this string is being started to get some discussion on the Minor Hockey AAA program or lack of a program at all. This minor hockey program is being run by an old timer B McK (former baseball ) , who has no idea of what is going on at the triple AAA level. You have but two teams , one in minor bantam and one in minor atom that are above 500. these two teams records are misleading with the minor Atom team having one line that does everything, the minor bantams have overachieved because of their trip pendsing trip to Japan , that has now fizzled.

My main message here is that the coaching in KMHA is horrible, run by people that have no experience playing the game , but for a couple of people, they coach out of a manual driven by the old timers who run the organization. they have no idea of their competition they are playiong against, they don't allow any parent of kids to coach even if they have played pro.

This once proud organization who had but one lowsy kid drafted in the 5th round last year is being run into the ground led by a bunch of coaches who are afraid of sitting kids down , having a pp unit and a pk unit on teams for fear johhnny's mommy or daddy might complain!

Who agrees with me???

Those are strong statistics in favour of your argument.
I hope your case brings out the silent majority. They are probably thinking the same.
Good luck!

On the positive note your flag ship team is doing well in the OHL

I have alot more statistics to prove my case . the coaches of the Kitchener rangers- PB & SS , know all about the problems that exist in KMHA., they are not happy about it at all , in fact they are trying to do something about the fact that only one kid got drafted last year, and it has started with them spearheading a spring Hockey program this year under the K-W Rangers Banner. Here's one for you , you've heard about the coaching mentorship propgram that Hockey Canada has initiated and many organizations have adopted. Well the Kitchener Minor Hockey program does not have a mentoring program in place, in fact , Kitchener Rangers assistant S.S. is listed in Waterloo Minor Hockey directory as their Mentoring coach. I rest my case with where KMHA is headed.

You should check your facts before you shoot off your mouth!!! There is a mentorship program at the AAA level this season started by SS and the Alliance. I am part of it. Go figure, your wrong.

You should check your facts before you shoot off your mouth!!! There is a mentorship program at the AAA level this season started by SS and the Alliance. I am part of it. Go figure, your wrong.

Ran into your youngest aforementioned team in a tournament last year....an "A" tournament at that.
Kids and parents were a bunch of "showboats" and deserve what you mention of!
Post elsewhere for sympathy!

Scott, why don't you run for President ?

If there spearheading a spring hockey program to improve hockey in Kitchener why are they using players from Waterloo, Brantford and Cambridge? How does that help Kitchener? It's all BS.

it is a campaign to help THEIR kids. why the **** should they help yours?

get off your fat ass and do it yourself.

"I have alot more statistics to prove my case . the coaches of the Kitchener rangers- PB & SS , know all about the problems that exist in KMHA., they are not happy about it at all , in fact they are trying to do something about the fact that only one kid got drafted last year, and it has started with them spearheading a spring Hockey program this year under the K-W Rangers Banner"

I have to agree with the 10:20 poster. Then lets not pretend you are doing it to bolster Kitchener hockey when you aren't using Kitchener kids.

The issue is to many AAA teams for the area to support! Look at Guelph Waterloo etc

guys join the fun

Kitchener has a sufficient population to support AAA from Novice to Midget.
20 years ago they had one of the best minor hockey systems around and were classified as one of the stronger hockey development centres.

I suggest you run for President of the KMHA.

It is odd that a once proud org., with arguably the best jerseys in the province, is incapable of fielding competetive teams. Something sure is going wrong down there. A combined KIT/Wat team would be excellent.

Do what ever London's doing. Most of their AAA and AA teams are doing well.

Kitchener alone, without Waterloo or Cambridge, should be capable of fielding a strong team perhaps only overshadowed by London based on population. This is obviously not the case. Non-parent coaches? Could be a problem. They won't have the same passion as a parent coach. I don't care what you say about the misguided ones that crop up every once in a while.

The current program for Atom AAA doesnt even have a full roster of Kitchener kids. They've got a Cammbridge cut, who, by the way, is pretty good and has to try out for Cambridge first next year. Their coaching staff is promoting goon play, more interested in big hits and dirty play behind the scene than they are about winning. Dirtiest bunch in the Alliance. I guess if you can't beat them you might as well hurt them. Excellent attitude!?!

they are running a spring program to help improve the best players who are not getting the development they should be. If there are good players from other centres that want to join, than that's what they want. Good/great programs support good/great talent with their equal good / great talent, not weaker talent.

the problem with the winter program, weak coaching supoorted with a weak kids and parents not willing to develop their kids to get up to the upper half of the team.

i agree with all of this. how are we to give our children a chance to make the NHL with the current weak system in place?

