This is how Capitalism workis in America, this is why Capitalism is a fraud.
Moyers is another Latte Liberal, like Michael Moore. He lives a lifestyle you and I could only match by winning a lottery. I couldn't care less, but you insist on embracing an economic world-view in which these clowns exist to make a fool of you. To each his own, I suppose.
This isn't about Moyers, Gus. Did you bother to watch the video? I would have to guess from your response, no. It's kind of lengthy but it's pretty informational and it's as critical of the Democrats and Obama as it is anyone. Just watch it before you make your ignorant comments.
This isn't about Moyers, Gus. Did you bother to watch the video? I would have to guess from your response, no. It's kind of lengthy but it's pretty informational and it's as critical of the Democrats and Obama as it is anyone. Just watch it before you make your ignorant comments.
Yes, it *is* about Moyers! He is *clearly* a talk-the-talker who doesn't walk-the-walk, so whatever he has to say carries no weight whatsoever. The Left is literally infested with such jackasses, which is a huge part of their problem. They know what's good for *us*, but just don't dare hold *them* to those same standards! pffttt... And yeah, it sucks when the Right does it too...
Jesus, you're a thick headed ass... Watch the FUCKING VIDEO, then make your ignorant comments if you like. Your comments as they are just make you sound stupid and bitter. Poor Gus, he's not a rich man so if a Rich Man says something critical about capitalism he must be a hypocrit.. Go fuck your ignorant self.
Are you talking about Robert Reich's interview concerning banks?
Well, Reich makes a good point until the issues are questioned. The first version is always true until the seconcd versiuon punches holes in it.
But I know how you debate so it must be your point to porove that Reich is right. He is not right.
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Glenn Beck hates 9/11 survivors. Shocking as Glenn Beck claimed that he hates 9/11 survivors. The Fox news personality and media clown has always been an outrageous demagogue, a pied piper to the illiterate, unwashed masses that make up the Fox news audience. Michael Stone,Examiner.com
Jesus, you're a thick headed ass... Watch the FUCKING VIDEO, then make your ignorant comments if you like. Your comments as they are just make you sound stupid and bitter. Poor Gus, he's not a rich man so if a Rich Man says something critical about capitalism he must be a hypocrit.. Go fuck your ignorant self.
I watched the video, Ron. Hell, I could have written the son of a bitch. Here are two fundamental truths that you cannot dispute. One: The *only* organization on the planet that legally demands money from me at gunpoint is a government! I have never once in my entire life written a tax check to Goldman Sachs! Two: As long as I make my house payment, I will *not* be foreclosed on! Let me add a third, taught to me by my grandad when I was about five. *Never* buy anything you cannot afford!
These dipshits have their panties all in a wad because "Big Biddness" uses money and influence to game the *government* to their advantage. Wow! There's some really breaking news! You know what occurs to me? If *government* wasn't in the business of regulating them, then they wouldn't have a system of regulations to game to their advantage, now would they? So the *cure* is to do some more of that really effective regulating? Har!!!
So what happens to *me* when all this goes haywire? Does Goldman Sachs demand more money from *me*? Not if I don't owe them any money for houses and credit cards that I haven't paid!!! OTOH, if Goldman Sachs sweet-deals the *government* into bailing their asses out for the people who *don't* pay them, where then do you think that *government* money comes from Ron? Jack up ol' gus, who's paying his own way and squeeze a little harder!
Moyers and these other two geniuses teach us to see *two* bad-guys. The Big Biddness bad-guys, who con the government, and the Government bad-guys, for letting it happen. Well shit, who's in charge here? Who is doing the bending over and cheek-spreading in this little sexual metaphor? So what do Moyers, and *you* see as a solution? More action from the fuckee? Har! Hows that all working out for you and Moyers so far???
I can handle thieves, Ron. The world is full of them. Sometimes it takes brawn, but mostly it takes brains. At my age, I seldom get cheated or scammed anymore. It's called *learning*. What I have no power to handle is thieves with the power of the State behind them. So the smartest thieves have learned to steal from the *government*, so then the government steals from me to cover their own stupidity. Who's the goddam bad-guy in my life here, Ron? The common thief that can't touch me, or *government* that always can?
what in the hell does Capitalism have to do with bad business policy (i.e. far-left vote-gathering politicians pushing risky home loans just to make it fair for the poor), Wall Streeters taking risky investment stratagies to do something with all these bad loans, and the unethical behavior by all.
