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Egyptian M4A4/FL10 engine deck question

September 3 2001 at 10:29 AM
  (no login)
from IP address 206.186.189.71

I hope someone can help me out on this one. I'm currently building this vehicle and one source that I'm using for reference says that the Egyptians modified the engine decks of all their M4A4s to M4A2s when they changed the multibank power plants to the M4A2 power plant. Another source does not mention the change of engine decks. What source is correct?

 
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AuthorReply

(no login)
62.27.194.164

A2 engine

September 3 2001, 2:59 PM 

Sampling material for the same project in the (behind the horizon) future shows me that the A2 engines including of the A2 engine deck are used.
Perhaps someone out there can remember the URL of this kind of Sherman in a Egypt museum and/or in the Sinai.
Anyway I can send you the pics if wanted.

frank

 
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not Frank Lobitz
(no login)
62.27.194.58

...included the A2 enginedeck... (of course)

September 3 2001, 5:35 PM 

In memory of my English-teacher, sorry

 
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(no login)
24.79.95.81

All available photos show M4A4.

September 3 2001, 4:20 PM 

Hi Peter

I also plan to do this vehicle in the future.

So far, I 've only seen photos of 3 surviving specimens: at Latrun, Israel from the Verlinden War Machines booklet, Micheal Green's Sherman book and Tom Gannon's recent book, the Egyptian display at "The Citadel" in Cairo, Egypt printed in AFV News Vol 34 #3 front cover and Keith Ross's Sinai wreck posted on his photopoint account and in AFV News Vol.32 #3

The Latrun vehicle and the Cairo vehicle both appear to be M4A4 from the length of the hulls and the spacing of the wheels. Profile shots shows the length of the hull to good effect. The Sinai tank wreck in Keith Ross's photos have the engine deck blown away and the hull is partly submerged in sand. But Steve Osfield in AFV News Vol.33 #2 thinks it is a M4A4. He writes, "This is apparent in the shape of the co-driver's hatch hood and the arrangement of plates and splash ring at the engine deck turret ring plate interface".

George Bradford has scale plans of FL10/M4 (Set # EG1) which also shows a M4A4 hull with the M4A2 diesel engine deck.
Please note that the original lower hull plate of the M4A4 was kept (shown on George's plans and in Tom Gannon's book). There is a spacer plate added between the M4A2 diesel deck and the end of the rear hull vertical plate as indicated on George's plans. The spacer plate is needed since the M4A4 hull is longer than the M4A2 hulls.

I've never seen a photo of the FL10 Sherman on short hull, except for the French prototype on the M4A1 hull (with radial engine), which is shorter in length than the M4A4. This photo appears in Tom's book.

I hope this helps. This is a pretty cool looking hybrid tank, eh?








 
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(no login)
206.186.189.153

Thanks guys

September 3 2001, 10:36 PM 

Thanks for the info you saved another project from being shelved. Your right Tony it is a cool looking conversion and pretty straight forward to-except now I have to figure out how to scratch a M4A2 engine deck, oh well.....

 
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(Login sharkmouth)
Missing-Lynx members
12.88.172.176

more info

September 3 2001, 10:52 PM 

Hi,
The M4A4 had many changes done to its hull other than a drop fit of the engines. The lower rear plate had the upper half of the doors cut away and filled to support the exhaust, the radiators mounted within had a welded spacer added which precluded the bolts normally seen going through the upper rear plate of the 'A2. Instead, they bolt to the spacer (which is welded to the upper rear hull plate). The bottom of the hull was modified to provide access to the twin engines as well as having new drain holes where they were now needed.
From above, you can NOT see the engines through the grills. There are sheet metal ducts that force air towards the air cleaners which ARE visible. I had thought of adding the Verlinden M10 update engines insert as well as using the tranny, etc.
The grills are not difficult to make since they are metal rods welded to a frame. Stretched sprue and sheet styrene to the rescue! Do not forget to add 'welded' letters to the filler caps for 'D' Diesel, 'W' Water, and 'H' Homelite(?) the auxiliary engine.
Hope this helps,
Saul Garcia

 
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(Login sharkmouth)
Missing-Lynx members
12.88.172.176

more info

September 3 2001, 10:55 PM 

Hi,
The M4A4 had many changes done to its hull other than a drop fit of the engines. The lower rear plate had the upper half of the doors cut away and filled to support the exhaust, the radiators mounted within had a welded spacer added which precluded the bolts normally seen going through the upper rear plate of the 'A2. Instead, they bolt to the spacer (which is welded to the upper rear hull plate). The bottom of the hull was modified to provide access to the twin engines as well as having new drain holes where they were now needed.
From above, you can NOT see the engines through the grills. There are sheet metal ducts that force air towards the air cleaners which ARE visible. I had thought of adding the Verlinden M10 update engines insert as well as using the tranny, etc.
The grills are not difficult to make since they are metal rods welded to a frame. Stretched sprue and sheet styrene to the rescue! Do not forget to add 'welded' letters to the filler caps for 'D' Diesel, 'W' Water, and 'H' Homelite(?) the auxiliary engine.
Hope this helps,
Saul Garcia

 
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(no login)
195.92.67.70

gyppo shermans

September 4 2001, 1:23 PM 

I visited the museums is egypt last year where there are 2 m4a4 FL10, Ive also seen the one in israel as well, they all have the m4a2 deck, thats not all, every sherman I saw in egypt had the deck (thats m4a4, and m4a2)so it looks like they reengined every vehicle

MJH

 
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tommyvicard
(no login)
194.2.27.9

Untitled

September 5 2001, 6:11 AM 

be careful with the french M4A1 prototype in Saumur ; it was specially mounted for tourist

 
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(no login)
209.4.41.72

Yes , to ALL Egyption Shermans that were not M4-A2s .

September 7 2001, 11:39 PM 

This was done to all Shermans that were not Diesel powered, and includes the M32-B1s used by them .

 
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