GOOD !!!!

How arrogant of you! To give the best kids a chance. If that were true than you son wouldn't be playing Scott.

Scott.harrison@sympatico.ca Harrison <Scott.harrison@sympatico.ca>

they are running a spring program to help improve the best players who are not getting the development they should be. If there are good players from other centres that want to join, than that's what they want. Good/great programs support good/great talent with their equal good / great talent, not weaker talent.

the problem with the winter program, weak coaching supoorted with a weak kids and parents not willing to develop their kids to get up to the upper half of the team.

Nice posting by SH (Kitchener 98 dad). That is arrogant, all you lower players in Kitchener should bow to his players greatness.

They are running a spring program to WIN. That is why there are kids from other centers outside of Kitchener/Waterloo. Any development talk is total BS. Spring hockey is taking the best and competing against the best to win - how do you develop in 9 - 10 weeks.

Just to ask a guestion about the organization . Does Kitchener take F1s. My son will be looking for a place to play next season and can/t seem to crack his own AAA zone team. How about Waterloo? thanks

Waterloo does not take F1's. I believe Kitchener allows 2 per team.

So how is Kitchener Minor Hockey any different than any other Minor Hockey Association. The people running them are in it for their kid(s), and their kid(s)only. Not to better the entire organization or the other kids playing. Alwyas has been and always will be that way. But if you have a problem get your release and go somewhere else like Cambridge, Brantford, Waterloo or Guelph. And make no mistake, Spring Hockey and all the hoopla BS around it is exactly the same BUT a few select individuals are making some $ not just the organization.

What makes Kitchener unique is parents like SH.

This is why regional gold didn't want this kid any more. 1. He didn't do squat and 2. dad is a wack job.

Get out of the Alliance and join the Omha
You will get more kids out and wont be splitting with cam, water,
Most parents would rather play in the OMHA

Should we go to the ETA or start out with the weaker SCTA loop?

I would say SCTA loop would be more your speed

I say we cancel the AAA program all together.

What is the point in running it, if it is just a waste of time for elite players, and any development happens on spring teams?

If the intent is only to develop the top players into NHL players, why bother wasting the time of the loser players with a bunch of false hope?

We don't want elite kids to be dragged down by those "bench warmers" and "house-league boys".

By the time boys are 7 or so, everyone knows who the best players are.

Forget public tryouts, just put them on a private team, where you don't have to answer to any whiners about why they are on the team.

It's better than doing the same thing within an Alliance team, and constantly having to defend it.

This is how life works. You're either born into it, or you're not getting it. It's never too early to learn your place in this world.

If the spring teams are just for the top players, why is it that the rumour mill says that one of the spring teams was forced to take a certain kid, and put him in a certain position, even though the coach didn't think he met the talent standard for that team?

Best players, or best connected players?

Best connected players of course

These teams in my estimation are a waste of time and money
They do not produce superior players over a short time. Only play with their own team will do that, over a season with patient, rather than panic coaching,that will develop much better players over the long run.
What has happend to pride in playing for your own centre?
If you knew the true statistics for players moving on to Junior or Pro, you may not be so eager to support pie in the sky, make money schemes, such as spring hockey.

These kids are people not little robots!

A note to coaches, lay out your program for the year, and don't tinker with it unless it is your decision to make changes. Remember too many cooks spoil the broth!

Some are best players, but I know several that are there by "connections only" they are good but not elite!

With all this hoopla about spring teams being so superior to regular "winter" teams at the AAA level, why have winter teams at all, lets just go for nine weeks in the spring/summer and forget all the rest.
Think of the benefits, no driving out of town in snowy weather,all those pesky tournaments, and their costs could be avoided. Come home to the pool for a swim, go shopping in your shorts. Arenas would only have to hire staff for ten weeks a year at big savings to the taxpayer.
Wow! Lets hear it for spring teams only.
Oh, by the way, those kids playing on the spring teams, is it my imagination, or do they look suspiciously like the old winter team kids?

