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British newspaper letters from 1960s (#4 of about 12): More letters about caning girls
by Anne O'Nimis
Continuing the series of letters from British newspapers. I'm not sure whether it's a question of 1960s values, or of whether the original letter collector was selective in the articles he/she saved, but pro-caning sentiment outnumbers anti-caning by about 3 to 1.
Reminder: Credit for collecting and scanning these letters goes to some other anonymous soul. I just found the scans and am typing them in.
From the Nottingham Evening Post:
Punishment by Caning Has Many Advantages (29 April 1965)
Mr. J.D. Bingham [apparently refers to author of an anti-caning
editorial] would do well to support causes more deserving than
young delinquents.
When I was a girl at school some 30 years ago, the cane was regularly
used for the maintenance of discipline in both girls' and boys' classes,
and I well recall being so punished for insolence at the age of 14. While
I suffered none of the psychological and social effects mentioned by Mr.
Bingham, I was most certainly deterred from repeating such behaviour.
Many of the young girls of today lack discipline both in school and at
home. Although the majority grow up as normal young people, a few
behave in a manner dangerous both to themselves and to society. Where
such behavior violates the law it would, I am sure, be of benefit both to
themselves and to the public if they were, as I was, bent over a chair and
soundly caned.
As a judicial punishment caning has many advantages. It can be used
for young people of either sex. When administered on the bottom,
although suitably painful at the time, it causes no physical harm, and due
to its association with naughtiness rather than actual crime, it lacks the
glamour of the birch.
If it were instituted for certain offences in the case of young persons
considered suitable for such punishment, it would save a great amount
of the work and expense involved in the present system of probation
officers, remand homes and approved schools. In addition, it would
enable cases needing more individual treatment to be dealt with more
carefully by orthodox means.
Spare the Rod, Hucknall.
A Girl's View of Caning (1 May 1965)
A someone who, unlikely as it seems to me at present, might possibly
find myself ordered to be caned if the ideas of some of your readers
were adopted, I should like to protest at this horrible idea.
Two years ago I attended a school where the cane was used by certain
teachers. It was almost a classroom joke with them, the victim being
required to touch his or her toes and receive two to four light strokes.
The boys treated it as a lark and an easy let-off, and a few exhibitionists
amongst us girls seemed to delight in suffering this punishment,
especially in mixed classes. Myself and others were afraid of being
punished this way, not because of the slight pain involved but because of
the humiliation. On the two occasions I was caned I was upset for some
time afterwards, although my parents said I had probably deserved it,
and not to be a silly girl.
I think this is what would happen if we were ordered to be caned by the
courts. Some of us would not be greatly affected by it, the showoffs
would glory in it, and others like myself would be upset out of all
proportion to the offence.
A Schoolgirl, Age 16, Mansfield.
Girls' Punishment (7 May 1965)
Having spent many years in mixed and girls' schools, I have never heard
of a girl being punished as "A Schoolgirl Age 16" of Mansfield describes.
In my experience where corporal punishment is administered to girls by
tawse or strap is generally used on the palms of the hands or on the
thighs and, except for occasional spanking of young children,
punishment would not be administered in front of class.
To the best of my knowledge, the cane is only used for girls in certain
corrective institutions as a punishment for serious offences and only
under strict regulations as to its use.
I have always found that while at the age of 11 or 12 the deterrent effect
of corporal punishment is similar for boys and girls, it increases greatly
with age in the case of girls, and most girls of 15 or over would regard
such punishment as a very severe penalty.
Provided that due regard were paid to age and sex I believe some form
of judicial corporal punishment would be a very good thing.
Mrs. Ruth M. Harrison, Farnsworth-drive, Calverton, Notts.
Why All the Fuss? (12 May 1965)
Why "Schoolgirl Mansfield" creates such a fuss over school spankings, I
don't know. I agree that to cane a girl is not desirable but we at boarding
school are subject to strapping with a "tawse," according to age, on the
hands or bottom by our school nurse in private. This, I am told, has been
practiced for years and all accept it without fuss.
I agree I was one who objected but at 15 I am sure I am better mannered
for it. If secondary schools were to adopt it more, I am sure some of the
present day hooliganism would stop.
ATTENTION: Protest against sadistic underage articles !
by ???
I want to protest against the acticles presented here!
As a regular poster to the other forum i DON'T want to be
associated with them in any way !
I strongly believe that everyone is not only responsible
for everything he or she does, but also (in some cases)
for what he/she does not do!
So i have to speak up!
This forum should not be a platform for mentally ill persons!
The right place for them is a psychiatry!
(This is not only rhetoric)
Everyone who supports the posting of sadistic articles dealing
with persons under the age of 18 should think about what he
does!
If i am the only one with this opinion - i made a big mistake
to ever post to Arild's forums!
If future articles don't deal with adults (and ONLY adults)
Arild's forums just LOST A POSTER!
I also dislike really sadistic postings and previoiusly made a suggestion about removing a 'chinese torture' entry - nonetheless I am greatful to Arild for the general high quality dignified content of this site - and believe it was probably an oversight. I hate to think of some of my oversights in the past. Having never participated in any sort of chat forum let alone an adult site,I have found the paraticipants to be charming, educated, tactful dignified and fun. There are a couple of movies in which adults have disguised themselves as children, and females disguised themselves as boys (eg. too young to kiss).Perhaps you were misled by looking at some of the stills. I accidently came across an adult site with spankings of children (rising stars I think it was called) and although I had never really thought about it, it was horrible to see stills of children's photographs used for adult pleasure. I can't see anyone here wanting any part of that sort of thing, and I hope there's not too many who enjoy really sadistic material.
Thanks Helen for your sensible response to ???. I concur completely with your observations.
Since August, 2001 I have posted roughly 45 articles and Letter's to the Editor. Most were orignally published more than 100 years ago and all in respectable mainstream newspapers. Several were pubished in high brow newspapers.
In addition to whatever titillation or amusement readers garner from them, they are historic snapshots into the concerns and life of everyday people young and old in 1893 and 1901 etc.
They ran along side letters about the crowded elevated trains, the pro and cons of keeping dogs in the City, how to cure a husband who drinks (several wives said spanking was the best cure), and if you would believe, whether or not the whipping post should be brought back as punishment for wife beaters.