Lack of ethics by a bunch of crooked politicians risking our money (not theirs) and a bunch of Wall Street accomplices has absolutely nothing to do with Capitalism....
What has happend has everything to do with Soicalists in our government pushing their "share the wealth" bullshit furthered by the efforts of the likes of ACORN and a bunch of corrupt politicians turning the other way when the issues are to damaging to their vote counts for the next election......
I guess you don't see that they are slamming the government for robbing you to pay Goldman-Sachs (or whomever). The guests are being critical of the government for a) hiring the same thieves and asses that created the problem b) bailing out the theives and asses that created the problem c) doing nothing to protect the people and homes that were suppose to be helped by the bailouts
If you had really watched the video you would have seen that they were not really slamming 'Big Bidness", they were slamming the government for making it so that the banking industry could do those things in the first place, for not doing better regulations, and for hiring the mutherfuckers that are so tied to the industry. It was an indictment on the Government and not "big bidness" as you seem to think. And that is why I called you ignorant, and you still are because if you really did watch the video yuu came away just as ignorant as if you had never seen it and just as pig headed.
I guess you don't see that they are slamming the government for robbing you to pay Goldman-Sachs (or whomever). The guests are being critical of the government for a) hiring the same thieves and asses that created the problem b) bailing out the theives and asses that created the problem c) doing nothing to protect the people and homes that were suppose to be helped by the bailouts
If you had really watched the video you would have seen that they were not really slamming 'Big Bidness", they were slamming the government for making it so that the banking industry could do those things in the first place, for not doing better regulations, and for hiring the mutherfuckers that are so tied to the industry. It was an indictment on the Government and not "big bidness" as you seem to think. And that is why I called you ignorant, and you still are because if you really did watch the video yuu came away just as ignorant as if you had never seen it and just as pig headed.
No, Ron, I am not disputing their observations, or even their assessments. Nor am I absolving Big Biddness of their culpability! What I am disputing are their *solutions*! "Hey!, we're getting screwed here! So let's go find some more dicks!". It's just like Obama claiming that Obamacare will be paid for by eliminating the waste and fraud from Medicare! Har! Since when? Crap, Ron, we have been electing "reformers" since forever!
So who do we have to protect us from Big Biddness? Who do I use to protect me from any other thieves? Me! Remember my fundamental truths? The *only* money that *any* bank, or giant corporation has *ever* taken from me was *through-the-government* in the form of taxes to pay for "bail-outs"! How's that for a track-record? So exactly which of the two Bad-Guys in this little cluster-fuck do you think I should be more wary of???
Thieves are thieves, Ron! And leopards have spots! And if *I* do my part, they can't touch me! OTOH, if I resist the *legal* thievery sanctioned by the *government*, then I become a barricaded fugitive on the six-o'clock news! Yes! It really is that simple!
You are right, Web, it has nothing to do with capitalism, unless you consider that it is how capitalism works right now unless you have the right regulatory controls. If it hadn't been for the fucking rightwingers deregulating the banking industry opening it up to that kind of fraud and abuse in the first damn place then you wouldn't be able to whine about Acorn, the leftists, and the poor people who got loans. It's the rightwing that gave the banking industry the free pass to make risky loans using very questionable practices.
It's not capitalism at all when the banks come crying to Uncle Sugar to bail them out.
It's not capitalism, but I'll bet the banks will try and tell you it is and I'll bet they'll tell you if they were just free to conduct business without regulations they could fix it and make everything all better.
it was not conservatives or Republicans or any one else but far-left Democrats doing everything possible to stop the Republicans from putting controls on Fannie-Mae/Freddie-Mack as evidenced in the 25 or so times taped (and put on You Tube) of congressional hearings stopping any efforts to put financial controls on the loan practices going back to 2006.
It is those very loose loan practices at the root of the finacial collapse, and now you say it was the rightwing giving a free pass. Please show me where the videos are proving what YOU say.
