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390 63 Galaxie shorty cast header question.

April 9 2007 at 9:51 AM

  (Login RichFerguson)
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I have a set of shorty cast headers I would like to install on my 63 Galaxie 500XL w/auto trans. Engine is a stock 64 Tbird 390. Currently the car has the stock log type exhaust manifolds. It looks like I will need to change the exhaust pipes to fit the shorty manifolds. Has anybody done this with pipes available from suppliers such as Mac's? I also see on eBay there is a crossover pipe assy for sale that is supposed to fit 61-63 Galaxies with 352HP or 406 engines. Ford part number for this reproduction part is C1AZ-5246-K. I can provide the eBay link to this part if anybody is interested. I know I can go down to a muffler shop and have a system made up but would rather not do it that way due the poor workmanship I will most likely get. Also, I am in a rural location and muffler shops are far away

 
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(Login Rhillebrand)
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Re: 390 63 Galaxie shorty cast header question.

April 9 2007, 10:27 AM 

Please post or email me the link to the exhaust pipes. I've been looking for someone that reproduces them for quite a while now. I had a local muffler shop build my exhaust system but would have liked to had the proper header pipe to clear the transmission better. Thanks....

 
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(Login RichFerguson)
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Re: 390 63 Galaxie shorty cast header question.

April 9 2007, 10:37 AM 

I don't know if this needs to be in the classifieds, but here it is. I found it very interesting and really would like to know if anybody has used it and how it fits and who makes it.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=003&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=130099104857&rd=1&rd=1

 
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(Login hawkrod)
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I know this is getting tough but please try and bear with the moderators

April 9 2007, 10:47 AM 

Posting an eBay ad is acceptable in the context of asking a technical question about the item. You basically asked "does anybody know if these fit" so that is a question. Had you instead posted "hey, look what I found on eBay" then it would be an ad and not acceptable. It is a fine line and each moderator may have a slightly different interpretation but trust me, the mods are trying hard to make this forum the best it can be. Hawkrod

Hawkrod

39 Ford Deluxe Coupe
59 Tbird 430
60 Lincoln Premier
(2)62 Tbirds
(3)68 Cougar XR7-G's
69 Cougar 428CJ 4 speed
77 1/2 Ford F250 4X4 w/460 swap
86 SVO mustang
76 F250 Crew Cab
1969 Mach I
look at my cars past and present at superford!

 
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(Login RichFerguson)
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I appreciate your effort, Hawkrod...

April 9 2007, 10:59 AM 

... and thanks for taking the time to clarify things. Yes I agree it can be a fine line sometimes and have no problem whatsoever with posting in the classifieds when necessary. Your reasoning makes perfect sense to me Thanks again!

 
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Rob
(Login GChief)
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It isn't hard....

April 9 2007, 11:19 AM 

I'm a dumba$$ and I can figure it out hawkrod... you guys are doing a good job...

 
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(Login FE4RD)
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Beware...

April 9 2007, 11:05 AM 

...I don't know about the quality of the linked pipe, it might be excellent. The fact it eliminates the heat riser valve is a good idea. You must make sure your manifolds are correct, to match the pipes.

Bending and making an exhaust pipe isn't rocket science. I understand your fear of poor workmanship, and your ruaral location. The original H-pipe for '65-67 427's is undersized. If I ever fit my '65-67 cast headers again I will have a 2 1/2" H-pipe made for them. I suspect, if the ebay replacement is a true reproduction, even without the heat riser, they might have kept the original smallish (2"?)pipe size.

I see you are in Maine. Perhaps someone on this forum knows of a good shop to take your car to. If the '63 headers come down as low as the '65-67 type, it would be an easy job to make an H-pipe.

 
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(Login RichFerguson)
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The H pipe in the posted link...

April 9 2007, 11:19 AM 

...appears to be necked down a foot or two beyond the manifold connection. I am not sure what you mean by correct manifolds. As far as I know (and sure as heck don't know it all) there are only one type of "shorty cast manifolds" that fit 60-64 FE equipped Galaxies. In other words they are all interchangable, same basic part number just different casting dates. Please correct me if I am wrong.

 
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(Login MT63AFX)
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Be aware 406s didn't allow for auto trans linkage, I'm not aware if the earlier...........

April 9 2007, 11:40 AM 

..........HP/shorty motors came originally with automatic transmissions, Rod.

Mickey Thompson's 63 1/2 AFX Hi-Rise 427 Lgt/Wgt Galaxie,
1957 C-600 Cab-over carhauler w/390-4V, 2-speed rear-end
FGCofA member #4908
MCGC member #75

"There will ALWAYS be an FE in my LiFE"

 
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(Login RichFerguson)
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Thats the kind of info I'm looking for...

April 9 2007, 11:54 AM 

... so what you are saying is the stock exhaust H pipe may interfere with the auto trans linkage? Or are you saying the cast shorty manifolds themselves would interfere? and would the interference be both console auto trans and column shift cars, or just column shift?