Yesterday, as a matter of curiosity I took a backward look at the age distribution in the 38 letters I've posted. 35 of the 38 letters had reference to a specific spanking or method of spanking. Twenty-eight of those referenced girls/women of 18 or older, in fact 17 of the 28 were 20 or older. Six were 17, four were 16, three 15 and two 14. I might add here that the two at 14, a year older than Juliet, were not specific but only referenced as sister's or daughter's.
One reason why most of the letters from that period are about spanking girls (plenty of letters about youngmen too) seventeen and older is because that was the issue of the day for many older girls/young women and there parents.
Taken collectively within an historical framework, what the letters said was that the spanking of girls (and boys) younger than 17 was ok, but that the spanking of older girls and young unmarried women living at home was common but being challenged.
I find those historical insights fascinating and hope others look at these letters too as historic snapshots into the past. They are not from MR or.....
Unless Arild or other regulars ask me to stop posting historically significant articles and letters here, I plan to continue posting from time to time.
I will as I have always done, not post something that is overtly brutal or exploitive of an underage person. In fact I don't even copy that type of article or letter when it pop's during my research.
I hope more people will post articles and letters from mainsteam newspapers and magazines here.
I'm equally sure as Helen suggested that as new posters get "the hang of it", they will avoid posting anything that might be improper or not make any sense.
Will,
ps. I always post my e-mail address along with my postings. If along the way anyone feels I've strayed away from the proper course please tell me.
I considered posting you a note earlier but laziness got the better of me. I had wanted to say how much I enjoyed reading your articles - from a historical point of view it has given me some interesting insights on how people behaved and viewed things so long ago. In particular, it makes me realize that spankings in the 1930's and 40's movies must have existed for the purpose of titilation, disguised as disciplinary - a way round the censor of the day. This is because my viewing of your articles suggests that spanking of girlfriends by boyfiends or girls by potential boyfriends which is common in the movies didn't much happen in real life. It seems spanking of daughters by mothers is more common. Very ocassionally we get the spanking of a wife by a husband - or a daughter by a father, but generally M/F spankings weren't common (if your articles are representative of the era) and they lacked the subliminal sexual content of the old classic movies.Thanks for your hard work and interesting contributions. I'm sure I'm one of many who enjoy the benefits of your hard work.
Appreciate the kind words and was very pleased to learn that you've also been captured by these interesting glimses into the past
My regret is that my computer capability has pevented me from posting the letters in there original format alongside all the other letters about all things, big and small that were on the minds of everyday people in 1893...1901 etc.
You would become addicted to reading those letters just like I have.
I agree and disagree with your conclusions though.
Dan, any chance that the whole series will be available on DVD? I notice some spanking video co.'s are starting to market this format. Would be great to have all those movie scenes on the best format...
Thanks...
British newspaper letters from 1960s (#3 of about 12): "Caning -- pro and con"
by Anne O'Nimis
Continuing in a series of transcribed letters from 1960s British newspapers. I'm glad it's holding readers' interest! And thanks to the anonymous collecter who got these together and scanned them in. I am merely typing them.
Portsmouth Evening News, Hants
Stock Up With Canes (19 Nov. 1964)
I was very interested in the letter appertaining to the purchase of punishment
canes. Like your correspondent, I have tried all over Portsmouth to buy a cane
without success. I wish he had stated in his letter in which town he did
eventually manage to buy one.
As a parent I think that caning is the ideal deterrent. It did me good a few years
ago, and as long as it doesn't become abandoned for psychological nonsense,
it will continue to have a salutary effect.
So come on, you Portsmouth shopkeepers, stock up with good old-fashioned
canes and do your bit to re-establish discipline among the unruly of today.
Arthur Purvis, North End.
Your correspondent, "Well Caned," wishing to buy a punishment cane must
be a very frustrated and unhappy person.
All parents who seem to delight in inflicting physical punishment on their
children should try to realize that love and understanding always bring out the
best in children and there should be no need for violence.
J. Hibbert.
I was surprised to notice that in reply to "Well Caned," the lack of letters
in agreement with him.
The majority of parents whose children love them and vice versa, know that a
good smack, or use of the cane at the appropriate time, is not held against
the parents, and is soon forgotten, but that the cause and effect of the
punishment is instilled in the child's mind.
If a little less psycho-analysis was practiced where children are concerned, and
a simple correction such as the cane is used, most juvenile problems would be
simplified and more effective.
J. Riatt, North End.
May I be allowed to say a few words in defence of "Well Caned"? Mr. Parsons
(Evening News, November 16) appears to be under the mistaken impression that
people who keep a cane in the home have sadistic tendencies.
The fact that a parent has a cane does not mean that it is in regular use. I
remember as a child my parents always had a cane hanging in the kitchen. I can
also remember my first taste of this ghastly instrument, and I made sure I
behaved afterwards.
Mother had only to reach for the cane to ensure obedience. Like Well Caned, I
find that as long as the household cane hangs in a prominent position, where the
children can see it, and know that it not only could but would be used, a threat is
often enough.
I consider this better than nagging or depriving the child of a treat. Patience and
tolerance, yes, but only to a certain extent. Children soon know when they have
the upper hand and have to be brought back into line.
Caned.
Punishing Children (27? Nov. 1964)
Looking for a cane? Ask any arts and craft shop for 3 feet of quarter-inch basket
cane. Soak one end and bend it to form a handle. Result -- a deterrent with a
sting which compares favorably with the type sold when we were children.
We had a cane upstairs and another downstairs and have no regrets. My
parents are the best, and we still are a most united family.
Thanks, all, for the many comments on this fascinating subject. When all is said and done, it appears our first opinion is correct: "Playboy" is NOT a spanko magazine. Even the few "Wicked Wandas" I remember have now been (correctly) attributed to Penthouse, not Playboy.
But I want to address the final comment in the previous post. It's from "Anonymous" but it's signed "Jinboy." He opines that perhaps advertisers could "get away" with a spanking in an ad today if there was an F/M pic along with an M/F.