And now we have the same crooks in charge in DC and they stole our money and gave it to the same fuck-ups to bail out their dumb, risky, bad business, unethical behavior......
We have nothing more that a true circle-jerk going on.....
You are right, Web, it has nothing to do with capitalism, unless you consider that it is how capitalism works right now unless you have the right regulatory controls. If it hadn't been for the fucking rightwingers deregulating the banking industry opening it up to that kind of fraud and abuse in the first damn place then you wouldn't be able to whine about Acorn, the leftists, and the poor people who got loans. It's the rightwing that gave the banking industry the free pass to make risky loans using very questionable practices.
So there wasn't any business/government corruption before those fucking rightwingers deregulated the banking industry? And who took advantage of that new opportunity for "fraud and abuse" Only Fannie and Freddy! Look who came to the new trough! The *government*! You just can't sell this Ron, without indicting the government, just like Moyers and his guests did. So why in God's name you all think the *same* governenment is somehow the *solution* is just beyond me!
It's not capitalism at all when the banks come crying to Uncle Sugar to bail them out.
I am in total agreement! And look what the government did! Ohhhh! They're "too big to fail!". Once again, who got the best of who??? And who got hosed? We did!!!
It's not capitalism, but I'll bet the banks will try and tell you it is and I'll bet they'll tell you if they were just free to conduct business without regulations they could fix it and make everything all better.
I don't give a quack what line of BS is used by either one! What I *do* know is which one can legally steal money from me! Let some big bank just run as wild as they want to for all I care! I don't do business with thieves to the best of my ability, and so far I've done a pretty good job!
Gus, get this through your thick fucking skull, I am not advocating that the same government do anything. I want to see people like Sumner, Geitner, Bernake, and all the rest of them tied up with the banking industry gone. Left, Right, it doesn't matter, we have to take their influence away. It's got to come from the top down, Obama needs to get his self free first.
you are right.....we need the entire swamp drained and all the scum and creatures cleaned out.....but with Obama and the likes of Polosi and Ried, oh, I almost forgot the scummiest Barney 'Fif'e' Frank, minding the swamp we are destined to continue to be screwed for some time to come.....
This message has been edited by webpm1 on Oct 12, 2009 2:58 PM This message has been edited by webpm1 on Oct 12, 2009 2:57 PM This message has been edited by webpm1 on Oct 12, 2009 2:56 PM
Gus, get this through your thick fucking skull, I am not advocating that the same government do anything. I want to see people like Sumner, Geitner, Bernake, and all the rest of them tied up with the banking industry gone. Left, Right, it doesn't matter, we have to take their influence away. It's got to come from the top down, Obama needs to get his self free first.
Oh okay, I get it now. Some *new* batch of "reformers" is going to be different from all those old batches of reformers, and *really* fix things, because they said so, and they promise this time! At least you've finally made a point. If I had ever in my life been as suckered in by a politician as you apparently have, I might have a different perspective on my *need* for government too!
Pardon me for suggesting that a corrupt government is worse than a corrupt business. Customers will quit buying the products of a corrupt business, but the corrupt government destroys the entire nation.
Pardon me for suggesting that a corrupt government is worse than a corrupt business. Customers will quit buying the products of a corrupt business, but the corrupt government destroys the entire nation.
Sorry, Poets, all you'll get from that brick wall is bumps on your head... Businesses don't have no "Obamamoney" to spread around.
Oh okay, I get it now. Some *new* batch of "reformers" is going to be different from all those old batches of reformers, and *really* fix things, because they said so, and they promise this time! At least you've finally made a point. If I had ever in my life been as suckered in by a politician as you apparently have, I might have a different perspective on my *need* for government too!
gus.
No you don't get it now, and evidently you aren't going to so.... whatever live with your strawman and be happy, I'm done.
Capitalism coupled with Government Regulation is the best system in the World. We need to preserve that.
But it is as the founders said. It is dependent on a moral and religious people. And corruption that continues to be tolerated will force the government and nation to collaspe.
Corruption not only in the government (on both sides of the aisle) but also in business. The way capitalism is practiced today does not function as the nations economic system but the nations economic downfall. The greed and corruption in Business and Industry coupled with the greed and corruption in government is destroying the nation but you wouldn't have one without the other.
