Took a chance on the three Hitler cards offered by seller therealjunker57 in eBay item 132254645054. Cards appeared to be trimmed in the listing photos and upon receipt I compared them to my 1984 WTW reprint set. I guess, not so surprisingly, the trimming by pure happenstance I'm sure, managed to take off just the right amount of the card where WTW reprint wording would have been, and the cards had the same "surface feel" - kinda waxy - that the WTW cards have, not the 1930's cardboard feel of the original Horrors of War cards. Refund requested and seller reported to eBay. Will update this posting when the case is resolved. My recommendation - stay away from this guy!!!
Almost immediately upon my contacting the seller, he responded: "As stated in the auction, I did not have these graded or authenticated, So these were being sold as pictured as repops stated in the auction description."
I am not sure what he means by "repops" and in any case the listing does not say "repops", "repros" or anything else than "the Holy Grail of this set" and that they are "1938 cards".
Oh well.... We'll wait to see what eBay does. I've had pretty good success with ebay resolving inadequately described (fake) items in favor of the buyer and giving a refund, but they have been generally low value items.
As it appears this evening (~2200 EDT), the listing does state, at the very, very bottom:
Some of our items are originals and others may be reproductions. We are not experts in all fields so unless we state for sure the originality we can not vouch authenticity so these are being sold as repops.
The seller might wiggle away on this one if that statement was part of the original listing.
I recently had a similar issue with some 1933 Goudey baseball cards. The listing was misleading and nowhere mentioned reprint. Seller responded much like yours did and refused a refund. I opened a case and about 4 days later eBay closed in favor of seller. I called to appeal and after speaking with someone and explaining my side, was given a refund and the case reversed within 5 minutes.
So my advice is keep pushing for refund and if you're lucky when you call eBay you'll get Danielle, who was the rep I got. Good luck.
As a longtime Ebay buyer since 1998, and a buyer of non-sports on Ebay since 2005, here's what I learned...
CARDS - I purchase better-looking raw cards of sets that I am interested in for submission to PSA for hopefully upgrading my registry sets. For the most part average cards are never a problem, but higher-demand cards force you to be extra careful.
One of the sets that I collect is "Star Wars" (Topps 1977) and there are some specific raw singles that I've purchased on EBay which almost inevitably come back as trimmed or otherwise altered. For me it happened to card numbers 67, 70 and 132 especially, but also some of the more difficult red numbers to obtain in higher grade (those that are Pop 5 and lower in terms of Gem Mint 10 specimens in the registry).
Card 132 is one of the few in this 330 card set that has yet to be graded even once in PSA 10 condition, so when you see an apparent well-centered raw single with sharp edges, no creases and no stains up for "Buy it Now" at $1.99 or a few dollars more, it should say ""Buyer Beware" instead !!
Same for, surprisingly, "Space 1999" cards 1 thru 6. On more than one occasion I have purchased a raw single off Ebay which came back with a grade indicating trimming. The first six cards of this set are notorious for appearing as though they were cut with a butter knife off the sheet, and as cheap as these cards are compared to "Star Wars", some sellers still resort to such tactics for resale purposes.
Bottom line is to be very careful when making a purchase. Ironically I've never really had problems with purchases from sellers in "The Wrapper" where pics are generally not available. That's where the more reputable sellers tend to be.
PACKS AND UNOPENED BOXES - ever since modern sets had cards that were so much higher in value than the rest of the set, whether in sports or non-sports, vintage pack-collecting has been a very risky proposition. I have purchased for some of the more expensive sets that I collect both packs and boxes and both have had their share of problems.
1st - a collector or dealer might purchase an unopened box of, say, 24 or 36 packs, then open a few (up to 4) and if they all are clunkers the seller can assume that the rest are as well, then purchase four more unopened packs and re-sell the "unopened" box in its entirety even though it is a veritable lemon.
2nd - I've encountered instances where it was clear to me that the "unopened" box and packs were cherry-picked. Cards in the center of a 5-card pack having creases, for example, is one way to tell. Curiously disparate distributions where key numbers seem to be universally missing is another possible way to tell...not guaranteed, but definitely reason to assume.
3rd - with the right equipment, and not that much cash, the most disreputable sellers will create an "unopened box". Here's how, and I'll use the very hot set "Star Trek" (Topps 1976) as an example...
-> Unopened boxes in recent years have been offered for as high as $12K, and have sold, definitively, for as much as $7,500. Ths is because PSA "POp 1" cards can command prices up to the $4K mark and beyond while even "Pop 4" cards have been selling for $1-2K.
-> There are 36 packs of 5 cards (180 cards) and 36 stickers in an unopened box
-> You can purchase two (2) mid-grade sets for as little as $75-100 each, and 4 more singles for another $8 or so
-> Low-mid grade stickers, as the set is commonly plagued by roller marks and poor centering never mind gum stains and dings, can be purchased or as little as $50-60 for 36 singles
-> Bunches of decent wrappers can be purchased if need be for another $40-80 depending on the seller
-> Empty boxes trade for anywhere from $20-50 depending on condition
-> Buy a 1976-1978 range box with similar sized gum on the cheap for $20-25 of some godawful set like "Here's Bo"
-> All in all, an "investment" of $325-425 coupled with some careful time in re-folding and re-sealing the wax wrappers will create an "unopened box"
I have no doubt that this cheesy tactic has been attempted with respect to this set and likely others.