Jinboy is probably thinking that with feminism in full swing nowadays, no advertiser could get away with ads such as the old Chase and Sanborn ad showing a man spanking his wife, or the old Van Heusen shirt ad, to name just two that we've all seen reprinted here.
But 21st century feminism is not the same as 1960s' feminism. Women have made giant strides, landing jobs in executive suites, running successfully for high office, managing large corporations, etc., etc. Please, folks, do NOT respond with some nasty nattering about how women's wages in general still do not equal men's wages. They may not, but the gap has been considerably narrowed, and is still closing -- fast! Women no longer have the comfort of complaining that they are being treated as second-class citizens.
In this era where women enjoy roughly equal status with men, feminism's big guns have been muted. You can see it, especially, on TV.
There are something like a half-dozen dating shows in syndication, and every one of them has featured scenes of guys spanking their dates. And they've also featured scenes of girls spanking the guys. Equal Opportunity Spankings, folks!
Look, too, at TV wrestling. I grew up in an era when Gorgeous George was a popular wrestling star, but you never saw him spank a girl in the ring. Now you see wrestling spankings all the time.
Recently I spent a lot of time lurking (and some delurking) on the message board for the new movie "Secretary" (2002). There are hundreds of messages on there, and without saying it in so many words, they are telling us that women are perfectly okay with spankings, as long as it is what they like!
Think about this phenomenon for a second: Eleven years ago -- in 1991 -- the mainstream film "Love Crimes" failed to get an "R" rating from the Motion Picture Academy's ratings board, because it contained a scene in which Patrick Bergin gave Sean Young a good spanking. The director had to pull the scene to release the movie. We know about the scene only because Miramax Films allowed the director (a woman, by the way) to release an unrated version to video. The unrated version contains the spanking scene.
Now fast-forward to 2002. "Secretary," a film in which James Spader gives Maggie Gyllenhaal a colossal walloping on the seat of her skirt, is quietly given an "R" rating by the MPAA. What changed in eleven years? Obviously, the prevailing mores.
So, Jinboy, I have a hunch that your hypothetical advertisers might have a shot at getting a classy M/F spanking ad into print, after all. Or on TV. Just look at the huge popularity of M/F pics that we've seen on this and other Internet forums. Step aside, folks... this dam is due to burst.
The reason Feminism made such great strides is because
too many men didn't have the bottle to stand up and be counted.Now,they can be bled white on divorce,with the
help of some false allegations about wife beating,as if a wife wouldn't say a malicious word about anyone,
let alone hit her husband.If it is simply about whether
you have the ability to do a job,i have come across quite a few mature 15 year old boys.What about some
positive discrimination here.I'm sure not too many women would like to be done for a parking offence by
someone who could be her teenage son.Apart from the tillitation in a spanking,spanking in the movies was about the fact that it was not acceptable for the hero
to sock a woman the way he could with a male villain.
I must say you hear a lot of women nowadays claim they are not feminists or,at least,not militant feminists.
Unless they have become closet feminists.Where women get less pay than men,it tends to have much to do with their reluctance to strike for better wages.
The reason Feminism made such great strides is because
too many men didn't have the ...
... blah, blah blah, blah blah blah blah ...
I'd love to trade sweeping generalizations with you, Mr. or Ms. Pet, but I think
you've confused this place for a feminism debate forum. Sorry, wrong number!
Yes, 1 thing I've noticed is that feminists seemed less frequent to object to something once heterosexual ladies had an equal opportunity to experience objects of their fantasy. For example, now there are plenty of sexy adds displaying the scantily clad male form, they are less likely to complain when an equivelently displayed lady is employed. Moreover, now ladies on mass have displayed a erotic desire to enjoy male strip routines, they have tacitly condoned the equivelant opportunity for the blokes. The outrageously popular British flick, "The Full Monty", further fostered this cause! There would be an hypocrasy to complain given ladies are enjoying these delights themselves, and fair enough too! The feminists of yesteryear had limited opportunity to enjoy such action. Now such frustration is quelled & the 'playing field has levelled', there is more tolerance to male endulgences. Moreover, women who have enjoyed such employment as performers, models, etc. have spoken up saying to allow them to express themselves and earn a living as they choose without interference from the 'feminazis'.
I reckon spanking opportunities could follow suit. Perhaps some M/F critics would be more obliging if these scenes were balanced out making it difficult to claim it degrading to 1 gender or the other. For example, there was a scene in the very first episode of the sitcom, "Something Wilder", where Gene Wilder & his stage wife spanked each other simultaneously in standing with kid's toys, I think it was. (Another 1 for CS6 or even CS7?) They got away with it without a hitch because the married couple portayed were swapping equal smacks together. Definately better than nothing! Perhaps there could be an episode where Ray Romano & his stage wife both got to spank each other in, "Everyone Loves Raymond", leaving things 'all square'!. And as for, "Friends", ...!!!
Perhaps F/F is a way to 'get the ball rolling'. For example, when Nikki Cox" played a dancer in her sitcom, "Nikki", the dancers could have swapped spanking action as 1 of their stage routines! (Plenty of songs to pick from!) Given their act was often raunchy, a spanking routine would definately have fitted in nicely with their genre!
Other possibilities to bring M/F spankings back to our screens? How about period pices, flashback scenes, recreating famous moments (like with "Hollywood Babylon", etc). F/F action may come over as less likely to offend so worth a try initially (& later)! Comedy might assist, e.g. spanking to put out a fire as with Adele Mara in "Rock Iron Line" or June Allyson in "Little Women". Anyone else with any ideas? There must be plaenty of 'dam bursting' ideas out there!
When casting a feamle spankee, you could always try for an alleged spankophile, like Elizabeth Hurley (yeh!), or some up-and-comer who is bursting for a chance to break into film or even someone who is seeking to shake her good girl image, e.g. Soleil Frye Moon maybe?
So that dam wall you speak of, Dan. This may just be 1 approach by which we can 'tweak' it to burst just a little quicker!,
Regards,
Jindabyne.
P.S. So just who was that 'Jinboy'?!
I my previous post was buried the notion we could concoct situations where spanking of adult ladies on our screeen could better gain acceptance amongst the current climate of public scruteny.
