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Dalmatian Latin - Language of Illyricum and Illyrians!!!

September 27 2002 at 4:36 AM
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Dalmatius  (no login)

 
Dalmatian language

This language existed until the end of the 19th century, when in 1898 its last speaker died. It used to be spoken on the Adriatic shores of nowadays Croatia and on the along islands.

There were two dialects of it: Vegliotian in the north and Ragusan in the south. We believe the language was in use since Roman colonists came here in the last centuries BC, but the first mentioning about it in linguistic literature appeared only in 1842, later all dialects were recorded, and linguists found several documents written in it in archives of Dubrovnik (former Ragusa).

The structure of it was fully West Romance. Numerous phonetic interchanges (kenur "to dine" - kaina "dinner") existed in it, which cannot be found neither in Italian, nor in Balkano-Romance languages.

Dalmatian was moving towards analytization: nouns and adjectives were losing their gender and number inflections, though verbs preserved masculine and feminine, singular and plural.

The definite article was used like a preposition (compare Romanian and Aromanian: a postposition article). The noun declension completely disappeared, and verb conjugation started to do the same.

Dalmatian vocabulary contains the majority of words from Latin origin, though the percentage of Slavic (Serbo-Croatian) words is rather high as well. The language used the Latin alphabet with some diacritical marks.

http://indoeuro.bizland.com/tree/ital/dalmatian.html

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Istroromanian language

This is considered by some linguists a dialect of Romanian language, but it bears some independent traits and in fact originated not from Romanian, but from Dalmatian language, spoken several centuries ago in Dalmatia and now extinct.

Istroromanian speakers are isolated as a linguistic island in Istria, the peninsula belonging to Croatia. Nowadays it is spoken actually in some Croatian villages in the northeast of the Istrian Peninsula. Speakers: from 1,500 to 3,500 according to different sources. So the language is considered quite endangered, and needs a revival seriously.

Roman settlements in Illyria first brought Latin language to this lands, where people spoke Illyrian and Venetic languages then. The mixture of those tongues with later additions of Slavic and other elements created the interesting structure and vocabulary of different varieties of Istroromanian language.

Among them, we can mention Istriot dialect, was used to be spoken in Croatia, in the western coast of the Istrian Peninsula, now only in towns of Rovinj (Rovigno) and Vodnjan (Dignano), by less than 1.000 speakers. The relationship of Istriot with other romance languages of the area (Italian and Friulian) is not still clear.

The Dalmatian language, the ancestor of Istroromanian, is an extinct Romance language also known with other names: Ragusan, Vegliot. It was widely spoken in Croatia along the coast of Dalmatia. Last it was seen in the town of Krk (Veglia) where it became extinct in 1898, formerly also in Zadar and Dubrovnik (Ragusa).

Istroromanian keeps many Latin features and morphological forms. See, for example, personal pronouns compared to Latin ones:

io : ego
tu : tu
ie : illus
io : illa
noi : nos
voi : vos
el'i : illi
eale : illae

The verb structure was simplified, but preserved infinitive, tenses and participles.

http://indoeuro.bizland.com/tree/ital/istro.html


 
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Dalmatius
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September 27 2002, 4:49 AM 

Romance languages - Dalmatian

Many Romance dialects have virtually ceased to be spoken in the 20th century. Of these, Dalmatian is the most striking, its last known speaker, one Tuone Udaina (Italian Antonio Udina), having been blown up by a land mine in 1898.

He was the main source of knowledge for his parents' dialect (that of the island of Veglia [modern Krk], though he was hardly an ideal informant; Vegliot Dalmatian was not his native language, and he had learned it only from listening to his parents' private conversations.

Moreover, he had not spoken the language for 20 years at the time he acted as an informant, and he was deaf and toothless as well. Most of the other evidence for Dalmatian derives from documents from Zara (modern Zadar) and Ragusa (modern Dubrovnik) dating to the 13th–16th centuries.

