the middle or end of next week.