Another scenario would be to mirror Susan Peters' spanking in "Young Ideas". Given as whilst Mary Astor spanked Susan, there was a 2nd. spanking, (M/M), also progressing, it would be difficult for disapproving feminists from complaining as (1) the spanking was F/F and (2) a bloke's copping it too!
For example, we could have Kate Hudson fleeing Goldie Hawn from the court room after being sprung for misleading everyone. Or how about Brdget Fonda fleeing Jane? Of course, they don't have to be Mum & daughter in real life, (though Carie Fischer also comes to mind!) It could be Jennifer Love-Hewitt fleeing the wrath of Susan Sarandon, say!)
Or to make it more universally appealing amongst us, rather than it being M/M & F/F, we could script M/F & F/M, say, (like it 1 of the publicity stills on this site). This way Harrison Ford could spank Jennifer Alba, for instance! Still little scope for feminist complaints with the F/M action on other frames.
Whilst the fast forward would be handy for the M/M action, the freeze frame or slo-mo may be more useful for Kate or Bridget or Jennifer's chastisement!
Anyone else with ways to help get spanking action back to our screens a little quicker?,
Jinders.
1960s British newspaper letters #2 of many: "Is spanking an indignity?"
by Anne O'Nimis
For your reading pleasure, in the tradition of Will/Gotham56's posts from this summer and earlier, here is another set of 'letters to the editor' from British newspapers from the 1960's. It starts with a letter that I previously published here on Arild's list; I did not realize that there were other letters that followed.
Extracts from Scottish Daily Mail, Edinburgh:
SPANKING (March 31, 1964)
When my 15-year-old daughter had friends in for the
evening, several of the girls said they must go home
at 9:30 or they would be spanked. Girls of this age
are too old to be treated to this indignity. (Mrs.) H. Young, Newport, Monmouth.
CHASTISING (April 2, 1964)
Mrs. H. Young [Letters, March 31], who claimed
that the spanking of young girls was an indignity,
should know that when children have been taught
obedience from an early age, threats and indignities
are quite unnecessary. Harry J. White, Freemantle, Southampton.
My 16 1/2-year-old daughter still gets a good spanking
across my knee for offences which I think warrent such
punishment. I consider this a necessity in bringing up
children. (Mrs.) R. Knowles, London, S.W.1.
Can you imagine being Mrs. Knowles' daughter and reading that in the paper? How embarrassing!
My sister and I, now 22 and 20, both recognised that
as teenagers we were subject to our parents' control,
which could be enforced by corporal punishment. We
believe this is a healthy fear. Colin Wilks, Nottingham.
Extract from The Daily Record, Scotland's National Newspaper, Glasgow:
DAD SPANKED HER -- AT 18 (March 1, 1966)
A good tanking (Record, Feb. 22) works just as well
with girls as with boys -- as I found out five years ago
when Dad caught me taking money from Mum's purse to
buy cosmetics.
I was made to bend over a chair and was belted. This
was the firs time my father had punished me since I
was 12 -- six years before that -- and I resolved never
again to do anything to make my parents ashamed of me,
and I never did. Mrs. W., Bruce Road, Glenrothes, Fife.
Note -- it really says 'tanking' in the first sentence, unless the copy was damaged somehow. Not 'spanking' or 'tanning,' 'tanking.' Typo? Local euphemism? Who knows.
"Twank" was a British regional variant on "spank" that survived at least into the mid-20th century. (It's in the Oxford English Dictionary, the big multi-volume source.)
In the British TV miniseries "Flickers" -- shown in the U.S. on "Masterpiece Theatre" -- starring Bob Hoskins and made in 1981 but set in the early 20th c., there's a scene where the head waiter at a restaurant threatens to take one of the servant girls downstairs "and twank yo' litt'w bum." (The only time I've actually heard it used.)
I don't believe how much useless junk I know about this subject.
Thanks for posting the lettes. Hope you will continue posting your collection here.
With your additions, this site has had posted Letter's to the Editor in mainstream english language newspapers representing every decade beginning with the 1890's thru the 1960's except from 1900 to 1919.
I will remedy that situation over the next few days. Though I must add that I found very few letter's to the editor written between the years 1903 and 1921, at least in the newspapers I've been focusing on.
The abundance of letters about spanking that appeared in the mid and late 1890's just seemed to disappear after 1902 then to reappear again in the early 1920's. Perhaps it had something to do with the introduction of "populist" style newpaper in the 1890's then the "tabloid" in the early 1920's.
Let's see how far we can stretch the continum. Perhaps someone could find more contemporary letters, those written in the 1970's and afterwards.
We could go the other way too if someone would post a few of the letter's that appeared in the Englishwomans Domestic Magazine during the 1870's and 1880's.
By the way Anne did were any of the letters accommpanied by sketches or photo's?
Thanks not only for these responses you posted, but also for
prior letters that you have both contributed here!
Js666, that's amazing that you knew the "twanking"
lingo. And there's no such thing as too obscure a fact
-- you never know when it will come in handy, such as in
this case. I had assumed it was perhaps a typo, and
I'm glad to know that it probably wasn't.
Will wrote:
With your additions, this site has had posted Letter's to the Editor in
mainstream english language newspapers representing every decade beginning with
the 1890's thru the 1960's except from 1900 to 1919.
[...]
Let's see how far we can stretch the continum. Perhaps someone could find more
contemporary letters, those written in the 1970's and afterwards.
We could go the other way too if someone would post a few of the letter's that
appeared in the Englishwomans Domestic Magazine during the 1870's and 1880's.
By the way Anne did were any of the letters accommpanied by sketches or photo's?
Will, That's awesome that this site is becoming such a
great historical resource. I'm all for stretching the
continuum, as you said -- I will continue to type these
letters over time (there must be two or three dozen),
and if I have any way of getting my hands on the
Englishwoman's Domestic Mag, I'll be all over it!
And yes, the letters were sometimes (infrequently, but
sometimes) accompanied by little line drawings. Almost
all of them were of a woman/mother as spanker; more
than half of the drawings featured a girl as recipient --
particularly since the letters I obtained tended to be
about the merits of girl-spanking.
Anne,
Welcome aboard! Love your input! (Though not so much the caning, but that's just me). Good to see Will getting such quality support.
Keep it coming!,
Jinabyne.