It is possible that, apart from isolated pockets, the language was then replaced by Croatian and, to a lesser extent, by Venetian (a dialect of Italian). It is certain, even from scanty evidence, that Dalmatian was a language in its own right, noticeably different from other Romance languages.

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On the Istrian Peninsula of Croatia close to the island of Krk, another Romance variety precariously survives with probably fewer than one thousand speakers; known as Istriot, it may be related to Vegliot.

Though some scholars connect it with Rhaetian Friulian dialects or with Venetian dialects of Italian, others maintain that it is an independent language. There are no texts except those collected by linguists.

A little farther north in the same peninsula, another Romance dialect, Istro-Romanian, is threatened with extinction. Usually classified as a Romanian dialect, it may have been carried to the Istrian Peninsula by Romanians from the northwestern part of the Balkan Peninsula who took refuge from the Turks in the 16th and 17th centuries; it has undergone strong Croatian influence.

The first evidence of its existence is a short list of words in a historical work of 1698; there are also collections of folklore texts from the 19th century, but it is otherwise unwritten. Another isolated Romanian dialect that may be nearing extinction is Megleno-Romanian (Meglenitic), from a mountainous region of Macedonia, just west of the Vardar River, on the border between the Republic of Macedonia and Greece.

In 1914 there were 13,000 speakers, but many have emigrated to Asia Minor, other parts of what was once Yugoslavia, and Romania, where small pockets survive (they numbered about 5,000 in the late 1990s). The only texts are those transcribed from oral traditions.

http://www.britannica.com/eb/article?eu=118108&tocid=74691&query=dalmatian

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Dalmatian language

extinct Romance language formerly spoken along the Dalmatian coast from the island of Veglia (modern Krk) to Ragusa (modern Dubrovnik). Ragusan Dalmatian probably disappeared in the 17th century; the Vegliot Dalmatian dialect became extinct in the 19th century.

"Dalmatian language" Encyclopædia Britannica
http://www.britannica.com/eb/article?eu=726

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Dalmatius
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September 27 2002, 4:52 AM 

Cited from
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Parthenon/6502/
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Neo-Dalmatian Language Page

Neo-Dalmatian is a reconstruction of the now-extinct Dalmatian, or Vegliot, language. I have collected as many words as I could find that were recorded in Vegliot, and established the patterns of their development from Vulgar Latin, and following these patterns I have reconstructed the Vocabulary.

The Grammar and Syntax was more problematic. I was unable to find anything of use in regards to the grammatical structure of the Vegliot language. Thus I was forced to "create" a grammar. The Neo-Dalmatian grammar is loosely based on Romanian, French and Italian.

Presently there are three speakers of Neo-Dalmatian, one of us being more fluent than the other two. Regardless I would not say it is endangered, for more people are learning it even now (well, okay, my sister and my girlfriend, but hey, that IS an increase!).

I have tried to be as accurate as possible in the reconstruction of the vocabulary, and I feel that I have done a (barely) passable job. As for the grammar, it probably has very little to do with the grammar of Vegliot.

I gladly welcome any suggestions or objections. I know I've made mistakes that will probably hurt the eyes and brains of Romanticists, but 90% of the languages I have studied, examined or speak are Uralic (I'm surprised I didn't "invent" a new Uralic language!), so if you come across anything you feel I should change, please tell me

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Chrestomathia Neodalmatica

Úna krestomátia da la langa neodalmátika ku úna deskripsión gramatikál da la lánga, ku úna glosúra, e ku des tékstas, túti ku traduksiónes in-a la langa engléza.



A chrestomathy of the Neo-Dalmatian language with a grammatical outline, a glossary, and texts with English translations.

 
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sarajevointercity
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September 27 2002, 5:02 AM 

Dalmatian language has once fully belonged in the Romance group. That old language (the original language of Illyria before coming of Slavs - Dalmatian Latin) has been gradually replaced by the Slavic language - Croatian languagea.