 
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(Login MT63AFX)
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I think the point I'm trying to make is the whole driver's side passageway...............

April 9 2007, 12:09 PM 

...........for exhaust routing must not be taken for granted. If I were adding shorties to a Galaxie with an automatic, either column or floor shift, I would skip the aggrevation, cussin', swearin', scraped knucles, and have custom H-pipes (full system) made by a reputable muffler shop or header builder, JMO, Rod.

Mickey Thompson's 63 1/2 AFX Hi-Rise 427 Lgt/Wgt Galaxie,
1957 C-600 Cab-over carhauler w/390-4V, 2-speed rear-end
FGCofA member #4908
MCGC member #75

"There will ALWAYS be an FE in my LiFE"

 
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Chris H
(Login 66FordCustomPI)
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My '63 390PI has factory shorties and an auto...

April 9 2007, 12:40 PM 

so they did come with them and there is room.

-Chris H

1966 Ford Custom 4dr. Police Interceptor
x-Mariposa County, CA Sheriff's Dept.
1963 Ford 300 Police Interceptor
x-Washington State Patrol
1967 Oldsmobile Delmont 88
x-Morgan Hill PD, CA (clone)
1970 Mercury Monterey
x-Santa Clara County Sheriff (clone)
2007 Chevy Impala 9C3

 
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(Login RichFerguson)
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Cool! What type of exhaust are you using...

April 9 2007, 1:15 PM 

... and do you recall what type of exhaust came on your car from the factory. I'd be happy with some sort of PI setup.

 
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Chris H
(Login 66FordCustomPI)
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I haven't got to the exhaust system yet...

April 9 2007, 1:41 PM 

but I kept the stock H pipe for comparison purposes. I was looking at the ebay auction and had seen that same piece available about a year ago.

I will check my part number book tonite to see if Ford had a separate # for manual vs. auto trans H pipes.

It seems the only cars with shorties and auto trans would be police package cars with 330HP 390's.

-Chris H

1966 Ford Custom 4dr. Police Interceptor
x-Mariposa County, CA Sheriff's Dept.
1963 Ford 300 Police Interceptor
x-Washington State Patrol
1967 Oldsmobile Delmont 88
x-Morgan Hill PD, CA (clone)
1970 Mercury Monterey
x-Santa Clara County Sheriff (clone)
2007 Chevy Impala 9C3

 
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(Login RichFerguson)
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Re: I haven't got to the exhaust system yet...

April 9 2007, 1:48 PM 

Thanks, Chris, I'd sure appreciate it if you could do that.

 
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Chris H
(Login 66FordCustomPI)
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Here's what I found...

April 9 2007, 6:31 PM 

There is a listing for C1AA-5246-K which is for 1961/1962 390HP/406 cars AND 390PI cars with auto trans. Perhaps the C1AZ number in the ad was a typo.

For 1963, there is a different number for 390PI with auto (C3AZ-5246-L) and different part numbers for 406 and 427 cars.

The difference looks to be 1/2" per the book. I do not know what it could be that causes it to be 1/2" shorter in '63.

The 390PI was available with power steering.

I think I will just have a new H-pipe made and not take any chances with the one on ebay not fitting. Of course, you could always take that chance.

-Chris H

1966 Ford Custom 4dr. Police Interceptor
x-Mariposa County, CA Sheriff's Dept.
1963 Ford 300 Police Interceptor
x-Washington State Patrol
1967 Oldsmobile Delmont 88
x-Morgan Hill PD, CA (clone)
1970 Mercury Monterey
x-Santa Clara County Sheriff (clone)
2007 Chevy Impala 9C3

 
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(Login FE4RD)
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they did have some different (thickness?) heat riser valves over the years...n/m

April 9 2007, 6:35 PM 

n/m

 
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(Login RichFerguson)
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Thanks for checking that out, Chris...

April 10 2007, 11:36 AM 

...very interesting there are so many different H pipes.

 
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(Login gear_head_62)
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I have 406 cast headers and an auto trans

April 9 2007, 12:22 PM 

in my '62 Galaxie. I have never seen any sort of prefab system for my car save for factory setups, which as mentioned, are designed for manual trans.
As I have been told/read in a 1962 Hot Rod, Ford did not offer a slushbox behind any 406 due to torque capacity concerns.

I had a local muffler shop do my pipes, and even though it took them a while, they got it right.
I think you're just going to have to bite the bullet and make the open header pilgrimage to the exhaust shop. If you don't trust them, stick around and keep an eye on 'em.

Steve



-1962 Galaxie 500 Town Sedan, 390/C6
-1965 Custom 2 door sedan, factoy 390PI/4 speed
-1992 Toyota Celica GT, 2.2L/5 speed (not fast, or furious)
-1989 Nissan Pathfinder Sport 2 door, 3.0L/auto
-2002 Honda VTX 1800R, 1800cc/5 speed
-1975 Honda CB550-4, 550cc/5 speed

 
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(Login FE4RD)
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more info...

