This is posted in the CYO thread but seems to deserve its own thread so people notice it. Very severe sanctions, play 10 games for an outlaw league and a kid can't play in HC the following season!

http://members.hockeycanada.ca/bulletins/public/bulletins.asp?ID=671

From: Allan Morris, Chair & Bob Nicholson, President



SUBJECT: OUTLAW LEAGUES – LEAGUES OPERATING
OUTSIDE THE AUSPICES OF HOCKEY CANADA



Hockey Canada, its member Branches, Major Junior and registered Junior Hockey Leagues in Canada are concerned with the proliferation of leagues that operate outside the auspices of Hockey Canada.

Hockey Canada offers the best development programs worldwide. It has invested significant resources in the development of officials, coaches, administrators and players countrywide. We have a committed strategy toward a cohesive long term athlete development model.

These “Outlaw” organizations do not support the development of these programs. Further, they operate in a vacuum, with no consideration to the impact of their programs on minor, junior, senior, adult recreational hockey, officiating development, coaching development or administrator development in Canada. These Outlaw leagues instead choose to utilize the resources already developed by Hockey Canada and its member Branches. The teams who make up these "leagues" operate in this fashion because they do not agree with the existing overall vision of Hockey Canada. They profess to have a better program yet often operate without a constitution, by-laws, create their own rule book and do not provide adequate insurance for their participants. Further, they offer the lure of "Rep" or "Junior" level competition when this is clearly not the case.

Hockey Canada, its member Branches, Major Junior Leagues as well as registered Junior Hockey Leagues wish to be exceedingly clear with our response to these programs.

Definition:

Hockey Canada and its member branches view all leagues that operate outside the auspices/sanctioning of Hockey Canada programs to be classified as “outlaw” leagues. For further clarity, this specifically refers to those leagues that operate programs in direct competition with those offered by Hockey Canada and its member branches. This currently does not include summer hockey leagues/teams, adult recreational hockey leagues/teams, high school hockey, and/or hockey schools.

Sanctions

1) Membership in Hockey Canada from those individuals that have participated (knowingly or otherwise) in "outlaw" programs will only be accepted based on the following schedule:
Outlaw League Participation Length of Period of Ineligibility for HC Programs

0-5 Exhibition Games/Games 3 months from last outlaw league participation

6-10 Exhibition Games/Games 6 months from last outlaw league participation

More than 10 Exhibition Games/Games 12 months from last outlaw league participation

If a participant makes the choice to participate in these programs, they must understand the ramifications of that choice and whether the league/team folds, whether released/suspended/fired the individual will only be eligible to register with legitimate teams under the Hockey Canada umbrella based on the schedule above.
2) Hockey Canada will NOT offer National or Regional Championships or any other Hockey Canada/Branch/CHL sanctioned events to those municipalities/arenas that support "outlaw" programs.
3) Finally, Hockey Canada and its member branches across the country will make every effort to ensure that those local minor hockey associations in areas where outlaw leagues exist are not supporting these leagues in any manner whatsoever. We will withhold tournament sanctions if need be to stress this point. To be clear Hockey Canada will not sanction any tournaments within Municipalities and facilities that support programs outside the auspices of Hockey Canada and its Branches.
This is aimed at those leagues that are operating in direct competition to established Hockey Canada, Branch and local minor hockey programs

What concerns me is this, "To be clear Hockey Canada will not sanction any tournaments within Municipalities and facilities that support programs outside the auspices of Hockey Canada and its Branches."

So these minor hockey associations, that are unlucky enough there is an outlaw league playing out of the same rink as they are, won't be permitted to host a tournament?

When you go directly to the Hockey Canada website there is no mention of this.

1:23, the link is to Bulletins on the Hockey Canada web site. Click English version doc on the link page, or go through portals from HC site till you land there.

I doubted it myself on the CYO thread-the word 'rep' seemed odd so I searched and found that bulletin.

HC must think cities won't risk the hotel dollars tournies bring in so will stop leasing ice to outlaw leagues. To me its the weak point of HC's plan. Not my field of expertise but the Comp act prohibts using a position of dominance in the marketplace to eliminate competition in such a manner.

You are obviously smarter than me cause I sure cant find it.

Never mind its actually on the hockey news website and they specifically mention that this is aimed at the CYO and the two Jr. Leagues.

hockeynews.wordpress.com

These sanctions are very tough.

Towns that rent ice to outlaw leagues/organisations

Oshawa
Markham
Richmond Hill
Gravenhurst
Tamworth
Innisfil


Just to name a few.