But even today the language of Dalmatia is certainly not the same language as the one spoken in Slavonia. In the dalmatian dialect there is a strong influence of latinisms and italian words, what makes the language spoken in Dalmatian unique.

 
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Jurica Lausic
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September 27 2002, 5:05 AM 

Principal language in Dalmatia is, like in any other part of Croatia, Croatian language.

In Dalmatia, if we mean on area that was a province in Austro-Hungarian Empire (under Austrian- ruled part), only Croatian language is spoken. Inhabitants are Croats.

There are two dialects of Croatian language, that are spoken in Dalmatia; CHAKAVIAN and SHTOKAVIAN. Chakavian kept many characteristics of Old Croatian (by forms, lexic, accentuation etc.) and it is the oldest and most archaic dialect of Croatian. Shtokavian dialect had got its current form 3 or 4 centuries ago. Shtokavian is much more homogenous than Chakavian dialect of Croatian. Chakavian dialect is very irregular.

So, in Shtokavian dialect, the word for "grandma" is "baba" or "baka".
In some Chakavian dialect areas word for "grandma" is also "baba" or "baka".
In Chakavian dialect, word for "grandma" is "nona" (spoken similarly to italian, but with "shorter" n; in italian is like "nonna"). The other form is "nuone" (N + diphtong UO, similar to "wa-" in "water" + N + E, like in "Ed"; in this form there is long-falling accentuation on first and short-rising accentuation on last syllable; but, in some areas, long-rising accentuation comes on first and falling accentuation on last syllable).

Maybe this will hard for someone to pronounce or to spell these words, but this mottled accentuation gave to Chakavian dialect the title of most melodic speech of Croatian language.

Foreign words in Chakavian dialect come from: - romance Dalmatian language,
- Venetian dialect of Italian
- other dialects of Italian that are on italian side of Adriatic
- Old Greek language - and words from Mediterranean koine (language of people whose lives and professions are closely tied them to sea: sailors, navigators, merchant navy, shippers, ship-owners, workers in shipyards and drydocks, ports, including administrative personnel, lighthouses, navy, fishermen and other professions connected to extracting of sea-goods...) Chakavians` lives are very tied to sea.

Foreign influences in coastal Shtokavian dialect come from the same languages as above; in inner Shtokavian dialect those influences came in smaller amount, but there are words that come from Turkish language.

Chakavians mostly live on coastal and island areas, and Shtokavians live in bigger coastal cities,in coastal areas southern from river Cetina and mostly in innerland. The old Republic of Dubrovnik, was originally Chakavian; throught centuries, it shtokavized.

Dalmatian language is an extinct romance language, that was spoken on eastern Adriatic coast. It was a barbarized Latin language, the language of romanized Illyrians (by the way, Dalmatia got its name after Illyrian word "d`lma", "sheep". That word come from non-romanized Illyrian language, that is considered as ancestor of Albanian language.

Dalmatian language, however, got its name after Byzantium empire`s province of Dalmatia, that was spread on scattered areas on eastern Adriatic coast, in "pockets". That province was remnant of ancient Roman Empire`s province Dalmatia, that spread on much larger area than ever later.

Last speaker of that language, that actively spoke it, was living on the island of Krk. He died in 1898. The other speakers of Dalmatian language assimilated in Croats, with whome they were in contact since (probably) 6th, but surely since 7th century.

In 19th century, Austro-Hungarian Empire has drawn new borders of Dalmatia. Dalmatian dog comes from THAT Dalmatia.

 
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Dàvide Sivèro
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September 27 2002, 5:07 AM 

The principal language today spoken in Dalmatia is Croatian. Once the Romance Dalmatian language was spoken, but it was replaced by Croatian in the country and to some extent in the cities and by Venetian in the cities.

