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Putter Length?

July 21 2004 at 12:32 PM
  (Login CarlSpackler)
from IP address 63.169.46.114

I read somewhere recently that the average putter length in the PGA tour is somewhere around 33.5 inches. This average included long putters, which suggests that the actual average for "normal" putters, i.e., not long or belly putters, is somewhat shorter than 33.5 inches. I am 5'10 and have gone to a 34 inch putter in recent years, but this has me thinking that I should go even shorter with my putter. Another reason that has me wondering if I should go shorter is that at address, both of my elbows are slightly outside of my shoulders and both wrists are "crooked" at about 45 degrees. Your (Geoff's) posts seem to suggest I could become a more consistent putter if my arms hung a little more freely (ala Phil Mickelson). I have tried to immitate his set up in the past, but when I do so my hands are practically gripping the putter below or close to the bottom of the grip. If a set up similar to Phils is what you reccomend, then I should be using a much shorter putter. Any thoughts on this? Also, any thoughts as to the truth of the PGA putter lenght average?

Thanks

 
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172.129.166.155

Centering Palms on Grip

July 22 2004, 5:28 AM 

Dear Carl,

If you check with the guys at Balance Certfied Golf, you will find that putters usually have a "node" low on the handle where the vibrations naturally cancel out, about two-three inches up from the lowest part of the grip material. Golfers who center their palms on the middle of the grip miss this "node of solid feeling" (as I might call it), and the backweighting of the BCG system changes the vibrational properties of the putter so that the node is moved up the handle into the palms.

This to me means that if you grip low with your setup -- that is, your setup yields a position of the hands with relaxed arms that is low on the putter grip -- then this obviates the need to have the node moved. Your palms are probably on the node if your palms are centered about two-three inches above the bottom of the grip.

If this happens to be the case, you would then have about 7-8 inches of the 10-inch grip material above the centers of your palms (or the center of the palm most on the grip). Anything bad about that? Possibly, if this makes the top of the handle snag in your clothing or your body during the stroke. But in my experience, this is not a problem, especially with relaxed and extended arms. Anything good about that? yes, as it happens. The extra length of the top of the handle above the palms acts as a more sensitive indicator of abruptness in the stroke motion. If you snatch the putter back from the ball with the hands acting abruptly, the handle will waggle in your palms, and the extra length above the palms effectively magnifies this bad waggle motion of the putter.

Conventional practice has golfers gripping the grip material so that the top or butt of the putter does not extend much if at all above the wrist line. There is no satisfactory reason why this should be the case.

So the objectives you want to achieve in fixing the length of the putter are (in order of importance):

1) having the palms centered on grip material and not stradling the grip material and the metal of the shaft;

2) having the palms centered on the node;

3) not having the top of the putter snagging in your clothing or against your body during the stroke; and

4) having some of the putter handle extending above the palms to magnify the feedback of when the stroke is getting too abrupt.

To do this, the setup comes first, then the putter must fit the proper setup, with the hands ending up on the grip where you want them.

So adopt your setup posture with arms hanging in a relxed way, elbows directly beneath shoulder sockets so each upper arm hangs like a log suspended at one end on a rope beneath the socket, with the forearms and hands ending up hanging naturally with the tips of the fingers lightly touching. However low your palms are centered is where you want the node of the putter, which is towards the lower end of the grip. If the palms end up about 3-4 inches from the bottom, that's probably fine, and no part of your hands reach to the metal. If the crook of your index finger or the tip of your thumb is lowest down the grip, this probably ought to end up with a little more grip material below it.

Do you need to cut down a putter? If your hands go too low and end up off the bottom of the grip material, yes. How much? Enough so there is at least about 4 inches from the center of the palms to the bottom of the grip.

If your hands center right at the bottom of the grip material, this would require cutting 4 inches off the putter and regripping it, so your hands would then center 4 inches from the bottom of the grip material. Whatever the distance from the center of the palms in your good setup back up the handle to get the palms onto the grip material is the number of inches to cut off.

