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ETTINGER - out of the loop?

December 22 2010 at 11:22 PM
Rick  (Login recreation)
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from IP address 98.165.81.74

 
Ettinger says he wants to focus on the technological gains-- when in fact the general overall concern of the cryonics community is the financial crisis. He's out of the loop. At 85, he should be telling all of us what his financials are... what insurance and what coverage he has... we're interested in his financials... this is the topic of the moment.

Here's his out of the loop post...
http://www.network54.com/Forum/291677/message/1293058324/Achievements

 
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Rick
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98.165.81.74

Ettinger back in the loop? -- with an interesting perspective.

December 25 2010, 1:39 PM 

http://www.network54.com/Forum/291677/message/1293301207/Achievements+%23+3




No log in needed at this time to post. Let's hear your story on your life insurance! The funding gap situation at Alcor is serious and demands everyone's attention.

 
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Rick
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98.165.81.74

Does the "mortician method" capture cell integrity well enough to say this is "cryoni

December 25 2010, 1:52 PM 

This debate has gone on for years... and I still don't know that answer. Ettinger puts forward the "local mortician method"... which seems to me to be ignoring the "high tech" aspects of what an SA or Alcor standby team is supposed to able to do... that's why the higher costs...

Ettinger wrote

"The Suspended Animation herring: Some within CI advocate buying service from Suspended Animation Inc. (SA), at a huge price increase which would make the total comparable to Alcor's, Elsewhere I have explained why I think this is a very bad and unnecessary idea. Any member or small local group, with a bit of effort and modest expense, can arrange standby that will be both cheaper and faster and more reliable. This isn't just speculation either--it's what Mae and I did when we lived in Arizona, and it worked very well when she died. Basically you just hire local morticians, train them, equip them, and pay them an annual retainer for a yearly practice session. Modest expense, quick response, high reliability, none of which are offered by SA. "


Maxim has pointed out deficiencies in SA... since 2007... as well as at Alcor...
http://cryomedical.blogspot.com/

... presumably she as pointed out those deficiencies at CI using morticians as welll... Here is a search of her
INDEX that I encouraged her to install on her blog... which I motivated her to create... on "cryonics institute"....


http://cryomedical.blogspot.com/search/label/Cryonics%20Institute%20CI

From what I can quickly gather, and from my reading of Maxim since 2007, she doesn't really hold CI's up to as
much of a spotlight as other operators... HOWEVER... she DID POINT OUT that CI's method of reading
perfusion pressures was WRONG FOR YEARS....

The best way to garner the capability of CI.. .is to read Best... but Best is in favor of SA working with CI...
whereas Ettinger is NOT...

To winnow this down... we'd have to have Maxim comment on CI's use of the "mortician method"... I'll
ask her to do that.



No log in needed at this time to post. Let's hear your story on your life insurance! The funding gap situation at Alcor is serious and demands everyone's attention.

 
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Rick
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Maxim points to local mortician method

December 25 2010, 2:09 PM 

http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=mortician+sitehttp://cryomedical.blogspot.com&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8


http://cryomedical.blogspot.com/2009/10/most-lame-excuse-in-cryonics.html

Cryonicists would be much more wise to make their own local arrangements, for friends, their personal physician and a local mortician to place them in the ice bath, administer and circulate the meds, and ship them on dry ice, than to pay those whiz-kids from SA, (



I’ve yet to figure out why SA has spent hundreds of thousands of dollars on purchasing and modifying two vehicles that won’t ever benefit most of their clients. Unless you live very close to that facility, or have adequate warning of your impending legal death, they are going to fly to your location and pick you up in a rented moving van. Like almost everything else at SA, the vehicles just don’t make sense, to me; they’re just a distraction from the fact that nothing is really being accomplished.Have an experienced mortician, or someone else with experience shipping human bodies, collaborate with some of the scientific experts in cryonics, to establish a sound protocol that complies with airline and DOT regulations, for shipping cryonics patients from the location of their legal death and (hopefully successful) washout procedure, to where they will be vitrified and stored. It doesn’t make sense to have a vitrification facility without a storage facility, (a direction it sometimes seems SA is heading); too many things can happen during transport, and from my brief exploration of transporting at cryogenic temperatures, it seems there are quite a lot of regulations to overcome.
http://cryomedical.blogspot.com/2007/07/sas-failure-to-deliver-promised.html





No log in needed at this time to post. Let's hear your story on your life insurance! The funding gap situation at Alcor is serious and demands everyone's attention.

 
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Rick
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98.165.81.74

Last time I looked, there were 10 CI members in Phoenix... do they have a local mortician?

December 25 2010, 2:12 PM 

I need to know this... help please.

Matt Sullivan's suggestion of living near CI as an alternative to Alcor is too difficult.. but getting together with CI people here who live by Ettinger's creed of a local mortician... a method that even Maxim seems to point to as possibly better than SA... and CI... as Rudi points me to.. might be worth looking at.

No log in needed at this time to post. Let's hear your story on your life insurance! The funding gap situation at Alcor is serious and demands everyone's attention.

 
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Rick
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98.165.81.74

I don't trust Ettinger's idea that inflation is a bugaboo... nor his confidence in...

December 25 2010, 2:19 PM 

...in higher tech methods not costing more... I'm simply exploring this CI in Pheonix option as an exercise at this point....

50K of life insurance might "go further forward in time" with CI than with Alcor... but ultimately, Ettinger has NOT dealt with the "funding gap" that CPlatt has pointed to...




No log in needed at this time to post. Let's hear your story on your life insurance! The funding gap situation at Alcor is serious and demands everyone's attention.

 
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Rick
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98.165.81.74

Very interesting how Ettinger's wife was handled from Phoenix....

December 25 2010, 2:21 PM 

...while Ettingers lived in Phoenix in the 1990s. It's a small small world!

No log in needed at this time to post. Let's hear your story on your life insurance! The funding gap situation at Alcor is serious and demands everyone's attention.

 
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Mark Plus
(Login advancedatheist)
24.116.66.39

Ettinger from hindsight disappoints me.

November 15 2012, 8:17 AM 

He had 50 years to work on cryonics, and apparently he couldn't do any better than the suboptimal situation we see in the cryonics movement now.

 
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