Dalmatian belonged to the eastern branch of Romance languages together with Italian and Rumanian, while Venetian is considered by most linguists as a dialect of a language, called variously "Northern Italian [aware that it isn't a dialect of Italian proper]", "Padanian", etc., belonging to the western branch of Romance languages together with Spanish, French, Portuguese, Occitan, etc.

Venetian is still spoken in some coastal cities (Zadar, Split).

 
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bosko denona
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September 27 2002, 5:08 AM 

A few words of contribution to this very interesting discussion.

It is still not clear whether the medieval dalmatian language in the cities of dalmatia was substituted by venetian , or venetian was introduced when dalmatian was already dissapeared from everyday use?

What is exactly the meaning of "lingua franca" that, according to some venetian documents, was spoken in Dalmatia?

 
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Joseph Mangan
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September 27 2002, 5:10 AM 

In response to Bosko Denona, Lingua Franca was the original lingua franca, an artificial language used throughout the Mediterranean as a koine in the Middle Ages, whose vocabulary was based mainly on Occitan and Italian dialects, supplemented by words from Catalan, Castillian Spanish, Portuguese, Greek, Arabic, Turkish and Croatian.

Grammar was almost non-existent.Its users included merchants and sailors. It was also used by Christian slaves of different nationalities in Muslim countries, between themselves and in communication with local Muslims. It survived in Algeria until the French arrived in 1830.

I would be interested to know which Croatian words are of Lingua Franca, as opposed to Italian, Venetian or Dalmatian origin.

More information can be had by searching google for lingua franca, especially the following :

A Glossary of Lingua Franca - 41k
http://www.uwm.edu/~corre/franca/edition2/lingua.2.html

 
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M.D. Arneri
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September 27 2002, 5:11 AM 

The Old dalmatian is Offically Extinct, however there are still people who speak it. The lingo has died out on mainland but the islands (especially the once further away) are still chating in 2/5 at least Dalmatian.

I would love to get in contact with anyone interested in bringing the old language back to the surface and into the daily life of people. The vegliot dialect is one of most interesting broken latin scripts that I have come across. And would be really sad to see it disapear. Thank you


 
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Dalmatius
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Sample of Dalmatian Latin

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September 27 2002, 5:26 AM 

Dalmatian (Extinct)

Sample: Tuota nuester, che te sante intel sil: sait santificuot el naun to. Vigna el raigno to. Sait fuot la voluntuot toa, coisa in sil, coisa in tiara. Duote costa dai el pun nuester cotidiun. E remetiaj le nuestre debete, coisa nojiltri remetiaime a i nuestri debetuar. E naun ne menur in tentatiaun, miu deleberiajne dal mal.


Translation: So when you pray, you should pray like this: Our Father in heaven, we pray that your name will always be kept holy. We pray that your kingdom will come, and that the things you want will be done here on earth, the same as in heaven. Give us the food we need for each day. Forgive the sins we have done, the same as we have forgiven the people that did wrong to us. Don't let us be tempted, but save us from the Evil One.

Statistics: Croatia (0) - Total (0)
Classification: Indo-European | Italic

http://www.language-museum.com/d/dalmatian.htm


 
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Dalmatius
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September 27 2002, 5:47 AM 

HISTORY

The meaning of the name Dalmatia or Delmatia, which is of Arnautic origin, is "land of shepherds" (delminium — pasture for sheep). The earliest mention of the name occurs at the time of the fall of the southern Illyric kingdom, 167 B.C. The people who dwelt near the rivers Neretva and Krka formed a league against the advancing Romans. Their principal town was Delminium, on the present plain of Sinj, or possibly Duvno in Herzegovina, and after that city the tribes called themselves Delmati, or Dalmati, 170 B.C. The islands were peopled by the Greeks; but the mainland by the Illyrians. The Dalmatian league soon came into conflict with the Romans.

