Russian / FSU women are programmed quite differently because they come from a culture of survival. It's not uncommon for the most "respectable" of women to have provided sexual favours at some time or another. If you've seen the poorer towns in Russia, you might say it's nearly excusable. After all, their bodies are often their most valuable of possessions.

Many Russian women come with credentials such as degrees and doctorates. Yet it's well known in Russia that an attractive woman rarely has to be studious. She only needs to "please" her professors. If that seems ridiculous, I'm sorry, but it's absolutely true. I have been to Russia numerous times in search of my own holy grail, so I've come to understand this. Ask Russian or Ukrainian expatriates in North America. They'll tell you it's true.

When a Russian woman says she has travelled, she's probably already well acquainted with the colour of easy money. Often these women travel to outlying countries where visas are not a problem and they can earn money "dancing" in what must seem like a fairly exciting life. If a woman has done this, she probably won't tell you about it at first, so when it arises sooner or later, it says something fairly important. Also many porn models are Russians. I know a man in California who discovered his fiancee on a porn site in a compromising position with three men. (I don't know about you, but I don't want a woman who's tasted a thousand penises.) For corroboration on these topics, there are many studies, but for starters, try http://www.uri.edu/artsci/wms/hughes/natasha.htm.

Often middle-aged or older Western men look to foreign countries after unhappy experiences with Western women. Stupidly many pursue young Russian women because they believe that they're underprivileged and will settle for something less than a shining prince or that a Russian woman will be both beautiful and subservient. But if a woman knows she'll never love such a man, doesn't she have an obligation to tell him he should save his money? Of course she does. To lead him on is clearly scamming.

In my opinion, any Russian woman who verbally invites the expenditure of money on her in any way is probably a scammer to some degree. Caveat emptor does apply, but love is blind. I have to sympathize with most guys who claim to have been scammed. It happened to me in the most insidious way. The question is whether it's fair to post an alleged scammer's photos and brand her accordingly. I completely support it if convincing facts have been provided. It might also be proper to state that "the information is here for your consideration, but it's not proof of the claim", as some scam sites do.

Gus

all you can do is to check them out thoroughly - get current pictures of them - get their home and work address and phone numbers - get some one who can seak the lingo to be there if you ring or even get them to ring if they have no or little english.find out all you can about them and their sincerity etc.

If you feel a lot for the women and have chosen her as the one and they feel a lot for you and they say your the only one for them etc etc there is one other test that is to e_mail them under another name using say hot mail or yahoo as it doesn't disclose the country origin - say you wrote to them before or have just seen the profile or whatever ( as you have their e_mail address)and say you liked their profile and enquire if they have met someone or would like to correspond with you or something this to this affect.

If what they were telling you under your real e_mail address is true they will tell you yes they are corresponding with some one and this is the person they would like to be serious with etc - of course if they write back and say no they haven't met anyone blah blah - then you will no

it mind sound a bad way to do it but you need to be sure - i suggested to a friend who was over the moon about his ukranian woman to do this they felt bad about doing it but you need to be sure.- he corresponded for a few weeks under the phantom name and fortunately or unfortunately found out the hard way but without costing his financially.

You don't know how many men they are corresponding with but when it becomes serious and it's your the only one for me and you feel the same way then you need to find this out.

I not saying all are like this but some are whether they asking you for money or not.

It is not fool proof but it may save you from being the fool.

MY TAKE IS ANY AGENCY THAT FAILS TO REMOVE A WOMEN FROM A WEB SITE WHEN A MAN COMPLAINS OF BEING SCAMMED THE AGENCY IS JUST IS SUSPECT AS THE WOMEN. A GOOD WEBSITE KNOWS THAT HIS CUSTOMERS ARE THE MEN BUYING THE PRODUCT . IF WORD GETS OUT THAT THAT AGENCY FAILS TO REMOVE THE SCAMMER FROM THIER SITE I WOULD NO LONGER DO BUSINESS WITH THEM PERIOD.BECAUSE THE WEB SITE IS SENDING THE MESSAGE OUT TO THE SCAMMERS IT IS ALRIGHT TO SCAMM MEN WE DONT CARE WHAT YOU DO ONCE YOU BOUGHT THE SCAMMER ADDRESS

Mark,

I agree with you in part as I say on Scam Alert (Warning Signs).

One thing I will say though is that as my essay "Sour Grapes" points out, there is the possibility (danger) that a "report" to an agency or anti-scam website could be generated by a person who just feels personally jilted or rejected. In such a case, would it be fair to the girl to demand that the agency remove her from their clientele? I think not.

To the extent that such things can be firmly established and a "known" or "confirmed" scammer is listed, I agree again that it should be a huge Warning Sign in dealing with an agency that continues to keep her as a client or advertise her profile.

But these things require balance and fairness and we want to keep an open mind and not make hard and fast rules about these things. That's my opinion anyway.

My take on this is the most agenicies if they really value men as as their prime number one customer removing one or two women as scammers from their site would do much to increase business to their site.
IF THE WEB SITE REFUSES TO REMOVE THE WOMAN THEN THE THE WEB SITE IS ENCOURAGING THE SCAMMING OF MEN .
THE WEB SITES ARE CONDONING IT ! THERE IS NO IN BETWEEN ON THIS ISSUE. IT VERY PLAIN AND SIMPLE !