This of course all assumes you have a good setup, which frequently requires some attention to how far back from the ball you stand at address.

With respect to Tour players, no I don't believe the statistic. If you look at Scotty Cameron's website, he lists the specs for 18 players, a pretty representative sample (over 10% of the the usual event field).

35.00 Ernie Els
35.00 Adam Scott
35.00 Ben Curtis
34.00 Paul Casey
35.50 Brad Faxon
42.25 Robert Gamez
34.25 Jay Haas
34.00 Dudley Hart
37.00 Peter Jacobsen
34.75 Tom Kite
35.25 Davis Love III
33.50 Phil Mickelson
35.00 Arron Oberholser
35.50 Mark O'Meara
35.00 Craig Perks
35.00 Tom Pernice
35.00 Curtis Strange
41.50 Jay Williamson

This sample shows an average of 35.7 inches. Ignoring the two belly putters, the average is 34.9 inches. So on average, Tour players don't vary much from what comes off the shelf. But I bet the average Tour player is taller than the average amateur golfer by several inches, too. Mickelson is 6'2". Els is 6'3". Faxon is 6'1". Jacobsen is 6'3". Mark O'Meara is 6'0". Davis Love III is 6'3". Tiger Woods is 6'2". While Robert Gamez is only 5'9" and Tom Kite is 5'8", I suspect that the Tour average is taller than the average amateur golfer by 2-4 inches. This means that if the Tour players have putters in the 35" range, amateur probably should have putters at least 1-2 inches shorter, on average, in the 33-34" range. Remember that Phil Mickelson is 6'2", but when his arms are extended relaxedly, his 33.5 inch putter is plenty long for him, and he has next to no handle extending above his wrist. He would be fine with a 34" putter or even a 35" putter, but normal-size golfers in the 5'10" range would do better with putters a couple of inches shorter, or at least gripped a couple of inches lower down the handle.

I don't recommend topping off the putter length so that the butt of the putter stops at the wrist line. This orients your hands on the grip material with reference to the top of the material, as the center of the palms is always only 2-4 inches below the wrist line. I would prefer that your hands are lower on the grip material than that, closer to the natural node. So if your hands end up on the sweet part of the handle on a 35" long putter with some of the handle extending above the wrist line, that's fine -- don't cut it. Cutting the putter is only required if your hands get below the node or off the grip material, and is not called for due to some handle extending above your wrist line.

On Tour, the real problem is a flawed setup position in the great majority of players, with the elbows held artificially inward and crooked. This is probably because the golfers are allowing their too-long putters to dictate their setup, placing their hands on the middle of the too-high grip handle, and this is backwards.

Cheers!

Geoff Mangum
Putting Theorist and Instructor

Geoff Mangum's PuttingZone

Golf's most advanced and comprehensive putting instruction.

Over 730,000 visits and growing strong ...

518 Woodlawn Ave
Greensboro NC 27401
336.230.0612 home
336.402.1602 cell




 
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Anonymous
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63.169.46.114

Re: Centering Palms on Grip

July 29 2004, 11:25 AM 

Geoff,
Thanks for your response to my question regarding putter length. I just read your post entitled "Ball/Target Dual Awareness and Right Hand" and it blew me away. I believe I suffer from a dominant right hand in my putter stroke and am eager to fix it. For example, I have noticed that in my follow through, my right elbow tends to straighten and turn ever so slightly to the inside, causing, I think, my putter face to open slightly. I don't know if this affects the roll of my putts (I hope the ball is already gone before this move happens) but I suspect it has led to a missed putt on occasion (to the right). Anyway, now that I have recognized the move, I want it out of my stroke (wether it is natural or not). It sounds like getting my right hand totally out of the stroke will cure this.

Carl

 
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172.134.195.149

Move the Lead Shoulder Up to Quieten Hands

July 30 2004, 7:56 AM 

Dear Carl,

To reach an understanding of what the elbow might or might not do in the stroke, it is necessary first to get a good grasp on handsiness. Sometimes, handsiness causes the elbow to get into the stroke in an unhelpful way, and sometimes the elbows changing orientation during the stroke causes handsiness. So, handsiness first, and then elbowsiness.