4th - worst of all are the sellers of "sealed" unopened boxes who steadfastly refuse to unseal the box to show you the contents. Now, there are two forms of the box being sealed..."BBCE" sealing which is an organization that seals the box with their own proprietary wrapping, and then generic heat-sealed wrappings around boxes. You are throwing money away at these if the seller balks at unsealing. There is no logical reason not to do so if the intent is resale. Best to avoid.
Collectors of those bagged "Death of Superman" comics might remember this lesson well. The content was supposed to be the same issue sold in mass quantities where the "Superman" character died, yet it was enclosed and heat-sealed in a protective bag with a black front and "S" logo on it, yet you could in no way verify the contents. Imagine your surprise opening it years down the line and seeing a comparatively worthless issue stored inside all that time. So best to avoid such purchases entirely.
I understand why some collectors like collecting "unopened packs", I certainly do, as well as why some choose to buy packs and boxes and open them for the purpose of upgrading their registry set, or just to take a chance at submission to PSA and doubling their investment or more. But there is definitely a "buyer beware" aspect to this side of our hobby that cannot be ignored, just as there is when buying desirable raw singles with prices that seem too good to be true.
Not every seller is disreputable, and more likely less than 2% fall into this category, and maybe even less than 1%...but they do exist and have been a thorn in the hooby for many years, and will be for years to come, I am sure.
And with printing technology improving with each passing year, it can get even worse. The following Ebay auction is clearly a reprint, but just take a look at the "Batman" Black Bat card number 1 in Ebay auction 182707496494 and see what I mean. Had this seller NOT intentionally included the reprint info on this card, it would likely grade Gem Mint 10 with PSA. There have been many reprint sets made over the years..."Superman" (1940), "Horrors of War" and many others...but in all cases the printer did the right thing and included the reprint caveat on the card. I dread the day where one day someone tries this same tactic using the right equipment and does not.
Daniel- I tried to go to see the item you listed. Could not find it until someone at ebay told me to go to the completed listings. It had sold within an hour after listing. I took a look at it and the bottom has, in my opinion, obviously been trimmed. Whoever did it does not have a paper cutter available as the cut on the left side seems to have curve to it.
After several back-and-forths with the seller waiting for eBay's 7-days-before-I can-file-a-claim policy to kick in, during which the seller admitted that he thought the cards were fake, but refused to refund them because of his "these may be repops(sp)" and "I don't accept returns" statements in the listing, eBay finally listened to my saga.
Within 48 hours, eBay electronically sent me a mailing label and told me they would refund the money when the items were received on his end. I feared that this duplicitous seller might claim hat I sent him something back that was different than what he sold me so I photographically documented every step of my packaging process. When the return got to him, as promised, I received a refund. Surprisingly, it was from the seller. I thought that I was getting a refund from "eBay", since ebay lists the policy as an "eBay guaranteed refund" policy.
I guess the bottom line is that this story had a happy ending - for me at least.
Bottom line #2 - stay away from therealjunker57.......
just looked at the 132332164672 item ya'll mention. The item location is the same as the location of the items I bought. This guy, lovingtheoldpaperstuff, is almost certainly the same guy with a different eBay name. What are the chances that two different guys are independently dealig fake stuff out of the metropolis of Jeffersonville, Indiana.....????
Too bad I can't figure out how to actually report this process. I can't find anywhere to actually state what this guy is doing. The best I could find was a fraudulent listing comment that did not let me elaborate. No number to call - no chat options.
When I completed the fraudulent listing report, it replied that I "had not bid on the item". I guess that means that I don't have standing to submit the report.....
Well, I DID bid on this item, and I won it. Like most people on here, I suspected it was fraudulent, but since the seller listed the dimensions wrong anyway, it would have been easy to send it back for a refund under "item not as described."
Turns out I didn't even have to do that. Seller has refunded my money with no item and no explanation (something else I thought might happen since the exact same card with the exact same defects had been sold, with positive feedback, the week before via a $99 BIN. I left negative feedback (as have a lot of others, claiming they bid on items that already had been sold) and reported the seller to eBay.
For those keeping track at home, my payment went to, and was returned by, an Angelina Thompaon, so if she starts any more accounts on eBay, keep an eye out for that name.
On another, completely unrelated note (but so long as I'm here), I attended the Philadelphia Sports Card and Memorabilia Show this weekend. A fair smattering of non-sports in the mix, but not much I didn't already have and/or could afford. I only wish non-sports cards were worth as much as the baseball guys seem to believe they are. I could have walked away with a near-mint "McHale's Navy" set for a cool $1,800! Saw a few ungraded '50s and '60s unopened non-sports packs for around $1,200 each. And I had my pick of empty '70s and '80s wax boxes from such non-sports luminaries as "The Six Million Dollar Man" and "E.T." for around $70 each.
Jeffersonville, Indiana is right across the river from me in Louisville, KY. There a bunch of fraudulent flea market crap floating around here all the time. It's ridiculous. Probably the same fake flea market stuff at EVERY flea market in America, I guess. Hopefully, no one on this board gets taken too bad by this idiot................I see this stuff and figure if it's too good to be true, it probably is...........
The Hitler reprint is up again. You can report it (I just did) to eBay as a trademark issue. Click report item then choose Copyright and trademark. From there choose counterfeit item then finally counterfeit, fake, or replica item. You then get a text box that you can use for some free text.