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Do putts that bounce skip or hop EVER drop?

June 25 2003 at 9:28 AM
 
from IP address 141.236.82.146

I've watched golfers putting for many years, and I've seen a lot of putts drop-- but I have never seen one that started out with a hop or bounce drop-- from any distance. Have you? It seems to me that I should have seen one drop, I've seen a few of the longer ones come up closer than they deserve.

Thank you again for your excellent comments, and this excellent website.

 
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152.13.186.51

Sure!

June 25 2003, 12:36 PM 

Dear Hugh,

Yes, I've seen putts drop after starting out with a hop or bounce. All putts that start out with skid or backspin or cutspin or bouncing or hopping eventually just roll, if they run long enough. And if the putt is just rolling with decent speed when it reaches the hole, it can certainly drop. So, unless the hopping or bouncing affects the "line" or path of the putt so bad it can't hit the cup, the hopping or bouncing doesn't necessarily make the putt un-droppable.

There really isn't enough research about balls hopping or bouncing in terms of just exactly how this affects the results, or affects the line, or affects the speed, etc. Yes, Scotty cameron has high-speed camera images of "launch" conditions, and states without analysis that a launch by a loft (dynamic? or static?) of 4.3 degrees "works best," this means nothing to me without the details and his criteria for what he means by works well, or the conditions of the testing. It is just as probable that he is labeling some golfers as good putters, and then concludes that whatever launch angle they usually have is the best, in comparison to other launch angles of not-so-good golfers.

Similarly, golf has always heard about the importance of so-called "true roll" or early roll or reduced skid putts, but I have never seen any real data on what effect this might have on results. Sure, it sounds right, but a) is it right, and even if so, b) what is the size of any difference, and even so, c) does the technique required to generate this sort of roll come with too high a trade-off price? Who knows? There just isn't any data one way or the other.

My personal experience has been to the effect that bouncing or hopping putts don't go off line very much, and while they lose some energy, they may also have just the right energy left over to sink. Most often, these putts come up short, but not seriously off line. So when I get to the trade-off of plain and simple effectiveness in the stroke versus an earlier ceasing of skidding or trying for very precise launch conditions, I'm a confirmed sceptic! I so far just opt for a plain effective stroke, and don't worry too much about hopping or skidding. Of course, my technique includes playing the ball well forward of the middle of the body and striving to make square on-line impact, so my emphasis on straight putts also happens to put a decent roll on the ball anyway. The limited point I'm making is that the straightness of the putt is probably more important than the quality of the roll. At least until someone shows me convincing data.

Cheers!

geoff mangum
The PuttingZone
http://puttingzone.com
Golf's most advanced and comprehensive putting instruction.


 
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Simon

203.118.167.85

At last some sense on this topic

June 30 2003, 3:09 AM 

Hi Geoff,

Well said!

As a putter designer I am amazed how many companies claim their putter gets the ball rolling early - Yes!C groove - Dandy - Stx - Teardrop.....

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm Can they all be right?
AND more importantly does it matter

I have found no evidence it matters!- despite the poster's assertion

With putting are we better to have a ball that skids or rolls ? Everyone assumes that rolling is better- there seems to be no proof

One day I am going to research this - I have most of the gear - a electromagnetic release putting machine and an aerial grid to measure the dispersion of putts -a PC - just need a fancy video camera and time!

Cheers

Simon

 
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