The sources of handsiness are a) habits and b) biomechanics and c) imperfect understanding of what else to do. Fortunately, the "cure" for handsiness ("reduction", really, as much as possible) is fairly simple and straightforward -- move the shoulder frame (and especially the lead shoulder socket) up in the forward part of the stroke from the bottom of the stroke arc and afterwards and let this lead shoulder socket moving up "pull up" or "lag up" the the lead arm, wrist, hand, and putter head all as a coordinated unit. This is a different habit with good biomechanics that effectively supplants handsiness.

Unfortunately, just saying this doesn't really capture excatly what needs to happen to prevent handsiness. So let me go a little deeper into the habits and biomechanics involved.

The basic habit is the reach-and-grasp action that is the fundamental use of the arm and hand. This is what we do whenever we pick up a object or reach out to control an object. As the arm extends out in space away from the body (by virtue of shoulder joint and elbow changing), we are targeting an end-point of the reach in terms of distance-and-direction but also in terms of the shaping of the hand as it fits the fingers to the position of holding the object. In a world of right-handers, door handles are typically to the left so the person opens the door reaching across the abdomen from right to left shaping and orienting the hand. The forearm rolls the hand thumb-left or counterclockwise as seen from the elbow as the reach progresses towards the door knob or handle, especially if the handle is a lever type. The turn of the door knob is clockwise typically, so the presetting of the hand counterclockwise with the counterclockwise rolling of the forearm is the usual "habit" we rely upon daily for this sort of task, as this pre-positions the hand and forearm to turn the handle and push open the door to the inside and back right. Another common habit is the handshake of two people facing each other. In a right-handed world, each person reaches from right to left acroos the body's midline to grasp the other's hand midway between the two people. This involves some extension and rolling of the forearm to set the hand in the correct position and orientation to grasp the other person's hand. A third common habit is folding the arms. In a right-handed world, typically the person reaches across the torso with the right hand and places the thumb behind the left upper arm and the fingers lay down outside the upper arm just above the left elbow, and the left forearm then (nearly simultaneously but really a little later) comes up to rest beneath the right forearm and the thumb-fingers arrangement finds the right upper arm and hooks into place. Again, the right hand is moved across the torso and the forearm is rolling counterclockwise or rolling "shut" or "closed."

This basic reach-and-grasp action is deliberately taken advantage of in most full-swing teaching, as the hand "releases" thru impact in some fashion -- at least as taught by many people. I believe this action in the full swing is related strictly to power, and is inappropriate and hurtful in the putting stroke, where power is really only a matter of tempo.

This brings us to the biomechanics. In the full swing, the arms go further than the shoulder frame, both back and thru. The club is "extended" back as the shoulders turn and then the lead upper arm comes a little across the upper chest as the back upper arm is kept fairly close to the upper chest by that arm's elbow folding and staying near the side instead of "chicken winging" away from the side. Then in the downswing and follow-thru, the arms again outrace the shoulder frame, hopefully coordinated momentarily at impact, but headed towards a finish not unlike the top of the backstroke but reversed. True, the shoulderframe powers the arms, but the arms also act somewhat like a "flail" as the full swing pivots back and thru. This arms-reaching-across-torso business is the biomechanics that adds to the habitual motions of normal human conduct and independently encourages the forearm rolling and hands changing orientation. If the forearm extend across the chest, the shoulder socket is changing so that the upper arm moves everything below it and usually the upper arm will roll the elbow and forearm inward toward the torso in this move; if the hand is also "reaching" to a position, the elbow will roll and extend the forearm more this same way to get the hand where it wants to go. This can all be felt or noticed by watching how this recah across the torso has the lead-side elbow sort of dragging and rolling across or just off the lead side of the abdomen.