Oh okay, I get it now. Some *new* batch of "reformers" is going to be different from all those old batches of reformers, and *really* fix things, because they said so, and they promise this time! At least you've finally made a point. If I had ever in my life been as suckered in by a politician as you apparently have, I might have a different perspective on my *need* for government too!
gus.
No you don't get it now, and evidently you aren't going to so.... whatever live with your strawman and be happy, I'm done.
No, I'm afraid that I *do* get it, and you're done, which is precisely *why* you are done.
Corruption not only in the government (on both sides of the aisle) but also in business. The way capitalism is practiced today does not function as the nations economic system but the nations economic downfall. The greed and corruption in Business and Industry coupled with the greed and corruption in government is destroying the nation but you wouldn't have one without the other.
Bullshit bullshit! Can you say General goddam Motors?! Chrysler?! However many banks now?! They *failed*!!! They practiced *bad* management until they *failed*!!! That's how *capitalism* works!!! Well goooooolleeeee! Lookee here! They're still out there in biddness now aren't they? I wonder why that is, Ron? gheezuz...
Bullshit bullshit! Can you say General goddam Motors?! Chrysler?! However many banks now?! They *failed*!!! They practiced *bad* management until they *failed*!!! That's how *capitalism* works!!! Well goooooolleeeee! Lookee here! They're still out there in biddness now aren't they? I wonder why that is, Ron? gheezuz...
gus.
And when they failed they begged for government handouts! Socialist Bastards! It wasn't just the dems that gave them money... the reps are in bed with the bankers and their lobbyists too. Bush 43 was the first to bail out banks! BTW Last I heard the bankers and wall street are still in biddness. gheezuz...
Bullshit bullshit! Can you say General goddam Motors?! Chrysler?! However many banks now?! They *failed*!!! They practiced *bad* management until they *failed*!!! That's how *capitalism* works!!! Well goooooolleeeee! Lookee here! They're still out there in biddness now aren't they? I wonder why that is, Ron? gheezuz...
gus.
And when they failed they begged for government handouts! Socialist Bastards! It wasn't just the dems that gave them money... the reps are in bed with the bankers and their lobbyists too. Bush 43 was the first to bail out banks! BTW Last I heard the bankers and wall street are still in biddness. gheezuz...
You are running a little behind the thread. Ron and I have *no* disagreement with regard to party politics here. So the act of begging is merit enough for a reward? Hell yes it was "socialist"! So why did the *government* say yes?! What good are all the goddam regulations in the world, if you are going to be propped up by our tax dollars, even if you go broke? I never bought shit from GM, and they don't owe me a dime, so why am I even involved here?
And why didn't Citi, Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs and Bank of America fail? How about AIG??? They didn't fail because our government pumped them full of tax money that will never be paid back!!! I guess all Pigs are Equal....just that some Pigs are more equal then others.....
Glenn Beck hates 9/11 survivors. Shocking as Glenn Beck claimed that he hates 9/11 survivors. The Fox news personality and media clown has always been an outrageous demagogue, a pied piper to the illiterate, unwashed masses that make up the Fox news audience. Michael Stone,Examiner.com
BILL MOYERS: That's the progressive Representative from Ohio, Marcy Kaptur, she's with me now. She has a Masters from the University of Michigan, did graduate study at M.I.T. and still lives in the same house in the Toledo working class neighborhood where she grew up.
She's in her 14th term in Congress, the longest-serving Democratic woman in the history of the House, and she's an outspoken financial watchdog on three important Committees: Appropriations, Budget and Oversight and Government Reform.
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she's been in charge...
she is the overseer who did nothing to help and everything to hurt the system
SIMON JOHNSON: Remember Wall Street convinced us that trading derivatives without any regulation, that all these kind of crazy housing loans, which are very dangerous for consumers. That all of this was sensible. All of this was a good way to sustain growth. That was wrong. That wasn't it. That wasn't that's not the end of the story. In the crisis, when things got bad, they also convinced the key people in Washington that they, the bankers, the big bankers, the Wall Street bankers, who are really responsible for all of these problems, they should be saved. Not just their banks, but they individually and should be saved. Their jobs, their pensions, all their perks. It's an extraordinary moment.
