Butch,
Nice to see you back in the discussion, your opinion is appreciated by many. It takes different people from many different walks of life to get a complete perspective. I find it difficult to discuss the dogs that Katrina is talking about because I have no real life experiences with a good defensive dog. Sure I have seen many dogs that people said were real killers, defensive based monstrosities that cause a slight tingle of fear when you see there impressive physique and large powerful heads, yet everyone has proven to be not real, easily ran from a up close and personal confrontation. In no way am I saying this is the case with all defensive based dogs just the ones I have come across, so my opinion I am sure is tainted from those experiences.
I can’t help but disagree concerning…..
"Dogs in prey drive are in a battle they know they can win. When things get tough, they get gone" …. Once again people are looking at this from a wild animal standpoint, a wolf is not comparable to a Dutch Shepherd. They are engaged in Prey sure, yet do not posses the same core character that their wild cousins posses, they are different through and through. This once again comes down to other traits other then their Prey or Defensive drives, Courage, Nerve, etc. They are engaged in a drive that enables them to relieve pressure, defensive dogs do not have the same luxury.
"This is true for any of the canine family, the object of a hunt/chase etc is to provide food to survive, not die. This, IMO is why prey is used to build up dogs, lots of battles that he knows he will win, each one giving him the confidence to believe he can win the next, even if it is a little tougher". No, my dog does not chase the bad guy so that he can survive by capturing his prey and eating it, that is what he has a dog bowl at home for filled with food. He chases the bad guy to engage a prey object in a fight, for the pure uncontrolled desire to capture and kill his prey, it has nothing to do with survival. Yes, I build the confidence and capability level of my dog each and every time he engages the bad guy and wins. So all of a sudden I have a dog that sees every bad guy out there as insignificant vermin for him to capture, he knows he can win the fight mentally, and has the Nerve, Courage, etc to push through should the fight prove more then he is accustomed to.
“Only a defensive dog that has chosen 'fight' over 'flight' can really be dependable in a life or death fight.” Simply in my opinion not true, where is the foundational base for that comment?
Once again they are engaged in the battle for completely different reasons, the base drives are different even if the contributing factors are the same, in my opinion there is no contest. I might not be getting out what I am trying to say correctly, or we can simply be at that point in an discussion where the two sides can see the others point of view yet choose not to agree with it.
I would love the opportunity to put this discussion to a real life test…… I would truly like to see if my opinion is flawed, I am always up for an honest lesson. Butch, do you know of say… five defensive based dogs that would be willing to come to your trial and take on five prey based dogs. We could use a variety of situations after your world trial and see where they lead us…… If I am wrong in my opinion I would honestly like to revamp my train of thought, yet I am unable to do that without proof because I honestly feel as though I am correct.
I look forward to your response, and thank you for your time.
Wayne
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