Sorry Gus, but your post reeks of inexperience, and a lack of cultural knowledge. Most men will sink to their own level, or even lower when in the FSU. I have many friends (including myself) who have successfully met and married wonderful, beautiful, modest, traditionl women from the FSU. Your implications are also true of many parts of the USA, and most other countries. The key is to know what your looking for, work hard, and don't bite the hook until you find her. If you are not a competent, successful, intelligent guy, this process will be too much for you. There are of course plenty of scammers, but they are easily avoided if you don't let your emotions control your actions. Wait until you have met the right woman, and are sure of her integrity. Believe me guys, there are more women of virtue in the FSU than you will find in the USA. If you want more references, check out one of the Russian women's lists.

Kretin, tupiza, skotina, Yanki go home, holy sheet, Scheisse, Arschloch und Arschificker, Kurwa, w zhopu jebannyj!

**** you!

Eto zhe tupyje skoty..

Gus, you are miseralbe, if you think this of Russian women, why are you going to marry them? Because your wemen are degenerates? Ob because you are a degenerate? May be you should marry a man? Had your professor ****ed you? May be you are so nice and can attract men?

Gus to Siberia!

the person who has just impersonated me when you heard a knock at the door it won't be avon calling - you better purchase some winter clothes if you do not have some already.

Long live the soviet.

p.s how come my statues have been taken down and what has kruschev been saying about me??

It is the risk one takes in any relationship with any women no matter what country they come from. The only difference is at least if the women is near where you live you know what she is upto - with the women from overseas you have no idea how many men they correspond with , how many men have visited them etc etc as you could be in a long list of men that these women realitisically con with affection and undying love.

a mate of mine found out the hard way after visiting a woman he had been corresponding with for a 2 years by e_mail and phone.He decided to suprise her by staying longer than he had told her as he considered he had found his partner and she indicated the same and the proposal of marriage was definately on the cards as he loved her and she told him she loved him and wanted to be with him etc etc. much to his suprise there she was with another overseas male walking hand in hand into the hotel the very next day.

the ones that scam for money are bad enough but the above ones to me are worse

Blind naivete is an endearing quality don't you think? Dishonest women think so, they love to correspond with people who think with their second head and have a fat wallet.

It would be interesting to know what the dollar flow into Russia is annually from Western Europe (thats the little bit attached to Russia for people from America) and the USA, I bet its huge! Certainly something those nice men in black mercedes would be interested in and certainly the government wouldn't be too interested in stopping.

So, the question is "does she love me and only me or is there a string of correspondants contributing to that dent in the mattress?" .... Easy, how many free e-mail services are around and how many pictures of nice looking young men are there floating around the internet? .... OK I'll spell it out.

Create an account of couldbeanyone@free.email.com and start corresponding with her under a different name and a different set of photos. Do it two or three times in different styles. Be a romeo, a rich whiz-kid and a total slob. If she just falls for your Richard Gere alter-ego, it may be she's just fussy and thinks her luck is in. However, if she falls for your Homer Simpson alter-ego too, well, need I say more?

Ho-hum, seems like you've got to be a bit of a bastard to keep your wallet intact in this melee.

BOAB

yep i use what you say Boab but of course this is not fool proof either as i feel some might be wised up to this tactic as many are using it seemingly - i have said to some i have no money, no house etc and even said that i would migrate to russia/ukraine etc to be with them - some have stopped emailing me - others have sent me information on immigrating to the ukraine and others have said they don;t care if i have money or not as they are not corresponding with me for monetary purposes.

Whether they believe me or not is something i don;t know

of course i never tell them about my financial status.

I suppose you cannot blame them for broadening their opportunities as from what the women tell me anywhere and any other circumstances are better than the ones they currently face in eastern europe.

best bet is to tke your time and meet as many as possible and then decide.

You are right, to some extent you can understand people wishing to improve their situation when it is as dire as it is in Russian/Ukranian cities.

To put it in perspective, St. Petersburg for example is HUGE!!. Some of the "so called" sleeping districts are so grim it defies belief. Prosvesgenia Prospekt is MILES long and it is a concrete strip with high-rise block stretching as far as the eye can see in every direction. In Britain the whole district which is about as big as Milton Keynes would be condemned as slums. Any one of us might be slightly dissatisfied with our 3-bed semi/condo with small garden/yard on the cosy outskirts of sleepyville, but it will never match the hard life they lead.

SO!!! All the more reason to be careful. I have been lucky, having been involved in this for some time, I started out completely naive and luckily don't bear any deep scares, just one or two scratches. There was a particular person I met in Saint Petersburg two years ago who was nice, genuine and honest. We were together for a year, she came to England, never made outrageous requests and she had a crap job, small child and small but permanent scar from one of the many violent episodes from her alcoholic ex-husband. After a period of unemployment, she shocked me by admitting that during that period she had used her agency advert to extort money from some western men using the visa scam. I was stunned because if she was capable of it then anyone could be. Remember that at that time, I was with her, he "boyfriend", I would have given her anything if she had asked but she didn't.

However, remember that whether the woman you're corresponding with is honest or not, it is STILL going to cost, this is not a pastime for the poor. As a general comment to anyone who may read this, don't do it unless you can afford it, its costly!