In 153 B.C. the Roman Senate sent envoys to negotiate with the Dalmatians, but they returned complaining that they were received in an unfriendly manner, and that they would have been killed if they had not secretly escaped. During the next year war broke out. Finally Publius Cornelius Scipio Nasica conquered the land and demolished the city of Delminium. The Romans' success was incomplete; they must subdue the neighbouring Illyrians and Celts if they wished to retain the whole of Dalmatia.

The two new consuls had to march from Gaul to Illyrium and occupy the city of Segestica, now Sisak, thence to invade Dalmatia and capture the city of Salona. The consul Metellus carried out this plan, defeated the enemy in 118 B.C., and celebrated a triumph at Rome, receiving the title Dalmaticus (117). The Roman Senate now created the large province of Illyricum, extending southward to the River Drim, northward as far as the Julian Alps and the River Sava.

The principal strategic point and fortress in this new province was the city of Salona (Solin). But the Dalmatians did not patiently bear the Roman yoke and tribute. Many uprisings broke out until the time of Octavian, who came to Illyricum in 40 B.C., and subjugated all the tribes; he made the rivers Drava and Danube the northern boundaries of the Roman possessions and sailed on them in his triremes. Later, when emporer, he broke the power of the Dalmatian and Pannonian tribes who tried again to throw off the Roman rule. The insurrection started in the year 6 B.C. and ended in A.D. 9. The power of the rebels was crushed and their country devastated. Since the Punic wars Rome had not been in as critical a situation as during this insurrection suppressed by Tiberius.





From this date begins the Romanizing of Illyricum. This province now received the name of Dalmatia and comprised all the land south of the River Sava, within which were many famous watering places, such as Aquæ Jassæ (the Varazdinske toplice of today), Aquæ Balissæ (Lipik in Croatia), and much mineral wealth exploited by them, as appears from their remains today. The Roman rule in Dalmatia ended with the entry of Christianity and the invasion of the northern nations.

The Romans persecuted the Christians in Dalmatia and Pannonia, but they flourished nevertheless. St. Paul sent his disciple Titus to Dalmatia, who founded the first Christian see in the city of Salona and consecrated it with his blood A.D. 65. St. Peter sent St. Domnius. Salona became the centre from which Christianity spread. In Pannonia St. Andronicus founded the See of Syrmium (Mitrovica) and later those of Siscia and Mursia.

The cruel persecution under Diocletian, who was a Dalmatian by birth, left numerous traces in Old Dalmatia and Pannonia. St. Quirinus, Bishop of Siscia, died a martyr A.D. 303. St. Jerome was born in Strido, a city on the border of Pannonia and Dalmatia. After the fall of the Western Empire in 476, peace never came to Dalmatia. She successively fell into the power of Odoacer, Theodoric, and Justinian. The Goths were Arians, but they did not persecute the Catholics.

Two provincial church councils were held at Salona — 530 and 532. The Western Empire was succeeded by the Ostro-Goths, after whose fall in 555 Dalmatia came under Byzantine power. In A.D. 598 the khan of the Avars advanced from Syrmium through Bosnia, devastated Dalmatia, and demolished forty cities. In A.D. 600 appeared the Slavs, who entered Dalmatia. Pope Gregory the Great wrote to Maxim, Archbishop of Salona: "Et de Slavorum gente, quæ vobis valde imminet, affligor vehementer et conturbor. Affligor in his, quæ iam in vobis patior; conturbor quia per Istriæ aditum iam Italiam intrare coeperunt".




In the seventh century Dalmatia received the dominant element of its present population, the Croats. In the ninth century we find the Croatian influence at its height, and the Croatian princes recognized as Kings of Dalmatia. At the time of Thomislav there were held two councils at Spljet for the whole of Dalmatia and Croatia. The legates of the Holy See, John, Bishop of Ancona and Leo, Bishop of Præneste, were present. Pope John X wrote a letter to Thomislav, King of the Croats and all the people of Dalmatia. In this he reminded the king of the Anglo-Saxons, to whom Gregory I sent not only Christianity, but also culture and education.