Having been subjected to the indignity at school in the 70s, I'd say it was pretty ineffectual. The absence of dignity I rather think was part of the punishment.
Some letters from British newspapers in the mid-1960s (#1 of many)
by Anne O'Nimis
For your reading pleasure, in the tradition of Will/Gotham56's posts from this summer and earlier, here are some 'letters to the editor' from British newspapers from the 1960's. They were collected and scanned by somebody else and typed by yours truly.
Extracts from Scottish Daily Mail, Edinburgh:
SPANKING (March 31, 1964)
When my 15-year-old daughter had friends in for the
evening, several of the girls said they must go home
at 9:30 or they would be spanked. Girls of this age
are too old to be treated to this indignity. (Mrs.) H. Young, Newport, Monmouth.
SPANKED (April, 1964)
I stayed last weekend with a girlfriend in London and
her mother had to bail us out after the Clacton
troubles. When we got home, my friend's mother gave
us 12 of "the best."
I am 15 and this the first good thrashing I've ever
had, and it made me disagree with the theory that
spanking is an indignity. For me it was a real
lesson -- no more rockers. (Name and address supplied.)
TEEN GIRL ADVISOR (undated)
Q. Unhappy Eighteen (S.E. 18). My mother spanks
me with a cane, which is terribly humiliating as I am
made to strip and bend across her knee. I dread the
occasions when she takes me into her bedroom to punish
me. What shall I do?
A. I can do little but offer you my sympathy.
Confide your trouble to a senior member of your family
who should speak to your mother on your behalf. To
treat a girl of 18 in this way is disgraceful. I
never encourage girls to rebel against their parents
but in this case I do most definitely suggest that you
refuse to allow the chastisement. Your punishments
may be justified, but suggest to your mother that you
be given them in another form. If she cares to write
to me personally, I shall be glad to answer.
The following column appears to be a 'private reply,' i.e. a public response to an unprinted letter, some time after the above letter ran.
TO SALLY (in Norfolk) (undated)
I still must disagree with you in your approval for
spanking for girls of 18. You say you do not mind it
and prefer it to nagging. That happens to be your
nature. For girls who are more sensitive and apt to
brood over such treatment it could have a very unhappy
and serious effect for a long time. It is an
unnecessary humiliation. The fact that you do not
feel humiliated is individual, but no two girls are
the same.
MEANIES (May 13, 1961)
I am a fourteen-year-old schoolgirl and think you were
very mean to print the article "Should Big Girls Be
Spanked?" ('Today' section, April 15).
It gave my parents ideas. When I came home late the
other night my father put me across his knee, took off
his slipper, and -- well, you can guess the rest.
I remain, yours hatefully -- Miss M.D., Hornchurch, Essex.
For your reading pleasure, in the tradition of Will/Gotham56's posts from this summer and earlier, here are some 'letters to the editor' from British newspapers from the 1960's. They were collected and scanned by somebody else and typed by yours truly.
Extracts from Scottish Daily Mail, Edinburgh:
SPANKING (March 31, 1964)
When my 15-year-old daughter had friends in for the
evening, several of the girls said they must go home
at 9:30 or they would be spanked. Girls of this age
are too old to be treated to this indignity.
(Mrs.) H. Young, Newport, Monmouth.
SPANKED (April, 1964)
I stayed last weekend with a girlfriend in London and
her mother had to bail us out after the Clacton
troubles. When we got home, my friend's mother gave
us 12 of "the best."
I am 15 and this the first good thrashing I've ever
had, and it made me disagree with the theory that
spanking is an indignity. For me it was a real
lesson -- no more rockers.
(Name and address supplied.)
Hi, Anne again, sorry for the tests! I'm trying to figure out how to make this look reasonably nice...
For your reading pleasure, in the tradition of Will/Gotham56's posts from this summer and earlier, here are some 'letters to the editor' from British newspapers from the 1960's. They were collected and scanned by somebody else and typed by yours truly.
Extracts from Scottish Daily Mail, Edinburgh:
SPANKING (March 31, 1964)
When my 15-year-old daughter had friends in for the evening, several of the girls said they must go
home at 9:30 or they would be spanked. Girls of this age are too old to be treated to this indignity.
(Mrs.) H. Young, Newport, Monmouth.
SPANKED (April, 1964)
I stayed last weekend with a girlfriend in London and her mother had to bail us out after the Clacton
troubles. When we got home, my friend's mother gave us 12 of "the best."
I am 15 and this the first good thrashing I've ever had, and it made me disagree with the theory that
spanking is an indignity. For me it was a real lesson -- no more rockers.
(Name and address supplied.)
Thank you very much for these they were very interesting. I am looking forward to further letters.I find reading tetters involving the spanking of women and older girls that were sometimes published in mainstream newspapers and magazines very interesting.
In the 1980s British spanking magazine Janus re-printed a series of letters from a British mainstream general interest magazine caleed "Picture Post" from the 1950s about the spanking of wives and teenage daughters.
The letters described mostly spanking of daughters by their fathers but some of wives by their husband. It appeared most letters were in favour but there was an occasional letter against.
I have been told that leeters concerning spanking occasionally appeared in Women's magazines until the 1970s. If anyone knows anything more about this please post them in.
Thanks for your follow-up, Roger. I find myself
wondering if the scans I have were originally
published in a spanking magazine. But it looks to me
like a very hard-working person literally went through
newspapers, copied relevant sections, and pasted them
up on a piece of white paper for copying/scanning. I
will be eternally grateful to him (or her) for doing
so, not just for the interesting historical perspective
-- who knew that so many young ladies had so much to
say about spanking -- but also for some incredibly
endearing margin drawings that appeared in the
papers. They are typically of a woman spanking a
girl or a boy. Much fun to see!
The "Picture Post" also ran a series of letters, mostly on the spanking and caning of daughters, in the Fall of 1939 -- in the same weeks when World War II was declared.
There was also a series on wife-spanking in the U.S. men's magazine "True" in late 1950 or 1951 (or 1952?). As an interesting side note: Hugh Hefner once cited these as part of what convinced him that post-war American sexual culture was weird (or perhaps sick) enough to justify the founding of "Playboy."