ALL of this armsiness, elbowsiness, and handsiness is unnecessary and hurtful in the putting stroke, and can be avoided by disallowing the arms to outrace the shoulder frame, and instead relying solely upon the turning of the shoulder frame as a unit to power the putting stroke with tempo.

To make this happen correctly with the shoulder frame movement, interlace the fingers of both hands across your sternum and then extend both arms straight out horizontally above the floor so that the center of your chest aims into the two hands. Now turn the upper body as far to the right as you can WITHOUT letting the hands get ahead (further to the right) of where the chest is pointing. If you are like most people, after about 45 degrees of turning the hands start to creep ahead of the shoulders. The faster you make this move, the more evident the loss of shoulderframe-arms-hands coordination becomes. If you make the motion with a slow even tempo and keep the upper torso relaxed, the "shape" of the triangle of shoulderframe, arms, and hands stays intact much better for a longer turn to the side.

Now, with the body bent forward in a putting address posture but with the hands together with fingers interlaced hanging down beneath the chin, make the same shoulderframe turn to the right WITHOUT allowing the left elbow to drag across the abdomen. Don't extend the left arm going back -- just send the left shoulder socket down to push the whole left arm down and back. The trouble comes when the shoulderframe ceases up and slows or stops but the arms and hands keep moving. To reduce this trouble, the fundamental point is to think of and to plan on and to actually move solely the lead shoulder socket down and back in the takeaway, instead of pulling the putter head back with the hands and arms, and thereafter to keep the tempo nice and even and smooth and relaxed so as not to encourage the arms and hands to get ahead of the shoulderframe, and to KEEP the shoulder socket headed down and back until the desired top-of-backstroke position is reached. Similarly, coming forward, DON'T HURRY the downstroke, as this speeds the hands ahead, and DON'T LIFT the putter with the elbows flexing -- just leave the hands hanging and keep the hands, forearms, and elbows all "quiet." This makes the stroke motion very simple looking and feeling, with only the lead shoulder socket moving or being moved. The side muscles in the abdomen pull the shoulderframe down and back, so the rest of the body is very quiet except that the lower body has some reactivity in it to keep balance and quietness.

In well over 90% of all putting strokes required by golf course situations, the backstroke does not exceed the comfort zone of 45 degrees, so the challenge of armsiness and handsiness arises most often in connection with strokes that are too quick or that go past this comfort zone.

As you power the shoulderframe with the relaxed tempo to push the lower tip of the triangle (putter head) back to the top of backstroke position by sending the lead corner of the triangle (lead shoulder socket) down and back, the arms should not rotate, the elbow should not flex, the upper arm pit should not change shape, and the hands and wrists should remain inert and unchanging in reference to the forearms, the putter handle, and the torso as it turns. In this manner, whatever way the shoulder socket moves, the putter face will reflect the socket in an amplified way. If the shoulder socket moves in a vertical plane, so will the putter face -- keeping it square and online at all times -- so long as you disallow changes in the triangle shape. Keep the focus on the lead shoulder socket moving in space correctly with good tempo, and the arms and hands will take care of themselves correctly simply by keeping nothing changing.

My key thoughts are often something like: my hands are nothing but gloves filled with sand -- heavy and inert; my shoulder socket is a ball on the end of a diving board and Jackie Gleason is about to do a leisurely swan dive off the end sending the tip of the board way down in a slow deep bending and then smoothly and powerfully straight up without hurry.

By making this sort of shoulder move with the gut to the top of the backstroke and then not hurrying down and moving from the bottom of the stroke casually up to a finish, the whole is much more like a slow slap of the rear hand's open palm back and then straight up at the sky, and a slap of the lead hand's backside back and then up at the sky. In the action, the hands are moved by the shoulder at a constant distance back from the line of the putt and the path of the putter head, and the hands neither get closer to this line or farther away at any time from start to finish. At the extremities of the stroke on both the back and forward sides, the hands are effectively extended away from the feet, as the putt line constantly gets farther back or forward away from the center of the stance, the same as the baseboard of a wall would do if you were making strokes along the baseboard of the wall. This extension away from the feet will habitually call into action the extrending and rolling of the arms and hands to make the extension complete, and that will send the putt off line by changing the putter face out of square and possibly changing the path of the sweetspot off line as well. This converts the putting action more towards a reaching across the body to shake the hand of someone standing down the putt line toward the target and across the line. So the trick is to use the shoulder turn to NOT to shake hands down the line but to lift the back of the lead hand in a slapping straight up at the sky, with the hand staying on that constant distance back from the putt line. Move the hand solely with the shoulder lifting the arm, hand, and putter as a unit.