Wonder what the Barrie & Red Circle leagues think of their friends at the CYO now. It was the cyo's agressive behaviour, constantly critizing HC and the OMHA through its 'sanctioning body' (joke) that brought this on. Recruiting OMHA players & coaches-even attending Whitby and Oshawa rep tryouts.

Put stop payment on those CYO enrollment checks, last guys out won't get any money back.

So Hockey Canada once again hurts kids in the centers making money off the outlaw leagues because they do not get there share of the pie?
MONOPOLY

It's never been about kids. It's about control.

London has a Red Circle league. Should people start pulling out of their tournaments now?

Red Circle in London has been around for 50 years or more. That's the league Lindros played in as a tot.

Is Hockey Canada threatening the Municipalities of York and Durham (regional government) with sanctions?

That was my thought exactly. What exactly would Hockey Canada construe as support for an outlaw league? Renting that league ice at regular rates? Renting ice time at prime hours? Refusing to stone the outlaw players and team staff upon entry to any arena where the vaunted HC sanctioned teams play?

This seems a very strongly worded and heavy-handed tactic. Do they expect OMH and WMH to rescind any requests for ice time for the 08-09 season until such time as Legends, Iroquois, and other arenas refuse to sell ice time to CYO? What about the parents whose tax dollars also paid to build/maintain said arenas, who have chosen (for God knows what reasons)to have their child play CYO next year? Can you say "Class Action"?

Do they really think that it is the cream of the HC-trained crop who are leaving HC to play CYO or in other non-sanctioned leagues? Is the talent pool really becoming that diluted? Are they next going to refuse to sanction events in towns with more than one HL system, even if they are HC sanctioned (Oshawa)?

What ever happened to freedom of choice? Is this mighty org called "Hockey Canada" or is it "Hockey Cuba", "Hockey Darfur", " Hockey Chechnya"?!?! Although I understand that CYO exec and Org is rife with problems, with this memo, HC is sort of making CYO's point for them - that people should/can if they wish, have the right/freedom to choose where their child will play hockey, for whom/which coach, with whom, and how much they would be willing to pay for that opportunity, without being strong-armed into a team with no choices at all....

did you know? Markham Majors came from the Thornhill Islanders which was an "outlaw" team in the 80s. They competed against Thornhill Thunderbirds AAA OMHA.

This does seem heavy handed but we all knew something was coming. The CYO used any method to recruit players and coaches from the OMHA including outright lies about the HC clubs and their executives.

HC should clarify the sanctions-ice contracts are already signed so it must be next season that tournaments will not be sanctioned if ice is rented to outlaw leagues?

Kids too, they are already enrolled in the CYO. If this kills the league surely the players will be allowed in Durham OMHA next season? What is the CYO refund policy, it was probably built around a 5% refund projection-if the CYO now folds how many can possibly get their money back?

I put this in the CYO thread, but I guess it should have went here.

Interesting, that bulletin has been pulled from the site?
Is true or BS? If it's bs someone has really got a lot of time on their hands to present it as well as they did.

Wishful thinking-the memo is on the HC site:

http://members.hockeycanada.ca/bulletins/public/bulletins.asp?ID=674

Its moved from the original link here but that link has been valid since yesterday.

ok, my bad, Thanks!

HC should be pretty careful how far they push, as they may just push themselves right out the window.

they should look at the reasons these leagues are being formed, and address there own issues.

Have to be nuts to enroll in the CYO now. Anyone ask for their registration money back yet, wonder how that will go.

What reasons 3:05, to pretend your kid plays rep?

If it wasn't for ignorant comments, you'd have nothing to post! The poor CYO parents or kids who read these comments are truly undeserving of the trailer park comments and I hope none of them take your opinion seriously. Most parents are just trying to let their kids enjoy hockey. So what if they play CYO. What do you suggest next? Should h/c line up all the CYO parents and kids and brand them like nazi prison camp members or make them wear a letter on their clothes so the public can scorn them. You are a twit, plain and simple.

Feeling your world crumble ...

BN

Don't be so sensitive 4:23. We have all heard you guys rip the Whitby & OM executive/coaches and many players. Never had one hockey discussion with a CYO coach or parents when they did not attack someone in the OMHA personally. And that includes your nicer coaches.

But make one little joke about the CYO and you go off.

Rumour is CYO coaches will be decertified by HC next.

You on the HC Board? Back up your statements please.

You can add Whitby to the list of towns that rent ice to these so called outlaw leagues.
If the Donkeys fold where will Whitby get all there AAA players in the future.
Don't tell me they may have to develop them on their own. LOL

It's a shame that the cyo had to ruin it for the likes of the London Red Circle and the Barrie league.