April 9 2007, 1:29 PM 

...1960 to 1968 352/390/406/427 "Special, PI" "exhaust manifold to muffler inlet pipe" all call for the same COAA-9450-A gasket. Measures 2.60" i.d. x 2 bolt holes, .45" diameter, 3.50" center to center. The 2.60" i.d. is why a 2.50" pipe size would be good to use, rather than the necked down (at the flange) 2" factory H-pipe.

If the ebay pipe isn't a perfect fit, you could end up having to modify it.

 
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(Login DaveColeman)
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Here are some pics that may help

April 9 2007, 3:10 PM 

This is on my 62 Galaxie. I bought this stainless system. It was supposed to be exactly like stock. It pretty much was, but the right side was twisted a little wrong where it is supposed to meet the right manifold. Since I had to fix that, I went ahead and slid the larger pipe up a little so I wouldn't have to use the heat riser. If it doesn't line up exactly with your manifolds, it is pretty easy to remove the larger pipe from the smaller pipe, adjust it, and weld it back like I had to do. From looking at the pics, I can't see how it could get in the way of any automatic tranny linkage. I am slightly concerned about how close it is to the transmission dipstick tube and the idler arm bushing, but it is only slightly closer than on my 63 Galaxie with stock exhaust. I personally don't think you will have any problem.








Dave Coleman
Greenfield, IN
1962 Galaxie 500XL
1963 Galaxie 500XL
http://www.62Ford.com/GalaxieLinks
http://jamesthornton.com/wp/display/378

 
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(Login RichFerguson)
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Dave! Great pics, very helpful...

April 10 2007, 11:33 AM 

...thanks for posting these. I haven't decided what to do yet, I really prefer to do as much myself as possible. I may buy the ebay H pipe and modify it if needed (I gas weld and MIG weld, would love to get set up to TIG)I see also on eBay there are stub pipes with flanges available.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=020&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=300097118071&rd=1&rd=1

I could modify my existing exhaust (almost new) with those.
Where did you get the stainless exhaust you are using, Dave?

 
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(Login DaveColeman)
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stainless exhaust

April 10 2007, 5:06 PM 

I got it at Kepich Exhaust. I wouldn't say they were the best place, but I was able to modify my exhaust to make it fit very close to perfect. I had to make a couple of trips to a muffler shop to have the pieces bent a little bit. They also sent me some of the wrong pieces, but they quickly sent me the right ones and didn't make me send the wrong ones back. I only used them because they were the only company I could find that had a complete stainless steel exhaust for my 62. You might have better luck finding someone that has a 63 system and if it doesn't have to be stainless, you can for sure find someone. I personally wouldn't recommend Kepich unless they are the only place that has what you need.

Dave Coleman
Greenfield, IN
1962 Galaxie 500XL
1963 Galaxie 500XL
http://www.62Ford.com/GalaxieLinks
http://jamesthornton.com/wp/display/378

 
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(Login sammy70)
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Epay Pipe

April 9 2007, 3:15 PM 

Is it just me or does the Epay h-pipe appear to be severly "smooshed?" Looks like it would be fine for a stocker, but would be a serious cork with any HP in front of it. When I used to run the cast shorties I had some buds at the exhaust shop make up the pipes. No problem at all for someone experienced with a bending machine...

SamM


 
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(Login FE4RD)
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parts book images...

April 9 2007, 5:01 PM 

It seems Ford changed the H-pipe almost every year from 1960 to 1964. The manifolds had some differences on the both sides:






What is interesting to me is how they managed the T-Bird uni-body casting to also fit the 1960-'64 cow-belly frame.

 
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(Login RichFerguson)
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Re: parts book images...

April 10 2007, 11:53 AM 

I guess I don't really understand what I'm looking at here, it looks like shorty cast manifold part (casting?) numbers in the right hand column. I do not see any other part numbers other than studs/nuts. Neat images by the way, thanks for ;posting them.
Here are the numbers that are on my manifolds (not a matched set and I do not know what they came off of, although I did get the C0AE-9430-B from Rod C of this forum )
Driver side C1AE-9431-C
Pass. side C0AE-9430-B
Are these part numbers or casting numbers or are they the same?

Would there be any reason to not use these manifolds together? Might be fodder for another post (Are all shorty cast manifolds the same?)

 
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HomeRun
(Login Homers65)
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Consider a mandrel bend system if possible...

April 9 2007, 6:14 PM 

That link to the ebay auction showing the repro shorty header system is a perfect example of the (perhaps minor) restrictions imposed on gaseous flow by the crushes in a conventionally bent system.

In this day of folks cheerfully spending 3-4X $$$$$ on such unproven items as synthetic oil and PTFE filters, I'd think we could be more interested in boosting performance potential by certifiable improvements such as a no-kink, no-crush mandrel bend exhaust system.

 
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