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LATER YEARS - not the same as earlier years.

December 21 2010 at 10:04 PM
Rick  (Login recreation)
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from IP address 98.165.81.74

 
My later years-- now in my 50's -- don't feel at all like my younger years... 20s, 30s, even 40s. I'd say things changed really rapidly from age 50 to 53. I'm afraid for my future now. I don't feel like I have "time" anymore. There are problems I can't resolve... as I thought I could when younger. I'm not "set up" for later years... at all. I'm in trouble in many ways... and I have to unload cryonics expenses... as well as a lot of other expenses... and be much more careful... I can't take the agony and pain of mistakes anymore. All this might lead to my resignation of my Alcor membership... costing more and more... with the concept of a 50K policy maintaining its worth long gone...

Even Rudi's offer of 100K insurance through a transfer plan... which would cost more than twice my current policy-- consider economical-- is not going to be viable for me, I don' think. Membership is too costly relative to other costs I have in my life now... and the urgent need to save more... for my "late late" years...

My situation is not conducive to the easy going way I had earlier about cryonics... the idea that it would all work out somehow... it's not working out "somehow"... not at all. I wonder if this is what all those Alcor dropouts go through that Alcor publishes but never comments on? They write about the "net gain" in members.... as if the loss of members is just a number... when they're actual human beings with stories to tell... and they never do despite the interent. I've never seen a member on Cryonet write "I had to drop my membership today because"...

I'm the only writer online who is confessing to things I'm confessing to. Why is that? Is there something wrong with me? Or do I understand what the whole purpose of writing is in an ostensibly free society... turning more and more fascistic, corporatist and dumbed down? See the blogs on google blogsearch and you'll get guys like Reason, or Maxim or the Oregon crowd... but never the cryonics dropouts. I might be the first cryonics dropout who continues to write.




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Rick
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Be sure to look at my index on this entire issue of PALM.

December 22 2010, 3:07 PM 

PALM is Pre Arranged Last Minute cryonics and I had it put on the agenda for the Jan 7 board meeting...

If I can't get that set up then I'll do a straight freeze as a protest... it won't be cryonics but body freezing as a protest against death... there will be "no rush"... and I'll have the local "removal service" drop my dead warm body off at Alcor's back door... so they won't even have to go get me with a standby team. I'll be in a black bag.. It's more symbolic and expressive than anything at that point... but it's very doable for 50K decades into the future I suspect.... especially if I pay my own cab fare.

I need someone at Alcor to act as executor or trustee of my trust, however-- I haven't seen any of the inner circle or big wigs write about that openly. Here's where unpersons idea of cryonics as religion comes into play... church communities usually help one another out that way... so that's what cryonics should be is a sort of church community. Lately, it looks like we could use a bake sale and a carwash to raise funds too. We could run an Alcor Bingo game too.

Click on INDEX in the top left corner for more crazy ideas and comments related to my Prospect of Mortality given the fact that Alcor is pricing themselves out of the market.

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Rick
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DROPOUT thread in Cold Filter

December 23 2010, 11:35 AM 

http://www.network54.com/Forum/291677/message/1293039436/a+cryonics+economics-dropout+tells+his+story+online

Mark Plus points endlessly to my participation in Stockgeneration which was a bubble just like any other bubble in real estate, the dot.com's, or derivatives in general. I saw SG as a bubble that ordinary people could participate in... it crashed for the same reason the bigger bubbles crash... including things like the propped up Euro.. and now the hyperinflating USdollar... I thinking at the time was to participate in the SG bubble temporarily, then get into the physical real economy... Mark doesn't tell my whole story-- neither does the Wired article either. Mark attacks Larouche not knowing that Laoruche stands for physical economy... and the end of bubbles.

Matt wrote

In some respect, Rick should be very pleased. He has been predicting the end of the world through financial collapse and hyperinflation for a long time. He has also repeatedly vented his frustrations at Alcor for not listening to his advice. Now, Alcor appears to be taking a stronger interest in their long-term financial obligations and pegging prices along a plot with inflation. The unfortunate irony is that Rick didn't take his own financial advice, but all may not be lost. CI only charges a small fraction of what Alcor charges, so he can easily change the beneficiary of his insurance policy

My comment-- I don't understand how I'm viewed as not taking my own "advice"... I didn't really offer advice... there's just nothing to be done... As far as CI's lower prices... it doesn't really work out that way... as I just discussed an option with CI with Rudy. It turns out I would pay the same with a CI /SA combo package as with Alcor.... Matt is behind the curve on this one.