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with liberals having been in charge in washington for most of the last 80 years
including marcy kaptur
now the liberals blame the banks that they were in charge of overseeing
why didn't they remove bad policy?
because it elected them
wall street has always been the same
the government has had regulatory power...
and made poor decisions
if you hate capitalism
you hate the founding system under which this great country became a beacon to the liberation of millions under the thumbs of socialist/fascist despots
if you hate capitalism
you hate the system that has brought more people out of poverty than any other in history
if you hate capitalism
you hate America
because America was founded and has thrived under individual liberty and private property rights for its entire existence
and it is under capitalism that people are even able to begin to shake off the shackles of tyranny ...the tyranny of despots and of systems (like Marxism/socialism/fascism) that have proven ...through out history to enslave one neighbor/citizen ...for the sake of another
whether it be an elite political tyrant with his heel on the neck of the working average citizen
or your own neighbor who would enslave you by being the looter or moocher that uses the guns of government to take what you have earned for himself...or some other parasite who refuses to earn it on his own ....and would use your labor for his benefit without your permission...
who is the slave and who is the master?
the master is the looter
the master is the moocher
the working productive man has become the slave in a society that refuses to recognize property rights and individual liberty
and those who excuse that slavery are destined to die in its shaky crushing grasp as you vote in more and more oppression on your neighbor....it will come finally around to you...
then you will be the victim of the historically repetitive crush of socialistic slavery that you have condoned and even endorsed for your neighbor
because you hate capitalism
and envy those who use freedom in a productive way for themselves
while you swelter in your own failure to support yourself
or profit from your thieving /looting laws that take what your neighbor has earned and use it for your own benefit without his permission
This message has been edited by gillis7 on Oct 13, 2009 10:17 PM
Did you see and hear that line in Detroit the other day, waiting on their "Obamamoney"? That's the Democrat voting base. The Dems have been promising them "Obamamoney" for 40 years. Look at all that progress. It's why they call themselves "progressives".
Yes, there is a lot to talk about former President Johnson's failures. This is the President who single handedly turned the Black American family from an intact family unit. You know the Nuclear Family Unit that we use to pride ourselves of having, and turned the black family unit to the single mom with children while the black father is now where to be seen.
Yes, there is a lot to talk about former President Johnson's failures. This is the President who single handedly turned the Black American family from an intact family unit. You know the Nuclear Family Unit that we use to pride ourselves of having, and turned the black family unit to the single mom with children while the black father is now where to be seen.
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i agree that's a key problem
and i agree that LBJ caused many problems
but how did he keep fathers from taking care of their families
i think that was/is cultural failure
poverty does not cause moral failure in fathers
there are many nations that are actually poor (as opposed to the microwave/satellite/cell phone/pizza "poor " we have here )and the fathers would never abandon their children....because the culture would not allow it
This message has been edited by gillis7 on Oct 15, 2009 8:09 AM
but how did he keep fathers from taking care of their families
It was written in the law. The women could not collect welfare checks if a man was in the house to support them; therefore, men stayed away. I had one Black woman in my class who had 5 children all by different men and her mother wanted her to have another just for payments. That is compassionate liberalism.
i think that was/is cultural failure
poverty does not cause moral failure in fathers
No, it is the failure of liberalism. They pay people to have children; therefore, there is no need for education to learn skills and get jobs. Having babies is the fastest way to the paycheck. AND, it bought the Black Vote.
there are many nations that are actually poor (as opposed to the microwave/satellite/cell phone/pizza "poor " we have here )and the fathers would never abandon their children....because the culture would not allow it
It is the Marxist philosophy and the Socialist philosophy. TAKIE from each according to his ability to produce and give to each according to his need. A new baby needs money for food. Liberals pay the money and are called compassionate.
That proves that the Liberals/socialists/communists are materialistic and greedy. Notice how they kill the unborn and have a death panel for the elderly. Why? a death panel? Obvious -- it is too expensive to keep them alive.
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Glenn Beck hates 9/11 survivors. Shocking as Glenn Beck claimed that he hates 9/11 survivors. The Fox news personality and media clown has always been an outrageous demagogue, a pied piper to the illiterate, unwashed masses that make up the Fox news audience. Michael Stone,Examiner.com