You say Hugh Hefner once cited the wife-spanking stories in men's magazines as part of what convinced him to launch "Playboy."
I don't doubt it, but if it's so, it seems strange that "Playboy" has never had much to do with spankings. Maybe Hefner and his advisers just wanted to keep an arm's length away from the subject, for whatever reason.
With the exception of a few (VERY few) "Wicked Wanda" cartoons and some single panel cartoons, I don't recall seeing ANY spanking references in Playboy mag. If it began in 1955 and that was 47 years ago, even one spanking ref a year would have yielded 47 spanking references... and there haven't been anywhere near that many.
<b>Dan wrote:</b>
<pre>With the exception of a few (VERY few) "Wicked Wanda" cartoons and some single
panel cartoons, I don't recall seeing ANY spanking references in Playboy mag.
If it began in 1955 and that was 47 years ago, even one spanking ref a year
would have yielded 47 spanking references... and there haven't been anywhere
near that many.</pre>
Hello, all --
I am by no means an avid reader of *Playboy*, but over
the years I've checked out a few issues, and while I
agree with Dan that it didn't seem to be the style of
the magazine, here's what I do remember....
<ul><li>The occasional single-panel cartoon, such as
Santa Clause spanking an unhappy adult woman on
Christmas Eve (Santa was saying, "Ho-ho-ho...!"
<li>An occasional reference to S&M in the Little Annie
Fanny strip... by the way, I belive Wicked Wanda (a
wonderful strip!) ran in a different magazine
<li>In issues I saw from the 1970's, letters to the
Playoy Advisor would sometimes mention spanking as
foreplay... now that was neat!
</ul>
Does anybody else have any other memories about this?
Spanking in Playboy magazine ... this article is more readable!
by Anne Again
Sorry about the prior reply with the bad formatting.
Dan wrote:
With the exception of a few (VERY few) "Wicked Wanda" cartoons and some single
panel cartoons, I don't recall seeing ANY spanking references in Playboy mag.
If it began in 1955 and that was 47 years ago, even one spanking ref a year
would have yielded 47 spanking references... and there haven't been anywhere
near that many.
Hello, all --
I am by no means an avid reader of *Playboy*, but over
the years I've checked out a few issues, and while I
agree with Dan that it didn't seem to be the style of
the magazine, here's what I do remember....
The occasional single-panel cartoon, such as
Santa Clause spanking an unhappy adult woman on
Christmas Eve (Santa was saying, "Ho-ho-ho...!"
An occasional reference to S&M in the Little Annie
Fanny strip... by the way, I belive Wicked Wanda (a
wonderful strip!) ran in a different magazine
In issues I saw from the 1970's, letters to the
Playoy Advisor would sometimes mention spanking as
foreplay... now that was neat!
Does anybody else have any other memories about this?
There were occasional references, especially in the 70's. There was a snip about the "Cheeks" jeans controversy. A jeans company published an ad showing a woman, wearing their product, bent over and being spanked by a man, also wearing the product. The feminists howled and the ad was pulled. It was reported, however, that the women's line sold much beter than the men's.
The only extended story I recall was about a male reporter who wanted to check out what this spanking business was all about. He made contact through a personals column and a woman showed up to be spanked. The whole business was extremely awkward. He then discovered that the woman was a reporter too, and they agreed to try something a bit more "normal." (Hey, it was the 70's.)
The article referred to had a title like "Dominant Male Seeks Submissive Miss with Spankable Bottom." As I recall, it also ran down most of the other major fetishes. The edition which featured the interview with Jimmy Carter in 1976, also contained a letter to the editor which related how a boyfriend learned to spank his girlfriend's bottom. As I recall her parents found them in a compromising position and had him spank her as punishment. One of the suggestions was to sprinkle the bottom with water first. "Wicked Wanda" was in Penthouse. Playboy also carried a picture of one of the Bond girls over the knee of a tuxedo clad man with him pulling her pants down. I also remember the Bend Over ad and the Santa cartoon. Those are the fixes I can fonfirm.
Yep, thanks Cromwell & co., the Bond lass beautifully positioned was the saltry Barbara Bach. I'll post a signed version of this pic in Arild's Yahoo group, "Spanking Post".
I've come across pics of playful F/F spankings that some of their stunning models have given each other when requested on the "Playboy" channel. If I can find it, I'll post it @ Arild's "Movie Spanking" group.
I remember reading in a spanking mag once that one "Playboy" edition featured a pic of a model, whose name I can't remember, posed for a spanking. They didn't show it but I think the date in question was December, 1980? Though it was a British spanking mag, I suspect this date probably referred the American edition of "Playboy"? Anyone got any leads from here?
Love to see that jeans add. I presume it was published prior to being pulled? Perhaps in this era if an F/M pic was included with the M/F pic, the advertisers may get away with it? Worth a thought?,
Jinboy.
Thanks, all, for the many comments on this fascinating subject. When all is said and done, it appears our first opinion is correct: "Playboy" is NOT a spanko magazine. Even the few "Wicked Wandas" I remember have now been (correctly) attributed to Penthouse, not Playboy.
But I want to address the final comment in the previous post. It's from "Anonymous" but it's signed "Jinboy." He opines that perhaps advertisers could "get away" with a spanking in an ad today if there was an F/M pic along with an M/F.
Jinboy is probably thinking that with feminism in full swing nowadays, no advertiser could get away with ads such as the old Chase and Sanborn ad showing a man spanking his wife, or the old Van Heusen shirt ad, to name just two that we've all seen reprinted here.
But 21st century feminism is not the same as 1960s' feminism. Women have made giant strides, landing jobs in executive suites, running successfully for high office, managing large corporations, etc., etc. Please, folks, do NOT respond with some nasty nattering about how women's wages in general still do not equal men's wages. They may not, but the gap has been considerably narrowed, and is still closing -- fast! Women no longer have the comfort of complaining that they are being treated as second-class citizens.
In this era where women enjoy roughly equal status with men, feminism's big guns have been muted. You can see it, especially, on TV.
There are something like a half-dozen dating shows in syndication, and every one of them has featured scenes of guys spanking their dates. And they've also featured scenes of girls spanking the guys. Equal Opportunity Spankings, folks!
