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R-109 Pirate Picture origins

April 22 2011 at 4:15 PM
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Mark E  (Login TheNewtonian)

Hello to All ,

Firstly many thanks to Jason Gorham for steering the Net54 Galleon in the right direction .

Jason & I shared a few mails regarding the origins and inspiration for the wonderful images in the R-109 Pirate Pictures set , Jason sent me a couple of scans that clearly showed where the artists borrowed ideas .

I spent an hour or 2 looking a little deeper into the subject matter and came up with a few extra .

I believe that Daniel H has also carried out research into the origins and maybe he'll post a few of his results , hope so .

The results are shown below .


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cards 12 & 41 seem to be a collage (if thats the right word) from 1 image

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Any thoughts or comments greatly appreciated .

Have a happy Good Friday .
----
Mark

 
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AuthorReply

Tom Boblitt
(Premier Login autograf)
Forum Owner

Great thread............

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April 22 2011, 4:24 PM 

Mark.....wonderful research.

 
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Mark E
(Login TheNewtonian)

not forgetting

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April 22 2011, 4:26 PM 

Mr Jason Gorham who also had a big hand in this .

 
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Dan C
(Login DanCalandriello)

stunned

Score 5.0 (1 person)
April 22 2011, 4:55 PM 

..stunned, shocked, very excited, etc , etc to see this information revealed
here at Net54....my personal thanks to all involved.

How can it be that you fellows are the first to unearth this information....
in nearly 80 years.... ?

I put it in the same category as Ralph's unveiling the lithos that Goudey
used for Indian Gum and the Robert Edwards Find a year ago.
.
.




 
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Jason
(Login Broncosfan1)

Pirate's Picture Gum Cards

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April 22 2011, 7:19 PM 

Much thanks to Mark for organizing the images and their corresponding R109 cards. He and I have shared several emails back and forth, many of them on a focus of pirates. I recently picked up a 1921 copy of Howard Pyle's book of pirates and saw some of the illustrations were the same as images in the R109 set or certainly served as insipiration. NC Wyeth also had several illustrations in 1911 Treasure Island, which Gum, Inc. used for the R109 set. With mine and Mark's research, you see the images above clearly were a big part of Pirate's Picture Bubble Gum cards.

I've long felt that the R109 set has been largely underappreciated compared to other great Gum, Inc. sets of the same period. Perhaps the fact that it's hard to put together a full set because of the 9,34 and 59 cards, or maybe the fact that it's hard to find the cards in ex shape or better turns some collectors off. It's great artwork, on par, or even better than other Gum, Inc releases of the 30's and early 40's - HOW, Lone Ranger, etc. Hopefully the thread that Mark started will encourage further interest in the set.

 
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Jack
(Login fallbrookjack)

Great Research work

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April 22 2011, 9:18 PM 

Way to go guys. I love this kind of revelation.

Mark - you stated in your original post, "Jason sent me a couple of scans that clearly showed where the artists borrowed ideas." I think the term should really be "PIRATED" ... Har!!!

-Jack

 
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Daniel H
(Login PancakeBunny)

Re: R-109 Pirate Picture origins

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April 22 2011, 10:15 PM 

I am a huge NC Wyeth fan (there is a great Biography out there that was published 10-15 years ago (like so many artistic types he was a bit askew); Howard Pyle ain't bad either. I started an article for the Wrapper (unbeknownst to Les) but never got anywhere close to the point of sending anything in. I have a post it note on the backs of the cards in my set identifying where I could trace back the inspiration for each card, where I could anyway. They are still there and I will see if you missed any from my findings. You have identified many of those I identified long ago. Busy weekend ahead, but I'll try to post back in a reasonable amount of time.

 
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Mark
(Login TheNewtonian)

Re: R-109 Pirate Picture origins

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April 23 2011, 1:42 PM 

Hi Guys , many thanks for your comments , I'm sure it makes the work done by Jason & Daniel all worth while .

Jack , I think your spot on ' pirated ' happy.gif

Some of the original images were also used by Pak Cups for their Jolly Roger issue (which can be seen in the food section of the Gallery)

----
Mark

 
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Jason
(Login Broncosfan1)

A few more Easter treats

Score 5.0 (1 person)
April 24 2011, 9:25 AM 

Here are a few more pics where NC Wyeth art corresponds to the R-109 set. Interesting to note that the 1911 Treasure Island cover art by Wyeth was partially used in at least three of the R-109 cards. The "4 against 1" card matches up with another Wyeth work from around 1913.

[linked image]

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Enjoy....and please keep the artwork coming.

Jason

 
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Mark
(Login TheNewtonian)

Re: R-109 Pirate Picture origins

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April 24 2011, 10:23 AM 

Great work Jason .

This might have some influence on #11 .

[linked image]
[linked image]

 
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Rick P
(Login oldtix)

Re: R-109 Pirate Picture origins

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April 24 2011, 10:38 AM 

Bravo! What a great thread! I'm not sure if any of you are fans of old comic books and newspaper strips, but this practice was widespread among cartoonists. The work of respected artists like Alex Raymond, Hal Foster, Frank Frazetta, Lou Fine and others were regularly used as "inspiration" by many of the production shops turning out work in the early 1940s. Along the same line, researchers have recently discovered that the first Batman comic-book story (The Case of the Chemical Syndicate) was almost entirely patterned from a 1936 Shadow pulp story and accompanying illustrations.

Now that our minds have been opened to the practice in cards, I suspect we'll discover the same heritage on many issues from the golden age...

 
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Mark
(Login TheNewtonian)

Just wondering

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April 25 2011, 11:33 AM 

if you guys think this one might have influenced card #52 .
My eye was drawn to the ' lamp ? ' behind the Captain .

[linked image]
[linked image]

 
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Mark
(Login TheNewtonian)

Re: R-109 Pirate Picture origins

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April 25 2011, 3:38 PM 

heres #52

[linked image]

 
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Mark
(Login TheNewtonian)

maybe

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April 25 2011, 3:45 PM 

#42

[linked image]
[linked image]

 
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Mark
(Login TheNewtonian)

another

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April 25 2011, 3:58 PM 

maybe .

[linked image]
[linked image]

 
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Anonymous
(Login TheNewtonian)

if theres anyone interested ...

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April 26 2011, 4:18 AM 

[linked image]
[linked image]

 
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Dan C
(Login DanCalandriello)

Lots of hours

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April 26 2011, 5:58 AM 

Anyone can tell there has been lots of hours put into this "project"

I hope someday we can do justice to it all with a comprehensive webpage(s)

Thanks to all contributors and those that commented. It's a revelation

worthy of congratulations.

 
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Chuck Ross
(Login ChuckRoss)

Re: R-109 Pirate Picture origins

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April 26 2011, 6:15 AM 

Looks like a labor of love. These are really interesting....most are dead ringers for the R109 card. A few are probably a little more of a leap of faith, but overall this is very impressive.

 
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Charley Ramone
(Login oldbubblegum)

Wow! WOW! Wow!

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April 26 2011, 4:21 PM 

Stunning! Incredible, Neat etc etc!

Many thanks to our man in the UK (JA#2) Mark and to Jason as well.

Super, super stuff.


"showin the love since 1965"


 
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