The cyo had the chance to remain in the OHMA.The cyo types could not give up the idea that select hockey is the same as REP hockey. Its not there is big difference between the now defunct select hockey and rep hockey. If little johnny is not good enough he not good enough and no extra ice time is going fix that.

I like the part that says: "This currently does not include summer hockey leagues/teams, adult recreational hockey leagues/teams, high school hockey, and/or hockey schools."

So I guess HC is planning to make further moves for control ? That doesn't sound very good !!

I bet these "other" associations probably consider Hockey Canada to be an outlaw group. This sounds like a lot of posturing from a group with very little teeth.

All about the kids and development, yeah right... it's all about control.

Hockey Canada blew this big time! They sent the wrong message to Parents for all of the Canadian Provinces. They just told all of Canada they are only interested in $$$. Should be interesting how they bail themselves out?

How could it be legal to punish people for their activities which happen outside of Hockey Canada sanctioned events?

Your grasping at straws-desperation is setting in. The CYO was all about money, you'll realize that trying to get reg money back.

You can stay with CYO, HC is not forcing you to come back-its actualy harder to return.

Reality is starting to set in.

"How can it be legal"? It is, been done before.

Has it ever been challenged in court?

So we can laugh at you more! We can tell you are new to hockey, can barely spell it. You dont understand what you signed up for when you signed your 1st son up for a privately run league, you dont understand what you have done! You should find out about the people that are running your league, while its still around, this is exactly what they wanted! They have actually killed the CYO, hopefully BB doesnt understand what you guys have done too it. You listened to them (owner and operator and those useless executives) and believed everything, look what you got out of it. Give your $$ to GH and he fight this in court for years at your cost, he will make the headlines and be happy, his joke of a lawyer .. check him out and find out about history as well. There are still bills that the CYO has not even paid for from last year

Has GH's lawyer ever won a case is a better question.

Hope those wanting refunds can get their mpney back.

Clarington supports these guys with ice. GH sits as Zone Chair

they will be sanctioned ... way to go ! Is he worth it, no!

wonder when the chpa will make an udpate to their site ...

Come again-the CHPA leader is zone chair in Clarington???

That can't be true.

Its a different GH in Clarinton.

Wonder how many players the CYO lost today, by the weekend the exec will have dropped out of site as money runs out.

You seem to be making this a CYO bashing. I think we are all missing the real issue here. We are being told where, how & when OUR CHILDREN should participate in sports. What is next?

The CYO was a great organization for many, many years and was a great development league for kids who got to play in the NYHL. Unfortunately one fool decided to take the league in his own direction, running the league like a dictator and making up rules as he went along. The Parents begged for help by the governing bodies but to no avail. Instead, they stayed at arms length. By the time the guy was finally removed the damage was done, sanctioning was lost due to pressure over territory and the CYO was left to the mercy of the local associations, causing a battle over control. If the governing bodies had dealt with the problem the CYO would still be within H/C, the rules would be adhered to and the kids would still be enjoying a great league. It's too bad and it's not something that couldn't be fixed if egos weren't in the way and control wasn't such a big part of kids hockey.

All the CYO recruiting was based on bashing the local OMHA centres 6:44am. Deny that if you want but I heard it with my own ears, many times. Word gets around of that bashing-you think the CYO has friends or will get sympathy from the OMHA supporters now.

Your league was competition for players and ice time with the HC leagues. Suprised HC did not impose sanctions on coaches/players from the start.

well...

its put up or shut up time for OMH, and WMHA.

reading some of the threads on here, I feel the CYO players/parents are getting into a worse situation.

only time will tell

I couldn't care less about the CYO or other "outlaw"(as HC calls 'em, not me), leagues. They have a choice and have/are making their choices. I'm not saying I agree with it one way or the other, but these people do have options.

My concern is for the "municipalities or facilities" that have a GMHL team, and rent them ice. They(HC) are threatening to penalize minor hockey associations who have absolutely nothing to do with them by not sanctioning their tournaments. That, imo, is out of line and taking it too far.

Good post 7:35, the former CYO exec started the downward spiral and opened the door for CHPA to take over. Feel bad for the players and parents caught up in all these politics. Many are only guilty of wanting a little more local hockey than OMHA hl offers.

Poor timing on HC's part. Announce penalties for playing in CYO last Feb and parents could make an informed decision on enrolling. Now many are faced with the dificult decision of reneging on commitments to play. Possible financial hardship also, CYO can not possibly pay out all the registration refunds if a large number now leave.

CYO will claim to members that a court will strike down these sanctions. The die hard will believe them, most will realize HC will have better legal advice than CYO so will be acting within its rights on sanctions.