Look, too, at TV wrestling. I grew up in an era when Gorgeous George was a popular wrestling star, but you never saw him spank a girl in the ring. Now you see wrestling spankings all the time.
Recently I spent a lot of time lurking (and some delurking) on the message board for the new movie "Secretary" (2002). There are hundreds of messages on there, and without saying it in so many words, they are telling us that women are perfectly okay with spankings, as long as it is what they like!
Think about this phenomenon for a second: Eleven years ago -- in 1991 -- the mainstream film "Love Crimes" failed to get an "R" rating from the Motion Picture Academy's ratings board, because it contained a scene in which Patrick Bergin gave Sean Young a good spanking. The director had to pull the scene to release the movie. We know about the scene only because Miramax Films allowed the director (a woman, by the way) to release an unrated version to video. The unrated version contains the spanking scene.
Now fast-forward to 2002. "Secretary," a film in which James Spader gives Maggie Gyllenhaal a colossal walloping on the seat of her skirt, is quietly given an "R" rating by the MPAA. What changed in eleven years? Obviously, the prevailing mores.
So, Jinboy, I have a hunch that your hypothetical advertisers might have a shot at getting a classy M/F spanking ad into print, after all. Or on TV. Just look at the huge popularity of M/F pics that we've seen on this and other Internet forums. Step aside, folks... this dam is due to burst.
The jean's ad was published in several magazines, including Playboy and Ms. magazine on the "No Comment" page at the end of the magazine. Time also related that the ad was used in some high powered main stream magazine, but I do not recall the name after two plus decades.
Do you have acces to foxtell. 'Reap the wild wind' is playing on 19 Oct - if you don't already have a copy. It's a good film. Also 'too young to kiss' is playing this month. Don't remember the date. Also a good movie but it's very much a woman's movie. You asked me who I'd like to trade places with in 'cinema swats'. Brenda Joyce's encounter with the waiter appealed to me - I thought his technique was particularly good although the setting didn't appeal to me and I could take or leave the waiter. Roger Moore as 'the saint' has always appealed to me, but being in the middle of the bush doesn,t. You're right about Elvis Presley. He's sloppy, plus I'd prefer a man - not a kid who hangs out on the beach with his beach bums.
Hi Helen,
Thanks for your inciteful & spirited reply. Yes, the, "Public Deb No. 1", spanking is 1 I am especially looking forward to. I can well imagine a keen spankee could well trade places for such a lively volley of spanks. (Youch!) It looks from the stills like they really did a quality job & pulled no punches on Miss Joyce's target zone in making this resounding anti-Communist stand really count. Especially remembering the passionate American 'MacCarthyist' attitudes towards stamping out this philosophy, what a brilliant piece of script writing to really add 'spark' to the spanking. To support 'The American way', that spanking had to be long, hard & stinging as a solid punishment for Brenda's character ever espousing such unpatriotic concepts. I'll bet Brenda never forgot how her acting prowess helped convey such a message to the viewing public! (Mind you, with the waiter fulfilling his characters gusto, she probably didn't have to act too much!) There in 1 scene, 2 great American traditional ways, Anti-Communism & OTK spanking. Yeh!
So my next probing question to you HELEN, given the actors available back in the 1940's, or later if you prefer, who would you have cast as the waiter to really make it an ultimate spanking scene? What Hollywood talent would have best served as a spanker of choice, be it yourself or Brenda Joyce on the receiving end? Who was the 'Roger Moore' of yesteryear?
Glad you enjoyed Dan's product so well. My turn shall come!
Thanks for the Foxtel info. I've had some frustrating times trying to catch some of these films in the past. I recall visiting people on 2 separate occasions hoping to tape them only to find they'd just just discontinued with those stations just before the spanking was screened. (Could you believe it!?) On a 3rd. occasion, I visited an old client to video the Van Johnson/June Allyson spanking only to find neither of us could get it to record. I didn't impose on his to stay until the early hours of the morning so again came away once again empty-handed. (Damn!) Before 1 guy ceased the relevant station, I did manage to tape Myrna Loy's spanking in, "The Thin Man Goes Home", I'm pleased to say for a rare moment of success. I found Myrna's moment OTK quite fun. A few gems turn up on Foxtel from time to time.
I guess you will be taping them but I wouldn't expect you to do anything to compromise your privacy. I guess I'll catch them when I finally get, "Cinema Swats". But I appreciate your efforts looking out for us. Two sets of eyes are better than 1!
Hope you find your ultimate film spanking experience one day, HELEN! Enjoy! (Maybe 1 day starring yourself?! Oh well, we can dream, right!) Thanks again,
All the Best,
Jinders.
Can you get into Adelaide Uni. I'll try and tape 'reap the wild wind' for you (as I have a friend with foxtell) and I'll leave the tape at the lost property office with Jinders written on it. Probably toward the end of the month. I'll leave you a message when I've dropped it in. There you are - privacy problem solved. By the way, if you try and pick me out, I'm an 87 year old grandmother with 6 little snotty nosed little grandchildren trailing behind, carrying a bag of intcontinence pads for myself (it happens at my age).
Hmm, worth a try, Helen. Nice plan. Let's do it! Very kind of you.
I'm really looking forward to seeing Paulette Goddard spanked in that 1. She's a lively firebrand of what I've seen of her acting. And "Reap the Wild Wind", is probably a good film. I saw Paulette spanked in, "North West Mounted Police", which was lively but brief & mostly off-screen. (Channel 7 screened it a year or so back). The publicity stills of Paulette OTK for "Suddenly It's Spring" & with Cecille B. De Mille are great but there's nothing like the real thing.
Being involved with tertiary institutions, it could be couriered to me but I reckon your idea is best. That is, as long as your friend doesn't mind. (So you would have seen the numerous posters of the Elvis Presley/Jenny Maxwell spanking advertising something plastered all over Adelaide Uni last year. It would have been interesting to have picked up on some of the reactions of the students & public as they came across that pic!)
And I'm sure your family is lovely. Thank you for your dialogue and in your efforts to track down the recording. I hope I can 1 day return the favour,
In Appreciation,
Jinders.
P.S. I'm no Robert Mitcham!