Wouldn't you have to gets votes to become President? Easier to sit back be a mouth piece.

.

If the writer of this silliness is attempting to convince me that he is correct, first he will have to convince me he did a better job when HE was coaching them in M/D. It is easy to criticize from the stands, not so easy to make it happen.Having one line considered as the whole team is foolish to start with, as there will be times when the lesser lights will step up and save the day when the big line falters,as I have witnessed with the AAA minor atom team before.Having coached hockey for many years myself, with a long string of successes, I can tell you unequivocably that no one, absolutely no one, that I know can state with any certainty which player is going to move on at the age of nine! Talent will come through no matter what, just ask Orr or Gretzky.

11;49 please elaborate

Guess not. Grow some balls or keep your BS to yourself.

If this upsets you so much, you must think it's about you. Grow up, the same things happen in spring hockey as any other team. There are always boys and girls who deserve a spot, but lose it when someone else was given a spot because of some deal made by their parents.

I am a parent at another age level in KMHA. I think too much parental involvement is not good for the development of the entire team. Father's try and make a fair scenerio, but time and time again, they don't realize how long little Johnny's been on the ice over other players.

Do I think KMHA has isues? YES! It's who you know that can get your son on the team.

When my son's asked to play in other centres for AAA but can't get looked at in Kitchener, yeah I think they have problems ---- Too much politics and who you know!

If you don't develop your son over the summer and through elite spring hockey, don't expect great coaching in KMHA to help pull your son through.

I can't remember the last time coaches made these teams cycle a puck before shooting. Why are GTHL teams so good? Because their players have been coached to use each other. They skate circles around KMHA AAA players in tournaments.

But don't say anything, the mere thought makes parents worried that their son would be cut or looked at differently by coaches. We are entirely at their mercy. Convenor's - please, there all friends.

GTHL teams are so good because they recruit kids from the province. KMHA has to draw from a population of 100,000 or so and only 2 imports. GTHL from well over 1000000 plus 5 imports.

You are right about the draw of kids. I guess my main point is coaching. Who tells these kids to use each other to win. The philosophy that a few kids are the means to win over the team should be dismised. It's certainly not teaching those players who have good talent how to play when they move on to other levels.

The problem is that too many of the coaching experts who are posting here think that they are NHL GM's. They want to run the team, but think that coaching 8 year olds is about recruiting and playing the big line constantly.

You are not smart enough to run an NHL team. If you were, you wouldn't be coaching Novice.

If you don't want to TEACH all of the kids at the lower ages, don't call yourself a coach.

When was the last time the MTHL/GTHL produced more than at best a couple of prospects for Major Junior "A".
Considering their record versus their talent pool, their percentage record is attrocious, so you can stop waving that flag right now. And be careful if you wish to answer this posting as I do know of which I speak.

Can a moderator just put this whole stupid thread out of its misery? It seems to violate a lot of the rules of this forum.

>

?

"And be careful if you wish to answer this posting as I do know of which I speak."

12:58, you sound like a frikkin retard

10;32 Feb. 5

You need to learn to read

it's not all about the recruitment, it's All about the coaching and coaches who see the game , who don't spectate during the game , who teach , & correct during the game , who run practices with high tempo, no sitting on your asses practices, who run tactical drills to counteract their opponents abiltities, and not just little old Johhny skating down the ice with his head down and never making a pass during practice but who makes plays during practice so he will be part of a team who works together very well from line 1 to line 3.

Not hard to do if the coach knows how to get kids to buy into a system of plays & strategies combined with skill mixed in.

What team are you talking about?

Playing Kitchener year in year out as a kid, they used to have a fantasic program and hand our a$$e$ to us. The Greenshirts had probably the best Midget program in the province, bar none. Every year, from Novice to Midget, they had teams that could compete with any team at the AAA level. I can't comment on the other levels, but I heard they were equally as strong. How can a city, that has only gotten bigger over the years, have such a fall from grace? I have a hard time believing it is one person that has caused this. It does seem as though development has fallen by the wayside. Is there a correlation between joining the Alliance and this downhill trend? I know nothing about the Alliance or their mandates, so I am not taking a shot at it. There's gotta be a reason other than one old school guy (or whatevewr the term was) running it into the ground. IMPOSSIBLE!