Neither Mark nor Matt speak to their points with full awareness of what they're talking about. They also have a less than conciliatory relation with me personally... its actually hostile... due to my Larouche position. Anything they can use against me to make me look bad, they'll use.

 
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Rick
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Matt's CI advice doesn't work without SA standby/transport-- making CI 28K plan pointless

December 24 2010, 8:16 AM 

Matt wrote

Also, you can move to Michigan. At CI, you can get a lifetime membership for $1,250, and cryopreservation is only $28,000. By your own account, you have already put in $20,000 into cryonics, and you still have your $50,000 life insurance policy. This means that your insurance policy is nearly double what is required by CI.

My comment...
This might be the case, but Rudi was pointing me to a CI/SA situation that covers SA standby/transport + CI using an upgraded 100K policy... I'll email Rudy and ask him about this further. Now that Max More is CEO of Alcor, I'll wait and see if there are going to be any policy changes. Max will preside over the Jan 7 board meeting where my PALM plan will be on the agenda. I just don't want to pay higher dues and I'd rather see the grandfathering reconfirmed... If these things are not dealt with, I'll do something more radical.


Matt's retort about my warnings about the economy were neither to Alcor specifically, nor anything I could specifically do anything about.. but have been in the nature of raising awarenss of the past 40 years of destruction of the economy... and generally what the solution is... he wrote
http://www.network54.com/Forum/291677/message/1293167896/Rick+Potvin%27s+response

As far as my position, I'm in no position to speculate on rare earth metals or anything else. We're all facing financial and industrial collapse together... Matt's survivalist tone indicates that he thinks he can survive a dark age. Good for him. The general picture is that most won't. And neither would cryonics. That's not "advice".. that's more of a warning about general conditions.

 
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Rick
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I'd like to know Matt's view on figuring a cryonics life insurance policy for inflation.

December 24 2010, 8:53 AM 

CI's charge is 28K but would this be true in 2057 AD when I'm 100 years old? (assuming my life expectency will be roughly that?). My answer is no... neither CI nor Alcor (as recently posted by Chapman) can hold the line on price with inflation and.. in Alcor's case, higher technology... or in CI's case, the addition of help by SA either in standby or air-transport...

So the question for Matt is... has he figured out how, in light of the lack of economies of scale to keep a lid on cryonics prices... and an expected continuation of lack of economy of scale.. combined with inflation and either higher tech at alcor or in CI's case... partnering with SA (thus increasing effectively the 28K rescue plan)... how we buy a "futures contract in cryonics" with life insurance that covers us at the end of our life "expectency" when cryonics would be performed? Has this been thought through enough?


 
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Rick
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DeRivas and the insurance policy transfer - cryonet msg

December 24 2010, 10:13 AM 

Derivas wrote
http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/dsp.cgi?msg=33128

My response.

It certainly IS transferrable... after I get the ownership of it back from Alcor which required ownership of it to process it quickly in the event of my deanimation. However... I'm not quite at that point. It's a 50K policy...

I talked with Rudi Hoffman a short time ago and he suggested cashing out of that policy (Lincoln Life -was Jefferson Pilot)... and with the $3000 or so current cash value, buy a new policy-- a 100K policy that would cover a CI + SA plan... I've never really understood the CI 28K plan that Matt referred to-- in that there is no provision for standby and transport... but with the CI + SA plan there would be...

I wrote Rudi to see why 50K doesn't cover CI 28K plan + 22K for SA standby and transport... apparently I need another 50K... which at age 53 and in my "weak economic position"... would probably not be something I'm likely to be interested in.

Max More just took over Alcor as CEO as of jan 1... so his policies may influence what I do. I originally paid $350 a year for Alcor membership but it's now $800/yr and has been jumping signifigantly every year for the past few years... I don't like that at all... over my NEXT 20 years... that would be 20K I could use for my later years... and I haven't "planned" "retirement" very well at all....