This week's "Entertainment Weekly" (Oct. 4), the photo issue, has an old-fashioned (soft) porno pic of Ben Stiller spanking an unidentified model. Nothing much, but coming so soon after the opening of "Secretary," you gotta wonder.
Hi JS666,
Letting you know I have just posted the pic in question in Arild's Yahoo Movie Spanking group. (We wouldn't be lucky enough for a 2nd. pic from Ben to be around, would we?) I picked that 1 up a year or so ago. Hopefully Ben & his mates can all help us out in bringing about our long awaited spanking revival? The good thing about Stiller having a go is he can give it a comic twist so it can gain general acceptance a little easier than other actors. Whilst the model's grin was a little too 'cheesy', it was a smart move that she was depicted as clearly enjoying her predicament to help EW to give it a run. Onya, Ben!
Thanks for bringing this development to our attention, JS,
Jinders.
P.S. Thanks to Bill Sova & others for their early eye witness accounts. Looking forward to, "The Secretary", reaching my continent. Yeh! It's interesting, Bill, how you described one potential spanker as not having a clue when Maggie Guylenhall positioned herself invitingly OTK.
That was the ploy used in Adelaide's musical, "Roulin Mouge". The lass playing Glitzy, (i.e. Charlotte Mudd or Caroline Lockett), whe singing, "Hanky Panky", would try to get the lead guy to spank her. He carries without any concept of what she is seeking. Hence, Glitzy takes off into the audience to get the spanking the lead guy fails to deliver. Whilst Charlotte got spanked by 6 male audience members before the song was up, Caroline was not so lucky. Luckily for her, I saved the day!
Just 1 more sign 'the worm' may be 'turning'. Fun M/F spanking may once again become a standaqrd form of theatrical & cinematic performance. We live in hope!
Hi Greg... All five (5) of the Cinema Swats videos are recorded in the NTSC (American) format. To get any of them into PAL, you would have to have it converted by a lab -- and then you would lose one video generation in quality.
But this used to be a much larger problem than it is now. A decade ago, there was resistance by those in PAL countries when they learned Cinema Swats was made only in NTSC -- but today, they take it in stride. The reason? In the last several years, new, multi-format video players have become popular in PAL countries. So they can now play tapes back in either format.
I'm not up on this but wouldn't digital editing programs take care of this less messily than the older technologies? At least so that degradation is almost unnoticible. Of course the multiformat players are the simpler way to go!
I saw the movie last weekend, after reading conflicting reports over whether the spankings given by James Spader to Maggie Guylenhaall were on-screen or not. This is to report that the first spanking is on-screen, with her bending over an office desk. Afterwards, she goes into the bathroom, and pulls down her panties to inspect the damage. Later on in the movie, in her home bathroom, wearing just a t shirt and panties, she spanks herself with a hairbrush. Still later, she tries to get her vanilla boyfriend into it by suggestively laying over his lap while they are hugging and kissing on a bed. But the guy is clueless.
I read somewhere in these pages of a cinema scene about a girl who is spanked by way of being tortured and then is guilotined when she cries out in pain.
I wonder if we can have this entry scrapped. Admittedly, I am only one person, but it produces similar feelings in me as if I saw children appearing on this site -
Thanks for your consideration of this request
Fussy femmale.
Caught yesterday's installment of "Entertainment Tonight" during which they did a report re how new videos of the American sitcom, "Friends", were being released including footage never before seen. In it was shown a scene where Jennifer Aniston leans over and spanks a standing Courtney Cox with her trusty right hand on Courtney's left buttock 4 times before running off in defensive mode. Anyone know the scene & can fill us in on Jen's motivation & Courtney's response? Courtney just stood there & took it like a 'trouper'. Luckily my video was running @ the time! Yay!
I reckon I've seen another scene where the same 2 ladies were spanking each other simultaneously in standing before Loisa Kudrow split them up by grabbing an ear from both of them telling them off like a doting mum. Anyone confirm this? Plenty of other 1 whackers the ladies have dealt each other, too, I've noticed. There's an F/F spankophile or 2 somewhere in their writing team! May his or her's career thrive & prosper!
Nice of 'Jen' to help 'Courts' out. (If only Jen was Jin!) After all, a friend in need!,
The 'J' Man.
Nice catch from ET yesterday, Jinders... It's lovely to learn what we already sort of took for granted: That women just adore spanking other women. No doubt, when word gets out as to exactly WHICH "Friends" video contains the excised footage you describe, sales will skyrocket.
But, er, oops... Didn't you post this to the wrong forum? This one is for non-movie and TV material. Oh well, it probably doesn't matter to Arild, who likes to read about good spankings, no matter where the message is posted. Again, nice catch.
As usual, you're right, Dan. I read the top line referring to this as being for, "Non-movie", material. If I'd bothered reading the next line I'd have realised TV stuff belonged in the other 1, I might have got it right.
Well, as Dan says, if anyone works out which "Friends" vid features the swats, please let us know. (Whichever forum!) There is also the possibility ET extracted it from other files & was not footage from the new video. Whatever, I was lucky enough to snare it on tape like the Lucille Ball 'bongo' spanking they showed months back. Looks like ET has an appreciation for */F spanking, too!
Well, Will needs a little support here, right?!,
Sorry team,
Jinders.
P.S. Thanks for the kind words, Dan.
I had a friend over on Wednesday night.(It was 'SCL', for those who remember her as my female spankee mate from Arild's spanking art group). As we chatted, we had the TV on an excellent Aussie chat show called, "The Panel". They had an attractive, confident & chatty lady with an American accent guest appearing throughout the entire show whose name I sadly did not catch.
At 1 stage, she clearly boldly stated, "I need a nap, a meal or a spanking." However, I missed the build up.
Does anyone in Australia (or New Zealand, etc?) who caught the show know the context in which our North American visitor made her comment? Who was she? I gathered she is an interviewer for a show or publication called, "E News", who has interviewed some leading names in 'show biz'. Her accent struck me as American rather than Canadian. She was probably around 30 years of age & very 'easy' on the eyes!
Whatever, I loved her honesty! (With me, I reckon we'd skip the food & slepp & go straight to her spanking option!) Hoping I'm not misplaced with my interpretation of her statement,
Jindabyne.
