Having being a very lucky chap and winning a very generous discount from Formations (for building a 54 cm Mörser Karl) I have treated myself to a Jumbo conversion plus a few extra bits and pieces. Having received the kit yesterday and seeing the marvellous moulding and attention to detail that has gone into it, I have decided that this has to be my next build. However, I have to confess that I'm a Sherman novice and will be asking some questions that may have been asked before. I have searched on here and already found out a lot, but as is always the case with research, new questions arise.

Recommendations for references? I have Hunnicutt, but it has very few in-action photos. I'm specifically looking for in-action photos and references as I have already bookmarked Toadmans's superb site.

Ideally I would like to go for a 75 mm main gun with a 50 cal coax. Was this combination ever seen? If so what units and thus what markings?

The only part I think that I'm lacking is the gun crutch, however my DML M4A1 Mid kit has one that won't be used. Would this style of gun crutch be used? The few photos I have seen show that it might be, although I have also seen other styles used.

That's it for now, I have a Panther and a 25 pdr to finish off first so I'm just looking for information and references at the moment. I'm sure I'll have other questions as I get more information.

Cheers

Andy

p.s. I can't rate Formations highly enough, superb customer service and products.

Andrew,
There are some battle pics in the following books from Concord; "The M4 Sherman at War vol. 1-2" and in "US Tank Battles in Germany 1944-45" I don't know if the 75mm gun with the .50cal was ever used. Someone else should chim in on that one. As to Mr. Erwin, he's OK if you like top quality product and service. But keep this under your lid or else he'll hear about it and raise his prices on us. (___)

Jim Guld

There is a new Allied-Axis book out with a section on the Jumbo. Pretty much the same old usaully seen photos, but in large format and all in one place which is nice during a build. Also there is the Cobra King restoration Project at Ft. Knox. They have a webpage detailing the history and ongoing restoration of "Cobra King", a Jumbo of the 4th Armored that was first tank to relieve Bastogne.

http://www.armorfortheages.com/Volunteers/Projects/CobraKingProject/CobraKingProjectPage.htm

Hi Andrew

I'm at the same stage with a 48th model so may be able to help although I'm no expert.

It's my understanding that the co-ax 50 cal and 76mm main gun went togeather.

Steve Zaloga does a build in the Osprey 'Modelling the US Army (76mm) Sherman Medium Tank' book and there was an article in Military Modelling Vol 32 No 4 by him as well.

It seems that Patton's Third Army was the only user of Jumbo 76mm although searching this site tends to confuse the issue.

Good Luck and have fun.

Nick

Hi Nick

Already have the Osprey book and it is proving to be invaluable.

I was just wondering about the article in MM, is this the same build that is in the ML gallery? I can't find the article on the MM home page so I suspect that I will have to subscribe, which isn't a problem as they're running a very generous promotion at the moment.

Andy

"It seems that Patton's Third Army was the only user of Jumbo 76mm although searching this site tends to confuse the issue."

There is a famous photo of the 3rd Armored Division, usually credited as being in Cologne, Germany. In the photo is an M4A3E2 with 76mm gun along with a couple other tanks. The 3rd Armored was a First Army outfit, so that puts at least one in their possession.

The 76mm gun was part of an upgrade authorized for Third Army tanks in early 1945. The M4A3E2s were to get 76mm guns (as available), the ones for 4th Armored Div also got .50 cal. co-ax (aircraft type guns seem to have been used), the turret .50 was moved to where the loader could fire it forward and often a .30 cal was mounted in front of the tank commander. The tanks were also fitted with metal mesh for holding natural camouflage (Sommerfield Airplane Landing Mat) and received black over OD paint. Third Army wanted more M4A3E2s but no more were available so a number of M4A3 76mm, both VVSS and HVSS equipped were modified with extra armor salvaged from KO'd tanks and some, or all, of the above changes. These seem to show up in the 4th, 6th and 11th Armored Divisions.

Gary

As always on here, some excellent answers and advice.

The two Concord books are now on my Amazon wishlist, Allied-Axis #23 has just been ordered.

I rather figured that the 50 cal went with the 76 mm main gun, never mind, I have an E8 that can have a 50 cal retrofitted to it.

Superb link to the Patton Museum refurbishment of Cobra King. Some days I really do think I'm in the wrong job...

Andy

Off the top of my head, I recall someone saying that only the 4AD mounted the .50 coax to their Jumbos. Can someone confirm this?

Roy Chow
AMPS 1st Vice President
http://www.amps-armor.org

it is possible the .50cal coax idea may have been short-lived. USMC units in the PTO also experimented with a .50cal coax, but dropped it pretty quickly. The main drawback (according to the experimenters) was the stunning noise level inside the turret; this from tanks crews who welded extra 75mm racks inside, and often fired up to eight or more supplemented loads of 75mm per day in infantry support. The long .50cal barrel was also very hard to change, and the weapon was notoriously cranky about the headspacing, making it a less than ideal weapon as a coax.

Headspace is a pain, but so is that timing wheel. Rumor has it there is a new .50 coming thet eleminates this headache.

No pun intended. FN has made a M2 for about 20 years that you didn't have to set head space and timing on. The rest of the world has been using it for years.

Hello Andy

I have just got all the parts at home to Update a Tamiya M4A3E2 Jumbo to Cobra King
(4th Armored/ 37th Tank Batallion )
The first tank to enter Bastogne to relief the 101th




I got the
Tankworkshop turret & transmission cover
Formation wheel set
Tasca .50
Formation trackguides
Lionmarc Bolts (missing on the Tamiya bogies)
AFV T-48 tracks (with enough duckbills ...._)
Bison Cobra King decals
Royal model U.S tank crew

and oh...The Tamiya Kit

as you can see on this picture it's a 75 mm gun with .50 on the turret.
I got a lot more pictures and reference
I can Email some tp you if you want

greetz Ronald
ps pls post some photographs of your project

sorry
I didn't see you were talking about a coax .50

Cobra King is currently undergoing restoration.

http://www.armorfortheages.com/Volunteers/Projects/CobraKingProject/CobraKingProjectPage.htm

Thank you all for the overnight flurry of information and discussion.

A quick recap on what's been mentioned so far:

50 cal coax only with 76 mm main gun. Makes sense really as the fitting of the former would be easier whilst the latter is being fitted.

Sommerfield matting and black overspray in same timeframe as armament upgrade?

So if I want to depict a 75 mm armed Jumbo then it would be 30 cal coax with a 50 cal on TC's position?

Prior to the armament upgrade all vehicles in OD only without Sommerfield matting, how about after the upgrade timeframe? There must have been at least 100 Jumbos still with 75 mm main guns, would these have been seen in armoured division battalions or only in the independent battalions?

Apologies for the extra questions, but learning about Shermans seems to be quite infectious.

Andy

p.s. Allied-Axis #23 arrived today after only ordering it yesterday. Always knew Historex were good, but this is exceptional service.

N/T