In addition to all of this... we see the recent expose via CPlatt and others about the grandfathering problem... inflation and higher tech.. .which all increase the price of cryonics over time making the 50K I bought years ago... worth less and less so that by 2057 when I'm 100... assuming I live that long... the 50K will no longer buy an Alcor washout and M22 anti-freeze. We're all scratching our heads trying to figure out why we didn't think of that.

Part of it has to do with the assumption that economy of scale would kick in which it hasn't. And probably won't. So I'm going to be "underfunded" no matter what. Even if I go with CI-- which to make it viable requires SA-- I'll need 100K... which in my case will cost me $110 a month at this point... .according to Rudi... including CI's lower membership fee.

DeRivas' idea repeats Matt's idea of going with CI but both ideas ignore that CI has no standby and transport... without CI... and even if one "moves close to CI", I'd still be "underfunded" with CI not being able to hold 28K over the next 30-50 years... my life expectency.

Cryonics might just "cost too much" in the "economic crash" we're seeing... and that'll be the end of it. At least that's the way it looks to me today.



 
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Rick
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I had hopes and dreams of making more money in my 20s-40s-- no longer.

December 25 2010, 6:18 AM 

In my 50's, I can understand and see that my hopes and dreams of making substantial money have evaporated... and now with the true cost of cryonics at my time of expected deanimation, I've lost hope that I can maintain the minimums that will be required for a decent preservation.

No log in needed at this time to post. Let's hear your story on your life insurance! The funding gap situation at Alcor is serious and demands everyone's attention.

 
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r
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I'd rather have the $20-40 in savings for later life than expensed in increasingly higher

September 5 2012, 7:46 AM 

...increasingly higher membership dues.

 
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John Kansevich
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costs

December 25 2010, 7:46 AM 

Ah, yes, so many others have had similar experiences. Especially now with Alcor's increase in funding fees. Myself, I lived just down the street from their facility for a time and then looked into C.I. thoroughly. Not only was C.I. much more affordable, but also more friendly and personable it seemed to me.

More recently I've rethought many existential matters. What I've concluded is that technology has advanced so rapidly that there are now actually alternatives to cryonics that make much more sense to me. I still believe cryonics does offer to preserve our brain's neurological patterns and such, so if one can afford it, then it's probably a fine added insurance.

My current trust, since I have become more of a "patternist" is with mindfiles and uploading and a cyber being immortality. This I firmly believe and am eternally grateful to the people who have offered us some means for actualizing this alternative and free of cost. You may contact me if you'd like to communicate further.

 
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Rick
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Terasem?

December 25 2010, 10:42 AM 

Terasem seems to be going that way. As far as CI goes, it might be true that they "seem" more affordable BUT .... have you read CPlatt on the funding gap... and how his formula works... ? CI is in the same bind. You have to take your life expectency into account... and gear the life insurance payout for that year... CI's promotion of 28K for a 50 year old now isn't going to work in 50 years... if you assume 100 year lifespan. Follow? Agree? Have you read Platt.

 
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Rick
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Mindfiles assumes an understanding of mind... which is something of a higher order

December 25 2010, 1:35 PM 

I'm watching terasem's mindfiles ideas here and there.. not in depth... I've had similar notions for a long time... ultimately... the idea of mind ... human mind is subject to discussion on this point... and so we have to look at some higher order of existence... where human mind operates...

I'm not convinced I can reproduce my mind in a machine... and am actually more hopeful that a proper written expression of ideas can be "taught" in a traditional "school" where "students" absorb the "mind" of the professor... whose mind is thus replicated... in multiple minds in the old fashioned way.

I take it you haven't heard that my mind has already been occupied by the Larouche "virus"... for the past 10 years... which is amusing because Terasem doesn't really provide any of the depth that the Larouche "mindfile" does... on many issues.... but this is old ground for me... it's a little funny. You might want to ask the Cold filter people about me... now that I'm online under my own name again. I trust they'll be moderately respectful. I hope that trust isn't misplaced of course.

I watched your video where you pledge alleigence to Terasem.. it's a bit unnerving since I am occupied by a mind virus that still believes in the anti-entropy of the sovereign nation-state... ahem... sorry. Thanks for the offer though!! happy.gif

No log in needed at this time to post. Let's hear your story on your life insurance! The funding gap situation at Alcor is serious and demands everyone's attention.

 
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