And don't let the pivot of the torso and shoulderframe (top of sternum, base of neck, where the clavicles meet to join the shoulders together) chase after the putter head back or thru, but the shoulderframe "rolls" beneath the pivot making the pivot rotate but not wander. This is especially critical in the forward stroke -- keep the pivot from chasing past the bottom of the stroke by allowing the shoulderframe lifting to raise the putter face on an ascending arc from the bottom of the stroke into the back of the ball. The hands stay as fully away from the shoulders as they always stay, the elbows do no lifting of the hands, the pivot stays stable in elevation and space although rotating in place, and the lead shoulder lifting up and back fires the putter face up and thru the back of the ball and casts the putter face square down the line.

Now, addressing your action:

You say your rear elbow rolls "open" and you miss to the outside. I can't be sure without seeing your setup and checking your eye dominance. It is possible you are right-handed but left-eye dominant like Jack Nicklaus and have something akin to an open setup and a right-elbow piston or push stroke. If that's the case, it sounds like you either are not setting up with feet and shoulders open to accommodate the push-type elbow action or are not open quite enough. If this is NOT your situation, and you are right-handed and right-eye dominant, and are missing right with the right elbow extending a little open in the thru-stroke, then you are either

1) hansy in the stroke action in a bad way, or
2) are setting up a little closed with your feet or shoulders or both, or
3) have a loop in your stroke path from ball back too much inside and then out to the right thru impact.

To get rid of this, you need to be sure you square up well at address, think of and then move solely the lead shoulder socket to power the triangle back and thru, and get the shoulder socket moving more vertically straight down at the balls of the lead foot to start and then vertically up and away from the balls of the feet thru impact. Bringing the putter back inside too much in the backstroke is from handsiness in pulling the putter back or from moving the triangle with a lead shoulder socket moving too much on a tilted path instead of a vertical path. A flawed backstroke is not fatal so long as the shoulder socket moves vertically up thru impact correctly at a time when the hands are keeping the putter face square to the address direction -- the ball will still roll straight even if the sweetspot is missed a little toeish or heelish. But of course it's better if the backstroke does not cause a problem to solve.

Pushing the lead socket straight down at the feet while the hands move along a path that stays a constant distance back from the putt line accomplishes a straight backstroke. letting the putter head coast to the top of the backstroke and then start down on its own under gravity prevents you from hurrying the hands down into impact. Keep the hands quiet. And the shoulderframe coming down is simply a relaxing of the gut that sent it back up to begin with. The shoulderframe really does not get back into action until the shoulders have fallen back naturally to level, when the putter head reaches the bottom of the stroke arc, and then the shoulderframe simply "catches" the falling putter / triangle and moves it upward to a coasting finish at the top of the thru-stroke. Basically, once the top of the backstroke is attained, the stroke down and thru just happens by itself, with a gentle finishing-off lifting when the shoulderframe levels out at the bottom. It is just like a child in a swing, giving the child a gentle push right at the bottom to keep the momentum up equal to that coming down. That's the role of tempo in powering the shoulderframe action.

I could go on indefinitely, but I hope this is a positive note to end on.

Cheers!

Geoff Mangum
Putting Theorist and Instructor

Geoff Mangum's PuttingZone

Golf's most advanced and comprehensive putting instruction.

Over 740,000 visits and growing strong ...

518 Woodlawn Ave
Greensboro NC 27401
336.230.0612 home
336.402.1602 cell




 
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