The council met in 925 to decide the question of the primacy of the Sees of Nin and Spljet; to re-establish rules of discipline, to settle administrative questions arising from disputes about the boundaries of dioceses, and finally to show the reason for using the Old Croatian language at Mass. On this occasion Bishop Grgur Ninski energetically defended the right of the Croatians to use that language. Pope Leo VI decreed by his Bull that the primate of Dalmatia and Croatia should be the Archbishop of Spljet.

All the decisions of the councils were sent to Rome for confirmation. The See of Nin was suppressed in 928, when the See of Spljet renounced the jurisdiction of the Patriarch of Constantinople and submitted to the Holy See. At the next council, held 1059-60 at Spljet, permission was given to use the Greek and Latin languages at Mass. The use of the old Croatian language was often forbidden, but never abolished.

During the following centuries the history of Dalmatia is closely connected with that of Croatia. In the course of time, however, Venice extended her authority over Dalmatia. Venice never gained the affection of the Dalmatian people. By the treaty of Campo Formio in 1797 she lost Dalmatia, which came under Austrian rule, under which is has continued to the present time with the exception of Napoleonic times (1805-1814).

The feeling towards Austria was not friendly, as the outbreak in 1869 shows. This was put down by force of arms in February of the next year. Influential patriots, the members of the home Diet, and the delegates in the Reichstag at Vienna are working to carry out the provisions of the fundamental law requiring the union of Dalmatia with the mother-country, Croatia, which the king promised in a solemn oath at his coronation.




The literature of Dalmatia from its beginning in the eleventh century was inspired by the Catholic Church and remained so until the rise of Humanism. Numerous private and public libraries existed, containing thousands of volumes (1520). The art of printing found its way to Dalmatia as early as the end of the fifteenth century. The first Humanists such as Mencetic, Bobali, Pucic, Gucetic, Marulic wrote in Latin and Croatian and produced many varieties of literature: the drama, lyrics, epics, bucolics, comedies, religious, and gypsy poetry. Dalmatia has in fact been called the cradle of Croatian literature. The city of Dubrovnik was spoken of as another Athens. Architecture flourished greatly, as is proved by the existing monuments.


http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/04606b.htm

 
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Dalmatius
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Sample of Istriot (Dalmatian origin)

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October 16 2002, 10:56 AM 

Istriot

Sample: Salve, o Regeina, mare de mi/aricuordia, veita, dulcisa e sparansa, salve: A Tei femo ricurso nui suspiremo, dulenduse, piurando in sta val da lagrame. Dai, Avucata nuostra stande a varda cu i uoci Tuovi mi/aricuordiu/i , e duopo stu i ilio fande vidi Gi/ou , frouto banadito deli veisare Tuove , o clamente , o pietu/a, o viergina dulsa, Mareia.

Translation: Hail Mary, full of grace. The Lord is with thee. Blessed are thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God. Pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen.

Statistics: Croatia (1,000) - Total (1,000)
Classification: Indo-European | Italic

http://www.language-museum.com/i/istriot.htm

 
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Great-Albania
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Re: Dalmatian Latin - Language of Illyricum and Illyrians!!!

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April 4 2006, 6:23 PM 

DALMATIA


Old Ages

Illyria and the Roman Empire
The history of Dalmatia began when the tribe from which the country derives its name declared itself independent of Gentius, the Illyrian king, and established a republic. Its capital was Delminium (current name Tomislavgrad); its territory stretched northwards from the river Neretva to the river Cetina, and later to the Krka, where it met the confines of Liburnia.

The Roman Empire began its occupation of Illyria in the year 168 B.C., forming the Roman province of Illyricum. In 156 B.C. the Dalmatians were for the first time attacked by a Roman army and compelled to pay tribute. In AD 10, during the reign of Augustus, Illyricum was split into Pannonia in the north and Dalmatia in the south, after the last of many formidable revolts had been crushed by Tiberius in AD 9. This event was followed by total submission and a ready acceptance of the Latin civilization which overspread Illyria.