Its too late to try out for OMH rep, so run to the OCHL.
The NASC is a trainwreck, makes the CYO look like valhalla.

9:01 was kicked out of NASC, then kicked out of CYO so knocks both leagues. WMHA will be next target when they boot her.

And if 901's kid could make omha rep they would be there.

OCHL is a far better program than the NASC

If you go back and read the opening statement it says minor hockey org.that support outlaw teams.most arenas are run by the town or municipality,they are the ones that rent the ice to them the same as they rent to minor hockey org.the minor hockey org.can not be held responsible for who the town or municipality rents ice to,so unless your minor hockey org.is actually giving $ to the outlaw leagues I would think you would have nothing to worry about.Right or Wrong ?

The last sentence makes me think you are wrong: To be clear Hockey Canada will not sanction any tournaments within Municipalities and facilities that support programs outside the auspices of Hockey Canada and its Branches.

The way that reads, to me, is that if the town you are in, or the arena you play in, supports them, then your minor hockey association will be unable to host a tournament.

yes you are right but the omha should not punish an minor hockey org.just because the town is renting ice to outlaw leagues,they need to make money to or taxes are already high enough

Ya, not saying I agree with it at all. It sure isn't fair to organizations that have nothing at all to do with them.

I did not realize Hockey Canada owned the rights to the game of Hockey. It almost sounds like they are scared of these organizations, i guess the loss of revenues is starting to take effect. Nice strong arm tactics HC, instead of fixing issues why people leave we'll just force them back... How Communistic is that, Why don't we change the name to HC Red Army... my God what will they stop at. My son plays in the G and truthfully I could care less about where other Parents get their kids to play, it's their choice. What's next, if your kid plays indoor Soccer in the Winter instead of Hockey we are going to suspend them as well.... give it up....

That means Richmond hill can have no tournaments because they have a team in the GMHL. As well as Thornhill where the Toronto Moose play of the GMHL.

Moose play out a facilty owned by town of Markham. That would effect Islanders/Majors and the Waxers organisations. However Waxers host there tournament in Toronto(Ice Sports) not in Markham.

Not sanctioning tournaments in municipalities that rent to outlaw leagues is not possible. HC will have to back down on that point, even if they make it effective 09/10 season its not practical.

Just as effective would be for HC to, whenever possible favour municipalities and centres where outlaw leagues do not exist for tournaments. Whitby could lose its Silver Stick tournament to Ajax/Pickering for example. That will get city councillors attention, these tournies fill hotels/restaraunts.

When does all this take effect, that memo is vague.

I was just on their website (hockey canada) and I cant find this rule or anything.

On HC site, bulletins-actions:

http://members.hockeycanada.ca/bulletins/public/bulletins.asp?ID=674

Why now, CYO ran all last year out of HC. Let the kids enroll and then do this.

Looks like top Donkey has some work to do to get around this one. lol EEEEEEYYYYYOOOOOOOORRRRRR

Adults only on this site please. Grow up.

Hockey Canada is a not-for-profit entity, therefore no one can challenge this legally from an anti-competition standpoint, those laws pertain to peoples ability to make a living, which is not applicable.

In the longer run, these things tend to not matter much.

"Break-away" sanctioning bodies nearly always wind up re-joining with the body they broke away from, as the costs of duplicating services, and greater per-person insurance costs for smaller groups usually drive them to reconcile their differences.

Unfortunately, a 3-5 year time span is an eternity to an 8 year old child.

Instead of trying to punish the "traitors", thereby escalating the conflict, HC should open a dialogue to find out what the issues are that led to the drive for independence in the first place.

Both organizations should remember to put the needs of the kids first.

Put your egos aside, and find some common ground.

Not for Profit ??

That may be the perception and initial thought behind HC's creation, let's open the books and see if that statement is true today... doubt it.

Everyone is preaching the demise of certain Outlaw leagues, so that being the case why should HC care ???

Either way this is an unfair tactic, and as with the BS in HC sanctioned centres, the kids are the ones losing out yet again...

Maybe Soccer isn't such a bad sport after all.....

The CYO has used every means available to recruit players. They should have known HC would respond eventually if they kept pushing, now its the poor, innocent CYO that's being bullied?

Good riddance, this should shut up the CYO about other organizations for awhile. HC should have done this the morning after the CYO put flyers on OMHA parents cars attending their banquet.

I agree, that part of it's fine, but as others have mentioned, the rest of it is pretty unfair to folks who have done nothing wrong.
I'm sure they will back off this part of it at least.

Should stand up and respond to this, w