The only reason, as far as I can see for the fall from grace, is too much parent interference with the teams and team selection. Too many people who think that they know at 9 and 10 years of age who is best.
I have had an opportunity to see both the minor and major Atom teams play, and niether team can be described as a one line team.
Also as I understand from parents, trainers, and hockey
school operators, the undisputed fastest, and most skilled, player on the minor Atom team plays on the third line so how can it be a one line team?
Everyone should settle down and enjoy the game instead of deciding they know better, and trying to get converts to their way of thinking.

Bobby044orr.

If you are who the people earlier think you are, you need to SHUT UP.

Get it straight. KMHA does not exist solely for your purposes.

You have angered a lot of people that you will need in the future.

Your boy is talented.

But, if you don't control your behaviour very soon, no coach in his right mind will touch your kid, and no parent in their right mind would let their kid play on a team coached by a guy with too little sense to get rid of you.

Your kid has already lost his spot on RG.

You kid can't show his talent, if he's not playing.

Think.

Hello

I dont live in the Kitchener area but this thread caught my eye .I got to tell whom ever is in control of this all,please leave the kid out of it.Unless the child is doing something to blatantly disrupt his team members he should be kept out of the mix.If the dad is a problem with your association It is not right to come on here and air your laundry with threats to ban a child.This happens way too much in minor hockey and this is how you get a bad reputation.Deal with the parent in an assertive manner and dont pay attention to anonymous notes or letters.This stuff has no substance without a name .This site is for fun and some pretty sour people get involved.It is not professional to even pay attention to this.Just an observation and a suggestion.

Regriff is this you?

12:10 I don't think anyone is threatening anyone. They are just reminding someone that in hockey kids often pay for the actions of their parents. Just ask those parents who crossed Bobby44orr in the past.

Although I don't like the way he singled out one kid as an example (hopefully this won't make that kid a target), I think 10:33 is right about both the minor and major Atom Kitchener AAA teams. Both teams have enough talent to have 3 lines that are capable of playing equal to or better than the majority of AAA lines that they would face. Even if the training is not perfect, the boys WANT to cooperated, and ARE smart, talented and creative enough to make it work.

As an outsider to your organization and reading the different messages, one thought came to mind.

How many people that have entered messages on this post have or will volunteer their time on the board or to help out one of these teams that they feel are being so poorly run.

Do you think the organization is run by an old time hockey guy because mass numbers of people want to step into his shoes, I think not.

Stop complaining and get involved, its only hockey and it supposed to be fun. If you are this upset I am sure you are sending the wrong messages to your kids

well said

I don't think the problem is with who is running the show. The problem is that people who are not think that they will personally benefit by meddling. I don't think you want people like that on the inside.

Everyone knows who started this post. Good kid, idiot dad. Not just thought about that way in Kitchener but whereever he goes.

I thank the writer 10:42 for his calm and accurate assessment of the situation.

As a former coach, then convenor, then Director of minor hockey covering many years, I can tell you it is not often that the efforts put in by all concerned are appreciated, or even acknowleged.

I think you are correct in assuming that many people would not take on these tasks, without complaining about the time and effort required to do the job.

Please remember that this is often a thankless, although often harrassed position to be in.

My hat is off to all those who give their time, without pay I might add, unselfishly, so that the hockey programs,
all over the province can even exist.

I agree that the volunteers of this sport don't nearly get the praise they should, however I think differently when it comes to parental involvement. In most cases these parents wouldn't contribute their time unless their child was on the team. And sometimes parent coaches go too far without realizing how their actions affect others.

On another note, my experience in AAA hockey (as a parent observing) is that other parents and kids can be cruel to others. Parents instructing kids behind the scenes to not pass to certain kids, kids bullying other kids, etc, etc....KMHA coaches tend to ride the fence on this stuff, which doesn't help these kids succeed as a team to their full potential. There should be a hands off policy (if there isn't already) for inappropriate behaviour (verbal and physical) and fully enforced by coaches. I've seen several instances where no action was taken (not even the player being benched in a game for a shift) The old school mentality that that's the way it is in hockey needs to change. Oh yeah, I've heard that from coaches too! That sure doesn't support KMHA's policy in regards to respecting others.

Simple question then. Would KMHA be better if they ran it the way that the guy who started this post would run a team?