Position of Dalmatia in the Roman Empire
The province of Dalmatia spread inland to cover all of the Dinaric Alps and most of the eastern Adriatic coast. Its capital was in the city of Salona (Solin). Emperor Diocletian made Dalmatia famous by building a palace for himself a few kilometers south of Salona, in Aspalathos/Spalatum. Other Dalmatian cities at the time were:

Tarsatica
Senia
Vegium
Aenona
Iader
Scardona
Tragurium
Aequum
Oneum
Issa
Pharus
Bona
Corcyra
Narona
Epidaurus
Rhizinium
Acruvium
Olcinium
Scodra
Epidamnus/Dyrrachium
The collapse of the Western Empire left this region subject to Gothic rulers, Odoacer and Theodoric the Great, from 476 to 535, when it was added by Justinian I to the Eastern (Byzantine) Empire.


Middle Ages

Medieval city-states and the country
Following the great Slavic migration into Illyria in the first half of the 7th century, Dalmatia became distinctly divided between two different communities:

The coast, except few town, and hinterland populated by Croats, besides the Romanicized Illyrian natives (and Celtic in the north), *The Byzantine enclaves populated by the native Romance-speaking descendants of Romans and Illyrians, who lived safely in Ragusa, Iadera, Tragurium, Spalatum and some other coastal towns.
These towns remained powerful because they were highly civilized (because of their connection with the Byzantium) and also fortified. The Croats were at the time barely in the process of becoming Christianized. The two different communities were frequently hostile at first.

In 806 the Dalmatian Croat was temporarily added to the Frankish Empire, but the cities were restored to Byzantium by the Treaty of Aachen in 812. The treaty had also slightly expanded the Dalmatian Croatia. The Saracens raided the southernmost cities in 840 and 842, but this threat was eliminated by a common Frankish-Byzantinian campaign of 871.





Croatian Dalmatia
Since the 850s the Principality of Dalmatia became known as the Duchy of the Croats. This duchy was also called Coastal Croatia and Dalmatian Croatia, because its used to be the old Slavic Principality of Dalmatia. This Duchy, and later, Kingdom, had its capitals in Dalmatia: Biaci, Nin, Split, Knin, Solin and elsewhere. Also, the Croatian noble tribes, that had a right to choose Croatian duke (later the king), were from Dalmatia: Karinjani and Lapcani, Polecici, Tugomirici, Kukari, Snacici, Gusici, Šubici (from which later developed very powerful noble family Zrinski), Mogorovici, Lacnicici, Jamometici and Kacici. Within the borders of ancient Roman Dalmatia, the Croatian nobles of Krk, or Krcki (from which later developed very powerful noble family Frankopan) were from Dalmatia as well.

The establishment of cordial relations between the cities and the Croatian dukedom seriously began with the reign of Duke Mislav (835), who signed an official peace treaty with Pietro, doge of Venice in 840 and who also started giving land donations to the churches from the cities. Dalmatia's first Croatian Duke, Trpimir, founder of the House of Trpimir and the Duchy of Croats, greatly expanded the new Duchy to include territories all the way to the river of Drina, thereby including entire Bosnia in his wars against the Bulgar Khans and their Serbian subjects. Croat's Duke Tomislav had created the Kingdom of Croatia in 924 or 925, crowned on Duvanjsko polje, unifying two Croatian duchies, Dalmatian and Pannonian. His powerful realm extended influence further southwards to Pagania, and even Zachlumia slightly


i do agree with you that dalmatian language is indo-european +italic somehow

 
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bosnuk
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Re: Dalmatian Latin - Language of Illyricum and Illyrians!!!

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April 3 2008, 6:30 AM 

ju favlua cota langa ko se klamu dalmatsun

 
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